Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion Pt. 4

[WeekapaugGroove]

I'd really have to think about this before saying I would do it but what if the Lakers offered Clarkson, Nance, and Deng's corpse for Monroe and Knight? Both Clarkson and Nance are young and could be useful players for the Suns moving forward. Taking Deng's contract is a hard pill to swallow but it has the same amount of years as Knight at about $4M per year more those final two years so it's really not a huge impact cap wise.

For the Lakers it clears about 17M off the books next summer and even more if they decide to stretch Knight. I'm sure they would like to get more for Nance but realistically this something like this is the only way Deng could be moved.

[BobbieL]

I'd really have to think about this before saying I would do it but what if the Lakers offered Clarkson, Nance, and Deng's corpse for Monroe and Knight? Both Clarkson and Nance are young and could be useful players for the Suns moving forward. Taking Deng's contract is a hard pill to swallow but it has the same amount of years as Knight at about $4M per year more those final two years so it's really not a huge impact cap wise.

For the Lakers it clears about 17M off the books next summer and even more if they decide to stretch Knight. I'm sure they would like to get more for Nance but realistically this something like this is the only way Deng could be moved.

Clarkson eats into the cap space next year and beyond. Nance is on a good deal

You are correct about Knight v Deng - so that's almost a wash

It would help the Lakers out tremendously. Granted they don't want to finish bottom 5 as they lose the pick.

[Stark]

I'd really have to think about this before saying I would do it but what if the Lakers offered Clarkson, Nance, and Deng's corpse for Monroe and Knight? Both Clarkson and Nance are young and could be useful players for the Suns moving forward. Taking Deng's contract is a hard pill to swallow but it has the same amount of years as Knight at about $4M per year more those final two years so it's really not a huge impact cap wise.

For the Lakers it clears about 17M off the books next summer and even more if they decide to stretch Knight. I'm sure they would like to get more for Nance but realistically this something like this is the only way Deng could be moved.

Yep i have also considered him as a possible trade candidate but we have two young pf prospect and as a pf who can't shoot he doesn't have much role in today's league, can he play small ball 5 ? Playing with a 5 who can shoot is probably the best way to use him. Maybe if we trade Chriss and give Bender the starting role, he can be a back-up PF and we could use some lineups with Bender-Nance as the frontcourt but still... kinda meh situation if you also think about Deng's contract. Lakers should give more valuable pieces.

Btw speaking of centers who can stretch the floor. Don't shoot me but probably the player that i would want to trade most from the Heat roster is Olynyk. I'm a sucker for spacing guys sorry. Booker-Jackson-Warren-Bender-Olynyk line-up would be something that i wanted to see.

[gaspar]

I'd really have to think about this before saying I would do it but what if the Lakers offered Clarkson, Nance, and Deng's corpse for Monroe and Knight? Both Clarkson and Nance are young and could be useful players for the Suns moving forward. Taking Deng's contract is a hard pill to swallow but it has the same amount of years as Knight at about $4M per year more those final two years so it's really not a huge impact cap wise.

For the Lakers it clears about 17M off the books next summer and even more if they decide to stretch Knight. I'm sure they would like to get more for Nance but realistically this something like this is the only way Deng could be moved.

That's **** horrendous. Knight for Clarkson is a wash. Clarkson makes $2-3M per year less, but Knight is actually a much better passer (he really is!) and 3-point shooter than Clarkson. Then you have the Suns swallow Deng's contract, which means the Suns can't sign anyone for the next 3 years... All that for what? A career backup in Nance Jr? That's ridiculous.

[WeekapaugGroove]

I should have probably noted I view Larry Nance as a C. I kind of like him in that rim runner P&R type set up with a stretch 4 like Bender or Chriss next to him. Now I do get that's not the biggest front court and could have issues with the really big traditional C's.

Edit: So I just realized that Nance is only 6'8... for some reason I had it in my head he was closer to 6'11. So yeah scrap this idea... I'm an idiot.



