Official Caris LeVert Thread

[Claud]

It speaks volumes that different people see different shades of great ballers in Caris' game.

Ultimately, the truth is there's never been a player like Caris in the league. He has a very unique game.

I say let Caris be Caris and let's see how far he can take it. Will be a crazy ride that's for sure.

[Keith Van Horn]

This video doesn't really help the case of anyone comparing Caris to Penny. Penny's footwork and athleticism were elite. I don't think Caris is on that level.

He (LeVert) has his own style of play. When Caris starts dunking on people like Penny was off the dribble we can discuss this.

edit: Please rewatch this video and think about this clearly. The footage in that video is nothing remotely close to what we've seen Caris LeVert do on the court. the speed, footwork, and athleticism are hall of fame level. lets not heap these kinds of expectations onto this kid please

Penny was a super human athlete. Caris doesn’t have his (le)vertical explosion but I think he definitely has the quick first step and footwork of Penny. He lacks the strength and the dunk on anyone mentality that Penny had however.

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the expectations. LeVert is the best prospect we’ve had since... I mean maybe Richard Jefferson?!? He flashes that sort of all-nba potential.

He is super unique though and it’s really hard to find someone who plays like him but I think a cross between Manu/Penny is a good start.

LeVert has solid footwork. Penny's footwork though? jesus. That dude would execute spin moves off of the dribble at full speed in traffic that I haven't seen someone to this day be able to do. We're talking what, 20 years since that time?

I think the expectations are kind of high based on these names mentioned. Manu, Scottie are hall of fame level players. Penny would have been in that category had he not been injured. I think LeVert is the most skilled prospect that we've drafted since Derrick Coleman. That in itself is where I'll leave it at.

the athleticism was just crazy. Probably more DWade -like than anyone else. But Levert is still getting stronger and he's shown he can improve his shooting and his passing has been getting better every day.

If I were Levert I'd try to model my game after him as much as possible. I'm not saying he'll ever be a Penny, more like my dream scenario, but it's a good goal to chase if you're Caris.

[MrDollarBills]

I'll fight anyone who wants to trade Caris.

Only if I don’t beat their ass first.

I say we just jump them in the parking lot

[MrDollarBills]

Penny was a super human athlete. Caris doesn’t have his (le)vertical explosion but I think he definitely has the quick first step and footwork of Penny. He lacks the strength and the dunk on anyone mentality that Penny had however.

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the expectations. LeVert is the best prospect we’ve had since... I mean maybe Richard Jefferson?!? He flashes that sort of all-nba potential.

He is super unique though and it’s really hard to find someone who plays like him but I think a cross between Manu/Penny is a good start.

LeVert has solid footwork. Penny's footwork though? jesus. That dude would execute spin moves off of the dribble at full speed in traffic that I haven't seen someone to this day be able to do. We're talking what, 20 years since that time?

I think the expectations are kind of high based on these names mentioned. Manu, Scottie are hall of fame level players. Penny would have been in that category had he not been injured. I think LeVert is the most skilled prospect that we've drafted since Derrick Coleman. That in itself is where I'll leave it at.

the athleticism was just crazy. Probably more DWade -like than anyone else. But Levert is still getting stronger and he's shown he can improve his shooting and his passing has been getting better every day.

If I were Levert I'd try to model my game after him as much as possible. I'm not saying he'll ever be a Penny, more like my dream scenario, but it's a good goal to chase if you're Caris.

haha...unless LeVert is a true basketball junkie he's too young to have seen Penny play, he was in diapers when Penny was out there giving people the business.

I said when we drafted him that based off of his college tape he really reminded me of Tracy McGrady coming out of high school minus the elite athleticism. He's just evolving into something I didn't expect with the way he is dishing the rock. He's becoming the type of player that people thought Dante Exum was going to become...and people were comparing Exum to Hardaway.

[Keith Van Horn]

it's crazy to think how pissed I was when we traded Thad.... to the point now where you can make a legitimate argument that CLV might be our starting PG by this point next year.

[Claud]

it's crazy to think how pissed I was when we traded Thad.... to the point now where you can make a legitimate argument that CLV might be our starting PG by this point next year.

I don't care about his position as long as the ball is in his hands. Magic usually occurs when we give him the ball. He makes the rest of his teammates better. A trait that only elite players have.

