Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion Pt. 4

[darealjuice]

I've heard this same thing for the last five years ... Len, Chriss, Bender, Jackson hyped same as this years crop of 18 year olds.

I say trade our draft picks and a few players for a legit star. Pick up a legit free agent this summer too.

Funny the official rebuild only started two years ago with the tank that lead to Bender and Chriss but even at that the set a goal of being back in the playoffs in 2020. you want to give up on the player that the majority of GMs around the NBA said would be the best player in 5 years because you are short sighted. No thanks I want a team that is going to be going after a championship not some "Oh I made it into the playoffs so everything is fine." look at Phil they have bright future because they had a plan and stuck with it and got some talented players to build around.

No, No! For at least five years (and probably longer) I have heard the repeated cries for losses so we can get a top 5 draft pick. Sure we overachieved a few of those years and netted TJ Warren and Booker. In the losing years we still haven't found the superstar most folks insist we will get.

You've heard people call for it, but our franchise hasn't been actually doing it until 2 years ago, which is their point.

[bwgood77]

This is the one draft where it would make the most sense to tank and we're headed in the wrong direction. It's good to develop a winning culture but with the talent we have, we're never going to be better than a first round exit type of team. We really need another all-star talent next to Booker. Booker and a bunch of roleplayers isn't going to cut it. We need to land in the top 5-6, otherwise I think we should think about packaging the pick with some other assets and getting a young player with more potential.

I've heard this same thing for the last five years ... Len, Chriss, Bender, Jackson hyped same as this years crop of 18 year olds.

I say trade our draft picks and a few players for a legit star. Pick up a legit free agent this summer too.

Well we already cashed in one of our 2018 picks, possibly a pick that will be as high as #1 for budding all star Brandon Knight. So that's the pick from this year you get to see traded and cashed in for that legit player. I don't view him doing that and panicking like he did with that move to try and cash in for hopes at a playoff spot turned out very well. The approach you prefer may prove to be the right one though when Knight returns next year and we compare him and the cap space he eats up to the player we may have gotten with that Lakers pick. Time will tell. We'll see if cashing in on picks really paid off. If so, it certainly didn't pay off quickly and I'd rather have the pick back. I'd like to not see that play out again by trading another pick this year or another unprotected future pick either.

[Mulhollanddrive]

I think we'll see the balance shift towards the trade avenue in the next 18 months. Even if we get a good outcome in the draft in either 2018 or 2019 it will have little impact on wins during McDonough's contract.

[Qwigglez]

This is the one draft where it would make the most sense to tank and we're headed in the wrong direction. It's good to develop a winning culture but with the talent we have, we're never going to be better than a first round exit type of team. We really need another all-star talent next to Booker. Booker and a bunch of roleplayers isn't going to cut it. We need to land in the top 5-6, otherwise I think we should think about packaging the pick with some other assets and getting a young player with more potential.

I've heard this same thing for the last five years ... Len, Chriss, Bender, Jackson hyped same as this years crop of 18 year olds.

I say trade our draft picks and a few players for a legit star. Pick up a legit free agent this summer too.

Well we already cashed in one of our 2018 picks, possibly a pick that will be as high as #1 for budding all star Brandon Knight. So that's the pick from this year you get to see traded and cashed in for that legit player. I don't view him doing that and panicking like he did with that move to try and cash in for hopes at a playoff spot turned out very well. The approach you prefer may prove to be the right one though when Knight returns next year and we compare him and the cap space he eats up to the player we may have gotten with that Lakers pick. Time will tell. We'll see if cashing in on picks really paid off. If so, it certainly didn't pay off quickly and I'd rather have the pick back. I'd like to not see that play out again by trading another pick this year or another unprotected future pick either.

It was a bold move at the time and Knight was considered a snubbed all-star in the East. He was only 23 at the time so it made sense that McD felt it was the correct decision. If it wasn't for Booker's emergence I could see Knight having played well, though likely not enough to warrant a top 5 pick in this upcoming draft but not as bad as he's been last year.
I hope McD doesn't look back at that trade and make him question other deals. Maybe he was hesitant to trade Bledsoe and the 4th pick for Kyrie becase he felt Jackson was going to be the next Kawhi. Right now looking back at that, I'd say that was a missed opportunity.