Just a suggestion but maybe all the TJ Warren discussion should go in the TJ Warren thread.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I should have probably noted I view Larry Nance as a C. I kind of like him in that rim runner P&R type set up with a stretch 4 like Bender or Chriss next to him. Now I do get that's not the biggest front court and could have issues with the really big traditional C's.

Just a suggestion but maybe all the TJ Warren discussion should go in the TJ Warren thread.

I might be with you if I could see Nance as our 5 of the future, but I can't. Clarkson is an upgrade over Knight with fewer years remaining. But Deng's contract might be the worst in the league at this point. We're just not getting a return that makes sense for swallowing that. Compare it to the Mozgov deal - they had to throw DLo in to make that happen. No reason to do this unless we're getting that kind of value in return.

(And for the record, I wouldn't do it for DLo either, as I don't see him as a good fit next to Booker/with the rest of our crew.)

Flexibility gives you the leverage in these sorts of situations. I'm happy to sit on it.

[Biff]

This just grates me to no end...not your trade scenario; it's not that bad, or anything. I personally am not crazy about it, just to get a Center, but my point is, we have Len, and while yes, Myles is a better option, he's not 3 1sts and JJ better...not even close. Yet we are just going to let Len walk out his merry way...

http://bkref.com/tiny/gvVnj

Look at the comparison, and yes, I get it's not all about stats, but Len is better than his stats in some ways, too...

It just makes ZERO sense why we are not starting Len this year, over Chandler. We can ONLY gain from it. Chandler can be traded to a contender and we can attempt to rebuild any goodwill possible with Len, and maybe re-sign him at year's end.

But instead, we are making trade proposals for a Center that, in reality, isn't all that much better than what we have in house, and are offering 3 x 1sts and our #4 overall pick from less than a year ago. To me, that's a poor investment.

Again, Lukas, this isn't on you or your proposal, per se, but more on our fearless leader.

I agree, I like Turner quite a bit but he's not worth anything close to 3 1st rd picks and Jackson. Maybe if the Pacers also sent back Sabonis or something.

That is the thing, Sabonis is legit. Maybe...just maybe they decide they want to pay Sabonis more then Myles and trade Myles for a wing? One can dream. But with position-less basketball, having Sabonis and Myles up front is killer for them.

I agree, I also think Sabonis is legit. If we could get Myles for a 1st and Jackson, I'd probably swing for it. But 3 1's and Jackson is a bit too much. I think JJ will be fine, he just needs to work on his shot. If he can become even a 33-35% 3pt shooter, he'll be a good player. He should go see that guy Oladipo trained with because the dude helped him take a huge leap.

[gaspar]

I should have probably noted I view Larry Nance as a C. I kind of like him in that rim runner P&R type set up with a stretch 4 like Bender or Chriss next to him. Now I do get that's not the biggest front court and could have issues with the really big traditional C's.

Just a suggestion but maybe all the TJ Warren discussion should go in the TJ Warren thread.

I might be with you if I could see Nance as our 5 of the future, but I can't. Clarkson is an upgrade over Knight with fewer years remaining. But Deng's contract might be the worst in the league at this point. We're just not getting a return that makes sense for swallowing that. Compare it to the Mozgov deal - they had to throw DLo in to make that happen. No reason to do this unless we're getting that kind of value in return.

(And for the record, I wouldn't do it for DLo either, as I don't see him as a good fit next to Booker/with the rest of our crew.)

Flexibility gives you the leverage in these sorts of situations. I'm happy to sit on it.

Clarkson is not an upgrade over Knight and they both have the same length of contracts.

[NavLDO]

I'd either do:
A) Bucks 1st and Knight for Tyreke
This would be a good ROI *if* we could sign a max contract free agent a la Cousins and then after we're done with our off-season dealings (also add Lin?) sign Tyreke to a 4 year deal regardless our cap situation.
The year after we'll have cap space available again with Chandler/Dudley off the books while having Booker, Cousins, Evans, Lin, Warren, Bender etc all locked in.

A lineup of Lin-Booker-Evans-Bender-Cousins would be insane. 3 point shooting and passing from all 5 positions. All but Bender can create their own shot.
If we need more D play Booker-Evans-Jackson-Bender-Cousins.

