Mentions we are 13-17 under Triano when Devin Booker is playing. Actually, we are 13-16 if under Triano and both Booker/Warren are playing. That's not too bad. Had we fired Watson immediately after last season and had JT at beginning of the off-season perhaps we'd see a different ripple effect where Bledsoe/Booker are dynamite and we may be closer to a .500 ball club, and we'd be actively on the trade market dangling our picks.
Now people are mentioning Avery Bradley, but it may take a 1st to acquire him. I'd rather go for George Hill where we may get an additional asset back, such as 2 2nd round picks. It isn't much, but Hill would basically be expiring next year, and he played very solid basketball for the Jazz last year. Bradley would also hinder our ability to offer a max contract to a free agent in the summer of 2019 if we give Bradley any kind of contract he is looking for (likely at least $16mil a year).
Nothing for Bradley since he's a free agent. We could decide then. I think he might be a McD target. I imagine the Pistons will hold onto as they try to make the playoffs. Hill for 2nds maybe depending on cap space plans. He is shooting 47% from 3. I'd still like to see what Davon Reed can do and give him some playing time down the stretch. And Daniels can shoot the 3 (over 40%) and is cheap. Canaan hits the 3 pretty well. I don't know if Hill moves the needle over these guys much and he is really expensive and leaves us little free agent options. I think Reed deserves a chance and if Canaan and Daniels keep playing fairly well, not sure the contract cost and cap space is worth it.
You might have a point. $40m in guaranteed money over the next two seasons is a lot of money for a decent but potentially non game changing upgrade. It's risky when we already have $30m in Knight. I want to see Reed perform but I'm not optimistic that he'll be producing right away.
Nice one juice.... your positive poster hubris is showing through. So you want Booker at the point... heck, Ive been saying that for as along as anyone. But the fact remains we do not have a starting caliber PG, we barely have a 2nd string caliber PG. To continue down this pathway is a disservice. Dumping the full time PG role onto Book right now is frankly an over load. As we dont have a starting caliber guard to run with him.
There is an obligation that every GM has and that is to make moves to get better. Right now, we are in a position to make a move and get better... even a minor one like adding Reke (or?). Sure, I can see the argument against him, as well as any/other individual players... but to assume any move McD makes is short term and done just to make the playoff is equally if not more short sighted. Adding Kemba or (?), a talked about notion, isn't just about this year. If it takes some of the mighty accumulated assets to get better, then so be it.
That said, its likely we do nothing.... then hear about all we tried to do. So when that happens... just remind yourself of who our PG next year likely is.
We couldn't get Bradley (or really anyone) in the offseason if we trade for Hill unless we moved other salaries. Trading Monroe for Hill and accounting for TJ's extension would put our salaries at $98 million for the team going into the offseason, which would leave us with very little cap space to work with unless we found a way to shed one or more of Dudley, Knight, and Chandler.
With that said, Hill wouldn't be bad with his contract only being guaranteed for $1 million in 2019/2020. If we did acquire him by trading Monroe, this Free Agency/offseason might be boring, but theoretically we could have around $50M in cap available for the 2019/2020 offseason with Booker ready for his max extension and TJ, JJ, Quese, Dragan, Ulis, Reed, Sauce, and Knight all still on the books.
Frank Lee wrote:Nice one juice.... your positive poster hubris is showing through. So you want Booker at the point... heck, Ive been saying that for as along as anyone. But the fact remains we do not have a starting caliber PG, we barely have a 2nd string caliber PG. To continue down this pathway is a disservice. Dumping the full time PG role onto Book right now is frankly an over load. As we dont have a starting caliber guard to run with him.
There is an obligation that every GM has and that is to make moves to get better. Right now, we are in a position to make a move and get better... even a minor one like adding Reke (or?). Sure, I can see the argument against him, as well as any/other individual players... but to assume any move McD makes is short term and done just to make the playoff is equally if not more short sighted. Adding Kemba or (?), a talked about notion, isn't just about this year. If it takes some of the mighty accumulated assets to get better, then so be it.
That said, its likely we do nothing.... then hear about all we tried to do. So when that happens... just remind yourself of who our PG next year likely is.
