2018 Brewers Discussion - Yelich Signing on Page 45

[Turk Nowitzki]

Uh, so the Brewers have interest in Lo Cain for some reason.

Holy ****, he turns 32 in April. Where has the time gone?

[WeekapaugGroove]

Uh, so the Brewers have interest in Lo Cain for some reason.

I really hope this is nothing more than doing his agent a favor and trying to keep his name out there for team that actually want him.

[trwi7]

Signing Cain would be so **** dumb I'm almost expecting it to happen.

[Kerb Hohl]

Signing Cain would be so **** dumb I'm almost expecting it to happen.

Yes, yes. The Brewers have made so many terrible moves since Stearns came in that I, too, expect 2004-ish Bucks-type moves.

I'll add that it would be somewhat head-scratching to sign him given the current roster makeup, but in theory, if something like I presented above where we traded away Santana, Broxton, and/or Brinson if it's a 2-3 year deal, it's not so bad. We've already seen Mike Cameron put up a 4 WAR at ages 33 and 34 for the Brewers. Cain was still one of the better defenders in baseball last year and a solid hitter.

I agree that I don't think as it currently stands that it would make any sense to pursue him and I'm assuming he's just using us to drive up the asking price.

[bizarro]

Signing Cain would be so **** dumb I'm almost expecting it to happen.

Yes, yes. The Brewers have made so many terrible moves since Stearns came in that I, too, expect 2004-ish Bucks-type moves.

I'll add that it would be somewhat head-scratching to sign him given the current roster makeup, but in theory, if something like I presented above where we traded away Santana, Broxton, and/or Brinson if it's a 2-3 year deal, it's not so bad. We've already seen Mike Cameron put up a 4 WAR at ages 33 and 34 for the Brewers. Cain was still one of the better defenders in baseball last year and a solid hitter.

I agree that I don't think as it currently stands that it would make any sense to pursue him and I'm assuming he's just using us to drive up the asking price.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2018/01/brewers-trade-rumors-lorenzo-cain-keon-broxton-domingo-santana.html

Signing Cain, who rejected the Royals’ qualifying offer, would cost the Brewers their third-highest selection in the 2018 draft as well as the slot money that comes with that pick. (That would be their selectionin Competitive Balance Round B, which is currently No. 74 overall.) That’d obviously represent somewhat of a deterrent, though the Brewers may look at signing Cain and addressing their rotation via trade as a means of more financially palatable course of action than signing Jake Arrieta, Alex Cobb or Lance Lynn (each of whom would also require the forfeiture of that pick after rejecting their own QOs).

Since this article was posted apparently the Rangers have picked up their interest a considerable amount. I just do not see this deal making sense given the pick and slot money lost. We've been pretty creative with the slot money the last couple years and I'd hate to lose out on that flexibility for a year or two of a 32 yo Cain.

[wichmae]

I think the cain stuff was agent leak. It just doesnt make any sense for us.

[Thunder Muscle]

Agree on Cain making no sense and would appears (hope) it is an agent leak. I mean I have to think if Brinson has a good camp that it may be his job, or even Phillips for that matter.

I still feel Broxton will be moved if they can get anything of value. I guess the only thing is he is cheap, offers speed, and has the ability to hit for power. So maybe they keep him around for OF depth. He is just so streaky that I don't know if he would be a productive bat off the bench. I could see him being one of those .190 pinch hit average guys.

[ReasonablySober]

I can get on board with Kerb's theoretical because it's pretty logical. The Brewers are loaded up and down the minors with legit OF prospects. They could trade Brinson and Santana for boatloads. Maybe Phillips, Ray, and/or Broxton get you a good return. The point is shoring up where your team is week (staff, IF), sign a stop gap or two OF, wait for the next wave of studs to arrive in Lutz, Harrison, and Clark.

[mlloyd10]

No point in signing cain since it costs us a 3rd rd pick

[Kerb Hohl]

I can get on board with Kerb's theoretical because it's pretty logical. The Brewers are loaded up and down the minors with legit OF prospects. They could trade Brinson and Santana for boatloads. Maybe Phillips, Ray, and/or Broxton get you a good return. The point is shoring up where your team is week (staff, IF), sign a stop gap or two OF, wait for the next wave of studs to arrive in Lutz, Harrison, and Clark to arrive.