B) Just offer Tyreke a monster 1 year deal in the off-season.

But Tyreke is a 41% 3PT shooter this year. WITH that included, he's a 31% Career guy. Looks awfully similar to another guy I know on our roster...name beings with 'War'...

Basically, we'll see how he ends up at year's end, but 9 seasons in the NBA, and he's had 1 good season, and 1/2 a great one. He will be worth more than what he got paid this off-season, but no need to break the bank on a guy like that, IMO. I'd rather stick with Daniels for our ancillary 3PT shooting, hope that Reed can fill in some holes, and draft a rookie, and save our money...OR...get a younger guy.

And how would we afford Cousins with both Chandler and BK still on the roster...AND paying out another big contract. That's impossible. What McD really needs to do, IMO, is shed Chandler's and Dudley's contracts before the Deadline; we're stuck with BK.

So, with 9 players (Knight, Warren, Jackson, Williams, Bender, Booker, Daniels, Chriss, and Reed), added up, that equals $52.7M. With 11 players, with Dudley and Chandler in the mix, it's $76M. This assumes we break off from Monroe (of course), Ulis, Canaan, Len, House, and Peters.

This where I lose all credibility/knowledge with Cap space, so those that know this stuff will have to correct my mistakes, but assuming Len signs elsewhere, we trade Monroe (hopefully) or he walks (which is STUPID to me, but whatever, even for a 2nd, I'd take it), Ulis is 'thanked for his services' but let go, and same with Canaan, House, and Peters is kept on a 2-way, if we are 'stuck' with Dudley and Chandler, we will have $76M on the books. Then add in 2 x 1st Rd Draft pick Holds, which I'll just say will be about $5M, assuming we get the 8th and 22nd picks, so that's $81M. The Cap is expected to be $101M, which leaves us just $20M.

$20M will not be enough for a Max Contract for a currently 'off-the-team player'. If we can unload Chandler, that number goes up to a little over $62M, I believe. If we keep Chandler but trade Dudley, we'll have almost $66.5, and again,it drops to below $53M, and gives us $47M if both are gone. I'm not sure when we need to 'pay' Booker, and get him a new contract, but it will be soon, but I think that is where the Luxury Tax works for us, because we are allowed to go over to sign our own players.

So, my point is, and why I've been 'harping' on why this is a critical off-season is because Booker will soon be deciding whether that 5th year really matters if he's gong to be on a perennial loser...PLUS, once we pay him the MAX, we lose a lot of flexibility to bring in top-tier FAs or All-Stars via trade.

So, If I've royally bungled this, I apologize, but I believe we need to be very careful this off-season and not pay the likes of a Hill or Dragic or in this case, a Tyreke, because saying we'll just wait 'til next off-season, I believe, is no longer a possibility for us; it needs to happen, IMO, before the Trade-Deadline next season, because the off-season following, I believe, is when we throw stupid money at Booker and hope he takes it...

So, if I am off-base, please let me know, again, but I believe this is how it needs to play out, so this is the year to go after our 'Boogie'-type player...

[lilfishi22]

You might have a point. $40m in guaranteed money over the next two seasons is a lot of money for a decent but potentially non game changing upgrade. It's risky when we already have $30m in Knight. I want to see Reed perform but I'm not optimistic that he'll be producing right away.

I'm all for McD finding a way to use our Cap space to the maximum of it's capacity...this season. But if it ties our hands AFTER this season?? I am 100% against it, unless, of course, the player we bring in is one McD sees being in our long-term plans and is either a rising star or a young star. But tying up our Cap space next season for a 30+ year old 'borderline starter' type, regardless of who it is...well, I personally think that would be a huge mistake. We don't need anymore Vets at any positions; Canaan seems to be exactly what we need for the short term.

If we can augment 'him' with an extra youngster who is better than Ulis from a team with seemingly deep pockets at the PG position, say Chicago with Jerian Grant, Denver with Mudiay, Brooklyn with Dinwiddie/Russell, Bucks with Brogdon, Sixers with McConnell, or the Blazers with Napier, then that would be fantastic, and McD should be exploring those options.

