Trade Ideas (Part III)

[DusterBuster]

If any of you guys listened to the latest Lowe Post, Zach had Windhorst on and talked some Cavs trade ideas. One of them he and Lowe were both discussing was involving the Blazers, so I thought I'd drop their ideas off and see what Cav fans think. So here's the basic rundown of their convo regarding the Blazers/Cavs idea...

*Windhorst loves the idea of McCollum for Love. Thinks CJ makes a great fit next to LeBron (which, side note, he's right).
*Lowe agrees but says Portland would need more to consider it, like CLE taking a bad contract or a pick.
*Windhorst agrees, suggests by name CJ and Meyers Leonard for Love, a pick and unnamed filler player (Lowe suggests Frye, Windhorst says he's already spoken for by Sacramento in the Hill deal).

So, using those parameters, what do Cavs fans think, is there potential for a deal here using this as a general framework?

CJ
Leonard

for

Love
Filler player (Korver? I'm assuming Frye and Shump are off the table because of Hill trade like Windhorst was.)
Cavs 1st Round Pick (reasonable protection)

What about changes to the pieces surrounding CJ and Love? Say Harkless instead of Leonard or swapping their own pick for the BKN pick if Portland throws in their 1st this year?

Just looking to see if there's a deal to build out here or not.

[Stillwater]

If any of you guys listened to the latest Lowe Post, Zach had Windhorst on and talked some Cavs trade ideas. One of them he and Lowe were both discussing was involving the Blazers, so I thought I'd drop their ideas off and see what Cav fans think. So here's the basic rundown of their convo regarding the Blazers/Cavs idea...

*Windhorst loves the idea of McCollum for Love. Thinks CJ makes a great fit next to LeBron (which, side note, he's right).
*Lowe agrees but says Portland would need more to consider it, like CLE taking a bad contract or a pick.
*Windhorst agrees, suggests by name CJ and Meyers Leonard for Love, a pick and unnamed filler player (Lowe suggests Frye, Windhorst says he's already spoken for by Sacramento in the Hill deal).

So, using those parameters, what do Cavs fans think, is there potential for a deal here using this as a general framework?

CJ
Leonard

for

Love
Filler player (Korver? I'm assuming Frye and Shump are off the table because of Hill trade like Windhorst was.)
Cavs 1st Round Pick (reasonable protection)

What about changes to the pieces surrounding CJ and Love? Say Harkless instead of Leonard or swapping their own pick for the BKN pick if Portland throws in their 1st this year?

Just looking to see if there's a deal to build out here or not.

Those ideas are total disregard for defense which is the problem. We don't need more offense,if we get better defense and rebounding at the pf spot next Love. IT3 has all but punched his ticket out if he's complaining about what anyone else is doing on the bench. He is not the man we need without making multiple changes to the sets etc.
Side note Love is a better 2 way player than CJ, Portland by wanting to dump a bad contract and ask for a pick would be basically saying no thanks we like our backcourt and our frontcourt is pretty good going forward.
Lowe and Windy should STFU ,this roster is in turmoil only because anyone not name LeBron and Love are always on the block. Isaiah thinks he's not but he Has to be along with Crowder neither of whom are more difficult to get rid of for the cohesion of the team to return than it would take trying to win anything with a former first option miget and a low iq SF who can't rebound or defend at the 4 spot.
**** Boston **** Irving **** the players we got in the trade. Trade them and we may win, keep them and we will never win another championship.

[King Ken]

I think Cleveland should make about 4 moves.

1. Get a legit PG. George Hill could be that, Idk yet. If he's Utah's Hill, then yes.

2. Move Smith to the bench for Korver. I understand you want to showcase him for trades but yeah, he's washed. He looks like a 14 year vet who relied on athletic ability but worse. Korver is the most effective player for the Cavs outside of James and Love. We all know he's not a 24-28MPG player but need needs to start and get 20MPG. It makes sense.