I agree we don't have a starting caliber PG, but I think there are better times/ways to address it than at the trade deadline. Kemba Walker, George Hill, Tyreke Evans, etc. that are available now are not any better than Bledsoe was and don't take us to the playoffs if added at this point of year.
The reason that I say these are short-term moves is because they are on short-term contracts that will either expand or be gone. Tyreke expires this offseason and is playing his way to a decent contract, Hill is entering his 30s and is only guaranteed for $1M of his $19M in 2019/2020 so he's a prime "waive" candidate to clear up space, and Kemba is going to get the same contract we were afraid Bledsoe would get while being marginally better. I know I'm focusing on those 3, but they're the only realistic ones I can think of outside of maybe Ricky Rubio (aka 6'4" Ulis).
I'm all for addressing the PG position. I hate watching Ulis as our starter as much as anyone. Whether it's drafting one, trying to trade our pick for a big time guard to put next to Book, or chasing one in free agency, I don't care as long as it's a smart, sustainable option. I just think it's best to not chase a car we can't catch right now, and we can get more potential trade value to use toward addressing that position by holding pat. If Ulis is the starter or still getting big minutes next year, then I'm pissed.
Mentions we are 13-17 under Triano when Devin Booker is playing. Actually, we are 13-16 if under Triano and both Booker/Warren are playing. That's not too bad. Had we fired Watson immediately after last season and had JT at beginning of the off-season perhaps we'd see a different ripple effect where Bledsoe/Booker are dynamite and we may be closer to a .500 ball club, and we'd be actively on the trade market dangling our picks.
Now people are mentioning Avery Bradley, but it may take a 1st to acquire him. I'd rather go for George Hill where we may get an additional asset back, such as 2 2nd round picks. It isn't much, but Hill would basically be expiring next year, and he played very solid basketball for the Jazz last year. Bradley would also hinder our ability to offer a max contract to a free agent in the summer of 2019 if we give Bradley any kind of contract he is looking for (likely at least $16mil a year).
Nothing for Bradley since he's a free agent. We could decide then. I think he might be a McD target. I imagine the Pistons will hold onto as they try to make the playoffs. Hill for 2nds maybe depending on cap space plans. He is shooting 47% from 3. I'd still like to see what Davon Reed can do and give him some playing time down the stretch. And Daniels can shoot the 3 (over 40%) and is cheap. Canaan hits the 3 pretty well. I don't know if Hill moves the needle over these guys much and he is really expensive and leaves us little free agent options. I think Reed deserves a chance and if Canaan and Daniels keep playing fairly well, not sure the contract cost and cap space is worth it.
You might have a point. $40m in guaranteed money over the next two seasons is a lot of money for a decent but potentially non game changing upgrade. It's risky when we already have $30m in Knight. I want to see Reed perform but I'm not optimistic that he'll be producing right away.
Some reason I thought Bradley would be a restricted free agent, IDK why. I wouldn't want him though because he's likely looking for a longer term deal which is why I'm not opposed to George Hill since we could cut him after next season and only $1mil of his contract would count towards the cap for 2019-20 season. I would also prefer Hill because he's just a far more efficient player than Bradley, he has better FG% and his Assist to Turnover ratio is better as well. It's hard to go wrong with Popavich coached players too.
I think there is a reasonable discussion to be made as to the value of cap space this summer. If you believe that we have a reasonably good likelihood of signing a player better than George Hill this summer, then of course we should not trade for him. If you (like me) believe the opposite, then an exchange of Monroe for Hill (with 2nd rnd pick going either way to balance the value if necessary) would be a good move for this team.
First, Hill is an ideal fit next to Booker, and an obvious upgrade at our biggest position of need. His contact would only run through next season if we wanted it to, so the burden would not be crippling for future moves. Second, we would be capitalizing off of Monroe instead of letting him go for nothing. If Hill really really sucks, then at worst it is another expiring contract that we carry for next season with the option of using it to capitalize off of salary dump needs from other teams. Third, we become a more interesting potential Paul George destination this summer. Hill and PG are good friends and had their most successful years together. A sign and trade with the Thunder could be a realistic option (TJ+Chriss+Mia/Milwaukee pick?). Finally, adding a stable point guard like Hill will hopefully speed up the development of our young players and make them ready for playoff contention sooner than playing with Ulis/Cannon.
