Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion Pt. 5

[sunsbum]

This is such a pathetic outlook. Look at what the TWolves did with Jimmy Butler...

Butler is the same age as Kemba and they brought him in next to Towns (same age as Booker) and Wiggins (same age as Warren).

And guess what...TWolves are one of the brightest up and coming teams in the league and their already top 5 in the West!

The same can happen here. Suns need to stop thinking 27 years old is ancient.

Jimmy Butler is a much better player than Kemba walker and the wolves were further along in their "process" when they acquired him.

Sure, Butler is definitely a better player than Kemba but you have to start somewhere.

Kemba is still a massive upgrade over any PG on this roster and has team leadership qualities as well. I listened to him when he was mic’d up at the All star game last year and many other star players actually respect his game so he could recruit in the future as well/guys will want to come here and play with him and Booker.

I also think Kemba isn’t done developing as a player and will play better next to a talent like Booker.

As far as Minnesota being further along in their “process”...that’s only true because they accelerated their process.

The Suns have the chance to do the same thing. What’s the difference between Minnesota and Phoenix before Minnesota got Butler?

- Booker is our Towns (aka rising superstar)
- Warren is our Wiggins (capable second/third option)
- Chandler/Dudley is our Gibson/Teague (overpaid vets)

Only thing we’re missing is the proven coach like Thibs but even that, it would be easier for us to get a coach with a good pedigree once the roster looks attractive enough for a coach which is precisely what happened in Thibs case.

Our situations are similar, we just have to take advantage of this.

They gave up kris Dunn, Lavine and the 7th pick for Butler. That's a huge package but Jimmy Butler was a perfect fit at the right time. I don't believe gutting our assets and team for Kemba Walker is going to have the same impact.

[gaspar]

It's Kemba **** Walker, not prime James Harden. The Hornets without any major injuries and with Walker and Dwight playing in all of their games have 2 more wins than the Suns...

Also, in 5 months: The Phoenix Suns select Jaren Jackson Jr. and pass on Luka Doncic and Trae Young, because they invested so much in Kemba **** Walker (a 28 year old player who in 12 months will be an unrestricted free agent asking for $150m )

$150M is the going rate for star players. If their not gonna pony up the money for star players then might as well just keep drafting but remember, you have to pay the ones you draft too.

Booker for example is coming up for a max extension.

And 28 years old isn’t 48 **** years olds. He isn’t gonna lose his legs or something soon and become trash.

Oh and don’t even think about the draft. I’ll assure you that the Suns will get screwed in the lottery regardless just like they have every single season.

If we wanted a player of Kemba's caliber on max contract to be our long term solution at PG, we should have gave Bledsoe his extension this summer, save ourselves from this whole saga and keep all of our assets.

[RaisingArizona]

It's Kemba **** Walker, not prime James Harden. The Hornets without any major injuries and with Walker and Dwight playing in all of their games have 2 more wins than the Suns...

Also, in 5 months: The Phoenix Suns select Jaren Jackson Jr. and pass on Luka Doncic and Trae Young, because they invested so much in Kemba **** Walker (a 28 year old player who in 12 months will be an unrestricted free agent asking for $150m )

$150M is the going rate for star players. If their not gonna pony up the money for star players then might as well just keep drafting but remember, you have to pay the ones you draft too.

Booker for example is coming up for a max extension.

And 28 years old isn’t 48 **** years olds. He isn’t gonna lose his legs or something soon and become trash.

Oh and don’t even think about the draft. I’ll assure you that the Suns will get screwed in the lottery regardless just like they have every single season.

If we wanted a player of Kemba's caliber on max contract to be our long term solution at PG, we should have gave Bledsoe his extension this summer, save ourselves from this whole saga and keep all of our assets.

ESPO, is that you?

[Revived]

It's Kemba **** Walker, not prime James Harden. The Hornets without any major injuries and with Walker and Dwight playing in all of their games have 2 more wins than the Suns...