[jredsaz]

I've heard this same thing for the last five years ... Len, Chriss, Bender, Jackson hyped same as this years crop of 18 year olds.

I say trade our draft picks and a few players for a legit star. Pick up a legit free agent this summer too.

Funny the official rebuild only started two years ago with the tank that lead to Bender and Chriss but even at that the set a goal of being back in the playoffs in 2020. you want to give up on the player that the majority of GMs around the NBA said would be the best player in 5 years because you are short sighted. No thanks I want a team that is going to be going after a championship not some "Oh I made it into the playoffs so everything is fine." look at Phil they have bright future because they had a plan and stuck with it and got some talented players to build around.

No, No! For at least five years (and probably longer) I have heard the repeated cries for losses so we can get a top 5 draft pick. Sure we overachieved a few of those years and netted TJ Warren and Booker. In the losing years we still haven't found the superstar most folks insist we will get.

In terms of getting what Philly did those odds are impossible now that the draft rules will be changing in 2019. Only a 14% chance of getting the #1 if you have the worst record. So basically there is a negligible chance to ever repeat what Philly did with the number of top 3 picks they got over the last five years.

In terms of waiting five years for JJ to become "the best player in his draft class" I will take a pass and trade him if necessary. Booker won't wait five years to become a winner and Jackson's shot may take that long to fix.

Can't just start trading draft picks and rookies willy-nilly. The right player and the right situation need to be in place. I think McD let some pitches go by over the past year but I don't see any player coming available for which I would consider moving a major asset like Jackson or our 2018 1st. At least in the near term.

Possibly Griffin but thats tough due to his injury history. Not for Jordan. Cousins wouldn't resign post Bledsoe. Not for Kemba.

[Qwigglez]

Funny the official rebuild only started two years ago with the tank that lead to Bender and Chriss but even at that the set a goal of being back in the playoffs in 2020. you want to give up on the player that the majority of GMs around the NBA said would be the best player in 5 years because you are short sighted. No thanks I want a team that is going to be going after a championship not some "Oh I made it into the playoffs so everything is fine." look at Phil they have bright future because they had a plan and stuck with it and got some talented players to build around.

No, No! For at least five years (and probably longer) I have heard the repeated cries for losses so we can get a top 5 draft pick. Sure we overachieved a few of those years and netted TJ Warren and Booker. In the losing years we still haven't found the superstar most folks insist we will get.

In terms of getting what Philly did those odds are impossible now that the draft rules will be changing in 2019. Only a 14% chance of getting the #1 if you have the worst record. So basically there is a negligible chance to ever repeat what Philly did with the number of top 3 picks they got over the last five years.

In terms of waiting five years for JJ to become "the best player in his draft class" I will take a pass and trade him if necessary. Booker won't wait five years to become a winner and Jackson's shot may take that long to fix.

Can't just start trading draft picks and rookies willy-nilly. The right player and the right situation need to be in place. I think McD let some pitches go by over the past year but I don't see any player coming available for which I would consider moving a major asset like Jackson or our 2018 1st. At least in the near term.

Possibly Griffin but thats tough due to his injury history. Not for Jordan. Cousins wouldn't resign post Bledsoe. Not for Kemba.

Josh Jackson, both Miami picks for Zach Lavine or DLo?

[jredsaz]

No, No! For at least five years (and probably longer) I have heard the repeated cries for losses so we can get a top 5 draft pick. Sure we overachieved a few of those years and netted TJ Warren and Booker. In the losing years we still haven't found the superstar most folks insist we will get.

In terms of getting what Philly did those odds are impossible now that the draft rules will be changing in 2019. Only a 14% chance of getting the #1 if you have the worst record. So basically there is a negligible chance to ever repeat what Philly did with the number of top 3 picks they got over the last five years.

In terms of waiting five years for JJ to become "the best player in his draft class" I will take a pass and trade him if necessary. Booker won't wait five years to become a winner and Jackson's shot may take that long to fix.

Can't just start trading draft picks and rookies willy-nilly. The right player and the right situation need to be in place. I think McD let some pitches go by over the past year but I don't see any player coming available for which I would consider moving a major asset like Jackson or our 2018 1st. At least in the near term.

Possibly Griffin but thats tough due to his injury history. Not for Jordan. Cousins wouldn't resign post Bledsoe. Not for Kemba.

