Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIV

[payitforward]

...What about Morris, Smith, Meeks, and our 1st for Marvin Williams and Monk?...

Not possible salary-wise. Williams costs too much going forward:

1. keeps us in the tax this year
2. puts us in the tax next year for sure
3. utterly unfeasible financially season after next.

[payitforward]

:o

How about John Wall + Marcin Gortat for Kemba Walker + Cody Zeller?

I'd do that deal in a heartbeat. Kemba is the same age as Wall, arguably just as good, and he costs just $12M a year. We swap Gortat for a much younger version. It solves our immediate luxtax problems and clears up some long term luxtax issues, all while retaining the pick.

The only problem is that we can't trade Wall until July 26th, which is after the luxtax calculation is worked out. So I guess it doesn't get us out of the luxtax this year, but it really does clear up a lot of long term problems for us.

For Charlotte, it gets them a "superstar" locked into a long term deal that will hopefully keep fans in the seats in a small market.

I'm totally with nate on this one ...

Me too. But, it's not likely....

[nate33]

If the Wizards can figure out a sensible way to get Kenny Faried at C they should go for it.

He's a plus rebounder but he has been mailing it in for the last couple of seasons. I think they need an energy guy. Burritos and energy guy who still plays Above the Rim.

Yup, & I've only been calling for this all season -- not to mention last season!

Guess who the starting Center is on the Golden State Warriors?

Spoiler:

Jordan Bell! -- rookie, so-called undersized, non-shooting,
big time rebounder.

C'mon now. I think Draymond Green and Kevin Durant, arguably the 1st and 2nd choice for defensive player of the year this year, might have something to do with Golden State getting away with Jordan Bell at center.

[payitforward]

Only to be swept by john wall on pnr with Howard while batum comes back to scoring form playing with a playmaking point guard...

That’s how our post season goes with this trade

Maybe. Or maybe the post season goes with Wall shooting Charlotte out of a series by going 2-11 from midrange every night while committing 5 turnovers to go with his 11 assists.

I'm not hating on Wall. I'm merely acknowledging that he does a lot of bad things to lose games in addition to all the good things he does to win games. Kemba doesn't do quite as many good things, but he does A LOT less bad things.

Just imagine having a reliable end-of-game ball handler who is also a reliable shot maker off the dribble. We haven't had a guy like that since Arenas, and Arenas won us a lot of ball games.

Agree w/ nate -- yet, the main point was in a previous post: this deal solves a zillion team-building problems.

Neither the world nor the Wizards revolve around the question "how good is John Wall?"

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

If the Wizards can figure out a sensible way to get Kenny Faried at C they should go for it.

He's a plus rebounder but he has been mailing it in for the last couple of seasons. I think they need an energy guy. Burritos and energy guy who still plays Above the Rim.

Yup, & I've only been calling for this all season -- not to mention last season!

Guess who the starting Center is on the Golden State Warriors?

Spoiler:

Jordan Bell! -- rookie, so-called undersized, non-shooting,
big time rebounder.

C'mon now. I think Draymond Green and Kevin Durant, arguably the 1st and 2nd choice for defensive player of the year this year, might have something to do with Golden State getting away with Jordan Bell at center.

Violently disagree Nate.

Jordan Bell was a defensive monster in Oregon's run in the NCAAs last year. Take a look at his last six NCAA games, particularly his last two:

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/jordan-bell-1/gamelog/2017/

Crazy field goal percentages, crazy rebounds, absolutely crazy amount of blocked shots.. NBA drafts are determined by Insiders who get paid a lot of money who often miss the obvious.

Jordan Bell is a dominating player. https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/belljo01.html

Nate, how do you explain that GS is +15 WITH Bell and only +8 WITHOUT Bell?
How do you explain his .199 WS/48 and his 19.5 PER?
PER 36mins 13 pts/10 rebs/4.5 asts/1.5 stls/2.5 blk...that is dominating.

He does a few things that even Draymond Green does not do as well. He's going to be a very solid player in the NBA for a very long time. I'm starting to figure out why they draft certain people. Jordan Bell and Patrick McCaw make a lot of sense for where the Warriors drafted.

[Shanghai Kid]

This may be controversial, but with the player Oubre is projecting to become, I think the Wizards should trade Otto Porter if the right package was there.

"Holy advanced stats Batman, Otto porter is top 3 in RPM among small forwards!"

And that would be us selling high.