[Keith Van Horn]

it's crazy to think how pissed I was when we traded Thad.... to the point now where you can make a legitimate argument that CLV might be our starting PG by this point next year.

I don't care about his position as long as the ball is in his hands. Magic usually occurs when we give him the ball. He makes the rest of his teammates better. A trait that only elite players have.

well I was thinking more along the lines of if he becomes a starting PG, then you can play with other players around him. Slide DLo to fulltime SG, move Lin to run the bench unit, and maybe Dinwiddie can get moved for another asset. Just thinking out loud.

[vincecarter4pres]

He is not nearly as athletic as Pippen or Penny, either on level or stylistically.

Agreed - Penny was an all-star basically the day they stepped on the court. I didn't see most of Pippen's early career, but having seen him at his peak I just don't think Levert has that kind of ceiling.

How about Eddie Jones?

Eddie Jones was on another tier athletically compared to Caris and a superior shooter from the perimeter (so far). Caris is definitely a better passer though and I think Caris is a better ball handler. Jones was a nasty player though.

I think these comparisons you guys are making are downright blasphemy and outrageous tbh, but I can't help but like them because guys like Pippen, Hardaway, and Jones were some of my favorite players to watch as a kid

Yeah, Jones was still faster and more explosive. Better shooter as well, but not by so much the gap can't be closed. Definitely agree Caris is already the naturally better passer and ball handler. Jones was like a Rich man's Kerry Kittles. One of my favorites growing up as well.

Yeah, some of these comparisons are outrageous though haha. Not even that Caris could never become a top player in the league, or a Hall of Famer, even though it's incredibly unlikely, but Penny? Pippen? Haha, whoa.

Like could he be a Jimmy Butler level player and that type of case/circumstances? Sure. Absolutely even. And that would be phenomenal!

But is Jimmy Butler a Hall of Famer?
Perennial MVP candidate?
Generational level talent(or prospect a few years ago before he actually arrived?)?
Is Jimmy Butler even a top 10 player in the league?
At least year in and year out and for the foreseeable future?
Butler is a lock top 20 kind of player, probably top 15, who can be argued in that 3rd tier at the end of the top 10 imho. And again, that is fantastic! But he's no Penny, he's no Pippen.
He's almost a Manu level guy. Not a Pierce though really. And Manu was just as good as some of the greats, but his injury issues and thus minutes restrictions always held back his raw stats or ability to even be on the court. Idk if it's fair to take away from his legacy cause of that, but I think advanced stats, rings, impact on the game beyond numbers and the fact he's international are what solidify his eventual induction into the Hall. And I love Manu, so that's not to take away from him. Hell, if he wound up traded somewhere like here(like the rumors of Parker and Manu for Kidd the year Kidd was about to be a free agent), he might have went on to put up 27/8/5 the rest of his career.


But I think strictly stylistically, even though there are very few comparisons which hit the nail on the head, Roy or Manu are probably the closest.

[Netaman]

Ginobli is probably the best recent comparison in terms of upside. But Levert's finishing/attacking is going to need to improve a lot to hit that upside. Also Ginobli was enormously clutch. Stylistically and athletically they are probably the closest comp though. Ginobli has a similar herky/jerky driving style.

[MGrand15]

The quicker we accept Caris as a future HOF lock, the easier this transition will be. Let's not make this awkward.

[SpeedyG]

Caris is a unique player on his own right, and I don't think he's really a direct comparison of a lot of guys. He's tall and lanky, but he's not explosive like Penny (Jesus I swear people have forgotten how explosive he was, and how ridiculous his footwork was, which imo was as close to Kobe as we've seen, especially in the post), or Pip, or even Eddie Jones.

He's more a crafty penetrator and uses his long steps instead of explosion.

Thinking about it now, and it's still not a 100% comp, but I think Ron Harper might be pretty close (I'm transposing Harper into 2018 and giving him the benefit of being more a point role like Caris and a more developed 3 shot based on era adjustment)

[MrDollarBills]

Speedy are we talking about Cavs/Clippers Ron Harper or Bulls Ron Harper?

