The Jabari Discussion Thread - Back 2/2

[Diggr14]

That said, I hope none of the blind optimism just said by Diggr is anyone in the front office's mind as they go through this process. Two torn ACLs is a big deal, just because you like the dude and he's already on our team doesn't change that fact. If he was a straight up FA right now from a different team, and we had cap space to sign him, would anyone be advocating for 4/100 for him? Let alone what he's asking? Just be realistic on it.

It’s not blind optimism, it’s the reality of the situation. He came back and put up those numbers last time in the season after injury, which is what I said in the blurb above that I could see him doing it again. To expect the same thing might be actually selling him short... considering he’s a little older now and apparently the surgery was done right this time. Like MD said, If he comes back and has solid stints as a scorer off the bench in his comeback this year, he will get max’d or close to by someone else in RFA (he suggests 4/80..i personally think it will be a little higher)... and we will match, take it to the bank. They aren’t going to let a 23 year old, former #2 pick who put up 20ppg, with clear upside go away for nothing. Just won’t happen unless he gets hurt again, or does something to piss them off on the way out.

[DingleJerry]

Yup, it's just PR fluff. All players do it, no big deal. Just don't believe the hype (I say that about everyone, not specific to Jabari). How many players leaving after saying stuff like this and how many god/family centric politicians/celebrities getting caught in sexual scandals do we need to see before people stop putting any stock in this stuff.

[M-C-G]

This can pretty much be proven by the discussion here the last 15 months and how vitriol it got that it's basically blasphemy to suggest trading him.

You've been around long enough to know those were not just vitriol about trading him(certainly where it began) but rather substantially larger toxic conversations between posters, myself right in the middle of it. That had far more to do than just the trade value and let's not pretend like anyone was an innocent victim in those discussion, because it was absolutely a two, three or maybe four way street.

[DingleJerry]

That said, I hope none of the blind optimism just said by Diggr is anyone in the front office's mind as they go through this process. Two torn ACLs is a big deal, just because you like the dude and he's already on our team doesn't change that fact. If he was a straight up FA right now from a different team, and we had cap space to sign him, would anyone be advocating for 4/100 for him? Let alone what he's asking? Just be realistic on it.

It’s not blind optimism, it’s the reality of the situation. He came back and put up those numbers last time in the season after injury, which is what I said in the blurb above that I could see him doing it again. To expect the same thing might be actually selling him short... considering he’s a little older now and apparently the surgery was done right this time. Like MD said, If he comes back and has solid stints as a scorer off the bench in his comeback this year, he will get max’d or close to by someone else in RFA (he suggests 4/80..i personally think it will be a little higher)... and we will match, take it to the bank. They aren’t going to let a 23 year old, former #2 pick who put up 20ppg, with clear upside go away for nothing. Just won’t happen unless he gets hurt again, or does something to piss them off on the way out.

I said the same thing that if he does well they can't let him go for nothing. But yes to essentially say 'two torn acls is no biggie' is blind optimism when no player has ever come back and played like their old self after it. Hoping for the best of course, but I hope management is being realistic and seemingly they are since they didn't cave at the deadline for his extension and are going to make him prove it for a few months.

[DingleJerry]

This can pretty much be proven by the discussion here the last 15 months and how vitriol it got that it's basically blasphemy to suggest trading him.

You've been around long enough to know those were not just vitriol about trading him(certainly where it began) but rather substantially larger toxic conversations between posters, myself right in the middle of it. That had far more to do than just the trade value and let's not pretend like anyone was an innocent victim in those discussion, because it was absolutely a two, three or maybe four way street.

For sure, not denying any of that. For this specific point I was reference that a large portion of that debate was people contributing nothing to the discussion other than to say he's untradeable, the thread should be looked, anyone suggesting it are nuts, etc. That was a big chunk, a few months ago we talked about this and I went back and counted a few pages of it and something like 8 or 10 posts were just comments like that. That's all I was referencing here. Everything around that was just as you say.

