Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion Pt. 5

[WeekapaugGroove]

Spoiler:

But as I stated above...Kemba cannot attract that big of a package...(sorry, Jordan). So either we eat a contract (which knowing McD, will NEVER be Batum...maybe Howard?? Then we ride his talent for a couple of years?? Probably not, Jordan won't trade him.), so likely Marvin Williams and/or MKG?? Or we trade something like Warren + Monroe + a pick for Kemba + MKG. That leaves us plenty of money THIS summer to get one more talent, AND assets.

Kemba isn't Kyrie, and look at what they got for him...an injured IT, a young Center, and a 1st and a 2nd, was it? OK, so, to me, if Kemba is 'less than' Kyrie, Warren + Monroe + our 1st will do. Still leaves us JJ, Bender, Chriss, Mia '18 1st, Mia '21 1st, Mil '20 1st.

Plenty of assets, and money. If we trade JJ, Bender, or Chriss...they come off our Cap as well, and that's $3-6M per, depending.

All I'm saying is Kemba gets us going in the right direction--Winning more than losing, IMO. He also brings Vet leadership at a position where it's actually best to have. We have JJ as our future SF (I'm convinced he'll be, at worst, a 4th option on a Playoff team. - -15/6/3 with a .350 3PT%...eventually, and stellar Defense)

So, whatever makes the most sense, be it draft, or FA, or trade, we go get our Center of the future with our remaining assets, and pick between Bender and Chriss as our PF of the future...

But say it's a pick, and we trade our Mia '21 1st, Mil 1st, Chriss, 2 x '18 2nds + the Mia '18 1st to move up to top 10, and take Bamba, because he slides to 9th, or Jaren Jackson...I like those two as targets, TBH.

Kemba / Booker / JJ / Bender / Jackson

I see that as a strong, contending team in '20, and a playoff team, at a minimum, in '19. Why? Because once we get a solid, 'all-star-talent' at PG, the young'ns at 3-4-5 will develop quickly, in my estimation. Much better/faster than if we have a rookie PG.

I don't think you have a very good understanding of how the cap works. Yes; it's a 'soft cap' but that just means you can go over to retain your own players on extension. You still need actual cap room to sign a FA. Heck the Suns don't even have max room this summer if they stand pat and just let Monroe expire and renounce the Len cap hold. The only scenario where they could acquire Walker and have max room is if Charlotte actually took back more long term money in that deal and they can't do that because they are already over the cap.

Which is why when I looked for teams to move Chandler too - the Twolves went to the head of the class. I am not sure he is the right fit. But, the Twolves invested a lot this year with Butler Gibson and Teague Chandler might help them in the mix . And best of all, Twolves have two nice expirings (Aldrich, Bjelica) and Glen Taylor has been shown to spend money.

Suns move Chandler for expirings
Let Monroe walk
renounce Len

about 33m of cap space less the first round picks from Heat and current

that should help get a max deal

I'd love to move Chandler for an expiring but it's hard to find takers. With the Wolves they owe Deng a bunch of money and really Towns should be playing a lot of C so I have a hard time seeing them want to take on Chandlers contract. It's kind of a weird year where there just aren't a ton of contenders with big expirings of guys they don't want. It's why Monroe is nearly unmovable even for a package of another expiring and say a 2nd rounder. He could help a team but the fit cap wise just isn't there. Cleveland has the Fry contract but it appears they will try to flip that with Shump for Hill.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Spoiler:

I don't think you have a very good understanding of how the cap works. Yes; it's a 'soft cap' but that just means you can go over to retain your own players on extension. You still need actual cap room to sign a FA. Heck the Suns don't even have max room this summer if they stand pat and just let Monroe expire and renounce the Len cap hold. The only scenario where they could acquire Walker and have max room is if Charlotte actually took back more long term money in that deal and they can't do that because they are already over the cap.

Which is why when I looked for teams to move Chandler too - the Twolves went to the head of the class. I am not sure he is the right fit. But, the Twolves invested a lot this year with Butler Gibson and Teague Chandler might help them in the mix . And best of all, Twolves have two nice expirings (Aldrich, Bjelica) and Glen Taylor has been shown to spend money.