Josh Jackson, both Miami picks for Zach Lavine or DLo?

No and I don't think the Bulls or the Nets would either.

[Qwigglez]

Can't just start trading draft picks and rookies willy-nilly. The right player and the right situation need to be in place. I think McD let some pitches go by over the past year but I don't see any player coming available for which I would consider moving a major asset like Jackson or our 2018 1st. At least in the near term.

Possibly Griffin but thats tough due to his injury history. Not for Jordan. Cousins wouldn't resign post Bledsoe. Not for Kemba.

Josh Jackson, both Miami picks for Zach Lavine or DLo?

No and I don't think the Bulls or the Nets would either.

Probably not unless they don't want any huge salaries on their books.

[jredsaz]

Josh Jackson, both Miami picks for Zach Lavine or DLo?

No and I don't think the Bulls or the Nets would either.

Probably not unless they don't want any huge salaries on their books.

That's true. Feel like both those teams went and acquiered those guys as building block guys. I think it's too much for the Suns at the same time. Lol. But I have to stay I day dream about a Russell/Booker backcourt.

[RaisingArizona]

Time to make a push! Kemba

[LukasBMW]

Looking at the bottom 14 teams, one could assume they might be interested in trading players that aren't on rookie contracts (IE, guys that fans still hope will pan out)

Atlanta
No one. They are not trading Schroder.

Lakers
No one of interest. Lopez is expiring. Ball and Ingram are untouchable. Clarkson is interesting if we can get him cheap.

Orlando
No one they would trade. Don't know if I want to pay AG. They ain't moving Isaac. Don't want Vucevic

Memphis
Too old

Sacramento
All the young guys I'd want to look at, they wouldn't trade. Unless we could somehow steal Fox from them.

Dallas
No one. They might be the worst team in the league.

Chicago
Again, all their young guys they will keep. Too bad Dunn has started to play well for them

Brooklyn
We missed our shot at Russell. Still hoping we target Okaor as a free agent.

Hornets
Kemba and Monk are interesting. But I'd only be interested if they are cheap. The front office may not want to trade assets for 2 years of 27 year old Kemba when we have 26 year old Knight locked up for 3 years.

Utah
They ain't trading Gobert. I'd still take a flyer on Exum

Philly
They can't pay everyone. Keep an eye on them.

Clippers
I'd pull the trigger if we can get Blake cheap. Our medical staff could keep him alive.

NYK
I'd make a godfather offer for KP.


But in reality...gonna have to keep building for the draft. And McDonough may have to find our next PG and C with some magic in that #10-14 range like he did with TJ and Book.

[Qwigglez]

Could we do this instead?

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ybebmd3t

I'm not a big fan of Kemba. We could offer whatever picks is necessary for the Hornets to do it.

Lillard Booker Warren Bender Chriss

[NavLDO]

With Booker, to maximise his skill set. You need to look at Warriors back court. Booker is a combo of Curry and Thompson a bit... Obviously not the shooter nor dribbler Curry is... But the ability to put the ball on the floor and get a long range shot is there.

You need a shut down defender who can switch easily and still be impactful.


Warren is a very good scorer and a pesky defender on the ball. But his lack of 3pt range and length to contest shots makes him ideal as 6th man on a playoff team where he can focus on putting up 15 to 17ppg off the bench.


Get an inside threath center who would crash the offensive boards and a Draymond Green type PF who can cover anyone defensively.... And you have a good recipe. Bender is suppose to be that player but not there yet.


I think ultimately McD will go for Cousins and hope Knight comes back well as he can be a floor stretcher at PG

If we are going to 'use' Warren in that capacity, we should trade him to a team that needs a Top 10 starting NBA SF, and get a starter in return, either via a top 5 draft pick, or a top starting Center/PG from another team.

You have to look at it from the player's perspective; these aren't just random Chess pieces. 'Demoting' Warren to a 6th Man role will do nothing but discourage him turn him into yet another disgruntled Suns player, that we end up trading away in 2 years for a heavily protected future 1st Rd pick in like 2024.

Warren has earned his starting spot on this team, and for everything he doesn't do well (3PT shooting), he balances out with other skillsets that other SFs DON'T have (ability to shoot from anywhere within the 3PT line, etc.).