Also, in 5 months: The Phoenix Suns select Jaren Jackson Jr. and pass on Luka Doncic and Trae Young, because they invested so much in Kemba **** Walker (a 28 year old player who in 12 months will be an unrestricted free agent asking for $150m )

$150M is the going rate for star players. If their not gonna pony up the money for star players then might as well just keep drafting but remember, you have to pay the ones you draft too.

Booker for example is coming up for a max extension.

And 28 years old isn’t 48 **** years olds. He isn’t gonna lose his legs or something soon and become trash.

Oh and don’t even think about the draft. I’ll assure you that the Suns will get screwed in the lottery regardless just like they have every single season.

If we wanted a player of Kemba's caliber on max contract to be our long term solution at PG, we should have gave Bledsoe his extension this summer, save ourselves from this whole saga and keep all of our assets.

Kemba doesn’t have the kind of injury history that Bledsoe does plus Kemba is a better 3pt shooter than Bledsoe as well which we desperately need in today’s nba and next to Booker.

[DaleyBlind]

Not going to lie, getting Kemba would be exciting.

[Damkac]

No thanks for Kemba.
Suns shouldn't make any moves before draft day. I know many posters would hate this but I really hope Suns will end the seson with their current roster (- Monroe).

[NapoleonII]

I'm torn.

I like Kemba a lot, but I want nothing to do with Howard or Batum, which I think the Hornets are probably looking to attach.

[Walt_Uoob]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y8pl3zn5 (or http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yamd34mt)

This is pretty boring because it's mostly finance-based but it makes some sense.

Kemba and Batum (or Howard) to DAL
Wes Mathews to PHX
BK and McBob to CHA

Dallas gets Kemba and unloads Mathews as the reward for absorbing Batum (or Howard)'s deal.
We take on two years of Mathews at $18m and unload three years of BK at $14m. Mathews becomes an expiring trade chip for next year or comes off our books for cap space in summer of 2019.
Hornets downgrade from Walker to Knight but unload Batum (or Howard's) deal as the reward.

This is another one that might need some picks added to even it out. Maybe we send a couple of seconds to Charlotte. Or, especially if it's two years of Howard instead of four years of Batum, Dallas sends a pick or two to Charlotte.

[sunsbum]

I don't think we need a superstar PG next to Booker. For the sake of my argument, let's look at who kobe, Jordan had next to them. The Derrick Fishers, Steve kerrs, Craig Hodges, BJ Armstrong's, Steve Blake's, Jordan Farmars....all these guys had a something in common, they could all shoot and they didn't take the ball out of their superstars hand. Devin is going to be pretty damn close to those two guys and we cannot make the mistake of pairing him with another dribble first, shoot second, pass third, max contract PG.

McConnell and Napier would be my two targets.

[NapoleonII]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y8pl3zn5 (or http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yamd34mt)

This is pretty boring because it's mostly finance-based but it makes some sense.

Kemba and Batum (or Howard) to DAL
Wes Mathews to PHX
BK and McBob to CHA

Dallas gets Kemba and unloads Mathews as the reward for absorbing Batum (or Howard)'s deal.
We take on two years of Mathews at $18m and unload three years of BK at $14m. Mathews becomes an expiring trade chip for next year or comes off our books for cap space in summer of 2019.
Hornets downgrade from Walker to Knight but unload Batum (or Howard's) deal as the reward.

This is another one that might need some picks added to even it out. Maybe we send a couple of seconds to Charlotte. Or, especially if it's two years of Howard instead of four years of Batum, Dallas sends a pick or two to Charlotte.

I like this. We really need to start aiming for the sweet spot years of Booker's prime (25-30) to have as much cap space as we can.