3. Trade Love to Miami for Whiteside.

4. Move Crowder to the 2nd unit and move TT or Green into the starting five. Ideally, I would prefer someone better than either one of these three. Crowder just isn't playing well at PF. He's a liability but I am afraid they are all liabilities. I would look to trade for a PF. None of these guys can start at PF for a playoff team. I would really look to trading the late 1st and J.R. Smith for Marvin Williams. Plays well in space, shooting the 3 ball at 45.2%. Can defend the PnR. Doesn't protect the rim and offensively can be useless when handling the rock but that's not needed in Cleveland anyway.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y9tvfaz7

I wouldn't move Crowder. You don't have another SF that's legit aside from him. Jeff is more of a undersized PF at this stage of his career.

At the end of the day, time to sell on Love. He is productive but opponents are doing work on him and the team is better without him this year than with him. Then again, the starting five is a mess so everyone including James is hindered by it. He's a terrible center by the way and since TT has regressed. It puts them in a tough position. Plus Miami can afford to lose Whiteside. Miami is better with him on the floor and Bam is ready to get legit backup minutes. That said, Whiteside is one of the most productive centers in the NBA today. His teams don't really benefit from his presence but Cleveland could do to him rim protection.

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[jbk1234]

If any of you guys listened to the latest Lowe Post, Zach had Windhorst on and talked some Cavs trade ideas. One of them he and Lowe were both discussing was involving the Blazers, so I thought I'd drop their ideas off and see what Cav fans think. So here's the basic rundown of their convo regarding the Blazers/Cavs idea...

*Windhorst loves the idea of McCollum for Love. Thinks CJ makes a great fit next to LeBron (which, side note, he's right).
*Lowe agrees but says Portland would need more to consider it, like CLE taking a bad contract or a pick.
*Windhorst agrees, suggests by name CJ and Meyers Leonard for Love, a pick and unnamed filler player (Lowe suggests Frye, Windhorst says he's already spoken for by Sacramento in the Hill deal).

So, using those parameters, what do Cavs fans think, is there potential for a deal here using this as a general framework?

CJ
Leonard

for

Love
Filler player (Korver? I'm assuming Frye and Shump are off the table because of Hill trade like Windhorst was.)
Cavs 1st Round Pick (reasonable protection)

What about changes to the pieces surrounding CJ and Love? Say Harkless instead of Leonard or swapping their own pick for the BKN pick if Portland throws in their 1st this year?

Just looking to see if there's a deal to build out here or not.

I would seriously question Altman's competence if he did that deal. Dumping Leonard alone would cost a good first - probably late lottery. Adding another 1st and Korver on top if it is crazy IMO.

[Stillwater]

I think Cleveland should make about 4 moves.

1. Get a legit PG. George Hill could be that, Idk yet. If he's Utah's Hill, then yes.

2. Move Smith to the bench for Korver. I understand you want to showcase him for trades but yeah, he's washed. He looks like a 14 year vet who relied on athletic ability but worse. Korver is the most effective player for the Cavs outside of James and Love. We all know he's not a 24-28MPG player but need needs to start and get 20MPG. It makes sense.

3. Trade Love to Miami for Whiteside.

4. Move Crowder to the 2nd unit and move TT or Green into the starting five. Ideally, I would prefer someone better than either one of these three. Crowder just isn't playing well at PF. He's a liability but I am afraid they are all liabilities. I would look to trade for a PF. None of these guys can start at PF for a playoff team. I would really look to trading the late 1st and J.R. Smith for Marvin Williams. Plays well in space, shooting the 3 ball at 45.2%. Can defend the PnR. Doesn't protect the rim and offensively can be useless when handling the rock but that's not needed in Cleveland anyway.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y9tvfaz7

I wouldn't move Crowder. You don't have another SF that's legit aside from him. Jeff is more of a undersized PF at this stage of his career.

At the end of the day, time to sell on Love. He is productive but opponents are doing work on him and the team is better without him this year than with him. Then again, the starting five is a mess so everyone including James is hindered by it. He's a terrible center by the way and since TT has regressed. It puts them in a tough position. Plus Miami can afford to lose Whiteside. Miami is better with him on the floor and Bam is ready to get legit backup minutes. That said, Whiteside is one of the most productive centers in the NBA today. His teams don't really benefit from his presence but Cleveland could do to him rim protection.

