Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion Pt. 6

[NavLDO]

not going to lie. I like Julius Randle.

I think Josh Jackson, and Bender are keepers.

We need to let Len walk, and also Trade Chriss.

I'm not big on Randle, it's not 1995 anymore. But I do think jj stays, bender is still in eval, n trade chriss if you have a taker.

Until next game, when Chriss does great, Bender turns back into a wall flower, JJ shoots 3 for 13, 1 for 6 from 3PT, and Len Blks 5 shots, and has one of his patented 18/14 nights...then it all changes again...oh, I love this forum...

Seriously though, Len is as good as gone, unless we work something out for him for $2-3M per, but I doubt it. Chriss might be able to be traded, but it won't likely be but as filler. I would love for Coach Triano to just pick 5 and stick with them...along the lines of what has been kind of the formula as of late...and Chriss as the 5, or Bender as the 5

Booker / JJ / TJ / Bender / Chriss

Kind of like what was mentioned, a few posts back, and then, hope the Heat keep losing, at least as much as they are winning and keep around that 18th pick they are in now to maximize our chances at grabbing a talent.

[thamadkant]

Randle's issue is that he is mediocre defensively. He's got average length not like Milsap or Brand... And he isn't a good passer or play maker like Griffin or Odom. He's a tweener who is OK off the bench... But as a starter? He needs to improve a lot. Chriss is better once he matures.

[Saberestar]

Randle's issue is that he is mediocre defensively. He's got average length not like Milsap or Brand... And he isn't a good passer or play maker like Griffin or Odom. He's a tweener who is OK off the bench... But as a starter? He needs to improve a lot. Chriss is better once he matures.

Randle a tweener? I think he is a legit 6'10, 250 lbs. I know that he was measured at the draft combine around 6'9, but he grew an inch after that IMO. In the current NBA he is a C....who can play some PF.

I agree about his defense, he is not very good but he is active, strong and quick enough to defend a bit in the perimeter. I am tired of watching opposing teams abusing of Chandler/Len/Monroe in the pick and roll.

If Bender improves and he becomes a solid stretch PF who can protect the rim for us someone like Randle can be perfect next to him.

[lilfishi22]

I don't want to put too much into this, but when the initial reports of Kawhi being unhappy in SA I figured the Suns would possibly try and showcase JJ more. I thought maybe if JJ can start to show more consistent flashes of being a great player, the Spurs would consider trading Kawhi for a package centered around JJ. Now that JJ has put together a string of 4 20 point games I am reluctant to trade him.
Now I know a lot of you think the Spurs would never trade Kawhi, but remember he can get the designated player extension which would be more than what John Wall will be getting in the future. And people are already saying that that contract is a financial burden. It makes signing other players virtually impossible because it takes so much cap space.
Before the draft the Spurs were trying to move up to acquire Jackson, even dangling LMA to make it happen. Now, I know a 32 year old LMA isn't the same as a 26 year old Kawhi, especially when LMA was putting up something like 18 and 8. But now he is looking like a top 15 player in the league and that's after he signed a 4 year extension. The Spurs have also been mentioned to be interested in Stanley Johnson, though Johnson would likely be a lot cheaper price than JJ but they have the same mold of being athletic wingman. It makes me wonder why the Spurs are so interested in these players when they already have the best two way wing player in Kawhi. Maybe they don't see him sticking around unless it's only for the designated extension l, and perhaps they don't feel any player is actually worth that kind of salary. So obviously a cheaper alternative while still remaining competitive is to go after players on their rookie deals.
Now I'm not sure if the Spurs would even trade Kawhi, but what if they approached the Suns and said they would trade Kawhi for JJ, Warren, Len, both Heat picks, the Bucks pick, and our 2019 1st unprotected and our 2021 1st with top 7 protection. Is that a deal you would take, if Kawhi gave us verbal confirmation that he would stay with us?

I know I strung together a strange web, but it's close to the deadline and I just wanted to spice up the board a bit.

I'd be down for that.

We *could* have a 'Kawhi-lite' or we could have the real Kawhi. Give me the real Kawhi. I still don't buy that he wants out or that the Spurs couldn't work things out. If they worked things out with LMA, who's less attached and hasn't been with the franchise as long, they'll work things out with the guy they drafted and is an NBA champion

[lilfishi22]

Triano may very well be better than some college candidate. College candidates often botch opportunities..some of the best ones, such as Rick Pitino and Calipari were major failures at the NBA level.