Suns move Chandler for expirings
Let Monroe walk
renounce Len

about 33m of cap space less the first round picks from Heat and current

that should help get a max deal

I'd love to move Chandler for an expiring but it's hard to find takers. With the Wolves they owe Deng a bunch of money and really Towns should be playing a lot of C so I have a hard time seeing them want to take on Chandlers contract. It's kind of a weird year where there just aren't a ton of contenders with big expirings of guys they don't want. It's why Monroe is nearly unmovable even for a package of another expiring and say a 2nd rounder. He could help a team but the fit cap wise just isn't there. Cleveland has the Fry contract but it appears they will try to flip that with Shump for Hill.

I've considered Chandler for Dieng. I think it makes sense for both teams, personally. I'd be a little worried about taking on that kind of salary, but if we draft a center and we hit, that player won't be up for an extension until a year after Dieng's contract comes off the books.

I'd try to sneak a Tyus Jones-Tyler Ulis swap into that deal. Maybe if we agreed to send out Dudley for flotsam as well? Maybe they'd insist on Daniels (to make for their lack of shooting and complete lack of swing players)?

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y8upsn9s

I don't think I'd throw a future first into that deal, but I'd send out a couple seconds. Minny gets out of long-term money and becomes more competitive this season: they could potentially add another big contract next offseason. I expect they'd be very hesitant to send Tyus Jones out, but he only plays about 15 MPG when Teague is playing. They have Aaron Brooks. Maybe the shooting concern is more pressing? Maybe they'd be able to get a better backup PG in a minor deal?

[Saberestar]

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Jay Triano HC for the Phoenix Suns next season confirmed.

[DB43]

And who do people think is worthy of a Max Contract in FA that we might actually stand a chance signing?

This should be interesting.....

Boogie?

[Kerrsed]

And here's my opinion on some of these rumors:

1. Kawaii isnt going anywhere. Sure he can be upset, but in San Antonio things like this change quickly. Hell, remember just last season when Aldridge was begging to be traded from the Spurs? What happened? Pop and the FO talked to him, and here they are winning games and Aldridge has had one of his best seasons and is an all-star once again. Kawaii may be upset at something right now, but best believe it will be smoothed over real soon, if it already hasnt.

2. Lillard is staying in Portland. Theres no way that Portland trades him. The meeting was blown out of proportion. It was more about asking him what he thinks they should do and not about one of the sides being disgruntled like the rumors tried to make it out to be.

3. The Kemba Situation. Word leaks that he is on the Market. This comes after they have been doing everything in their power to cut the dead weight and alleviate themselfs of the bad long term contracts that are dragging them down and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future. It took a good week before Jordan came out with his, "It’s not like we are shopping him. We would not just give him up. I love Kemba Walker. I would not trade him for anything but an All-Star player.” Yes, could they get an all-star caliber player in return for Kemba? Sure. But they would be in the same damn situation that they currently are. I believe they know this and thats why they were looking at attaching Kemba to a bad contract or two for a much smaller return, as Kemba by himself wasnt getting the "All-star player" in return offers that Jordan wanted.

What they are doing and have been doing hasnt worked, and its about time for them to hit that reset switch on the franchise, and the first step of that is to create as much cap room as possible and the only way they can do that is by attaching Kemba to some bad deals and lessen the return they get for him (Which didnt look that high to begin with). I have seen multiple Hornets fans also state that they believe that Jordan is just giving the typical GM BS and hoping that he can help save some of Walkers value that was destroyed by placing him on the block and not liking any of the offers, a while waiting so long to deny it.

4. George Hill, the Kinds could care less. This season is no longer about winning as their Hill/Zbo experiment has failed. Time to develop their youth and start looking towards the draft. Both players could be had for cheap, and is a major reason why Cleveland is very interested.