[bwgood77]

Phoenix Suns
Hornets get: Guard Tyler Ulis, forwards Dragan Bender and Jared Dudley, centers Greg Monroe and Alan Williams

Suns get: Guards Michael Carter-Williams, Julyan Stone and Kemba Walker, centers Dwight Howard and Johnny O'Bryant

Like Indiana, Phoenix could offer Charlotte major cap relief in the form of Monroe's $17.9 million expiring contract and a non-guarantee on Williams' 2018-19 salary. As compared to the Pacers, the Suns have more young talent to sweeten an offer. I've included 2016 No. 4 overall pick Dragan Bender here, but fellow 2016 lottery pick Marquese Chriss would fit too, or Phoenix could offer Miami's 2018 first-round pick.

While Walker and Devin Booker would make an outstanding backcourt, the question is how motivated the Suns would be to acquire a 28-year-old point guard not long after trading Eric Bledsoe to the Milwaukee Bucks.

http://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/22153805/best-kemba-walker-trades-charlotte-hornets-nba-contenders

I'd be surprised if that was enough to get him. I'd rather trade the Miami 18 than Bender or Chriss.

[WeekapaugGroove]

I took a quick look at Batum and I knew he was having a rough year but oh my goodness has he been terrible this season. He's like brandon knight last year bad. It's too bad because Batum playing like he did in his decent years would be a decent fit and would allow the suns to use TJ as the main piece going to Charlotte in a trade like this but at his salary and dog **** play I wouldn't touch Batum with a 10 foot poll.

[bwgood77]

$150M is the going rate for star players. If their not gonna pony up the money for star players then might as well just keep drafting but remember, you have to pay the ones you draft too.

Booker for example is coming up for a max extension.

And 28 years old isn’t 48 **** years olds. He isn’t gonna lose his legs or something soon and become trash.

Oh and don’t even think about the draft. I’ll assure you that the Suns will get screwed in the lottery regardless just like they have every single season.

If we wanted a player of Kemba's caliber on max contract to be our long term solution at PG, we should have gave Bledsoe his extension this summer, save ourselves from this whole saga and keep all of our assets.

Kemba doesn’t have the kind of injury history that Bledsoe does plus Kemba is a better 3pt shooter than Bledsoe as well which we desperately need in today’s nba and next to Booker.

I like Kemba better than Bledsoe but he's not that much better. His 3 pt shooting is not that great. Under 35%. He can't get to the rim nearly as well and has an eFG% below 50%...worse eFG%/TS% than Bledsoe. He has a better ast/to ratio...close to 3/1 but still averages less than 6 apg.

He is a negative on defense.

I agree we need a GOOD 3 pt shooter next to Booker but someone shooting about 35% from there isn't exactly what I consider good.

[Sunsfan12]

Kemba would be an exciting get. But he’s the type of player you go after when you’re already ready to compete and he puts you over the top. If we already had Booker and, say, Anthony Davis on this team the sign me up. Kemba is a great get if he’s your third best player. If he was 22 I might do it because it gives us time to acquire that other star. But at 27-28 it doesn’t give us much time. So as of today hard pass.

[RaisingArizona]

All or nothing lol. Whatever guys.

[Revived]

If we wanted a player of Kemba's caliber on max contract to be our long term solution at PG, we should have gave Bledsoe his extension this summer, save ourselves from this whole saga and keep all of our assets.

Kemba doesn’t have the kind of injury history that Bledsoe does plus Kemba is a better 3pt shooter than Bledsoe as well which we desperately need in today’s nba and next to Booker.

I like Kemba better than Bledsoe but he's not that much better. His 3 pt shooting is not that great. Under 35%. He can't get to the rim nearly as well and has an eFG% below 50%...worse eFG%/TS% than Bledsoe. He has a better ast/to ratio...close to 3/1 but still averages less than 6 apg.

He is a negative on defense.

I agree we need a GOOD 3 pt shooter next to Booker but someone shooting about 35% from there isn't exactly what I consider good.

He’s taking a lot of tough shots which is why his % is so low. Hornets are a mess of a team.

I think Kemba will get better looks playing with Booker/Warren than whoever they have in Charlotte (Batum, Marvin Williams etc).

He was known as a good shooter coming out of college as well. And he was selected to be in the 3pt contest at the All Star game and they haven’t had any players participate in the 3pt contest unless their a good shooter, at least that’s how it’s been in recent years.