There is only ONE college coach that I would call and he coaches in Storrs, CT and I am not talking about Kevin Ollie.

And as much as I like Auriemma -I still prefer Triano, Fizdale, Van Gundy, Messina , JB Bickerstaff, even Mike Brown.

Not sure why people bring up Fizdale so much. This guy has been a career assistant who finally got an opportunity and failed after 1 year. Is it because LeBron tweeted about him or something? Van Gundy? Why? Mike Brown, no thanks. Bickerstaff has only been an assistant or interim coach on teams on a downward spiral..not sure why on him either. Messina...ok, I get that one.

Same reason why people seem to be on board with Triano staying on. He's a career assistant coach who's had multiple opportunities in the past.

[bwgood77]

There is only ONE college coach that I would call and he coaches in Storrs, CT and I am not talking about Kevin Ollie.

And as much as I like Auriemma -I still prefer Triano, Fizdale, Van Gundy, Messina , JB Bickerstaff, even Mike Brown.

Not sure why people bring up Fizdale so much. This guy has been a career assistant who finally got an opportunity and failed after 1 year. Is it because LeBron tweeted about him or something? Van Gundy? Why? Mike Brown, no thanks. Bickerstaff has only been an assistant or interim coach on teams on a downward spiral..not sure why on him either. Messina...ok, I get that one.

Same reason why people seem to be on board with Triano staying on. He's a career assistant coach who's had multiple opportunities in the past.

Well we've seen our players grow and get better under Triano. That's the reason for him. I didn't hear anyone say lets hire him because "he's a career assistant who has multiple opportunities in the past". I did mention he had a lot of experience. Fizdale has been a long time assistant as well but I don't see a compelling reason he'd be a good hire when he just got his first job and lasted a little over a year, and apparently didn't get along with at least Marc Gasol.

He might be a decent hire but I don't see why he would particularly be a good coach. I get that he was at Miami when LeBron, Wade and Bosh were but I don't know how that helps...it was teams with those guys and cheap vets around them getting to the finals.

[Fo-Real]

http://arizonasports.com/story/1405723/marquese-chriss-suspension-practice-phoenix-suns/

Details on the chriss suspension. Good to hold him accountable but this seems pretty minor.

Yep, this board blew this way the hell out of proportion.

[NavLDO]

I know this isn't a 'Draft' Thread, but i just noticed how many teams have multiple 1st Rd picks this year; I wonder if some 'trade opportunities' might present themselves as they did in 2016.

Reason I ask is because from what I am seeing, that 'Top Tier' Group has expanded from 5 to, I'd say, 9 players, and since we are potentially 2 players away, I wonder if it might be advantageous to trade up a few spots from our 2nd, 1st Rd pick. For instance, right now, the Sixers own the 9th and 15th picks overall. The Hawks own the 22nd, 25th and 29th. The Clippers own the 13th/14th. And the Cavs own the 8th and the 24th.

Would you all, say we kept our 5th, and say the Heat slid back down to the 20th...be willing to move back to say, the 8th, if it meant we were able to draft 15th instead of 20th?

So maybe, it would be like us getting

Sexton and Carter

vs

Young and McCoy

I don't know...just a thought. Not saying I'm for it or against it, but thought it was an interesting scenario in case maybe ll our favorites are gone by 5, would Mcd pull that trigger or not.

[lilfishi22]

Not sure why people bring up Fizdale so much. This guy has been a career assistant who finally got an opportunity and failed after 1 year. Is it because LeBron tweeted about him or something? Van Gundy? Why? Mike Brown, no thanks. Bickerstaff has only been an assistant or interim coach on teams on a downward spiral..not sure why on him either. Messina...ok, I get that one.

Same reason why people seem to be on board with Triano staying on. He's a career assistant coach who's had multiple opportunities in the past.

Well we've seen our players grow and get better under Triano. That's the reason for him. I didn't hear anyone say lets hire him because "he's a career assistant who has multiple opportunities in the past". I did mention he had a lot of experience. Fizdale has been a long time assistant as well but I don't see a compelling reason he'd be a good hire when he just got his first job and lasted a little over a year, and apparently didn't get along with at least Marc Gasol.

