Trade Ideas (Part III)

[King Ken]

I have to believe that JR, Shump, & 1st for Hill & filler would've gotten it done. But shaving $9 million (at least) of off Hill's deal and VC expiring would give the Kings enough cap space to sign a legit starter this summer at any position they choose.

You know, I would have to agree. Basically Cleveland didn't want Hill's contract for just Shump and Channing. They wanted them to take J.R. as well and Sac had no interest. Probably asked for the Brooklyn pick.

The Kings want Frye, Shump & a 1st for Hill. That's a lot for a guy who is owed $20 million next year, is on the back nine of his career, and wasn't having the best season before his team shut him down. Pretty sure the market for Hill is the Cavs and no one else.

Yep! I would say no for the Cavs. Not taking Hill's contract and giving a 1st. Even if he's good this year, if LeBron leaves, then what?

[King Ken]

That's fair. I think there will be two or three teams bidding on him on draft day.

I would say, maybe 6-8 teams at the least. I just think Stillwater will be surprised at the value coming back to Cleveland.

It will be dependent on two factors: (1) How much bad salary the Cavs are willing to take back; and (2) whether the Cavs prefer the best pick they can get, or the best rebuilding package they can get. I think at team like the Jazz or Suns will be pretty motivated.

Motivated and trading a lottery pick are two different questions. I think a team like Charlotte would have more interest.

[Sactowndog]

Yeah they want a first on top of the salary relief and the Cavs aren't going to give it.

Not sure this is accurate. Don’t really need salary relief. My guess is no first was the problem.

I have to believe that JR, Shump, & 1st for Hill & filler would've gotten it done. But shaving $9 million (at least) of off Hill's deal and VC expiring would give the Kings enough cap space to sign a legit starter this summer at any position they choose.

One thing we have learned in Sac is our ability to sign a “legit starter” in free agency is currently slim and none unless we vastly overpay.

The trade you outline maybe gets done but your basically just renting cap space by taking on JR and Shump for a pretty late first. Compare if we wait until the next trade deadline to trade for those seeking to clear cap space for the 2019 class of free agents which includes as of now players like Thompson, Kawhi and Kyrie.

I think we probably get more value waiting until next year if we are basically trading Hill for cap space rental.

[Sactowndog]

I have to believe that JR, Shump, & 1st for Hill & filler would've gotten it done. But shaving $9 million (at least) of off Hill's deal and VC expiring would give the Kings enough cap space to sign a legit starter this summer at any position they choose.

You know, I would have to agree. Basically Cleveland didn't want Hill's contract for just Shump and Channing. They wanted them to take J.R. as well and Sac had no interest. Probably asked for the Brooklyn pick.

The Kings want Frye, Shump & a 1st for Hill. That's a lot for a guy who is owed $20 million next year, is on the back nine of his career, and wasn't having the best season before his team shut him down. Pretty sure the market for Hill is the Cavs and no one else.

For this year I would agree but that’s not what the competition the Cavs are facing. The alternatives are trade Hill now for the late 1st with some contracts or wait and trade Hill in 19 with ZBo to a team looking to clear cap for the 19 free agents.

The Cavs 1st is so late it’s not worth taking on more than Shump and Frye. If it’s Shump and JR and a late first then most think we are better waiting for 2019.

[Stillwater]

I'll just address the Kev stuff. I think you will be in for a rude awakening on Kev's trade value.

There isn't a coaches chosen all star in the league that isn't worth 2 lottery picks,c'mon man.
As far as rude awakening I've never had any in my entire life,doubt it's gonna happen here either.
We probably are not shopping Love at all anyway as it's pretty clear the team is not pointing fingers at him, the little guy was the finger pointer with Crowder backing his argument (you see what that got him)and this roster is more torn about the pg position and is more likely pointing at the little guy.
Isaiah needs to accept he isn't that guy here if he wants to be here long enough to see what's it's like to win a championship

No. He's not worth two lottery picks.