But guys like Hill, Rubio, Conley, Dragic, etc., that will only help us short term, stagnate our rebuild, and put us right back where we are in a few years when they retire, and, oh BTW, not take us to the Finals because they aren't really that good, is counter-intuitive to what we are trying to do here, IMO. I would just as soon wait until next season and start fresh with a new rookie PG that will grow with the youngsters we have, and keep BK until we can upgrade him.

Agree to a certain extent. The reason I wouldn't mind Hill or even Dragic is because they are both fairly efficient players and their contracts don't run past next season. I'm not sure with the way the roster is currently constructed that any big name free agents this off-season want to join us. Now, maybe next season we are playing .500 ball and we are getting positive criticism from the media and all-stars are starting to take notice, maybe then we can use such contracts (Hill, Chandler, Dudley) to upgrade our roster via trade or even in the 2019 off-season to sign some top tier free agents.

This is why I'm against trading for Conley since his contract is longer than that, and even Whiteside. Whiteside also seems to have character issues and I'm not sure he really cares too much about winning a championship. Now if we were to trade for Whiteside and Dragic and kept our youth, then I think we would have a fairly balanced roster however we'd have to expect a lot of internal development from the younger guys to be considered contenders.

Tough position to be in really, but I think I'd prefer to just stand pat right now, and maybe see if we can go after Aaron Gordon in the off-season. I know he's a RFA, but maybe he pulls a Joe Johnson and says he doesn't want to stay in Orlando and we do a sign-&-trade deal. The Magic are likely to keep him but they do have a new GM so perhaps they want a fresh start without anymore big contracts looming.

If not AG then Boogie is the other obvious choice, but he'd have to see see that we are capable of being a playoff team next year. I'm actually hoping the Pelicans make the playoffs this year and just get swept in the first round so Boogie sees that they really don't have any room for improvement since they would be capped out if he stays in New Orleans.

Yeah I agree. I don't mind adding salary that rolls into next season. Goran is a guy who imo could make a decent impact and likely elevate the games of both Booker (via his passing and ball handling) and Warren (via being another scoring threat). The issue is he's expensive and I think it's likely he'll pick up his $19m option in 2020. I think Hill is a decent gamble. Still expensive but he's only guaranteed $1m in 2020 so we can cut him if he's not playing well or if we need cap space in 2020.

I don't really feel like big time (max) FA's are likely to join us. I think Booker is a major consideration (as a player and recruiter) but I don't think the rest of the roster is especially enticing. I love the idea of Aaron Gordon but I feel like the Magic will match any deal for him. He's still super young, just turned things around and they have cap space.

I'm on the fence with Boogie. I feel like he's in his prime now and wants to win. I don't think a Boogie/Booker team is there yet with the rest of this roster and with him I don't think we have much room to make moves. As a player, I think he could be the perfect big man for this team. Booker's outside game complements Boogie better than AD so I wouldn't be opposed to going after Boogie in the offseason but if we didn't go that way, I'd be OK as well

[Cutter]

A lot of people believe that, on the business side of basketball, Booker loves being the man and the face of the franchise and is committed to being a Sun for the long haul. That we can take our time tanking year after year and Booker will not request a trade even if we are a continual bottom feeding team.

I think we need to be very careful with this assumption. OKC Thunder fans thought it is was impossible that Kevin Durant would ever leave. Thunder were at one time a tanker's paradise: having a horrible record year after year and drafting stud Kevin Durant, stud Russell Westbrook, stud James Harden, and semi-stud Serge Ibaka. The Thunder for a while were the poster boys for tanking. Yet they could never get the team to a position where they could be perennial contenders for a title even with all that talent. Eventually ego and salary demands forced the trade of Harden and Durant left a couple of years later. Their tank experiment ultimately failed.

Suns need to build around Booker, bring in some young-vets (24-28 years old) via trading of existing talent and draft picks, and bring in some older-vets for stability. Get the team good enough for the 6th-8th spot in the playoffs, then an superstar might consider joining the Suns in trade or FA (see Charles Barkley traded to the Suns). That we are going to somehow tank-and-draft our way to a championship (like the Thunder tried to do) requires a leap of faith that I just can't accept. Suns better be careful about not alienating Booker with this current #timeline silliness.