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Crowder is on a decent contract and he should be easy to trade.
We don't decide to not make trades because the player is the only legit positional player when we are not even using them at that position.
Whiteside is a waste of $ if Love is not on the roster at the 4.
If Love gets traded before the deadline ( extremely unlikely) it's for 2 lottery picks bare minimum and a bad contract and it equates to a rebuild which seems highly unlikely considering it would punch Lebrons ticket unless the picks were projected in the top 3 and even then probably would. Gilbert is not going to devalue his product right before he sells it.
Gilbert is going to make every move possible to win now and retain Lebron, because if he doesn't he will not be selling this team for nearly what it is worth right now with no future

[King Ken]

I think Cleveland should make about 4 moves.

1. Get a legit PG. George Hill could be that, Idk yet. If he's Utah's Hill, then yes.

2. Move Smith to the bench for Korver. I understand you want to showcase him for trades but yeah, he's washed. He looks like a 14 year vet who relied on athletic ability but worse. Korver is the most effective player for the Cavs outside of James and Love. We all know he's not a 24-28MPG player but need needs to start and get 20MPG. It makes sense.

3. Trade Love to Miami for Whiteside.

4. Move Crowder to the 2nd unit and move TT or Green into the starting five. Ideally, I would prefer someone better than either one of these three. Crowder just isn't playing well at PF. He's a liability but I am afraid they are all liabilities. I would look to trade for a PF. None of these guys can start at PF for a playoff team. I would really look to trading the late 1st and J.R. Smith for Marvin Williams. Plays well in space, shooting the 3 ball at 45.2%. Can defend the PnR. Doesn't protect the rim and offensively can be useless when handling the rock but that's not needed in Cleveland anyway.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y9tvfaz7

I wouldn't move Crowder. You don't have another SF that's legit aside from him. Jeff is more of a undersized PF at this stage of his career.

At the end of the day, time to sell on Love. He is productive but opponents are doing work on him and the team is better without him this year than with him. Then again, the starting five is a mess so everyone including James is hindered by it. He's a terrible center by the way and since TT has regressed. It puts them in a tough position. Plus Miami can afford to lose Whiteside. Miami is better with him on the floor and Bam is ready to get legit backup minutes. That said, Whiteside is one of the most productive centers in the NBA today. His teams don't really benefit from his presence but Cleveland could do to him rim protection.

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Crowder is on a decent contract and he should be easy to trade.
We don't decide to not make trades because the player is the only legit positional player when we are not even using them at that position.
Whiteside is a waste of $ if Love is not on the roster at the 4.
If Love gets traded before the deadline ( extremely unlikely) it's for 2 lottery picks bare minimum and a bad contract and it equates to a rebuild which seems highly unlikely considering it would punch Lebrons ticket unless the picks were projected in the top 3 and even then probably would. Gilbert is not going to devalue his product right before he sells it.
Gilbert is going to make every move possible to win now and retain Lebron, because if he doesn't he will not be selling this team for nearly what it is worth right now with no future

Love trade value isn't close to high enough to one really high lottery pick at this point much less two. Maybe in weak classes but not right now. It would take a team to already have a top 10 pick and the players they want are gone to be open to doing it. For example, i could see the Suns doing it if they miss out on Sexton and Young. No offense but I don't see it the way you do. I don't see Crowder having much trade value.

I don't see you doing any better than Marvin in a J.R. Smith trade even with a late 1st attached.

I think any Whiteside acquisition to Cleveland must address the PF position with a stretch 4. It can't work otherwise. Miami is trading Whiteside for anyone on your roster not named Love without the Brooklyn pick. I don't know what you want that makes sense. You literally tried to suggest to Atlanta fans to trade Collins for Crowder. That's like Atlanta fans asking for Love for Bazemore. The trade value is astronomically too wide to even make the suggestion.

You gotta get realistic with the market. And yes, you would like to bring in Whiteside with Love but that's not happening without that Brooklyn pick.

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[DusterBuster]

Lowe and Windy should STFU

I would seriously question Altman's competence if he did that deal. Dumping Leonard alone would cost a good first - probably late lottery. Adding another 1st and Korver on top if it is crazy IMO.

So any chance of like.... a friendly dialog about a CJ for Love deal or are tensions in Cavs-land so high right now that apparently having a back and forth of ideas isn't happening?

