Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion Pt. 6

[WeekapaugGroove]

There's even a risk if Booker agreed to the plan. Let's say they make a couple win now moves this summer that don't work out and it's another **** show of a season. Or what if the Suns can't land any good FA's in the summer of 19 and now Booker is mad that they couldn't deliver on their end of the plan and he took all the risk. Booker is frustrated and now he decides it's in his best interest to go out and get an offer sheet that gives him a nice pay day but also let's him opt out and become a UFA in 3 years. Once they let him hit RFA then if he chooses to he can go meet with other teams and get wined and dined; those teams will know the Suns will match but it gives them an opportunity to start planing the seeds for when he's a UFA.

[BobbieL]

There's even a risk if Booker agreed to the plan. Let's say they make a couple win now moves this summer that don't work out and it's another **** show of a season. Or what if the Suns can't land any good FA's in the summer of 19 and now Booker is mad that they couldn't deliver on their end of the plan and he took all the risk. Booker is frustrated and now he decides it's in his best interest to go out and get an offer sheet that gives him a nice pay day but also let's him opt out and become a UFA in 3 years. Once they let him hit RFA then if he chooses to he can go meet with other teams and get wined and dined; those teams will know the Suns will match but it gives them an opportunity to start planing the seeds for when he's a UFA.

there are a lot of What Ifs that can go wrong. I just hope the Suns do the right thing with Booker

And I know the Suns have been getting hammered in the media - especially with another 40 point loss to the Warriors. But

--the Warriors sucked for a long time 1995 to 2011 went to the playoffs once
--granted they got the rings now to do what they will
-the Sixers had the Process - took four years
--the Clippers were horrible for a long time

But I think the Suns with the Timeline are doing the right thing. It was good they tried for LMA but that meant signing Chandler and that has been bad. So moving forward, just have to hope the draft picks are the right ones, the develop and a nice core is created.

[Saberestar]

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Probably Payton and Booker together tonight!

[RunDogGun]

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Probably Payton and Booker together tonight!

While I’d love to see a possible future starting lineup, I’d rather have Booker rest and be completely healthy.

[JMac1]

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Probably Payton and Booker together tonight!

While I’d love to see a possible future starting lineup, I’d rather have Booker rest and be completely healthy.

I think Elf’s recent play has us a little excited and they want to see if Elf is real or not when Booker plays.

[King4Day]

I called NBA radio last night when Justin Termine was on. I asked what their thoughts on the developmental process for the Suns (since the Bender and Jackson are showing slight improvement). They had nothing kind to say about it. I really wonder if those two players (or any others) would be much improved if they were somewhere else like Boston or San Antonio.

[JDLAW]

There is no upside for Booker to wait for his big payday. Even suggesting such an idea to him and his agent would go over like a lead balloon. The extension has already been mentioned in the local press and Booker has stated he would sign it. The Suns have been selling Booker as their franchise cornerstone and star and to suggest he goes another year being underpaid (as compared to his draft class) sends a very negative message to him, the general fanbase, and the season ticket holder base (I am a member and Booker's presence was a big selling point). It also suggests to Booker he does not even deserve the same treatment that Warren got, who extended after his third year.

With respect to financial, it would be a big hit to Booker from which he could not recover. You can do the math, but deferring $25M for a year and assuming he has the same career length - the money is never recoverable. As pointed out, an injury scenario would be devastating.

Finally, the last thing you want is for him to hit free agency, even if the Suns have rights of first refusal. Other teams get a chance to recruit him for unrestricted free agency and potentially set the calendar for when he becomes one. Does anyone even think the notion of pursuing an unknown free agent by preserving cap space is worth this? No amount of sitting down with him and "explaining" will undo the negative messages. Actions are much louder than words.

This is an idiotic notion that needs to be put to rest - 6 feet under.

[RunDogGun]

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Probably Payton and Booker together tonight!

While I’d love to see a possible future starting lineup, I’d rather have Booker rest and be completely healthy.

I think Elf’s recent play has us a little excited and they want to see if Elf is real or not when Booker plays.