[Jdiddy701]

A lot of people believe that, on the business side of basketball, Booker loves being the man and the face of the franchise and is committed to being a Sun for the long haul. That we can take our time tanking year after year and Booker will not request a trade even if we are a continual bottom feeding team.

I think we need to be very careful with this assumption. OKC Thunder fans thought it is was impossible that Kevin Durant would ever leave. Thunder were at one time a tanker's paradise: having a horrible record year after year and drafting stud Kevin Durant, stud Russell Westbrook, stud James Harden, and semi-stud Serge Ibaka. The Thunder for a while were the poster boys for tanking. Yet they could never get the team to a position where they could be perennial contenders for a title even with all that talent. Eventually ego and salary demands forced the trade of Harden and Durant left a couple of years later. Their tank experiment ultimately failed.

Suns need to build around Booker, bring in some young-vets (24-28 years old) via trading of existing talent and draft picks, and bring in some older-vets for stability. Get the team good enough for the 6th-8th spot in the playoffs, then an superstar might consider joining the Suns in trade or FA (see Charles Barkley traded to the Suns). That we are going to somehow tank-and-draft our way to a championship (like the Thunder tried to do) requires a leap of faith that I just can't accept. Suns better be careful about not alienating Booker with this current #timeline silliness.

This has to be the best post on this forum ever, couldn’t agree more.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[lilfishi22]

A lot of people believe that, on the business side of basketball, Booker loves being the man and the face of the franchise and is committed to being a Sun for the long haul. That we can take our time tanking year after year and Booker will not request a trade even if we are a continual bottom feeding team.

I think we need to be very careful with this assumption. OKC Thunder fans thought it is was impossible that Kevin Durant would ever leave. Thunder were at one time a tanker's paradise: having a horrible record year after year and drafting stud Kevin Durant, stud Russell Westbrook, stud James Harden, and semi-stud Serge Ibaka. The Thunder for a while were the poster boys for tanking. Yet they could never get the team to a position where they could be perennial contenders for a title even with all that talent. Eventually ego and salary demands forced the trade of Harden and Durant left a couple of years later. Their tank experiment ultimately failed.

Suns need to build around Booker, bring in some young-vets (24-28 years old) via trading of existing talent and draft picks, and bring in some older-vets for stability. Get the team good enough for the 6th-8th spot in the playoffs, then an superstar might consider joining the Suns in trade or FA (see Charles Barkley traded to the Suns). That we are going to somehow tank-and-draft our way to a championship (like the Thunder tried to do) requires a leap of faith that I just can't accept. Suns better be careful about not alienating Booker with this current #timeline silliness.

+1

This is exactly why I've argued we need to revisit the "Timeline". The Timeline was a fine plan when you literally had nothing but picks and good but not amazing players. Booker is legitimately amazing and we're doing ourselves and him a disservice if we're not reevaluating this timeline and consider accelerating it. It's completely negligent to think Booker would be OK with the team continuing to tank while he's trending the completely opposite way.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

A lot of people believe that, on the business side of basketball, Booker loves being the man and the face of the franchise and is committed to being a Sun for the long haul. That we can take our time tanking year after year and Booker will not request a trade even if we are a continual bottom feeding team.

I think we need to be very careful with this assumption. OKC Thunder fans thought it is was impossible that Kevin Durant would ever leave. Thunder were at one time a tanker's paradise: having a horrible record year after year and drafting stud Kevin Durant, stud Russell Westbrook, stud James Harden, and semi-stud Serge Ibaka. The Thunder for a while were the poster boys for tanking. Yet they could never get the team to a position where they could be perennial contenders for a title even with all that talent. Eventually ego and salary demands forced the trade of Harden and Durant left a couple of years later. Their tank experiment ultimately failed.