Avery Bradley would be a nice addition, but I don't like the idea of overpaying for a guy who I'm not convinced is that much of a difference maker. And he'll be looking for a long deal, which we should be wary of for players with no all-star potential like himself. I'd rather just play Jackson and Reed.
lilfishi22 wrote:My whole point is that TJ right now is a fine player but for us to take our game to the next level collectively, he needs to do more than just be an efficient 2PT scorer. We're going to struggle getting up to the upper echelon of the playoff brackets if our 2nd/3rd best scorer is a wing that can't shoot 3's or pass very well. It's just the way the NBA is today. You need to spread the floor for your star players to flourish and be most effective. If we want a great complementary scorer next to Booker, we need someone that can hit the 3 because Harden didn't become Harden and averaging double digit assists by playing next to guys who can't hit 3's. I want that complementary scorer to be Warren but he needs to have a reliable 3 ball if we are to be a contender.
Regarding the assists, the only 2 players who comes close to TJ in USG% is Wiggins and Harris. Neither guys are great passers but neither players a liability from the 3 either, in other words, they provide an outlet for passers. TJ doesn't pass much and he doesn't shoot the 3 ball. As I mentioned already, if we want TJ to be a 2nd option on a upper echelon playoff team, he needs to be able to pass and/or spread the floor for your #1 option.
And to say TJ is a 'different animal' means very little. He's different in that he's only very good at one thing. He's different in that he can't hit 3's like many of the top SF's. He's different in that he has a low assist rates compared to his high usage. I'm not saying he can't be on a good team but his weakness is very apparent already. When teams scout out team better and see what TJ can and can't do, it's going to be an issue for us.
Well, since I gave you 'my argument' opinion, I'm curious--no snarkiness, or attitude in this question at all--just pure curiosity. What do you think we should do during the off-season, presuming Warren does not start shooting the 3 better; I don't honestly think it's getting much better this season. Also presuming his assists hover around his current season average, as does his usage rate. Do think Warren would be amenable to a reduction in status, so long as maintains his minutes...say 28-30 per game or so? Or should McD shop him while he's 'hot' to a contender as a 6th-Manwho doesn't shoot 3s, or whatever he can market Warren as, in order to improve our pick status, obtain a pick, or package him with Monroe, maybe, and Dudley, for a young 'star in the making' and a bad contract?
I ask because if you do not see Warren as a 3rd piece on a contributor, and we want to contribute, that would mean we would 2 more contributors, and I don't think we can keep Warren, Chriss, JJ, and Bender and get two more contributors (assuming the other 3, since they are currently 'worse' than Warren, are not your idea of a contributor either? Maybe JJ improves, and one of Chriss and Bender to become the #2 and #3 guys..
I personally think we need a stud at PG, and then #s 2 & 3 can come from other positions. But maybe not? I guess I am just wondering what your ideas or ideal scenarios are to pair with Booker to become our 'Big 3', and, can Warren exist on this type of team in Phoenix if he isn't part of it (basically, he not being a starter...if we have a Big 3, and he's not one of the 3, yet he's a starter, then we have a Big 4 that no one recognizes as such, I guess, because he'll still be, at worst, an 18/5 guy).
We keep going as is but if a good deal comes along for us to get better, we should look into it even if it includes TJ. I don't think we're an upper echelon playoff team for a couple of seasons unless our young guys really start contributing consistently ala the Boston young'ins and another star comes along and we have an opportunity to nab this player. I'm trying to mentally put Warren on one of the top playoff teams and I can't see him better than a 3rd option at best with his weaknesses.
I'm not suggesting we trade him because we're not "there" yet and he could still develop consistency from the 3 and he could become a bit more of a playmaker (we've seen some flashes). But if an opportunity does present itself, I'd look into it. Before we get to the upper echelon, we need to be a playoff team and TJ should be fine until then.
Sadly, I'd have to agree. I love Warren and his game, and I especially love the contract we have him on for the next 4+ years. But at the same time, that contract, along with his scoring ability, have to make him a very marketable commodity, and if it's the difference between keeping Warren and NOT getting the All-Star, or vice-versa, we have to take the All-Star.
What I would be upset about is if we traded him for draft picks, or an improvement in our draft pick 'status', since we know Warren is a fantastic contributor, and I would hate to trade a known 'Valued Commodity' for an unknown, in the sense, of course, that Chandler, Dudley, BK, etc. are not ' Value-less Commodities', for us, at least.