So, we build 'around' his and Booker's strengths, not start over. I noticed you didn't mention JJ in there...what's your plans for another SF that can't shoot 3s? Because not only can he not shoot 3s...he can't shoot period. He hopefully will get better, but there is no guaranty. But he's a great defender.

Point is, we will never get the prototypical player at all the positions; you just have to hope you get players that are REALLY good in some aspects and work to develop those aspects, and build around them with the other players. You don't just say...

"sorry, SFs are supposed to be good 3PT shooters, so while you're a stud in all other facets, we're going to demote you to 6th-Man, because we have a rookie that plays the same position that we drafted higher than you. Never mind that he's not any better at the 3 than you are..."

[Saberestar]

That "sixth man" thing about Warren needs to stop IMO.
He is getting closer to a borderline All Star player.

He is too good (and improving) to not start in this league.

[NavLDO]

I've heard this same thing for the last five years ... Len, Chriss, Bender, Jackson hyped same as this years crop of 18 year olds.

I say trade our draft picks and a few players for a legit star. Pick up a legit free agent this summer too.

Funny the official rebuild only started two years ago with the tank that lead to Bender and Chriss but even at that the set a goal of being back in the playoffs in 2020. you want to give up on the player that the majority of GMs around the NBA said would be the best player in 5 years because you are short sighted. No thanks I want a team that is going to be going after a championship not some "Oh I made it into the playoffs so everything is fine." look at Phil they have bright future because they had a plan and stuck with it and got some talented players to build around.

No, No! For at least five years (and probably longer) I have heard the repeated cries for losses so we can get a top 5 draft pick. Sure we overachieved a few of those years and netted TJ Warren and Booker. In the losing years we still haven't found the superstar most folks insist we will get.

In terms of getting what Philly did those odds are impossible now that the draft rules will be changing in 2019. Only a 14% chance of getting the #1 if you have the worst record. So basically there is a negligible chance to ever repeat what Philly did with the number of top 3 picks they got over the last five years.

In terms of waiting five years for JJ to become "the best player in his draft class" I will take a pass and trade him if necessary. Booker won't wait five years to become a winner and Jackson's shot may take that long to fix.

I'm ok with draft picks, and developing them, etc., but what I'm tired of is trying to be 'bad' so we can target a specific player that is going to be the savior of this franchise. You are exactly right; last year, it was JJ. If we could ONLY get JJ, all our 'woes' would disappear. So, now we have JJ, and it's not enough, so now, it's Doncic or Young...if we could only 'Tank' enough to ensure we get one of them, our problems would be solved...then when that doesn't happen...again...

So yes, I'm tired of all the 'promises of success' that certain draft prospects are supposed to bring us. We have 3 x Top 5 picks, and a Top 8 pick in house. One of which HAS been developed, but doesn't get to start two others are in 'redundant' positions.

So, I'm with you...to a point. I'm ok with targeting Doncic or Young, but I'm not ok with losing to get it done. We have, at our disposal, if we so choose, the 2016 AND 2017 #4 overall picks that are in the development stage, that are in, again redundant positions, that we can trade. We have Ours and Miami's '18 1st we can trade. We have Miami's Unprotected '21 1st and Milwaukee's weirdly protected 1st we can trade. You can't tell me that we couldn't use the 2 '18 picks, the '21 pick, plus JJ and/or Bender, to move up to a position to target Young or Doncic, IF that is what McD wants. OR, we could trade some of that pkg for, as you say, a Legit Star to pair with Booker & Warren, then all is right n the world...

[jredsaz]

Looking at the bottom 14 teams, one could assume they might be interested in trading players that aren't on rookie contracts (IE, guys that fans still hope will pan out)

Atlanta
No one. They are not trading Schroder.

Lakers
No one of interest. Lopez is expiring. Ball and Ingram are untouchable. Clarkson is interesting if we can get him cheap.

Orlando
No one they would trade. Don't know if I want to pay AG. They ain't moving Isaac. Don't want Vucevic

Memphis
Too old

Sacramento
All the young guys I'd want to look at, they wouldn't trade. Unless we could somehow steal Fox from them.

Dallas
No one. They might be the worst team in the league.

Chicago
Again, all their young guys they will keep. Too bad Dunn has started to play well for them

Brooklyn
We missed our shot at Russell. Still hoping we target Okaor as a free agent.