[jbk1234]

Lowe and Windy should STFU

I would seriously question Altman's competence if he did that deal. Dumping Leonard alone would cost a good first - probably late lottery. Adding another 1st and Korver on top if it is crazy IMO.

So any chance of like.... a friendly dialog about a CJ for Love deal or are tensions in Cavs-land so high right now that apparently having a back and forth of ideas isn't happening?

If it were Love/Crowder for McCollum/Harkless, I'd be okay with that. But, the underlying problem with the Cavs right now is the former Celtics players who think they are better than they are. IT and Crowder need to go IMO.

[King Ken]

Lowe and Windy should STFU

I would seriously question Altman's competence if he did that deal. Dumping Leonard alone would cost a good first - probably late lottery. Adding another 1st and Korver on top if it is crazy IMO.

So any chance of like.... a friendly dialog about a CJ for Love deal or are tensions in Cavs-land so high right now that apparently having a back and forth of ideas isn't happening?

If it were Love/Crowder for McCollum/Harkless, I'd be okay with that. But, the underlying problem with the Cavs right now is the former Celtics players who think they are better than they are. IT and Crowder need to go IMO.

Pretty damn good trade if you land Hill. The frontcourt is questionable

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[DusterBuster]

Lowe and Windy should STFU

I would seriously question Altman's competence if he did that deal. Dumping Leonard alone would cost a good first - probably late lottery. Adding another 1st and Korver on top if it is crazy IMO.

So any chance of like.... a friendly dialog about a CJ for Love deal or are tensions in Cavs-land so high right now that apparently having a back and forth of ideas isn't happening?

If it were Love/Crowder for McCollum/Harkless, I'd be okay with that. But, the underlying problem with the Cavs right now is the former Celtics players who think they are better than they are. IT and Crowder need to go IMO.

I actually prefer that trade to the idea one the guys on the Pod put out. I would still like to see if the Blazers could extract a pick of some sort (obviously), but if that trade went down just as you listed, I wouldn't be upset.

[DusterBuster]

So any chance of like.... a friendly dialog about a CJ for Love deal or are tensions in Cavs-land so high right now that apparently having a back and forth of ideas isn't happening?

If it were Love/Crowder for McCollum/Harkless, I'd be okay with that. But, the underlying problem with the Cavs right now is the former Celtics players who think they are better than they are. IT and Crowder need to go IMO.

Pretty damn good trade if you land Hill. The frontcourt is questionable

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What about expanding jbk's deal to include Ed Davis from the Blazers? Davis is imo, one of the most underrated backup bigmen in the league. His productivity off the bench is second to none and honestly one of the best role players I've seen in Portland in a long time. I'm not interested in giving him up, but with his contract expiring and the likelihood of the Blazers not being able to resign him, they should use in him in a trade if they want to get anything for him.

Love
Crowder
Korver

for

CJ
Harkless
Davis

[jbk1234]

I'd rather use IT and/or Crowder to get a PG at this point anyway:

Read on Twitter

[jbk1234]

If it were Love/Crowder for McCollum/Harkless, I'd be okay with that. But, the underlying problem with the Cavs right now is the former Celtics players who think they are better than they are. IT and Crowder need to go IMO.

Pretty damn good trade if you land Hill. The frontcourt is questionable

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What about expanding jbk's deal to include Ed Davis from the Blazers? Davis is imo, one of the most underrated backup bigmen in the league. His productivity off the bench is second to none and honestly one of the best role players I've seen in Portland in a long time. I'm not interested in giving him up, but with his contract expiring and the likelihood of the Blazers not being able to resign him, they should use in him in a trade if they want to get anything for him.

Love
Crowder
Korver

for

CJ
Harkless
Davis

We'll give you IT instead.

[DusterBuster]

Pretty damn good trade if you land Hill. The frontcourt is questionable

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What about expanding jbk's deal to include Ed Davis from the Blazers? Davis is imo, one of the most underrated backup bigmen in the league. His productivity off the bench is second to none and honestly one of the best role players I've seen in Portland in a long time. I'm not interested in giving him up, but with his contract expiring and the likelihood of the Blazers not being able to resign him, they should use in him in a trade if they want to get anything for him.