Suns need to build around Booker, bring in some young-vets (24-28 years old) via trading of existing talent and draft picks, and bring in some older-vets for stability. Get the team good enough for the 6th-8th spot in the playoffs, then an superstar might consider joining the Suns in trade or FA (see Charles Barkley traded to the Suns). That we are going to somehow tank-and-draft our way to a championship (like the Thunder tried to do) requires a leap of faith that I just can't accept. Suns better be careful about not alienating Booker with this current #timeline silliness.

+1

This is exactly why I've argued we need to revisit the "Timeline". The Timeline was a fine plan when you literally had nothing but picks and good but not amazing players. Booker is legitimately amazing and we're doing ourselves and him a disservice if we're not reevaluating this timeline and consider accelerating it. It's completely negligent to think Booker would be OK with the team continuing to tank while he's trending the completely opposite way.

I don't understand. Haven't we recently seen a lot of promising developments in the young players on our roster? Why don't we think we can make the playoff leap organically, with these young guys, next year? I would like to add a rotation guard here, but Jackson, Reed and maybe Knight may do the trick on their own.

The timeline isn't about tanking. It's about staying patient and prioritizing the development of young talent rather than taking shortcuts (e.g., trading Dunn and Markkanen for Butler).

[lilfishi22]

A lot of people believe that, on the business side of basketball, Booker loves being the man and the face of the franchise and is committed to being a Sun for the long haul. That we can take our time tanking year after year and Booker will not request a trade even if we are a continual bottom feeding team.

I think we need to be very careful with this assumption. OKC Thunder fans thought it is was impossible that Kevin Durant would ever leave. Thunder were at one time a tanker's paradise: having a horrible record year after year and drafting stud Kevin Durant, stud Russell Westbrook, stud James Harden, and semi-stud Serge Ibaka. The Thunder for a while were the poster boys for tanking. Yet they could never get the team to a position where they could be perennial contenders for a title even with all that talent. Eventually ego and salary demands forced the trade of Harden and Durant left a couple of years later. Their tank experiment ultimately failed.

Suns need to build around Booker, bring in some young-vets (24-28 years old) via trading of existing talent and draft picks, and bring in some older-vets for stability. Get the team good enough for the 6th-8th spot in the playoffs, then an superstar might consider joining the Suns in trade or FA (see Charles Barkley traded to the Suns). That we are going to somehow tank-and-draft our way to a championship (like the Thunder tried to do) requires a leap of faith that I just can't accept. Suns better be careful about not alienating Booker with this current #timeline silliness.

+1

This is exactly why I've argued we need to revisit the "Timeline". The Timeline was a fine plan when you literally had nothing but picks and good but not amazing players. Booker is legitimately amazing and we're doing ourselves and him a disservice if we're not reevaluating this timeline and consider accelerating it. It's completely negligent to think Booker would be OK with the team continuing to tank while he's trending the completely opposite way.

I don't understand. Haven't we recently seen a lot of promising developments in the young players on our roster? Why don't we think we can make the playoff leap organically, with these young guys, next year? I would like to add a rotation guard here, but Jackson, Reed and maybe Knight may do the trick on their own.

The timeline isn't about tanking. It's about staying patient and prioritizing the development of young talent rather than taking shortcuts (e.g., trading Dunn and Markkanen for Butler).

The timeline absolutely is about tanking. The main reason we have Jackson is because we tanked last season by sitting a perfectly healthy and productive Bledsoe. It's certainly helped our tank that Bledsoe and Knight have had significant time off the last couple of seasons but make no mistake, top picks are what we're after as part of the #Timeline

We've seen flashes, we've seen talent but we haven't seen consistency. Promising development =/= NBA players until they consistently contribute. I've liked what I've seen from Chriss as of late while JJ and Bender had their best game of their young careers recently but I still haven't seen enough to think we'll make a playoff 'leap' off the improvement of our young players. I'm not ruling it out but I don't want to depend on them turning into very good role players while ignoring the other paths.options toward relevancy. I agree adding a veteran guard is a solid step in the right direction.

[Jarlaxle0204]

A lot of people believe that, on the business side of basketball, Booker loves being the man and the face of the franchise and is committed to being a Sun for the long haul. That we can take our time tanking year after year and Booker will not request a trade even if we are a continual bottom feeding team.