He might be a decent hire but I don't see why he would particularly be a good coach. I get that he was at Miami when LeBron, Wade and Bosh were but I don't know how that helps...it was teams with those guys and cheap vets around them getting to the finals.

I'm not saying Fizdale is necessarily a better hire than Triano. I'm highlighting that both guys were career assistants (except for JT's HC stint with the Raps) with questionable records coming in but somehow Triano gets a better rap only because he's done good but hardly revolutionary things for this team. Triano seems like Pops when you compare it to the clown we had in that position before him. The Fizdale firing was panned league-wide and more a testament of the Grizzlies front office than anything. And literally everything you've said about Fizdale could be said for Triano but you seem to dismiss Fizdale. Who knows what Fizdale could do with this young team.

[lilfishi22]

I know this isn't a 'Draft' Thread, but i just noticed how many teams have multiple 1st Rd picks this year; I wonder if some 'trade opportunities' might present themselves as they did in 2016.

Reason I ask is because from what I am seeing, that 'Top Tier' Group has expanded from 5 to, I'd say, 9 players, and since we are potentially 2 players away, I wonder if it might be advantageous to trade up a few spots from our 2nd, 1st Rd pick. For instance, right now, the Sixers own the 9th and 15th picks overall. The Hawks own the 22nd, 25th and 29th. The Clippers own the 13th/14th. And the Cavs own the 8th and the 24th.

Would you all, say we kept our 5th, and say the Heat slid back down to the 20th...be willing to move back to say, the 8th, if it meant we were able to draft 15th instead of 20th?

So maybe, it would be like us getting

Sexton and Carter

vs

Young and McCoy

I don't know...just a thought. Not saying I'm for it or against it, but thought it was an interesting scenario in case maybe ll our favorites are gone by 5, would Mcd pull that trigger or not.

Nope. I prefer to keep our #5 pick. Talent difference between #15 and #20 is marginal in most drafts but in this particular draft, the difference between #5 and #8 could be significant.

[Waylay13]

I know this isn't a 'Draft' Thread, but i just noticed how many teams have multiple 1st Rd picks this year; I wonder if some 'trade opportunities' might present themselves as they did in 2016.

Reason I ask is because from what I am seeing, that 'Top Tier' Group has expanded from 5 to, I'd say, 9 players, and since we are potentially 2 players away, I wonder if it might be advantageous to trade up a few spots from our 2nd, 1st Rd pick. For instance, right now, the Sixers own the 9th and 15th picks overall. The Hawks own the 22nd, 25th and 29th. The Clippers own the 13th/14th. And the Cavs own the 8th and the 24th.

Would you all, say we kept our 5th, and say the Heat slid back down to the 20th...be willing to move back to say, the 8th, if it meant we were able to draft 15th instead of 20th?

So maybe, it would be like us getting

Sexton and Carter

vs

Young and McCoy

I don't know...just a thought. Not saying I'm for it or against it, but thought it was an interesting scenario in case maybe ll our favorites are gone by 5, would Mcd pull that trigger or not.

The draft drops of at 6 and then it isnt even close. Right now I have Young rated around 3 or 4 in this draft and Sexton is at best for the Suns a mid teens pick. He fails at the single most important skill for a point guard and that is passing the ball. I am so sick and tired of Hero ball points that think they can win a game by themselves that it isnt even funny.

[Kerrsed]

I know this isn't a 'Draft' Thread, but i just noticed how many teams have multiple 1st Rd picks this year; I wonder if some 'trade opportunities' might present themselves as they did in 2016.

Reason I ask is because from what I am seeing, that 'Top Tier' Group has expanded from 5 to, I'd say, 9 players, and since we are potentially 2 players away, I wonder if it might be advantageous to trade up a few spots from our 2nd, 1st Rd pick. For instance, right now, the Sixers own the 9th and 15th picks overall. The Hawks own the 22nd, 25th and 29th. The Clippers own the 13th/14th. And the Cavs own the 8th and the 24th.

Would you all, say we kept our 5th, and say the Heat slid back down to the 20th...be willing to move back to say, the 8th, if it meant we were able to draft 15th instead of 20th?

So maybe, it would be like us getting

Sexton and Carter

vs

Young and McCoy

I don't know...just a thought. Not saying I'm for it or against it, but thought it was an interesting scenario in case maybe ll our favorites are gone by 5, would Mcd pull that trigger or not.