[Prokorov]

i like the harper comparison and agree he is nowhere in the penny realm. i think he does impact beyond stats like manu did. if you can find a way to keep caris as your 4th best player or "3B" coming off the bench giving you 28-32 high impact mintues you are in great shape.

caris can do it all but he is at his best running the show with the ball... but i dont think if he is your highest usage player #1 option you can be a great team. in that manu role though, sky is the limit

then again, i think you can maybe turn him into a starting point gaurd if we moved on from DLO and had a more balanced usage down the roster

[SpeedyG]

Speedy are we talking about Cavs/Clippers Ron Harper or Bulls Ron Harper?

Younger Harper obviously. He was very limited in Chicago due to age/role/scheme.

[SpeedyG]

i like the harper comparison and agree he is nowhere in the penny realm. i think he does impact beyond stats like manu did. if you can find a way to keep caris as your 4th best player or "3B" coming off the bench giving you 28-32 high impact mintues you are in great shape.

caris can do it all but he is at his best running the show with the ball... but i dont think if he is your highest usage player #1 option you can be a great team. in that manu role though, sky is the limit

then again, i think you can maybe turn him into a starting point gaurd if we moved on from DLO and had a more balanced usage down the roster

Don't really see a reason why he can't do what he's doing now even sharing the guard spot with Dlo. Keep in mind that ideally, this happens next season with further lead guard experience for Caris AND Allen at 5. And similar to now, when the defense defends Caris and prevents him from breaking them down, we normally swing it to the other side to Harris/Stauskas, only next season that will be Dlo in that role.

[Antti22]

i like the harper comparison and agree he is nowhere in the penny realm. i think he does impact beyond stats like manu did. if you can find a way to keep caris as your 4th best player or "3B" coming off the bench giving you 28-32 high impact mintues you are in great shape.

caris can do it all but he is at his best running the show with the ball... but i dont think if he is your highest usage player #1 option you can be a great team. in that manu role though, sky is the limit

then again, i think you can maybe turn him into a starting point gaurd if we moved on from DLO and had a more balanced usage down the roster

Hello, Debbie! Debbie Downer...

[MGrand15]

I think this talk of Caris only being good with the ball in his hands or at PG is WAY premature. He's shooting 40% on spot up 3s. He runs the floor extra hard in transition. He doesn't hog the ball. And he can defend both guard spots equally well.

Nothing really holding him back from mixing on and off the ball. We just happen to only have 2 ball handlers. The beginning of the year he struggled regardless of position.

[Prokorov]

i like the harper comparison and agree he is nowhere in the penny realm. i think he does impact beyond stats like manu did. if you can find a way to keep caris as your 4th best player or "3B" coming off the bench giving you 28-32 high impact mintues you are in great shape.

caris can do it all but he is at his best running the show with the ball... but i dont think if he is your highest usage player #1 option you can be a great team. in that manu role though, sky is the limit

then again, i think you can maybe turn him into a starting point gaurd if we moved on from DLO and had a more balanced usage down the roster

Don't really see a reason why he can't do what he's doing now even sharing the guard spot with Dlo. Keep in mind that ideally, this happens next season with further lead guard experience for Caris AND Allen at 5. And similar to now, when the defense defends Caris and prevents him from breaking them down, we normally swing it to the other side to Harris/Stauskas, only next season that will be Dlo in that role.

i think he can do what he is doing now next to DLo. i dont think he can be a 20/6/6 type guy next to dlo.

[Prokorov]

I think this talk of Caris only being good with the ball in his hands or at PG is WAY premature. He's shooting 40% on spot up 3s. He runs the floor extra hard in transition. He doesn't hog the ball. And he can defend both guard spots equally well.

Nothing really holding him back from mixing on and off the ball. We just happen to only have 2 ball handlers. The beginning of the year he struggled regardless of position.

i think you misunderstood. i think he can 100% play off ball. i just dont think he can reach his peak without higher usage.

[Prokorov]

i like the harper comparison and agree he is nowhere in the penny realm. i think he does impact beyond stats like manu did. if you can find a way to keep caris as your 4th best player or "3B" coming off the bench giving you 28-32 high impact mintues you are in great shape.

caris can do it all but he is at his best running the show with the ball... but i dont think if he is your highest usage player #1 option you can be a great team. in that manu role though, sky is the limit

then again, i think you can maybe turn him into a starting point gaurd if we moved on from DLO and had a more balanced usage down the roster

Hello, Debbie! Debbie Downer...

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