5. Im also pretty sure that anyone on the Jazz not named Gobert is for sale. While they thought that Rubio could be their savior and hoped that he could be the player that the Wolves also hoped he could be when they drafted him, its been a huge failure. He is having his worst season by far. While not being able to shoot worth ****, he hung his hat on his defense and playmaking, both of which have taken a HUGE hit.

6. Clippers are in the same situation as the Jazz, with the exception that i believe that NO ONE is untouchable. Its a team lacking any real identity. There was already rumblings that they regretted a lot of the offseason moves they made (Griffin/Gallinari), and now with an injury riddled team, their best player is an expiring 31 year old Lou Williams. The team lacks any real young "Up and Comers", and they are currently stuck in no mans land, right outside the playoffs. As i said before, anybody is gettable.

7. Cleveland will once again steal a couple of players. It amazes me how some of the teams like the Cav's can constantly turn their crap players into real actual players that will end up helping them in the long run. They have been linked to everyone from Hill/Zbo to Jordan to Kemba to Others, while only having Shumpert/Frye/Smith and a mid to late lotto pick to offer. Seems like they tend to pull this off every year.

I think that covers most of the current rumors out there.

[BobbieL]

Spoiler:

I don't think you have a very good understanding of how the cap works. Yes; it's a 'soft cap' but that just means you can go over to retain your own players on extension. You still need actual cap room to sign a FA. Heck the Suns don't even have max room this summer if they stand pat and just let Monroe expire and renounce the Len cap hold. The only scenario where they could acquire Walker and have max room is if Charlotte actually took back more long term money in that deal and they can't do that because they are already over the cap.

Which is why when I looked for teams to move Chandler too - the Twolves went to the head of the class. I am not sure he is the right fit. But, the Twolves invested a lot this year with Butler Gibson and Teague Chandler might help them in the mix . And best of all, Twolves have two nice expirings (Aldrich, Bjelica) and Glen Taylor has been shown to spend money.

Suns move Chandler for expirings
Let Monroe walk
renounce Len

about 33m of cap space less the first round picks from Heat and current

that should help get a max deal

I'd love to move Chandler for an expiring but it's hard to find takers. With the Wolves they owe Deng a bunch of money and really Towns should be playing a lot of C so I have a hard time seeing them want to take on Chandlers contract. It's kind of a weird year where there just aren't a ton of contenders with big expirings of guys they don't want. It's why Monroe is nearly unmovable even for a package of another expiring and say a 2nd rounder. He could help a team but the fit cap wise just isn't there. Cleveland has the Fry contract but it appears they will try to flip that with Shump for Hill.

I agree about trying to move Chandler. And your point about Dieng is correct - he is owed a lot of money and KAT should be playing center.

Maybe the Bucks for Chandler but the best you will get out of that is Teletovic - which is only 2 to 2.5m of savings next year. Sure it helps the cap. At one point, Frye//Shumpert for Chandler might have worked out but again, with Shumperts option, still only 3m savings next year. That's why the TWolves made some sense

At worst - Chandler expires next year so for a team trading for him, they know its only one more year to go

[Walt_Uoob]

I don't think we need to try to finagle cap space for two max contracts in 2019. Just doesn't seem likely that there will be two guys who make sense, want to be here, and are FAs all at the same time. I'm all for maintaining the flexibility to bring in one max guy but we're going to need to focus on drafting/developing one more star internally and trading for another.

One thing I could see us doing at draft time is using our own pick and trading one or more of our other picks for future picks so we can continue to have assets for the elusive 'disgruntled star' trade. Especially if we get the MIL pick around #15, someone could fall to that range that some other team really covets.

[Saberestar]

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[Saberestar]

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[bwgood77]

Spoiler:

And here's my opinion on some of these rumors:

1. Kawaii isnt going anywhere. Sure he can be upset, but in San Antonio things like this change quickly. Hell, remember just last season when Aldridge was begging to be traded from the Spurs? What happened? Pop and the FO talked to him, and here they are winning games and Aldridge has had one of his best seasons and is an all-star once again. Kawaii may be upset at something right now, but best believe it will be smoothed over real soon, if it already hasnt.