Love
Crowder
Korver

for

CJ
Harkless
Davis

We'll give you IT instead.

I don't think Portland would want IT on their team, he'd be too much of a distraction. Plus isn't Love, Crowder and IT the ones at the center of all the latest Cavs problems? If he was in the deal, he'd be bought out and I don't think Portland want to give up a player as useful as Davis for essentially nothing. Maybe swap IT for Korver and Vonleh for Davis or a 3rd team could be brought in to take on IT...

Speaking of chemistry problems, Love and Crowder being traded together doesn't seem like a great idea from that standpoint as much as I like it from a talent and roster fit standpoint for Portland... :/

[jbk1234]

What about expanding jbk's deal to include Ed Davis from the Blazers? Davis is imo, one of the most underrated backup bigmen in the league. His productivity off the bench is second to none and honestly one of the best role players I've seen in Portland in a long time. I'm not interested in giving him up, but with his contract expiring and the likelihood of the Blazers not being able to resign him, they should use in him in a trade if they want to get anything for him.

Love
Crowder
Korver

for

CJ
Harkless
Davis

We'll give you IT instead.

I don't think Portland would want IT on their team, he'd be too much of a distraction. Plus isn't Love, Crowder and IT the ones at the center of all the latest Cavs problems? If he was in the deal, he'd be bought out and I don't think Portland want to give up a player as useful as Davis for essentially nothing. Maybe swap IT for Korver and Vonleh for Davis or a 3rd team could be brought in to take on IT...

Speaking of chemistry problems, Love and Crowder being traded together doesn't seem like a great idea from that standpoint as much as I like it from a talent and roster fit standpoint for Portland... :/

Yeah that wouldn't be fair to Love.

[DusterBuster]

We'll give you IT instead.

I don't think Portland would want IT on their team, he'd be too much of a distraction. Plus isn't Love, Crowder and IT the ones at the center of all the latest Cavs problems? If he was in the deal, he'd be bought out and I don't think Portland want to give up a player as useful as Davis for essentially nothing. Maybe swap IT for Korver and Vonleh for Davis or a 3rd team could be brought in to take on IT...

Speaking of chemistry problems, Love and Crowder being traded together doesn't seem like a great idea from that standpoint as much as I like it from a talent and roster fit standpoint for Portland... :/

Yeah that wouldn't be fair to Love.

What about this 3 team with Nuggets?

Love, Crowder and Barton to Portland
CJ, Harkless and Davis to Cleveland
IT to Denver

Still concerned about the Love/Crowder dynamic, but maybe if Crowder and love are in a different situation where they're both playing their natural positions, there'll be less tension. *shurg*

[DusterBuster]

Or in light of Crowder's recent demotion out of the starting lineup and him having a tough time with the Cavs lockerroom, I still like the idea of a straight up Davis for Crowder swap.

Davis is averaging better stats than Thompson in about 7-8 less minutes per game and at less than half the price....

Also with the Sacramento Hill trade reportedly dead, it would open up more options with Frye and Shumpert. Maybe:

Sumpert
Crowder

for

Davis
Harkless

[ceremony816]

MAVS
Shumpert
TT

CAVS
Matthews
Noel

[King Ken]

Or in light of Crowder's recent demotion out of the starting lineup and him having a tough time with the Cavs lockerroom, I still like the idea of a straight up Davis for Crowder swap.

Davis is averaging better stats than Thompson in about 7-8 less minutes per game and at less than half the price....

Also with the Sacramento Hill trade reportedly dead, it would open up more options with Frye and Shumpert. Maybe:

Sumpert
Crowder

for

Davis
Harkless

The Blazers would hang up

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[DusterBuster]

Or in light of Crowder's recent demotion out of the starting lineup and him having a tough time with the Cavs lockerroom, I still like the idea of a straight up Davis for Crowder swap.

Davis is averaging better stats than Thompson in about 7-8 less minutes per game and at less than half the price....

Also with the Sacramento Hill trade reportedly dead, it would open up more options with Frye and Shumpert. Maybe:

Sumpert
Crowder

for

Davis
Harkless

The Blazers would hang up

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They would? I'm a Blazer fan offering it lol