I do too, but not when there is a risk Booker could be out even longer. Get him healthy and let them build some chemistry for the last 15 games.

I wouldn’t mind starting Reed one of the games that Booker is out. Put some pressure on him. Maybe against a team where we could start, Payton, Reed, Jackson, Warren, Bender.

[RunDogGun]

I called NBA radio last night when Justin Termine was on. I asked what their thoughts on the developmental process for the Suns (since the Bender and Jackson are showing slight improvement). They had nothing kind to say about it. I really wonder if those two players (or any others) would be much improved if they were somewhere else like Boston or San Antonio.

I think both would be huge in SA. Pop is a great coach, and has a solid system. Guys elevate under Pop, and every player plays hard.

[BobbieL]

I called NBA radio last night when Justin Termine was on. I asked what their thoughts on the developmental process for the Suns (since the Bender and Jackson are showing slight improvement). They had nothing kind to say about it. I really wonder if those two players (or any others) would be much improved if they were somewhere else like Boston or San Antonio.

I think both would be huge in SA. Pop is a great coach, and has a solid system. Guys elevate under Pop, and every player plays hard.

I think Triano is a good coach. But, if the Suns move on, my top choices are Messina and the other guy, Borrego (?) - I should google him. But the other assistant next to Pop.

As for the media - they are hating hard on the Suns now. Its easy. Sarver has been a joke. So, I take a lot of it with a grain of salt.

If Reggie Miller or CWeb had been a 2nd or 3rd year player and the other team was wining by 40 and the coach gave the clipboard to the players - they would have been ticked. They are talking with years of experience in the league and able to have a new perspective. So to me, I took what they said with a grain of salt. I like what Barkley said "flagrant foul somebodies a**". As for CWeb - he can just STFU - his team had one of the biggest choke jobs in NBA history. Granted the refs didn't help in Game 6 but they lost to the lakers in game 7 at home. He should just STFU - call another time out. That's handling things well!!

Even Kerr - jeez - why didn't he pull that stuff Saturday night against the Spurs. At least Pop did that thing with Patty Mills taking a vote playing the Warriors. Meaning he gave the keys to the Assistant against the Suns and still did that thing with Patty Mills against GSW.

So for the media - easy targets.

[JMac1]

While I’d love to see a possible future starting lineup, I’d rather have Booker rest and be completely healthy.

I think Elf’s recent play has us a little excited and they want to see if Elf is real or not when Booker plays.

I do too, but not when there is a risk Booker could be out even longer. Get him healthy and let them build some chemistry for the last 15 games.

I wouldn’t mind starting Reed one of the games that Booker is out. Put some pressure on him. Maybe against a team where we could start, Payton, Reed, Jackson, Warren, Bender.

I agree about resting Booker, of course, however, I think most of his rest is needed for Tank Mode.

[Walt_Uoob]

There is no upside for Booker to wait for his big payday. Even suggesting such an idea to him and his agent would go over like a lead balloon. The extension has already been mentioned in the local press and Booker has stated he would sign it. The Suns have been selling Booker as their franchise cornerstone and star and to suggest he goes another year being underpaid (as compared to his draft class) sends a very negative message to him, the general fanbase, and the season ticket holder base (I am a member and Booker's presence was a big selling point). It also suggests to Booker he does not even deserve the same treatment that Warren got, who extended after his third year.

With respect to financial, it would be a big hit to Booker from which he could not recover. You can do the math, but deferring $25M for a year and assuming he has the same career length - the money is never recoverable. As pointed out, an injury scenario would be devastating.

Finally, the last thing you want is for him to hit free agency, even if the Suns have rights of first refusal. Other teams get a chance to recruit him for unrestricted free agency and potentially set the calendar for when he becomes one. Does anyone even think the notion of pursuing an unknown free agent by preserving cap space is worth this? No amount of sitting down with him and "explaining" will undo the negative messages. Actions are much louder than words.

This is an idiotic notion that needs to be put to rest - 6 feet under.

It might be idiotic for other reasons but I think you have a couple things wrong here. 1) the extension starts for Booker in the same year whether he signs it this summer or next, so there's additional peace of mind from signing it a year early but there's no actual financial benefit. And 2) there is an upside for him personally to the extent that he values winning and thinks that max cap space in summer 2019 will help the team win.