But if at the trade deadline, for instance, and this is just an example, not a 'desired scenario' I am painting, but let's say the Sixers are fighting for that 8th seed, and Covington goes down with an injury. If the Sixers came to us and said, 'Hey, we need a SF to finish the season, and you all need a PG. How about we trade you Markell Fultz for TJ Warren + '18 Mia 1st?' In a scenario like that, where they know they'd be getting a fantastic 1-2 punch at SF for years to come at a reasonable cost, and for the rest of this season, they have a guy that ensures they maintain their Playoff push, and we get our potential PG of the future, we'd almost have to take advantage of something like that.
LukasBMW wrote: He's a shot blocking big with post moves and a 3 point shot. Plus he plays with intensity. He'd be a serious problem at the 5 alongside of Chriss or Bender.
I'd trade one of Chriss/Bender + Jackson + picks for him in a heartbeat.
Miami, Miami, Bucks, and a top 5 protected Suns pick would be OK with me.
But I bet Indiana still says "NO" to that.
He shoots 33% from 3, isn't a particularly good rebounder and shoots less than 50% from the field. He is a pretty good shot blocker and I like him as a player but Bender is shooting far better from 3 this year and I think he could eventually be close to as good of a shot blocker and is probably a better perimeter defender.
But most of all, we may be able to get a C in the draft who has the potential to be better. I've always liked Myles Turner but that is a drastic overpay.
My dreams of finding our next great center in this draft have gone out the window with our recent winning streak.
LAC (Gets something for Jordan) -Monroe -Bucks 1st (via suns -2 second rounders from the Suns
Indiana (Dumps contracts, get two picks, a young player with potential, and a legit center) -Jordan -Jackson -Suns 2018 1st -Miami 2018 1st
Phoenix (Gets their 5 of the future, takes on some salary) -Myles Turner -Al Jefferson -Thad Young
So we lose Jackson, 3 1st rounders (Miami 18, Bucks 1st, Suns 18), and 2 seconds.
PG Knightmare/Ulis SG Booker/Daniels/Reed SF TJ/Thad PF Chriss/Bender C Myles/Len/Sauce
Chandler, Dudley, Jefferson all rot on the bench collecting golden parachute money. Then we make a run at a PG via trade or 2019 free agency when Dudley, Chandler, Jefferson all come off the books.
This just grates me to no end...not your trade scenario; it's not that bad, or anything. I personally am not crazy about it, just to get a Center, but my point is, we have Len, and while yes, Myles is a better option, he's not 3 1sts and JJ better...not even close. Yet we are just going to let Len walk out his merry way...
Look at the comparison, and yes, I get it's not all about stats, but Len is better than his stats in some ways, too...
It just makes ZERO sense why we are not starting Len this year, over Chandler. We can ONLY gain from it. Chandler can be traded to a contender and we can attempt to rebuild any goodwill possible with Len, and maybe re-sign him at year's end.
But instead, we are making trade proposals for a Center that, in reality, isn't all that much better than what we have in house, and are offering 3 x 1sts and our #4 overall pick from less than a year ago. To me, that's a poor investment.
Again, Lukas, this isn't on you or your proposal, per se, but more on our fearless leader.
Walt_Uoob wrote:I'll have to pay more attention to Bradley next time I get the chance. His stats don't jump off the page but if he's a true game-changer defensively and a three-point specialist on offense I could see that working with Booker. Is Bradley expected to draw a big contract? If we could get him for Warren-level money then he seems like a nice complementary piece, but if he's expecting $20m+ per year I'm not sure how you build a contender around that.
It would also be funny to see us go from three point guards to basically none, with three shooting guards (Bradley, Booker, Knight) instead.
I think the settlement over the alleged sexual assault is likely to dampen his value a bit (which is what my #metoo comment above was referring to).
bwgood77 wrote: He shoots 33% from 3, isn't a particularly good rebounder and shoots less than 50% from the field. He is a pretty good shot blocker and I like him as a player but Bender is shooting far better from 3 this year and I think he could eventually be close to as good of a shot blocker and is probably a better perimeter defender.