Hornets
Kemba and Monk are interesting. But I'd only be interested if they are cheap. The front office may not want to trade assets for 2 years of 27 year old Kemba when we have 26 year old Knight locked up for 3 years.

Utah
They ain't trading Gobert. I'd still take a flyer on Exum

Philly
They can't pay everyone. Keep an eye on them.

Clippers
I'd pull the trigger if we can get Blake cheap. Our medical staff could keep him alive.

NYK
I'd make a godfather offer for KP.


But in reality...gonna have to keep building for the draft. And McDonough may have to find our next PG and C with some magic in that #10-14 range like he did with TJ and Book.

I think Barnes in Dallas, Vucivic, Payton and Ross in Orlando, and even Bazemore in Atlanta could all be targets.

[carey]

That "sixth man" thing about Warren needs to stop IMO.
He is getting closer to a borderline All Star player.

He is too good (and improving) to not start in this league.

It's just hard when your only elite skill is scoring from the mid-range and in. His defense is improving. If he became an above average defender that would go a long way. He doesn't really pass or rebound very well. He can get you points in bunches though. I'm not sure how many times I've seen him turn a 1-8 start into a 10-20.

[JMac1]

I've heard this same thing for the last five years ... Len, Chriss, Bender, Jackson hyped same as this years crop of 18 year olds.

I say trade our draft picks and a few players for a legit star. Pick up a legit free agent this summer too.

Well we already cashed in one of our 2018 picks, possibly a pick that will be as high as #1 for budding all star Brandon Knight. So that's the pick from this year you get to see traded and cashed in for that legit player. I don't view him doing that and panicking like he did with that move to try and cash in for hopes at a playoff spot turned out very well. The approach you prefer may prove to be the right one though when Knight returns next year and we compare him and the cap space he eats up to the player we may have gotten with that Lakers pick. Time will tell. We'll see if cashing in on picks really paid off. If so, it certainly didn't pay off quickly and I'd rather have the pick back. I'd like to not see that play out again by trading another pick this year or another unprotected future pick either.

It was a bold move at the time and Knight was considered a snubbed all-star in the East. He was only 23 at the time so it made sense that McD felt it was the correct decision. If it wasn't for Booker's emergence I could see Knight having played well, though likely not enough to warrant a top 5 pick in this upcoming draft but not as bad as he's been last year.
I hope McD doesn't look back at that trade and make him question other deals. Maybe he was hesitant to trade Bledsoe and the 4th pick for Kyrie becase he felt Jackson was going to be the next Kawhi. Right now looking back at that, I'd say that was a missed opportunity.

Maybe, I’m the only one but I still don’t have a problem with the non Kyrie trade.

1. Would Devin have regressed instead of explode like he has this year? Devin deferred too much to Bledsoe IMO. He and Irving could have butted heads.
2. TJ is”growing” on me, but he ain’t there yet, however, he plays sooooo well with Booker. If he could shoot the three....game over. I think this synergy w Book and TJ doesn’t happen, although it could have been great between Booker and Irv.
3. Irving’s defense which brings me to point 4
4. JJ. was drafted for defense and Swiss Army Knife status. BPA and nice fit.
5. Irving may have left. Who wanted nor needs that drama? That could as we know, kill team chemistry.

I’ll never 20/20 the Kyrie thing. If you make the best decision possible based off of the evidence at the time, you made the right decision no matter the outcome. A bad outcome doesn’t equate to a bad decision.

[JMac1]

That "sixth man" thing about Warren needs to stop IMO.
He is getting closer to a borderline All Star player.

He is too good (and improving) to not start in this league.

It's just hard when your only elite skill is scoring from the mid-range and in. His defense is improving. If he became an above average defender that would go a long way. He doesn't really pass or rebound very well. He can get you points in bunches though. I'm not sure how many times I've seen him turn a 1-8 start into a 10-20.

And that’s why we drafted JJ.

[King4Day]

Could we do this instead?

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ybebmd3t

I'm not a big fan of Kemba. We could offer whatever picks is necessary for the Hornets to do it.

Lillard Booker Warren Bender Chriss

I'd love Kemba on this team as I think he'd mesh well with Booker.
It'd cost us our 2018 first and both Miami firsts at the least for that deal to go through. Kemba is too valuable to that franchise and they have no need to deal him.