[BobbieL]

I think Elf’s recent play has us a little excited and they want to see if Elf is real or not when Booker plays.

I do too, but not when there is a risk Booker could be out even longer. Get him healthy and let them build some chemistry for the last 15 games.

I wouldn’t mind starting Reed one of the games that Booker is out. Put some pressure on him. Maybe against a team where we could start, Payton, Reed, Jackson, Warren, Bender.

I agree about resting Booker, of course, however, I think most of his rest is needed for Tank Mode.

I think rest Booker tonight just because he gets a week off. But I think the team needs to see how he and payton mesh. ping pong balls be damned -

[WeekapaugGroove]

There is no upside for Booker to wait for his big payday. Even suggesting such an idea to him and his agent would go over like a lead balloon. The extension has already been mentioned in the local press and Booker has stated he would sign it. The Suns have been selling Booker as their franchise cornerstone and star and to suggest he goes another year being underpaid (as compared to his draft class) sends a very negative message to him, the general fanbase, and the season ticket holder base (I am a member and Booker's presence was a big selling point). It also suggests to Booker he does not even deserve the same treatment that Warren got, who extended after his third year.

With respect to financial, it would be a big hit to Booker from which he could not recover. You can do the math, but deferring $25M for a year and assuming he has the same career length - the money is never recoverable. As pointed out, an injury scenario would be devastating.

Finally, the last thing you want is for him to hit free agency, even if the Suns have rights of first refusal. Other teams get a chance to recruit him for unrestricted free agency and potentially set the calendar for when he becomes one. Does anyone even think the notion of pursuing an unknown free agent by preserving cap space is worth this? No amount of sitting down with him and "explaining" will undo the negative messages. Actions are much louder than words.

This is an idiotic notion that needs to be put to rest - 6 feet under.

It might be idiotic for other reasons but I think you have a couple things wrong here. 1) the extension starts for Booker in the same year whether he signs it this summer or next, so there's additional peace of mind from signing it a year early but there's no actual financial benefit. And 2) there is an upside for him personally to the extent that he values winning and thinks that max cap space in summer 2019 will help the team win.

You're correct on when that money would kick in but in general I agree with JD.

I really don't think it can be understated how big of a financial risk there is for catastrophic injury. The difference between getting $130M+ or literally nothing at all is something that is so significant for not only that player but his family in the future. Someone brought up insurance but I doubt an insurance company would cover such a thing.. they would probably say 'dude just sign the damn extension'.


The funny thing about all this talk is that if they wanted to the owners and players union could very simply fix this timing issue. They could change the CBA where a 4th year player only counts against the cap as their restricted tender number regardless of when they sign an extension (a year early, at RFA summer, or even matching a tender).

Seems like a potential win win for everyone. Teams get a little extra flexibility and also don't face the decision on timing when looking at early extensions. For the players there is potentially more bidders for vet FA's with more teams with flexibility which could lead to more money in the overall salary pool. Plus it could lead to an uptick in guys getting the early extension so dudes get that security earlier. No real downside in doing this.

[darealjuice]

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Jazz fans are so annoying lol

[Kerrsed]

Devin Booker (hip) will try to play Wednesday vs. the Jazz, according to John Gambadoro of Arizona Sports 98.7.

Coach Jay Triano sounded encouraged about Booker playing earlier today, and it sounds like Booker is going to be out there. He's almost certainly going to be a game-time decision in a late start, so we likely won't have any concrete info until after lineups lock. His return means Elfrid Payton won't have to handle the ball as much, and those two guards should be staggered. Tyson Chandler is out, so the other starters should remain the same with Dragan Bender, Josh Jackson, Payton and T.J. Warren.

[Kerrsed]

Chandlers out again (What a surprise), so hopefully we get BeastmodeBender at Center tonight. He played great against Jokic, lets see what he can do against Gobert (At least he should be able to pull him out of the paint on defense).