Nope, i want NOTHING to do with Sexton. He will be a bust, you can quote me on that. He is no where near the top tier.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Seems such a quiet trade period.

[Djedefre]

Triano has done a much better job than a lot people give him credit for. The idea that we're "done for good" and it'll be "the end of this franchise" if we end up retaining Triano is pretty overdramatic. This season should have been dead in the water from the minute we got no immediate return for Bledsoe and left Triano trotting out Mike James as the starting PG. Instead, we're on pace for a better record than last year despite replacing one of Bledsoe's best seasons with effectively nothing.

Who knows exactly how much can be credited to Triano changing things up, but Booker and TJ are having their best year, JJ has gone from having a -14.1 net rating in 2017 to +19.4 so far in 2018, Bender seems to be starting to break out of his shell and do more than be a shooter, and Marquese was playing good basketball before he started getting banged up. I don't know if he's for sure our guy and we need to be scouring the Earth for the right guy, but I think Triano has done a good job working with the hand he was dealt and wouldn't be upset if he ended up being the head coach going into next season as long as we continue seeing development through the year.

Exactly this kind of approach made us so much harm in recent years - you could hear/read the same when Watson was the hc and again a little earlier when it was Hornacek:

1. Pick up the first name you ran into and give him hc job (who cares about his resume, doesn't matter if he's a total beginner or if he ever showed any promise)
2. Try to save a few $ in the process
3. If you notice something's not right with the team, ignore it and act like nothing's happening
4. When team starts accumulating losses, launch the self-deceiving program - make up all kinds of silly excuses to justify poor coaching, give all the credit for player x/y improvement to current hc and preach patience
5. Start lowering already low standards and expectations
6. When everything starts falling apart and it's too late, finally admit you messed up and repeat the process from step 1 to 6

I'm tired of incompetent coaches in the making that take first steps in the coaching job. I'm willing to wait for players to develop and pick up their game, but god i'm sick of coach prospects. This 'solutions' (like this giving Triano a shot suggestions) are just wasting time. If we really want to get out of this black hole, solid and reliable coach with philosophy is condition of all conditions. We can continue lowering the bar but i'm afraid we're already touching the bottom.

Who are you thinking about? Triano has a ton of experience and has really done a good job with our guys. I mean we could go after other assistants, like Triano was, under Stotts before becoming ours, and is a coach of the Canadian national team, or we could go after a college coach, but the NBA is an entirely different animal than coaching in college, which is largely just recruiting good players.

I remember liking Stevens at Butler a lot because he overachieved with a small school...not just a little bit, but took a mid major to the national championship twice in a row...it's hard enough for a major top recruiting program to get there any year, much less two in a row. There are not other Brad Stevens types out there.

Shaka Smart looked like the closest thing with VCU, but he went to Texas and is not doing anything special.

The only other smaller school coach that has really taken a small school far and I think had an undefeated or 1 loss season is the guy at Wichita St, Gregg Marshall.

So if I was going to look at a college coach it would be him.

All of the guys at the big programs are largely simply relying on their recruiting (Calipari, Coach K, Miller, Wright, Izzo, Williams, Self, etc). Those guys have dream jobs though.

The last big name college coach to go to the NBA from a big school was Billy Donovan. He hasn't been enormously popular in OKC.

I doubt we get a guy like Messina. I wouldn't mind Kokoskov...he was a previous assistant with us. Maybe David Blatt but don't know.

Just going in a different direction guarantees nothing, and it could end up badly. Frank Vogel was looked at as a big name and good coach after doing well in Indiana and he has done crap in Orlando.

Then there are over the hill guys who likely would not be good these days like JVG. Just not sure what options out there look good.

It mostly comes down to the players you have and getting the most out of them and Triano seems to be getting more and more out of our players every game. They are not going to win a lot going against guys with 5-10 more years of NBA experience on a regular basis...but we have had some nice wins. The coach can only do so much playing guys in their early 20s, G league players, or over the hill vets.

I’m talking about all the Kidds/Watsons/Hornaceks/Trianos of this world. Jay might be experienced in terms of being around NBA organization for a longer period of time, but he spent vast majority of his career so far as an assistant. His only head coaching gig ended with 38% w-l%. So yes, if we talk hc job, he’s a beginner.