I think we need to be very careful with this assumption. OKC Thunder fans thought it is was impossible that Kevin Durant would ever leave. Thunder were at one time a tanker's paradise: having a horrible record year after year and drafting stud Kevin Durant, stud Russell Westbrook, stud James Harden, and semi-stud Serge Ibaka. The Thunder for a while were the poster boys for tanking. Yet they could never get the team to a position where they could be perennial contenders for a title even with all that talent. Eventually ego and salary demands forced the trade of Harden and Durant left a couple of years later. Their tank experiment ultimately failed.

Suns need to build around Booker, bring in some young-vets (24-28 years old) via trading of existing talent and draft picks, and bring in some older-vets for stability. Get the team good enough for the 6th-8th spot in the playoffs, then an superstar might consider joining the Suns in trade or FA (see Charles Barkley traded to the Suns). That we are going to somehow tank-and-draft our way to a championship (like the Thunder tried to do) requires a leap of faith that I just can't accept. Suns better be careful about not alienating Booker with this current #timeline silliness.

You make it sound like Durant left because OKC used to tank. They went to the finals once and his last year they got to game 7 of the Western Conference Finals. Hell, they had a 3-1 lead in that series. Durant was there for at least 8 years. We don't need to bring anyone in yet. Booker is only in his third year. This is not an apt comparison in my opinion. OKC made the mistake of not resigning Harden because they didn't want to pay him. We aren't destined to make the same mistake. If we get to the finals once and WCF another time and are a perennial playoff team I don't see why Booker wouldn't stay.

Durant left because he didn't want to play with Westbrook and he's a bitch. Booker is an alpha. Durant is not.

I'm not against bringing in talent and getting better. I just don't agree with your comparison. I think with Durant and Westbrook they WERE actually perennial contenders.

[lilfishi22]

A lot of people believe that, on the business side of basketball, Booker loves being the man and the face of the franchise and is committed to being a Sun for the long haul. That we can take our time tanking year after year and Booker will not request a trade even if we are a continual bottom feeding team.

I think we need to be very careful with this assumption. OKC Thunder fans thought it is was impossible that Kevin Durant would ever leave. Thunder were at one time a tanker's paradise: having a horrible record year after year and drafting stud Kevin Durant, stud Russell Westbrook, stud James Harden, and semi-stud Serge Ibaka. The Thunder for a while were the poster boys for tanking. Yet they could never get the team to a position where they could be perennial contenders for a title even with all that talent. Eventually ego and salary demands forced the trade of Harden and Durant left a couple of years later. Their tank experiment ultimately failed.

Suns need to build around Booker, bring in some young-vets (24-28 years old) via trading of existing talent and draft picks, and bring in some older-vets for stability. Get the team good enough for the 6th-8th spot in the playoffs, then an superstar might consider joining the Suns in trade or FA (see Charles Barkley traded to the Suns). That we are going to somehow tank-and-draft our way to a championship (like the Thunder tried to do) requires a leap of faith that I just can't accept. Suns better be careful about not alienating Booker with this current #timeline silliness.

You make it sound like Durant left because OKC used to tank. They went to the finals once and his last year they got to game 7 of the Western Conference Finals. Hell, they had a 3-1 lead in that series. Durant was there for at least 8 years. We don't need to bring anyone in yet. Booker is only in his third year. This is not an apt comparison in my opinion. OKC made the mistake of not resigning Harden because they didn't want to pay him. We aren't destined to make the same mistake. If we get to the finals once and WCF another time and are a perennial playoff team I don't see why Booker wouldn't stay.

Durant left because he didn't want to play with Westbrook and he's a bitch. Booker is an alpha. Durant is not.

I'm not against bringing in talent and getting better. I just don't agree with your comparison. I think with Durant and Westbrook they WERE actually perennial contenders.

+1 just for this

[Damkac]

Booker is 21 and still on his rookie contract. He will sign new deal with the Suns soon. He is many years away from being free agent so why worry about him leaving already? Suns needs to worry about being great team in few years. They don't need to be good right now.