Right, and that would be the only way it happens. No way Stearns is dumb enough to sign Cain when he already has 4 MLB starting OF on the roster.

But in the end, I think that it's Cain's agent posturing.

[Kerb Hohl]

No point in signing cain since it costs us a 3rd rd pick

Trade half of farm system for several decent Royals veterans? Sure!

Give up a 3rd round pick for a 4 WAR player? No, no that's just silly.

[mlloyd10]

No point in signing cain since it costs us a 3rd rd pick

Trade half of farm system for several decent Royals veterans? Sure!

Give up a 3rd round pick for a 4 WAR player? No, no that's just silly.

I'll make this very simple for you - Cain will cost about $15-$20 mil per season for 4 years.

Half the farm system? 4 guys, none in the top 100 - OK

[Kerb Hohl]

No point in signing cain since it costs us a 3rd rd pick

Trade half of farm system for several decent Royals veterans? Sure!

Give up a 3rd round pick for a 4 WAR player? No, no that's just silly.

I'll make this very simple for you - Cain will cost about $15-$20 mil per season for 4 years.

Half the farm system? 4 guys, none in the top 100 - OK

A lot of the suggestions are coming that he may come at a bargain of 3 years.

But that's the point. We rehash this with every wannabe small market budget hawk on here. Is Wade Davis overpaid? Yes. Would Cain be? I actually think maybe not, but it's quite possible. Do they easily fit under the team's budget short and long-term with minimal other areas to spend? Yup.

But:

A. You're keeping future cheap players and

B. If it's a short-ish contract and can be afforded, it makes sense. If the Brewers are still well under Mark's budget and a free agent contract is fair, then it should not be a terrible thing. If the Brewers were a 75 win team with no youth and an already $115 million payroll for several years...then yeah, it's stupid.

We don't get to hang a banner for being an 80 win team with a $65 million payroll. At a certain point, the entire idea of getting so many other young/value players is so that you can overpay other veterans to get over the top or keep your own.

The best thing about this (yes, far-fetched at this point) scenario is that you get to keep the 4-5 prospects that maybe would've gone to KC. Instead, those 2 or 3 of guys will now play for $600k/year from 2020-2023 and be productive major leaguers.

[mlloyd10]

But he wont come cheap - He turned down the qualify offer - At minimum, hes getting 3/45

I'll take this to the bank - Over the next 3 years Brinson > Cain

But here is my wish list

1.Trade Broxton
2. Do nothing
3. Trade for Archer if it doesn't cost you Brinson/Hiura/Burnes/Peralta
4. Offer Cobb a 4/60 deal - 20/20/10/10

[Kerb Hohl]

But he wont come cheap - He turned down the qualify offer - At minimum, hes getting 3/45

I'll take this to the bank - Over the next 3 years Brinson > Cain

But here is my wish list

1.Trade Broxton
2. Do nothing
3. Trade for Archer if it doesn't cost you Brinson/Hiura/Burnes/Peralta
4. Offer Cobb a 4/60 deal - 20/20/10/10

I'd take Cain at 3/$45 assuming the other moves to clear the OF out (probably for more pitching) were made. He's worth $15 million/year even if he is getting older. Plus no comp pick would be attached if that was the case.

I'll also take your bet on Brinson/Cain. Brinson eventually may become similar to what Cain is, but I think Brinson will have some growing pain years for another year or two here while Cain will have 2-3 productive years coming out of his prime.

Brinson just scares me that he may have some contact issues early in his career.

My scenario actually suggested that you trade Santana/Broxton and play Cain in RF. That means Brinson still plays.

I think Archer will cost too much. I don't think the Rays will just give him away and there are a lot of teams bidding. He'll definitely cost some valuable prospects of ours.

[mlloyd10]

But he wont come cheap - He turned down the qualify offer - At minimum, hes getting 3/45

I'll take this to the bank - Over the next 3 years Brinson > Cain

But here is my wish list

1.Trade Broxton
2. Do nothing
3. Trade for Archer if it doesn't cost you Brinson/Hiura/Burnes/Peralta
4. Offer Cobb a 4/60 deal - 20/20/10/10

I'd take Cain at 3/$45 assuming the other moves to clear the OF out (probably for more pitching) were made. He's worth $15 million/year even if he is getting older. Plus no comp pick would be attached if that was the case.