But most of all, we may be able to get a C in the draft who has the potential to be better. I've always liked Myles Turner but that is a drastic overpay.
My dreams of finding our next great center in this draft have gone out the window with our recent winning streak.
LAC (Gets something for Jordan) -Monroe -Bucks 1st (via suns -2 second rounders from the Suns
Indiana (Dumps contracts, get two picks, a young player with potential, and a legit center) -Jordan -Jackson -Suns 2018 1st -Miami 2018 1st
Phoenix (Gets their 5 of the future, takes on some salary) -Myles Turner -Al Jefferson -Thad Young
So we lose Jackson, 3 1st rounders (Miami 18, Bucks 1st, Suns 18), and 2 seconds.
PG Knightmare/Ulis SG Booker/Daniels/Reed SF TJ/Thad PF Chriss/Bender C Myles/Len/Sauce
Chandler, Dudley, Jefferson all rot on the bench collecting golden parachute money. Then we make a run at a PG via trade or 2019 free agency when Dudley, Chandler, Jefferson all come off the books.
This just grates me to no end...not your trade scenario; it's not that bad, or anything. I personally am not crazy about it, just to get a Center, but my point is, we have Len, and while yes, Myles is a better option, he's not 3 1sts and JJ better...not even close. Yet we are just going to let Len walk out his merry way...
Look at the comparison, and yes, I get it's not all about stats, but Len is better than his stats in some ways, too...
It just makes ZERO sense why we are not starting Len this year, over Chandler. We can ONLY gain from it. Chandler can be traded to a contender and we can attempt to rebuild any goodwill possible with Len, and maybe re-sign him at year's end.
But instead, we are making trade proposals for a Center that, in reality, isn't all that much better than what we have in house, and are offering 3 x 1sts and our #4 overall pick from less than a year ago. To me, that's a poor investment.
Again, Lukas, this isn't on you or your proposal, per se, but more on our fearless leader.
I like Len, far more than most, and always said I'd give him a small contract. But he has regressed a bit as rim protector at 1 rpg and 1.6 per 36 and has been focusing more on right things offensively, but is still inconsistent. Can be great rebounder but not always is.
Not sure why he doesn't start but there could be a lot of reasons. Maybe Booker and starters play better with Chandler, the vet presence out there and Chandler is under contract this year. Triano has said he really helps with starters directing defensive rotations. Monroe helps with assists, which is good given our lack of assists and PG. Len is good with second unit.
I know you have mentioned Len does better when starting and more minutes, which is true for a lot of players, but players simply should do well in whatever role they have (and Triano likes him with the bench). Anyway, he may not re-sign anyway and we may find a better rim protector and shooter in the draft. Jackson Jr probably already projects as a better defender, rim protector and can hit the 3. Bamba actually a great rim protector. Plenty of Cs in free agency.
Bender may start looking better at C...if he fills out I think he will be a better shot blocker, defender and can stretch the floor and hit the 3. Play Tyson when need vet/traditional and Bender for small ball if you don't draft one or sign one. We might sign someone cheap like Dedmon if Atlanta drafts Ayton or Bamba...who knows. No need to keep harping on Len....I think we know your opinions on the matter...same goes for Warren. I agree with a lot of it but I don't think anything said is new at this point, or has been for awhile.
LAC (Gets something for Jordan) -Monroe -Bucks 1st (via suns -2 second rounders from the Suns
Indiana (Dumps contracts, get two picks, a young player with potential, and a legit center) -Jordan -Jackson -Suns 2018 1st -Miami 2018 1st
Phoenix (Gets their 5 of the future, takes on some salary) -Myles Turner -Al Jefferson -Thad Young
So we lose Jackson, 3 1st rounders (Miami 18, Bucks 1st, Suns 18), and 2 seconds.
PG Knightmare/Ulis SG Booker/Daniels/Reed SF TJ/Thad PF Chriss/Bender C Myles/Len/Sauce
Chandler, Dudley, Jefferson all rot on the bench collecting golden parachute money. Then we make a run at a PG via trade or 2019 free agency when Dudley, Chandler, Jefferson all come off the books.
This just grates me to no end...not your trade scenario; it's not that bad, or anything. I personally am not crazy about it, just to get a Center, but my point is, we have Len, and while yes, Myles is a better option, he's not 3 1sts and JJ better...not even close. Yet we are just going to let Len walk out his merry way...