2. Lillard is staying in Portland. Theres no way that Portland trades him. The meeting was blown out of proportion. It was more about asking him what he thinks they should do and not about one of the sides being disgruntled like the rumors tried to make it out to be.

3. The Kemba Situation. Word leaks that he is on the Market. This comes after they have been doing everything in their power to cut the dead weight and alleviate themselfs of the bad long term contracts that are dragging them down and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future. It took a good week before Jordan came out with his, "It’s not like we are shopping him. We would not just give him up. I love Kemba Walker. I would not trade him for anything but an All-Star player.” Yes, could they get an all-star caliber player in return for Kemba? Sure. But they would be in the same damn situation that they currently are. I believe they know this and thats why they were looking at attaching Kemba to a bad contract or two for a much smaller return, as Kemba by himself wasnt getting the "All-star player" in return offers that Jordan wanted.

What they are doing and have been doing hasnt worked, and its about time for them to hit that reset switch on the franchise, and the first step of that is to create as much cap room as possible and the only way they can do that is by attaching Kemba to some bad deals and lessen the return they get for him (Which didnt look that high to begin with). I have seen multiple Hornets fans also state that they believe that Jordan is just giving the typical GM BS and hoping that he can help save some of Walkers value that was destroyed by placing him on the block and not liking any of the offers, a while waiting so long to deny it.

4. George Hill, the Kinds could care less. This season is no longer about winning as their Hill/Zbo experiment has failed. Time to develop their youth and start looking towards the draft. Both players could be had for cheap, and is a major reason why Cleveland is very interested.

5. Im also pretty sure that anyone on the Jazz not named Gobert is for sale. While they thought that Rubio could be their savior and hoped that he could be the player that the Wolves also hoped he could be when they drafted him, its been a huge failure. He is having his worst season by far. While not being able to shoot worth ****, he hung his hat on his defense and playmaking, both of which have taken a HUGE hit.

6. Clippers are in the same situation as the Jazz, with the exception that i believe that NO ONE is untouchable. Its a team lacking any real identity. There was already rumblings that they regretted a lot of the offseason moves they made (Griffin/Gallinari), and now with an injury riddled team, their best player is an expiring 31 year old Lou Williams. The team lacks any real young "Up and Comers", and they are currently stuck in no mans land, right outside the playoffs. As i said before, anybody is gettable.

7. Cleveland will once again steal a couple of players. It amazes me how some of the teams like the Cav's can constantly turn their crap players into real actual players that will end up helping them in the long run. They have been linked to everyone from Hill/Zbo to Jordan to Kemba to Others, while only having Shumpert/Frye/Smith and a mid to late lotto pick to offer. Seems like they tend to pull this off every year.

I think that covers most of the current rumors out there.

I pretty much agree with all but #6. The Clips were one of those fringe playoff teams, in the 7-10 range for most, but I think if you told most people that Blake would miss 16 of the first 46 games, no one would have expected them to be only a half game out of the playoffs.

I think they may let Jordan go or trade him, but they may keep him too since Blake and him are friends. I definitely don't think Blake will be on the block any time soon...sure they'd trade him for Towns, but Towns is obviously untouchable.

They could do something like this... http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yazjaxn7

[Kerrsed]

Read on Twitter

"The goal is to win games"

"Can't see them making a significant move considering where they are in standings."

So let me get this straight, we are a horrible team (5th worst), but the goal is to win games.....and we expect that to happen by NOT making a significant trade?

[bwgood77]

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Yeah, I remember when looking at 2019 free agents a month or so ago, Kemba was one of the guys I wouldn't have minded going after. But that's different than trading for him not only because you don't have to give up assets, but because if he signs, you know you have him post 2019. You trade for him there is far from a guarantee on that...especially given that article someone posted.

And of course they want to unload bad contracts if trading him or "want an all star such as Kawhi Leonard".

[Kerrsed]

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See these are the quotes i hate, and you see people here on RealGM spout the same drabble.