Just my opinion, I don't see the impact with Otto. I see a player who disappears for full quarters and was not able to step up in a secondary role when Wall was hurt. I see him as a good roleplayer, but can a middle of the pack team afford to have a roleplayer maxed out? Extremely efficient with his 12-14ppg, but not a playmaker and not a lockdown defender. And I'm not convinced his efficiency would stay up with a bigger scoring role.

Just my take, I think I'm not as high on Otto as a lot here, advanced stats be damned. I think his value is going to decrease dramatically if he gets older and loses the "young player with potential" tag he still has.

[dangermouse]

This may be controversial, but with the player Oubre is projecting to become, I think the Wizards should trade Otto Porter if the right package was there.

"Holy advanced stats Batman, Otto porter is top 3 in RPM among small forwards!"

And that would be us selling high.

Just my opinion, I don't see the impact with Otto. I see a player who disappears for full quarters and was not able to step up in a secondary role when Wall was hurt. I see him as a good roleplayer, but can a middle of the pack team afford to have a roleplayer maxed out? Extremely efficient with his 12-14ppg, but not a playmaker and not a lockdown defender. And I'm not convinced his efficiency would stay up with a bigger scoring role.

Just my take, I think I'm not as high on Otto as a lot here, advanced stats be damned. I think his value is going to decrease dramatically if he gets older and loses the "young player with potential" tag he still has.

I agree 100% on all points.

[NatP4]

...overall, (Beal is) really having a great season again and playing at a superstar level...

This is completely untrue.

He didn't have a superstar season last year, let alone this year. & last season was "great," b/c it was the first time he started justifying his high draft position at all.

Beal's only 24, & he's good & can still get better. But, it's ridiculous to load him down w/ this excessive praise.

What is off from last year to this year? He’s almost the same player. Improved in a lot of areas and is much better defensively (part of the game you don’t pay attention to) his 3pt shooting is down

[payitforward]

...overall, (Beal is) really having a great season again and playing at a superstar level...

This is completely untrue.

He didn't have a superstar season last year, let alone this year. & last season was "great," b/c it was the first time he started justifying his high draft position at all.

Beal's only 24, & he's good & can still get better. But, it's ridiculous to load him down w/ this excessive praise.

What is off from last year to this year? He’s almost the same player. Improved in a lot of areas and is much better defensively (part of the game you don’t pay attention to) his 3pt shooting is down

Don't tell me what I do or don't pay attention to, Nat, ok?

Brad's 2 pt. % is down. His 3 pt. % is down. & his FT% is down. It takes him almost 2 more shots per 48 minutes to score the same # of points as last year.

Some other stuff is improved & makes up in part for this problem, but in all he's down from last year. &... last year was good -- but certainly not, as you called it, "superstar."

[NatP4]

This is completely untrue.

He didn't have a superstar season last year, let alone this year. & last season was "great," b/c it was the first time he started justifying his high draft position at all.

Beal's only 24, & he's good & can still get better. But, it's ridiculous to load him down w/ this excessive praise.

What is off from last year to this year? He’s almost the same player. Improved in a lot of areas and is much better defensively (part of the game you don’t pay attention to) his 3pt shooting is down

Don't tell me what I do or don't pay attention to, Nat, ok?

Brad's 2 pt. % is down. His 3 pt. % is down. & his FT% is down. It takes him almost 2 more shots per 48 minutes to score the same # of points as last year.

Some other stuff is improved & makes up in part for this problem, but in all he's down from last year. &... last year was good -- but certainly not, as you called it, "superstar."

His TS is only slightly down with everything else up across the board. Forget the superstar word, you’re getting to tripped up on that. All I’m saying is that he’s having a similar year to last season, which is good.

[Shanghai Kid]

What is off from last year to this year? He’s almost the same player. Improved in a lot of areas and is much better defensively (part of the game you don’t pay attention to) his 3pt shooting is down

Don't tell me what I do or don't pay attention to, Nat, ok?

Brad's 2 pt. % is down. His 3 pt. % is down. & his FT% is down. It takes him almost 2 more shots per 48 minutes to score the same # of points as last year.

Some other stuff is improved & makes up in part for this problem, but in all he's down from last year. &... last year was good -- but certainly not, as you called it, "superstar."

His TS is only slightly down with everything else up across the board. Forget the superstar word, you’re getting to tripped up on that. All I’m saying is that he’s having a similar year to last season, which is good.

He's a ball stopper this year. He kills the ball movement whenever he puts his head down and takes 7-8 seconds to figure out what he wants to do.