Look at the comparison, and yes, I get it's not all about stats, but Len is better than his stats in some ways, too...
It just makes ZERO sense why we are not starting Len this year, over Chandler. We can ONLY gain from it. Chandler can be traded to a contender and we can attempt to rebuild any goodwill possible with Len, and maybe re-sign him at year's end.
But instead, we are making trade proposals for a Center that, in reality, isn't all that much better than what we have in house, and are offering 3 x 1sts and our #4 overall pick from less than a year ago. To me, that's a poor investment.
Again, Lukas, this isn't on you or your proposal, per se, but more on our fearless leader.
I like Len, far more than most, and always said I'd give him a small contract. But he has regressed a bit as rim protector at 1 rpg and 1.6 per 36 and has been focusing more on right things offensively, but is still inconsistent. Can be great rebounder but not always is.
Not sure why he doesn't start but there could be a lot of reasons. Maybe Booker and starters play better with Chandler, the vet presence out there and Chandler is under contract this year. Triano has said he really helps with starters directing defensive rotations. Monroe helps with assists, which is good given our lack of assists and PG. Len is good with second unit.
I know you have mentioned Len does better when starting and more minutes, which is true for a lot of players, but players simply should do well in whatever role they have (and Triano likes him with the bench). Anyway, he may not re-sign anyway and we may find a better rim protector and shooter in the draft. Jackson Jr probably already projects as a better defender, rim protector and can hit the 3. Bamba actually a great rim protector. Plenty of Cs in free agency.
Bender may start looking better at C...if he fills out I think he will be a better shot blocker, defender and can stretch the floor and hit the 3. Play Tyson when need vet/traditional and Bender for small ball if you don't draft one or sign one. We might sign someone cheap like Dedmon if Atlanta drafts Ayton or Bamba...who knows. No need to keep harping on Len....I think we know your opinions on the matter...same goes for Warren. I agree with a lot of it but I don't think anything said is new at this point, or has been for awhile.
I think Len remains a pretty good rim protector, based on the eye test. Certainly miles ahead of Chandler.
I think the reason Chandler starts over Len is the turnovers, the unsteadiness, the bad hands, and the lack of toughness relative to Chandler. I was surprised how much more effective Chandler was against Adams the other night. But that's just it with Len - he's had very good games against Jordan, Drummond, Adams, and then on other occasions he gets worked.
Maybe if Bender gets the starting gig, Alex will be elevated to the starting role also, considering how well they play together.
A lot of those questions surround Whiteside, who hasn't looked right since returning from a bone bruise in his knee. The Heat play a crisper style with Olynyk at center, and they have left Whiteside on the bench in crunch time of almost every recent game.
"It's tough, but I don't want to get caught up in it," Whiteside says. "We're winning. But of course you want to be out there."
Johnson is Miami's best power forward, and spacing gets cramped when he and Whiteside share the floor; defenders slough away from Johnson to clog Whiteside's rim-runs. Spoelstra has upped the shooting by starting Olynyk and Whiteside together, and bringing Johnson off the bench. It's awkward. Olynyk has to defend power forwards or wings. The Heat are minus-24 in the 118 minutes Whiteside and Olynyk have shared the floor, per NBA.com. Olynyk's shooting unlocks the Dragic-Whiteside spread pick-and-roll, but the Heat offense -- still just 23rd in points per possession after fattening up on an easy schedule over the past month -- can't subsist on a steady diet of that.
Spoelstra prefers more ball and player movement. The offense comes alive when Spoelstra shifts Olynyk to center alongside Johnson. Those groups feature at least four solid shooters, and sometimes five playmakers. Johnson is the supreme connector, skittering from one side to the other with a delightful, unselfish hyperactivity. He can effectively play center, setting screens and rolling with four shooters around him.
Whiteside's post game has atrophied. He has hit just 41.8 percent of post-up attempts, per Synergy, 43rd among 52 players who have attempted at least 50 such shots. Factor in fouls drawn, turnovers, and kickout passes that lead to shots, andWhiteside has been one of the half-dozen least productive post-up players in the league, per data from Second Spectrum.