[lilfishi22]

Booker is 21 and still on his rookie contract. He will sign new deal with the Suns soon. He is many years away from being free agent so why worry about him leaving already? Suns needs to worry about being great team in few years. They don't need to be good right now.

We had Morris locked up and on a good contract, didn't stop him from being unhappy and forced his way out of Phoenix. Bledsoe was locked up for another two seasons on a reasonable contract, that didn't stop him from being unhappy and forced his way out of Phoenix either.

Don't be naive and think that just because a young guy is locked up that means they are happy to play on a crap team.

[NavLDO]

I just don't get the point of going all in now.

If we go all in now and get someone like Kemba for at least our pick, Miami's pick, and maybe a young player, then we have to go 25-15 from now to get to .500 and even have a shot at make the playoffs. Only the top 7 teams even have 25 wins at this point in the season, and you'd be hard pressed to convince anyone that someone like Kemba takes us from bottom 8 to top 8 in record, especially when you consider the time it can take for high usage players to gel into a new system. Not to mention that our second half includes 4 games against the Warriors, 3 games against the Rockets, and 2 games against the Cavs, with almost 75% of our remaining games being against teams in the playoffs or right on the border of being in the playoffs, so wins aren't exactly going to be easy to come by for us.

What does selling out now for a pipe dream at the this year's playoffs gets us? Why not be patient, play out this season and let young guys develop, and evaluate what we can do with our assets when they've solidified their value this offseason? Regardless of how you feel about drafting players, it's undeniable that higher draft picks are more valuable in trades, and our pick won't be valued as the likely top 8 pick that it is if we're trading for a star in an attempt to boost our record mid-season.

I agree with you. I don't think we are on the cusp and don't expect us to be on a winning streak and on the cusp of the 8th seed given our schedule and how we have struggled and barely beat even the very worst teams, sometimes with crazy comebacks. We do catch a good team off guard on occasion and it's fun and nice to see our young players play well and gain confidence but it's not something I expect to do often. My point was that if I really thought the team was a fringe playoff team, that might be when you want to make a move. We are not currently a fringe playoff team being more than twice as far from the western 8th seed than the west's worst team, that being before we hit the tough part of our schedule.

I think the best course is to let the young guys keep developing, use our picks wisely and let the team grow. I don't think adding one piece does much for us. It might make us a little better but the core of our team simply won't be ready to really compete in the playoffs for a couple of years. It might be nice to make it next year and get a taste of it, but I'd rather do it organically for the most part. I don't mind adding a piece this summer if it makes sense, since we have cap space, like Avery Bradley if they think it's best to use the cap space this summer, but would rather not deplete our assets since we are not likely going anywhere anyway and we need to let our young guys play as much as possible.

You go ahead and let F-n Ulis develope. Jesus.... you guys make it sound like adding a GD real pg is going to throw this team backwards.

What are you afraid of? Losing 4-1 in the playoffs ?

Christ, I’ll drop down 5-6 picks in the draft to see that.... oh... and can’t you consider that as developing?

F-n tanker mentality around here. I can see not wanting to break up this so called core, but wtf? We have enough damn draft picks. Face it, you are not going to swap an 8-9 and a 16-17 for a top 5.

Go out and get a PG! Now. This team will develop better and quicker when you eliminate that glaring hole.

The love affair with drafting is blinding. Raising AZ couldn’t have said it better.

I agree. But it needs to be the RIGHT PG for the RIGHT price. No need to pay any PG that isn't going to be in our future plans for a few years. If we want to bring one in...a Vet that helps us get better and our young players better...for the rest of this year, then I'm all for it. So long as we drop the salary at year's end, so we can actually target our long-term option at PG...a young one that we can continue to develop. Ideally, I think this might be our best option. A PG that has already proven worthy of the NBA, yet young enough to stick around for another 8-10 years.

But all this talk about bringing in Dragic...or Hill...or Lowry...or any other older PG, just to eat up all of our funds that we might be able to use for other pieces that might be able to stick around more than a couple years.