You simply can’t put Jay Wright and Nova in the same bucket with all the others mentioned above. How many 5star recruits went to Nova during Wright’s tenure? And how many chose Duke/Kansas/Kentucky/Arizona/UNC every year? It’s incomparable. Comparing with them, Villanova is a small school. Same story with Bennett and Virginia - decent amount of talent, but never even close to that of famous programs. Yet he is doing a great job for years.

Shaka and Marshall are interesting too.

Blatt for sure. I’d even send an emissary to try convincing Obradovic to take the job, throw bags of money on him.

Bold - that’s what i’m talking about, apologetic approach. We had some nice wins, players are improving... Every team occasionally nabs some nice win, even worst ones like Hawks and Magic this season, or Nets a year before. As for player improvement, Bender’s one good game is still accompanied with 3 bad ones when he simply disappears, Chriss is struggling all season. Jackson is playing better lately, but should he get the credit for it or Jackson is maybe finding his game with more NBA experience. People were talking the same about player improvement under Watson and how Chriss made signifficant progress because of him and his family mantra.

[Frank Lee]

I'd bet its either Triano or Kidd... and if its Kidd, then he also replaces McD. Kidd is a two for one salary and would completely justify paying McD to go away.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Booker is out vs Lakers, Sasha Gray will play backup PG.

[bwgood77]

Randle's issue is that he is mediocre defensively. He's got average length not like Milsap or Brand... And he isn't a good passer or play maker like Griffin or Odom. He's a tweener who is OK off the bench... But as a starter? He needs to improve a lot. Chriss is better once he matures.

Randle a tweener? I think he is a legit 6'10, 250 lbs. I know that he was measured at the draft combine around 6'9, but he grew an inch after that IMO. In the current NBA he is a C....who can play some PF.

I agree about his defense, he is not very good but he is active, strong and quick enough to defend a bit in the perimeter. I am tired of watching opposing teams abusing of Chandler/Len/Monroe in the pick and roll.

If Bender improves and he becomes a solid stretch PF who can protect the rim for us someone like Randle can be perfect next to him.

I was never a Randle fan, but looking at his numbers after games, he clearly is a hard worker and a player. He will have games where he gets 15-17 rebounds...and I think he could be a good passer. His overall stats don't look great for the year, but he didn't get a lot of playing time either due to Kuzma and Nance getting more minutes. He has improved defensively and can be a good passer overall.

Overall I'd probably still pass because of lack of shot blocking and 3 pt shooting, and we just can't afford to have another guy who can't shoot 3s. I think as a big, and especially a C, you need to be able to rim protect in some capacity. If he was cheap, he wouldn't be a bad rotation guy but I don't think he is necessarily a good fit, and if we can get a rim protector and 3 pt shooter like JJJ, who plays great D, or Bamba, if we miss out on Doncic, Young and Porter, I'd go for those guys, I think over Bagley. Ayton has to be up there in top 2 or 3 as well, especially if he can shoot. I'd love if he'd engage more defensively but he can block shots.

Bagley does seems like he is a guy who can get better defensively, maybe even block shots and hit 3s in time, though he's not a great FT shooter so not sure...but I think he goes top 4 or so which means wherever we pick, there will likely be a better option for what we need.

I don't think there is a clear cut BPA other than Doncic, though I think any of those guys, particularly Young, and Ayton who can get there...or maybe Porter or JJJ, but I wouldn't count out Bamba or Bagley so ultimately I will be happy with top 7.

After that it gets dicey between Carter, Mikal Bridges, maybe even Robinson, though there is limited info on him much like Porter, so he is a wildcard....and Sexton, but I've cooled on him. I think he might be like Monk who can't get on the court much for a not so great team.

[thamadkant]

Would Suns fans here entertain trading Warren for Hood?

Not really even sure why they want to trade Hood. He can play next to Mitchell and Burks can play PG. Hood is big enough to be SF.

His 3pt range coulde be so useful .. Especially since Suns may run Booker and Jackson as backcourt Long term.

Rather have him than Aaron Gordon.

[hollywood6964]

Would Suns fans here entertain trading Warren for Hood?

Not really even sure why they want to trade Hood. He can play next to Mitchell and Burks can play PG. Hood is big enough to be SF.

His 3pt range coulde be so useful .. Especially since Suns may run Booker and Jackson as backcourt Long term.

Rather have him than Aaron Gordon.

I'd pass on that deal.

[Mulhollanddrive]

I'd like to build around Young-Booker-Jackson.