[NatP4]

Look at this. Just effort and unselfish play

**** wrong thread

[long suffrin' boulez fan]

1st + Mahinmi for George Hill?

Salaries match. Makes us better for next couple of years. Good solid vet who can play alongside B.B, Wall and/or Sato.

[Error Afflalo]

1st + Mahinmi for George Hill?

Salaries match. Makes us better for next couple of years. Good solid vet who can play alongside B.B, Wall and/or Sato.

Not only is Hill a much better player than Mahinmi, the final year of his deal (2019-20) is only $1M guaranteed. That's huge with Oubre up for a new deal, Gortat/Morris expiring, and Wall making crazy money.

The issue is the pick. We're in desperate need of young talent on cheap deals. If we could get away with giving up a 2019 or later pick, sign me up.

[verbal8]

Not a trade but what about Bogut? Anything that leads to fewer minutes playing Mahinimi seems like a good idea.

[nate33]

This may be controversial, but with the player Oubre is projecting to become, I think the Wizards should trade Otto Porter if the right package was there.

"Holy advanced stats Batman, Otto porter is top 3 in RPM among small forwards!"

And that would be us selling high.

Just my opinion, I don't see the impact with Otto. I see a player who disappears for full quarters and was not able to step up in a secondary role when Wall was hurt. I see him as a good roleplayer, but can a middle of the pack team afford to have a roleplayer maxed out? Extremely efficient with his 12-14ppg, but not a playmaker and not a lockdown defender. And I'm not convinced his efficiency would stay up with a bigger scoring role.

Just my take, I think I'm not as high on Otto as a lot here, advanced stats be damned. I think his value is going to decrease dramatically if he gets older and loses the "young player with potential" tag he still has.

I agree that Otto Porter should be on the table, but I really don't think "the right package" will be there. Porter's type of low-usage, high-efficiency production is typically underrated. Chances are, we'd get back a guy with better counting stats but a worse in-game impact.

I also think we'd be selling low on Porter. Porter is in the middle of a slump due do injury problems to his hip and back.

Finally, I think Porter's value will increase as he fills out and moves over to PF full time even if he doesn't really get much better. Maybe that's still a year or two down the road, but eventually, like Durant, Rudy Gay, and Marvin Williams, he'll be considered a PF. And a guy who can post his numbers at the PF spot (plus the few extra rebounds he'll get due to his proximity to the rim on defense) is worth more than a guy who posts the same numbers at the SF spot.

[nate33]

1st + Mahinmi for George Hill?

Salaries match. Makes us better for next couple of years. Good solid vet who can play alongside B.B, Wall and/or Sato.

Zero chance. It doesn't solve our luxtax problems this year or next year. Indeed, it makes them much worse. That trade will cost Ted an additional $20M in out-of-pocket money over the next 2 years.

That said, I'd probably do it if it was Mahinmi + Smith + Frazier + pick for Hill. Sacramento has the cap room to do it. Unfortunately, I don't think a #20ish pick is enough to convince them to take on an extra year of Mahinmi, not to mention the downgrade in talent from Hill to Mahinmi.

[nate33]

Man, I've scoured the contracts all morning, but I can't find any cap-saving deal that makes any sense for both teams, other than simply attaching a pick to Jason Smith and sending him to an under-the-cap team.

Nobody needs a center, and the only teams with Trade Exceptions are already pushing the luxtax and aren't looking to add players.

I really hope that Ted signed off on paying the luxury tax when he agreed to acquire Mahinmi and extend Wall. Otherwise, I fear we're going to trade a 1st round pick to dump Smith, and then end up trading another 1st round pick a year or two down the road to dump Mahinmi's final year. Mahinmi is a dinosaur in this league. You are better off just going small and playing a PF in his place. Nobody wants him.

Words can't express what a disaster the Summer 2016 offseason was. It has already cost us a 1st round pick and will certainly cost us at least one more, all while wasting about $90M and getting us NOTHING USEFUL WHATSOEVER in on-the-court talent.

[NatP4]

We got Satoransky that offseason

And why do you keep acting like we have to avoid the luxury tax? They have said over and over that they would pay it. We aren’t trading our pick to just dump a contract. Step back off the cliff

[NatP4]

Mahinmi+2018 1st for Nerlens Noel. Play him off the bench behind Gortat to hide some of his value, re sign him with the Mahinmi money and using the bird rights you acquire via trade. Simple stuff. He’s 23 years old. You’re capped out sure, but you just paired Noel with Wall Beal Oubre Porter for the next few years.