[bwgood77]

I called NBA radio last night when Justin Termine was on. I asked what their thoughts on the developmental process for the Suns (since the Bender and Jackson are showing slight improvement). They had nothing kind to say about it. I really wonder if those two players (or any others) would be much improved if they were somewhere else like Boston or San Antonio.

No national guy is going to have any idea about their recent play. They will pull up their b-ref #s for the year and they look horrific. I mean god awful. I mean I don't watch other teams that much so I rely a lot on those numbers plus a bit of the eye test for other teams, but no one spends their time watching the Suns other than us, so they likely don't even get the eye test.

There hasn't been too much to like about Bender or Jackson until very recently and it's still pretty inconsistent for both.

Especially when you call them the night after a 40pt+ loss...our fourth for the year.

I wouldn't have much kind to say about the Suns as an outside either...sometimes it's hard to as a die hard guy who watches the games and sees the occasional bright spots. Overall our team has had about as horrific a year as you can have. We have had by far the biggest point differential...the Kings are actually fairly close, but after that, most losing teams haven't been outscored by even half as much as us for the season....even in that bottom 8.

That lack of a PG and their continued injuries have REALLY hurt...I mean not that Watson had us prepared to come into the season whatsoever to start with. Triano took over a team that had just lost two out of first three games by 40+ points...and then sent one of their 2-3 best players home...a guy who was our best player often last season.

So he takes over an ill prepared team with 2 40+ losses, minus one of their top 3 players and has G league level point guards the rest of the year.

There have been some positive moments, but those are few and far between...and on top of that...as bad as this season has been, we pulled out some crazy wins against a few of the worst teams to potentially hurt us getting a potential difference maker in the draft. Hopefully that last part doesn't matter.

[bwgood77]

There is no upside for Booker to wait for his big payday. Even suggesting such an idea to him and his agent would go over like a lead balloon. The extension has already been mentioned in the local press and Booker has stated he would sign it. The Suns have been selling Booker as their franchise cornerstone and star and to suggest he goes another year being underpaid (as compared to his draft class) sends a very negative message to him, the general fanbase, and the season ticket holder base (I am a member and Booker's presence was a big selling point). It also suggests to Booker he does not even deserve the same treatment that Warren got, who extended after his third year.

With respect to financial, it would be a big hit to Booker from which he could not recover. You can do the math, but deferring $25M for a year and assuming he has the same career length - the money is never recoverable. As pointed out, an injury scenario would be devastating.

Finally, the last thing you want is for him to hit free agency, even if the Suns have rights of first refusal. Other teams get a chance to recruit him for unrestricted free agency and potentially set the calendar for when he becomes one. Does anyone even think the notion of pursuing an unknown free agent by preserving cap space is worth this? No amount of sitting down with him and "explaining" will undo the negative messages. Actions are much louder than words.

This is an idiotic notion that needs to be put to rest - 6 feet under.

You seem to be suggesting he would get a huge raise next year that he wouldn't get if he waited. No one was suggesting he forego any money. His pay increase wouldn't be until the 2019-20 season regardless of when he signed it. It was just a delay in signing on the dotted line his max extension that would start in 19-20....do it in late 18 or summer of 19?

If your understanding was that he would be giving up $25 million, then obviously of course there is no way we would suggest such a scenario to him. Warren isn't making any more money right now than he would have had he signed the same deal with his extension this coming summer...and he'd make the same next year.

That wasn't the thought of him waiting.

But you are mostly right regarding everything else...that it might send a bad message since it has been mentioned in the press, he has been basically marketed as the franchise player, there is a small chance he might rather have a shorter deal with an opt out or player option after a couple of years after another bad year, etc.....the potential injury...for many reasons it doesn't make sense for him or us to wait. I doubt we'd land a max guy anyway and have calculated we could carve out $20+ million regardless anyway with the extension.

[Sunsdeuce]

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This should give everyone a good laugh. So much to be said about this article. Starting with the fact that the Lakers actually think Lonzo is an asset. I doubt any team would trade for him right now.

I personally wouldn’t trade a flat half drunken can of pepsi for Lonzo. Lakers are stuck with his sorry a$$.