If you trade for him now, you get him. If you wait till FA, you are now fighting with other teams to get him. Everyone makes it seem like, "Oh, we can just sign him, because we know he wants to come here", NO, he wants to get the most money possible and be on the best team that he can be. Sure we could maybe offer him the first, but so can a lot of other teams, and im betting they are currently in a much better position than us.

I just hate seeing people use that damn excuse. Why trade assets for him when we can just sign him outright in the offseason. Yes, like its that easy. If we trade for Griffing, he would be here right now, instead of trying to sign him in the offseason, where he decided to re-ink with the Clippers. Thats just one of the many examples.

[bwgood77]

Read on Twitter

"The goal is to win games"

"Can't see them making a significant move considering where they are in standings."

So let me get this straight, we are a horrible team (5th worst), but the goal is to win games.....and we expect that to happen by NOT making a significant trade?

Spoiler:

Well you know what he means...they are not going to try and lose and sit some of their best players so they can lose..but they are not going to go out of their way to add players to get better since they are out of the playoff race/likely to get a high pick..but want to develop the "fight to win" mentality....

And, as new ASU football coach once said....

Watch on YouTube

[n4th4n4]

Read on Twitter

"The goal is to win games"

"Can't see them making a significant move considering where they are in standings."

So let me get this straight, we are a horrible team (5th worst), but the goal is to win games.....and we expect that to happen by NOT making a significant trade?

It's called tanking without saying you are tanking. It's not that hard to figure out.

[bwgood77]

Read on Twitter

See these are the quotes i hate, and you see people here on RealGM spout the same drabble.

If you trade for him now, you get him. If you wait till FA, you are now fighting with other teams to get him. Everyone makes it seem like, "Oh, we can just sign him, because we know he wants to come here", NO, he wants to get the most money possible and be on the best team that he can be. Sure we could maybe offer him the first, but so can a lot of other teams, and im betting they are currently in a much better position than us.

I just hate seeing people use that damn excuse. Why trade assets for him when we can just sign him outright in the offseason. Yes, like its that easy. If we trade for Griffing, he would be here right now, instead of trying to sign him in the offseason, where he decided to re-ink with the Clippers. Thats just one of the many examples.

But he will go to his preferred team of those who want him in 2019 regardless. Trading for him doesn't guarantee you re-sign him then. And of course you would give up assets (not that we have "all star" assets they want or want to take back bad deals since we have no all star).

[bwgood77]

Two of our players make this list...(the second one...must click on twice and scroll right to see second list)...

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[BobbieL]

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"The goal is to win games"

"Can't see them making a significant move considering where they are in standings."

So let me get this straight, we are a horrible team (5th worst), but the goal is to win games.....and we expect that to happen by NOT making a significant trade?

Spoiler:

Well you know what he means...they are not going to try and lose and sit some of their best players so they can lose..but they are not going to go out of their way to add players to get better since they are out of the playoff race/likely to get a high pick..but want to develop the "fight to win" mentality....

And, as new ASU football coach once said....

Watch on YouTube

Suns have proven all year - they will win some games now and again but over the course of the rest of the season, with the tougher part of the schedule - they will lose without trying to tank.

But I think you are right about how they will proceed - if they add a player like Kemba Walker: it costs them assets now, it probably means taking a bad contract and because they get say Marvin Williams and Kemba - they are a better team which won't get them the play-offs but will lose out on that top 6 pick.

The Suns by natural ability of their team -- will play hard, win some games, maybe even beat a team like the OKC win a Sunday ago and still lose a lot more games.

This summer though - Ryan McD needs to DO something!!

That Heat pick should be open for business on draft night. IF they get the Bucks pick - same thing. Heck for the right player, would trade one or both picks to move up one spot on draft night

[NTB]

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[jcsunsfan]

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"The goal is to win games"

"Can't see them making a significant move considering where they are in standings."

So let me get this straight, we are a horrible team (5th worst), but the goal is to win games.....and we expect that to happen by NOT making a significant trade?

IOW. We are tanking by NOT making a trade. That way the players can play for wins and the tank is still intact.