Stats don’t always tell the whole story especially when it comes to shooting.

[n4th4n4]

This reminds me of the Harden talk a few years back. Many here said don't touch him, he doesn't play defense. Draft and stay the course... At some point, we need to pair Booker with a star. Stars are slim pickings. Have to pounce when the opportunity presents itself. I'd be 100% shocked if McD isn't in on this.

This is a terrible comparison. Harden was 22 when he was traded. Kemba is 5 years older than that now. And one year away from needing a massive extension which would kill our roster flexibility for the next half a decade.

Same concept. You have to pull the trigger when there's a chance because these opportunities are few and far between. Like how everyone thinks 27 is too old. ******* kidding me?

These opportunities are NOT far and few between. In the last 12 months alone Paul George, Oldadipo, Irving, Butler, Chris Paul, and Cousins have all moved teams. And we are about to add Kemba to that list. Stars are traded frequently in the NBA.

[RaisingArizona]

This is a terrible comparison. Harden was 22 when he was traded. Kemba is 5 years older than that now. And one year away from needing a massive extension which would kill our roster flexibility for the next half a decade.

Same concept. You have to pull the trigger when there's a chance because these opportunities are few and far between. Like how everyone thinks 27 is too old. ******* kidding me?

These opportunities are NOT far and few between. In the last 12 months alone Paul George, Oldadipo, Irving, Butler, Chris Paul, and Cousins have all moved teams. And we are about to add Kemba to that list. Stars are traded frequently in the NBA.

And these were the critiques

Paul: 1 year rental. Will go to LA.
Oladipo: Nobody thought he was a star 50 games ago.
Butler: Didn't fit timeline.
Paul: REALLY too old.
Cousins: Headcase. Rental. Not a winner.

[bwgood77]

Kemba doesn’t have the kind of injury history that Bledsoe does plus Kemba is a better 3pt shooter than Bledsoe as well which we desperately need in today’s nba and next to Booker.

I like Kemba better than Bledsoe but he's not that much better. His 3 pt shooting is not that great. Under 35%. He can't get to the rim nearly as well and has an eFG% below 50%...worse eFG%/TS% than Bledsoe. He has a better ast/to ratio...close to 3/1 but still averages less than 6 apg.

He is a negative on defense.

I agree we need a GOOD 3 pt shooter next to Booker but someone shooting about 35% from there isn't exactly what I consider good.

He’s taking a lot of tough shots which is why his % is so low. Hornets are a mess of a team.

I think Kemba will get better looks playing with Booker/Warren than whoever they have in Charlotte (Batum, Marvin Williams etc).

He was known as a good shooter coming out of college as well. And he was selected to be in the 3pt contest at the All Star game and they haven’t had any players participate in the 3pt contest unless their a good shooter, at least that’s how it’s been in recent years.

Stats don’t always tell the whole story especially when it comes to shooting.

Well his 3 pt shooting is right along the lines of his career 3 pt shooting. 34.9% this year. 35.1% over his 7 year career. Just been taking tough shots his whole career but really a lot better shooter?

[n4th4n4]

Same concept. You have to pull the trigger when there's a chance because these opportunities are few and far between. Like how everyone thinks 27 is too old. ******* kidding me?

These opportunities are NOT far and few between. In the last 12 months alone Paul George, Oldadipo, Irving, Butler, Chris Paul, and Cousins have all moved teams. And we are about to add Kemba to that list. Stars are traded frequently in the NBA.

And these were the critiques

Paul: 1 year rental. Will go to LA.
Oladipo: Nobody thought he was a star 50 games ago.
Butler: Didn't fit timeline.
Paul: REALLY too old.
Cousins: Headcase. Rental. Not a winner.

I think you are having trouble following this conversation. The point you made earlier was that "these opportunities are few and far between."

Beyond that, you are straw-manning. Excluding Oladipo, the consensus was that these trades were great for the teams receiving the stars. I don't think that would be true for us taking on Kemba.