I'll also take your bet on Brinson/Cain. Brinson eventually may become similar to what Cain is, but I think Brinson will have some growing pain years for another year or two here while Cain will have 2-3 productive years coming out of his prime.

My scenario actually suggested that you trade Santana/Broxton and play Cain in RF. That means Brinson still plays.

I think Archer will cost too much. I don't think the Rays will just give him away and there are a lot of teams bidding. He'll definitely cost some valuable prospects of ours.

Why is that?

[Kerb Hohl]

But he wont come cheap - He turned down the qualify offer - At minimum, hes getting 3/45

I'll take this to the bank - Over the next 3 years Brinson > Cain

But here is my wish list

1.Trade Broxton
2. Do nothing
3. Trade for Archer if it doesn't cost you Brinson/Hiura/Burnes/Peralta
4. Offer Cobb a 4/60 deal - 20/20/10/10

I'd take Cain at 3/$45 assuming the other moves to clear the OF out (probably for more pitching) were made. He's worth $15 million/year even if he is getting older. Plus no comp pick would be attached if that was the case.

I'll also take your bet on Brinson/Cain. Brinson eventually may become similar to what Cain is, but I think Brinson will have some growing pain years for another year or two here while Cain will have 2-3 productive years coming out of his prime.

My scenario actually suggested that you trade Santana/Broxton and play Cain in RF. That means Brinson still plays.

I think Archer will cost too much. I don't think the Rays will just give him away and there are a lot of teams bidding. He'll definitely cost some valuable prospects of ours.

Why is that?

Isn't it $50 million = comp pick now? I'm not too polished up on those rules so not sure.

[mlloyd10]

I'd take Cain at 3/$45 assuming the other moves to clear the OF out (probably for more pitching) were made. He's worth $15 million/year even if he is getting older. Plus no comp pick would be attached if that was the case.

I'll also take your bet on Brinson/Cain. Brinson eventually may become similar to what Cain is, but I think Brinson will have some growing pain years for another year or two here while Cain will have 2-3 productive years coming out of his prime.

My scenario actually suggested that you trade Santana/Broxton and play Cain in RF. That means Brinson still plays.

I think Archer will cost too much. I don't think the Rays will just give him away and there are a lot of teams bidding. He'll definitely cost some valuable prospects of ours.

Why is that?

Isn't it $50 million = comp pick now? I'm not too polished up on those rules so not sure.

Im not smart enough to under stand this

Free agents are eligible to receive a qualifying offer only if (1) they have never before in their careers received a qualifying offer, and (2) they were on the club's roster for the entire previous season (in-season acquisitions are not eligible).The draft pick compensation received by the team that loses the free agent depends on whether the club exceeded the luxury tax in the previous season, as well as whether the club received revenue sharing the previous season.

• If the team that loses a free agent after making a qualifying offer neither exceeded the luxury tax threshold nor received revenue sharing in the previous season, that team's draft pick compensation would land after Competitive Balance Round B (after the second round) of the following Draft.

• If the team that loses the free agent did exceed the luxury tax threshold the previous season, that team's compensatory pick would come after the fourth round of the Draft.

• If the team that loses the free agent was a revenue-sharing recipient the previous season, based on its revenues and market size, and if and only if the player it lost signs with another club for at least $50 million, that team's compensatory pick would land between the first round and Competitive Balance Round A of the 2018 MLB Draft. If the player signs for less than $50 million, the team that lost the player would receive draft pick compensation after Competitive Balance Round B.

[Kerb Hohl]

Whatever it is, the scenario could be:

Broxton for a reliever, Stanton (plus maybe something else not major) for a good, young/controllable starter, Cain for 3 years. Keep all or most of the prospects. To me, that's worth losing a comp pick. They'd be fine budget-wise. Win now, win later.

Anyways, none of this is likely coming anywhere close to happening. Just interesting to discuss.

[Turk Nowitzki]

Whatever it is, the scenario could be:

Broxton for a reliever, Stanton (plus maybe something else not major) for a good, young/controllable starter, Cain for 3 years. Keep all or most of the prospects. To me, that's worth losing a comp pick. They'd be fine budget-wise. Win now, win later.

Anyways, none of this is likely coming anywhere close to happening. Just interesting to discuss.

Who is Stanton? Did you mean Brinson? Or maybe I am missing something.