Of course he is, but nobody has 2 in 2018 that are projected in the lottery and few teams have 2 that they will give up because nobody that has 2 that would still have 1 afterwards in consecutive years where they could part with picks in consecutive years is even close to the same timeline that adding 1 yr of KLove to benefit from it.Example Philly could justify giving up their 2018 Lakers pick (projected outside of Bostons grasp) and their 2019 Sac pick (2019 weak in comparison to 2018)for Love, but it's highly unlikely given the age of that roster it would make a lot of sense for them,doesn't mean he isn't worth it.
Same thing with Phoenix that has multiple 1sts but only their own projected lottery and the team is too young.
I bet we could get ATL 2018 and 2019 lottery picks with the other picks they own still available to them for Love because the 2019 would be late lottery at best anyway.Maybe they are dumping their vets and going full rebuild, but is not their previous m.o.
Doesn't matter anyway because the Cav's front office is not trading their 2nd best player at the deadline

[jbk1234]

You know, I would have to agree. Basically Cleveland didn't want Hill's contract for just Shump and Channing. They wanted them to take J.R. as well and Sac had no interest. Probably asked for the Brooklyn pick.

The Kings want Frye, Shump & a 1st for Hill. That's a lot for a guy who is owed $20 million next year, is on the back nine of his career, and wasn't having the best season before his team shut him down. Pretty sure the market for Hill is the Cavs and no one else.

For this year I would agree but that’s not what the competition the Cavs are facing. The alternatives are trade Hill now for the late 1st with some contracts or wait and trade Hill in 19 with ZBo to a team looking to clear cap for the 19 free agents.

The Cavs 1st is so late it’s not worth taking on more than Shump and Frye. If it’s Shump and JR and a late first then most think we are better waiting for 2019.

That's the competition they're facing at the deadline. After that, it's all guess work. Shump will be expiring next year and JR will essentially be expiring. You have as much chance trading for the player of your dreams next year with those two as you do with Hill.

[jbk1234]

Please let the Clippers extend DAJ. Please...

http://www.latimes.com/sports/clippers/la-sp-clippers-report-20180128-story.html

[Sactowndog]

The Kings want Frye, Shump & a 1st for Hill. That's a lot for a guy who is owed $20 million next year, is on the back nine of his career, and wasn't having the best season before his team shut him down. Pretty sure the market for Hill is the Cavs and no one else.

For this year I would agree but that’s not what the competition the Cavs are facing. The alternatives are trade Hill now for the late 1st with some contracts or wait and trade Hill in 19 with ZBo to a team looking to clear cap for the 19 free agents.

The Cavs 1st is so late it’s not worth taking on more than Shump and Frye. If it’s Shump and JR and a late first then most think we are better waiting for 2019.

That's the competition they're facing at the deadline. After that, it's all guess work. Shump will be expiring next year and JR will essentially be expiring. You have as much chance trading for the player of your dreams next year with those two as you do with Hill.

Who’s talking about trading for the player of our dreams? I don’t see that happening at all. I do potentially see us renting cap space at the trading deadline next year for a 1st of some sort hopefully around the 20 mark. Slightly better than the 1st we would get from you.

[Stillwater]

For this year I would agree but that’s not what the competition the Cavs are facing. The alternatives are trade Hill now for the late 1st with some contracts or wait and trade Hill in 19 with ZBo to a team looking to clear cap for the 19 free agents.

The Cavs 1st is so late it’s not worth taking on more than Shump and Frye. If it’s Shump and JR and a late first then most think we are better waiting for 2019.

That's the competition they're facing at the deadline. After that, it's all guess work. Shump will be expiring next year and JR will essentially be expiring. You have as much chance trading for the player of your dreams next year with those two as you do with Hill.

Who’s talking about trading for the player of our dreams? I don’t see that happening at all. I do potentially see us renting cap space at the trading deadline next year for a 1st of some sort hopefully around the 20 mark. Slightly better than the 1st we would get from you.

Hill doesn't help us enough to justify any move sending Shumpert who is a better defender just to get a true pg who has been shooting well enough to play off ball which he would do here if we are not moving IT3
Cavs need Kemba if they want to replace Isaiah and would consider Payton the cheaper option worth taking over Hill with Kemba drawing too much value outgoing.

[Sactowndog]

That's the competition they're facing at the deadline. After that, it's all guess work. Shump will be expiring next year and JR will essentially be expiring. You have as much chance trading for the player of your dreams next year with those two as you do with Hill.