Spoelstra of late has moved toward a closing lineup of Richardson, Dragic, Ellington, James Johnson, and Olynyk. Whether the Heat can survive on defense with Olynyk at center is an open question,but that five-man group has blitzed teams so far.
It is notable for whom it does not include: Whiteside, Justise Winslow, and Dion Waiters.
Together, Winslow and Whiteside form Miami's best realistic trade package -- their only means of a huge talent upgrade. (The Heat have shown zero interest in moving Dragic, per league sources.) The Heat could dangle them for a star center on an expiring contract -- DeAndre Jordan or DeMarcus Cousins. Miami has an appetite for that kind of gamble; they feel they can sell any willing rental on Heat culture -- plus tax benefits and weather. The word "willing" is key there. Miami's ultra-physical, workaholic culture isn't for everyone; there at a least a few players in the league who would hesitate to sign there if they had an equal offer elsewhere, per league sources.
Even so, before the season, Whiteside for Cousins was my favorite potential fake trade in the league, though it required New Orleans falling out of the playoff race. The Pelicans have hung in. Meanwhile, the trade values of Whiteside and Winslow are cratering at exactly the wrong moment. Very few teams need centers.
As far as what Avery Bradley is going to get this summer if it was two years ago I would say he get's 18-20M per year easily. This summer I'm not so sure about that. His best bet is the Pistons like him and offer him a nice deal but if they choose to go in another direction it gets very unpredictable.
Unless the cap dramatically goes up there won't be a ton of teams with a ton of cap space this summer. That's why I'm leery to do a deal for a guy like Hill. Due to the lack of space the Suns would have a real opportunity to either chase a big name who might not have as many options as years past or they could wait and see who's left standing after the initial wave of FA musical chairs and try to scoop up a bargain. Plus at that point the draft will be done and they should have a very clear picture of their short and long terms needs.
Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming Wow! What a Ride!-H.S.T.
bwgood77 wrote: He shoots 33% from 3, isn't a particularly good rebounder and shoots less than 50% from the field. He is a pretty good shot blocker and I like him as a player but Bender is shooting far better from 3 this year and I think he could eventually be close to as good of a shot blocker and is probably a better perimeter defender.
But most of all, we may be able to get a C in the draft who has the potential to be better. I've always liked Myles Turner but that is a drastic overpay.
My dreams of finding our next great center in this draft have gone out the window with our recent winning streak.
LAC (Gets something for Jordan) -Monroe -Bucks 1st (via suns -2 second rounders from the Suns
Indiana (Dumps contracts, get two picks, a young player with potential, and a legit center) -Jordan -Jackson -Suns 2018 1st -Miami 2018 1st
Phoenix (Gets their 5 of the future, takes on some salary) -Myles Turner -Al Jefferson -Thad Young
So we lose Jackson, 3 1st rounders (Miami 18, Bucks 1st, Suns 18), and 2 seconds.
PG Knightmare/Ulis SG Booker/Daniels/Reed SF TJ/Thad PF Chriss/Bender C Myles/Len/Sauce
Chandler, Dudley, Jefferson all rot on the bench collecting golden parachute money. Then we make a run at a PG via trade or 2019 free agency when Dudley, Chandler, Jefferson all come off the books.
This just grates me to no end...not your trade scenario; it's not that bad, or anything. I personally am not crazy about it, just to get a Center, but my point is, we have Len, and while yes, Myles is a better option, he's not 3 1sts and JJ better...not even close. Yet we are just going to let Len walk out his merry way...
Look at the comparison, and yes, I get it's not all about stats, but Len is better than his stats in some ways, too...
It just makes ZERO sense why we are not starting Len this year, over Chandler. We can ONLY gain from it. Chandler can be traded to a contender and we can attempt to rebuild any goodwill possible with Len, and maybe re-sign him at year's end.
But instead, we are making trade proposals for a Center that, in reality, isn't all that much better than what we have in house, and are offering 3 x 1sts and our #4 overall pick from less than a year ago. To me, that's a poor investment.
Again, Lukas, this isn't on you or your proposal, per se, but more on our fearless leader.
I agree, I like Turner quite a bit but he's not worth anything close to 3 1st rd picks and Jackson. Maybe if the Pacers also sent back Sabonis or something.
"Now everybody wanna play for the heat and the Lakers? Let's go back to being competitive and going at these peoples!" - Kevin Durant