[KidA24]

So was pretty much every article put out about Giannis and how much he loves Milwaukee though and we don't blame him for it. It's part of the business. And yet he wanted a one year less deal so he could hit FA sooner for his own flexibility and to lock in a mega deal a year earlier.

Nope. Bucks saved the 5 year contract for Jabari. Like idiots.

[GBBucks]

The biggest problem I have with Jabari is that he picked #12. Wanted to make us all believe that he was the bucks version of Aaron Rodgers. The **** nerve of this guy. What a bull pr move, I can't believe none of us saw through this facade until now.

If Jabari hadn't tried to take rodgers' number, I doubt Rodgers would have gotten hurt. Cut him IMO.


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[M-C-G]

So was pretty much every article put out about Giannis and how much he loves Milwaukee though and we don't blame him for it. It's part of the business. And yet he wanted a one year less deal so he could hit FA sooner for his own flexibility and to lock in a mega deal a year earlier.

Nope. Bucks saved the 5 year contract for Jabari. Like idiots.

Kid, I don't think that is true...I would have to go back and look but I think I recall something from Hammond that talked about this being the contract that Giannis and his reps wanted and as a dumb compromise, we asked him to take a little less so we could sign power houses like Hawes stretch clause, Liggins and GP2s of the world without being in the luxury.

I actually feel pretty confident that Giannis got the deal he wanted. Just enough security with 100M and right in his prime to get the next super max as soon as he can.

[DingleJerry]

So was pretty much every article put out about Giannis and how much he loves Milwaukee though and we don't blame him for it. It's part of the business. And yet he wanted a one year less deal so he could hit FA sooner for his own flexibility and to lock in a mega deal a year earlier.

Nope. Bucks saved the 5 year contract for Jabari. Like idiots.

Team spun it as a positive for the team to not give the 5th and to be less than max so that it didn't fluctuate based on the cap. But this was a savvy AF move by Giannis' team to be thinking big pic instead of just for the extra 20 mil right now. On the other hand, if you believe the Bucks spin on it then it's a huge indictment of the Bucks management to be that stupid. Well, maybe they were that stupid and Giannis' team just said what a bunch of idiots and did it rather than demanding the 5 year max because that's what they wanted anyway. Essentially his yearly on his next deal will massively trump his yearly on this one, so the sooner to get to it the better. Plus of course the flex to bail if the team blows, and subsequently getting to the next big deal a year sooner too.

[SirChurros]

Yup, it's just PR fluff. All players do it, no big deal. Just don't believe the hype (I say that about everyone, not specific to Jabari). How many players leaving after saying stuff like this and how many god/family centric politicians/celebrities getting caught in sexual scandals do we need to see before people stop putting any stock in this stuff.

You can love a city and still end up moving on from it. Circumstances change, better opportunities arise.

[Chapter29]

[

He was never fat.

That is not an appropriate amount of body fat for an NBA player, let alone a sf. Not even close. It's probably a good 25 lbs of excess. There is almost no muscle tone there. On a body that big, 25 extra lbs. of excess fat is going to seem like a pretty thin layer, and it's perfectly healthy for an average person or even a football player. But it's a huge liability for an NBA combo player. Your eyes aren't discerning enough if you can't see it.

ETA: You're also ignoring multiple pictures where he's been quite a bit bigger than that, and the fact that he himself has admittedly gone through cycles of being really fat and having to get in shape going back to high school.

Sorry, just the difference of the definition of fat. He's not fat imo.

[coolhandluke121]

Sorry, just the difference of the definition of fat. He's not fat imo.

Isn't it implied that I was talking about being above optimal weight for basketball? I mean I don't give a **** how attractive he is or anything. Yeah, he wasn't "fat", but look at his tone compared to guys like Carroll in one of the pics you posted. That's the difference between a guy with good NBA conditioning and a guy who's getting by on talent, and it's reflected in his inconsistent efforts and energy levels.