Who’s talking about trading for the player of our dreams? I don’t see that happening at all. I do potentially see us renting cap space at the trading deadline next year for a 1st of some sort hopefully around the 20 mark. Slightly better than the 1st we would get from you.

Hill doesn't help us enough to justify any move sending Shumpert who is a better defender just to get a true pg who has been shooting well enough to play off ball which he would do here if we are not moving IT3
Cavs need Kemba if they want to replace Isaiah and would consider Payton the cheaper option worth taking over Hill with Kemba drawing too much value outgoing.

That’s fine. We will trade him next year for a team that wants to clear cap space. Most Kings fans are good with that outcome. We aren’t in a rush.

If you want to trade JR and IT instead that might work.

[jbk1234]

Who’s talking about trading for the player of our dreams? I don’t see that happening at all. I do potentially see us renting cap space at the trading deadline next year for a 1st of some sort hopefully around the 20 mark. Slightly better than the 1st we would get from you.

Hill doesn't help us enough to justify any move sending Shumpert who is a better defender just to get a true pg who has been shooting well enough to play off ball which he would do here if we are not moving IT3
Cavs need Kemba if they want to replace Isaiah and would consider Payton the cheaper option worth taking over Hill with Kemba drawing too much value outgoing.

That’s fine. We will trade him next year for a team that wants to clear cap space. Most Kings fans are good with that outcome. We aren’t in a rush.

I would do the deal as originally reported. But I wouldn't offer cap space AND a first. I don't know what to make of reports that Hill isn't taking a discount this summer on a buy out. I don't know if that's his camp letting Vlade know he expects his money if he's kept around or if that conversation really happened.

[Sactowndog]

Hill doesn't help us enough to justify any move sending Shumpert who is a better defender just to get a true pg who has been shooting well enough to play off ball which he would do here if we are not moving IT3
Cavs need Kemba if they want to replace Isaiah and would consider Payton the cheaper option worth taking over Hill with Kemba drawing too much value outgoing.

That’s fine. We will trade him next year for a team that wants to clear cap space. Most Kings fans are good with that outcome. We aren’t in a rush.

I would do the deal as originally reported. But I wouldn't offer cap space AND a first. I don't know what to make of reports that Hill isn't taking a discount this summer on a buy out. I don't know if that's his camp letting Vlade know he expects his money if he's kept around or if that conversation really happened.

Yep I get your point. I understand why you don’t want to do it but as reported I think the Kings do better next year. Meaning Hill is worth more for the cap space he will clear then as a player.

[daoneandonly]

I have to believe that JR, Shump, & 1st for Hill & filler would've gotten it done. But shaving $9 million (at least) of off Hill's deal and VC expiring would give the Kings enough cap space to sign a legit starter this summer at any position they choose.

You know, I would have to agree. Basically Cleveland didn't want Hill's contract for just Shump and Channing. They wanted them to take J.R. as well and Sac had no interest. Probably asked for the Brooklyn pick.

The Kings want Frye, Shump & a 1st for Hill. That's a lot for a guy who is owed $20 million next year, is on the back nine of his career, and wasn't having the best season before his team shut him down. Pretty sure the market for Hill is the Cavs and no one else.

Would you trade that package (the 1st being Cleveland's, not BKN) to Dallas for Matthews/Noel?

[jbk1234]

You know, I would have to agree. Basically Cleveland didn't want Hill's contract for just Shump and Channing. They wanted them to take J.R. as well and Sac had no interest. Probably asked for the Brooklyn pick.

The Kings want Frye, Shump & a 1st for Hill. That's a lot for a guy who is owed $20 million next year, is on the back nine of his career, and wasn't having the best season before his team shut him down. Pretty sure the market for Hill is the Cavs and no one else.

Would you trade that package (the 1st being Cleveland's, not BKN) to Dallas for Matthews/Noel?

Not a chance. I'm all for marketing but the notion that Matthews is worth a first on his deal is a little much. JR would have to go out for sure if we were taking back Matthews.

[daoneandonly]

The Kings want Frye, Shump & a 1st for Hill. That's a lot for a guy who is owed $20 million next year, is on the back nine of his career, and wasn't having the best season before his team shut him down. Pretty sure the market for Hill is the Cavs and no one else.

Would you trade that package (the 1st being Cleveland's, not BKN) to Dallas for Matthews/Noel?

Not a chance. I'm all for marketing but the notion that Matthews is worth a first on his deal is a little much. JR would have to go out for sure if we were taking back Matthews.

I can see that, but do you mean JR and Shump, or JR in place of Shump? I think Dallas would still do the instead one, but not take both, which would make a deal between the two unlikely.

[jbk1234]

Would you trade that package (the 1st being Cleveland's, not BKN) to Dallas for Matthews/Noel?

Not a chance. I'm all for marketing but the notion that Matthews is worth a first on his deal is a little much. JR would have to go out for sure if we were taking back Matthews.

I can see that, but do you mean JR and Shump, or JR in place of Shump? I think Dallas would still do the instead one, but not take both, which would make a deal between the two unlikely.

It would probably depend on if you wanted the first or not. JR/Frye for Matthews/Noel or JR/Shump for Matthews/Noel and the Cavs first.

[daoneandonly]

Not a chance. I'm all for marketing but the notion that Matthews is worth a first on his deal is a little much. JR would have to go out for sure if we were taking back Matthews.

I can see that, but do you mean JR and Shump, or JR in place of Shump? I think Dallas would still do the instead one, but not take both, which would make a deal between the two unlikely.

It would probably depend on if you wanted the first or not. JR/Frye for Matthews/Noel or JR/Shump for Matthews/Noel and the Cavs first.

Yeah I saw the pick being included when people added Noel. I was fine with a straight swap of Frye/Shump for Matthews, no picks involved, but not sure if the cavs would be interested in that since it adds about 7-8 mil next year.

[jbk1234]

I can see that, but do you mean JR and Shump, or JR in place of Shump? I think Dallas would still do the instead one, but not take both, which would make a deal between the two unlikely.

It would probably depend on if you wanted the first or not. JR/Frye for Matthews/Noel or JR/Shump for Matthews/Noel and the Cavs first.

Yeah I saw the pick being included when people added Noel. I was fine with a straight swap of Frye/Shump for Matthews, no picks involved, but not sure if the cavs would be interested in that since it adds about 7-8 mil next year.

Yeah I'm not sure why the Cavs would do that. Frankly, I don't know that Noel has 1st round pick value at this point.

[daoneandonly]

It would probably depend on if you wanted the first or not. JR/Frye for Matthews/Noel or JR/Shump for Matthews/Noel and the Cavs first.

Yeah I saw the pick being included when people added Noel. I was fine with a straight swap of Frye/Shump for Matthews, no picks involved, but not sure if the cavs would be interested in that since it adds about 7-8 mil next year.

Yeah I'm not sure why the Cavs would do that. Frankly, I don't know that Noel has 1st round pick value at this point.

Oh he does not, given his contract status, attitude, and injury history, we won't get much for him. Only thing with the Cavs are they are a win now team who could use a rim protector, but still, yeah a first is rather steep for half a season.

[Vae Victus]

Homerun move idea involving BRK pick.

CLE trades
JR Smith
Iman Shumpert
Channing Frye
Derrick Rose
BRK #1

LAC trades
DJordan
Avery Bradley
Lou Williams

Clips take back 2 bad long term contracts and minor salary to help with your tax burden. In return gives you upgrades at 3 positions (C, SG, 6th man) all at the cost of BRK's pick.

CLE gonna take a hard shot at taking down GSW in the finals with as loaded of a roster as they can get.

C- DJ, TT
PF-Love, Crowder
SF-LBJ, Korver
SG-Bradley, Wade
PG- IT, Lou Will

Clips go full blown tankathon. Unlikely the team will be a player in FA next offseason (those LBJ rumors are hilarious) so taking in extra years from JR and Shump isnt that big of a deal as long as they get serious value from it in the BRK pick.

I'm pretty much as shocked as anyone else the Clips decided to blow it up in insane fashion like this, but gotta roll with it. West wants to rebuild HARD, that much is clear.