I hope he really is in great shape like people are saying and the limited pics we have are showing, but if it's a dramatic difference it will just go to show that I was correct in criticizing him for that. It also begs the question, is he just toning down for his contract year push?

[RRyder823]

Are people really still bitching about the letter?

Good **** lord

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[Chapter29]

As I mentioned he could have been and appears to be in better shape. So what though really? What's the big deal here? The dude can't get into better shape? Can't learn and improve? I'm confused.

[jute2003]

Was LeBron fat before he slimmed down a year or two ago? Is he fat now after he decided he was more effective with the weight and put it back on?

[DingleJerry]

I'd trust that he realized it's best for his long term health of his knees to be at that weight. Not that he's doing just to get a contract and then get lazy. You never know what'll happen of course. But I'd guess this comes from the doctors telling him to do it to reduce the chances of another tear.

[KidA24]

So was pretty much every article put out about Giannis and how much he loves Milwaukee though and we don't blame him for it. It's part of the business. And yet he wanted a one year less deal so he could hit FA sooner for his own flexibility and to lock in a mega deal a year earlier.

Nope. Bucks saved the 5 year contract for Jabari. Like idiots.

Kid, I don't think that is true...I would have to go back and look but I think I recall something from Hammond that talked about this being the contract that Giannis and his reps wanted and as a dumb compromise, we asked him to take a little less so we could sign power houses like Hawes stretch clause, Liggins and GP2s of the world without being in the luxury.

I actually feel pretty confident that Giannis got the deal he wanted. Just enough security with 100M and right in his prime to get the next super max as soon as he can.

I never saw a single thing about it from Giannis' side, simply that the Bucks convinced him to take the 4 year deal so they could save the 5 year for Jabari and yes, sign the crap that they've signed with their cap space since then.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/bucks-discussed-max-contract-with-giannis-antetokounmpo-who-took-less/

[M-C-G]

Nope. Bucks saved the 5 year contract for Jabari. Like idiots.

Kid, I don't think that is true...I would have to go back and look but I think I recall something from Hammond that talked about this being the contract that Giannis and his reps wanted and as a dumb compromise, we asked him to take a little less so we could sign power houses like Hawes stretch clause, Liggins and GP2s of the world without being in the luxury.

I actually feel pretty confident that Giannis got the deal he wanted. Just enough security with 100M and right in his prime to get the next super max as soon as he can.

I never saw a single thing about it from Giannis' side, simply that the Bucks convinced him to take the 4 year deal so they could save the 5 year for Jabari and yes, sign the crap that they've signed with their cap space since then.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/bucks-discussed-max-contract-with-giannis-antetokounmpo-who-took-less/

As I recall that Hammond comment was a follow up to when the 5 year max wasn't an option, but it has been a while now. I still will contest that Giannis was getting whatever contract he wanted and if you look at what the first year of his next contract will likely play he ABSOLUTELY made the right decision. I mean Harden's extension was a 4/170M dollar deal, Steph 5/200. I mean, for a guy like Giannis, getting to that next deal is the right move. I don't think our ineptitude is what he got him there.

[yannisk]

Who cares about the letter? Let's assume that his agent put him to it so what?

The thing that is worrying is that Jabari has already a rich history of major injuries. I think it is a big risk to commit a big part of your salary cap to a guy with two ACLs . We are not too far away from contention, we need a center, a better coach and be smart with our bench. Why to risk everything? Even if he stays healthy will Jabari (especially after the injuries) be better than Middleton or Bledsoe? He is a very good offensive talent who is terrible defensively and does not do anything else particularly well.

If he does not want a team friendly contract, let him walk. Sign a quality free agent center where there is bigger need, you will end having a better team and without watching every game biting your lips every time he falls down

[Iheartfootball]

I love this board in the weirdest, most unhealthy way.