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LeBron James?

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Difference in Stature Between CP3 and BG 

Post#181 » by Ranma » Fri Oct 6, 2017 6:51 pm

MartinToVaught wrote:There's a difference between being there in the room making a face-to-face pitch and making a half-assed phone call. IMO, if CP3 was anywhere near as hungry for a ring as he'd like everyone to think he is, he'd have scheduled his vacation for later in the summer and joined Blake and DJ at the Durant meeting.


As was mentioned before, Paul was already aware of Durant's intentions and feelings during his free agency. With Doc in charge at the time and the friction between Paul and Griffin & Jordan, Durant didn't want to be a part of that situation and Paul certainly didn't want to advocate for that mess.

Based on the the rumblings and what transpired, Griffin and Paul were not coming back together for another run together and, lest you forget, Paul was apparently the Clippers' first choice and only went hard after Griffin after Paul bailed.

Also, notice how Paul was the one recruited by another elite player while Griffin was taking meetings with the Suns before the Clippers came calling.

I'm not exactly happy with how Paul left the organization, but he did allow for us to trade for the depth we've been lacking through his departure. A case can be made that Ballmer's indulgence and lack of urgency prior to this off-season along with Doc's horrendous track record caused Paul to lose faith in the organization, which prompted his desire to depart even to the point of leaving big money on the table.
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Re: LeBron James? 

Post#182 » by og15 » Fri Oct 6, 2017 9:07 pm

MartinToVaught wrote:There's a difference between being there in the room making a face-to-face pitch and making a half-assed phone call. IMO, if CP3 was anywhere near as hungry for a ring as he'd like everyone to think he is, he'd have scheduled his vacation for later in the summer and joined Blake and DJ at the Durant meeting.
Well, there's no basis to call the phone call half-assed, that's just pure conjecture, so I'd rather us stick with what we actually know. Could have been a great conversation and very convincing. Remember that Durant was still impressed with the Clippers, but his desire for GS and the easier road, as well as Durant obviously knowing that the Clippers would have to gut most of the depth to get him, were factors. Players aren't oblivious to how the salary cap and such work, and if they are, they certainly have agents and people around them who will let them know, but they can also research on the internet just like us.

I agree, maybe Paul doesn't want to win a championship to the maximum degree that it consumes his life and is placed above spending quality time with his family, but that's not really something I'm going to criticize any player on, nor do I think 99% of us would criticize any player on that. Basketball is still your "work" as an NBA player, and in the end, basketball accomplishments don't define a player's actual life, so I'm not going to start questioning anyone's desire to win because they are putting their family first. If he was on a vacation with the boys and didn't want to return, that's different, and I would have a very different take.
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Re: Difference in Stature Between CP3 and BG 

Post#183 » by og15 » Fri Oct 6, 2017 9:19 pm

Ranma wrote:
MartinToVaught wrote:There's a difference between being there in the room making a face-to-face pitch and making a half-assed phone call. IMO, if CP3 was anywhere near as hungry for a ring as he'd like everyone to think he is, he'd have scheduled his vacation for later in the summer and joined Blake and DJ at the Durant meeting.


As was mentioned before, Paul was already aware of Durant's intentions and feelings during his free agency. With Doc in charge at the time and the friction between Paul and Griffin & Jordan, Durant didn't want to be a part of that situation and Paul certainly didn't want to advocate for that mess.

Based on the the rumblings and what transpired, Griffin and Paul were not coming back together for another run together and, lest you forget, Paul was apparently the Clippers' first choice and only went hard after Griffin after Paul bailed.


Also, notice how Paul was the one recruited by another elite player while Griffin was taking meetings with the Suns before the Clippers came calling.

I'm not exactly happy with how Paul left the organization, but he did allow for us to trade for the depth we've been lacking through his departure. A case can be made that Ballmer's indulgence and lack of urgency prior to this off-season along with Doc's horrendous track record caused Paul to lose faith in the organization, which prompted his desire to depart even to the point of leaving big money on the table.
I don't think this was the case, don't think I heard anything suggesting that one or the other was the priority and the other was secondary. The only guy that was being forgotten was Redick as the team definitely had moved on from him as soon as game 7 ended. Ballmer's honest interview didn't infer or suggest, he clearly said they wanted both and were willing to pay the money for both, as well as take on the implications of paying Paul big money in his mid-late 30's. Doc also said they had already pitched to Griffin before Paul left, and talked to him about with or without Paul, and he had agreed to re-sign either way.

Now, I don't think Jerry West was happy Paul left, there were mixed reports coming out after as everyone was making their own story up as to what happened, but with Ballmer's interview, and with West going out of his way to always say Paul is one of his favorite players, it was likely that building a team with him was also part of his draw here. We saw it again in a recent West interview from a couple of weeks ago, you get the sense that he was not happy that they were unable to retain Paul, but was happy they got good value back for the circumstances.

Durant actually said his whole draw to the Clippers was playing with Paul/Griffin/DJ. He said that he and DJ were close, which we know, said that he had known Paul since high school, and he had gotten to know Griffin over the years, which makes sense if him and DJ are close, but also with like All-Star games and all that.

"Blake , D.J. and C.P -- that's what made it interesting," Durant said, via the San Jose Mercury News' Anthony Slater. "Those three guys are tremendous, unbelievable talents. They made it tough on me. They made it tough. Just knowing those guys. Like I said, D.J. is a close friend. C.P., I've been knowing him since I was in high school. I got to know Blake over the years. All that other stuff -- I've been in L.A. every summer. Facilities, all that stuff is the same to me. As long as you have a court and the ball. And Jamal Crawford has been a close friend of mine since I've been in the league, so the players, that's what made it tough. They did a great job."
https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/wait-kevin-durant-was-seriously-considering-clippers-in-free-agency/

He didn't choose the Clippers because in terms of the finances, and the roster, GS was the easiest and most direct path for him to get what he wanted.
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Durant's Forays Into Free Agency 

Post#184 » by Ranma » Mon Oct 9, 2017 8:35 pm

og15 wrote:Durant actually said his whole draw to the Clippers was playing with Paul/Griffin/DJ. He said that he and DJ were close, which we know, said that he had known Paul since high school, and he had gotten to know Griffin over the years, which makes sense if him and DJ are close, but also with like All-Star games and all that.

"Blake , D.J. and C.P -- that's what made it interesting," Durant said, via the San Jose Mercury News' Anthony Slater. "Those three guys are tremendous, unbelievable talents. They made it tough on me. They made it tough. Just knowing those guys. Like I said, D.J. is a close friend. C.P., I've been knowing him since I was in high school. I got to know Blake over the years. All that other stuff -- I've been in L.A. every summer. Facilities, all that stuff is the same to me. As long as you have a court and the ball. And Jamal Crawford has been a close friend of mine since I've been in the league, so the players, that's what made it tough. They did a great job."
https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/wait-kevin-durant-was-seriously-considering-clippers-in-free-agency/

He didn't choose the Clippers because in terms of the finances, and the roster, GS was the easiest and most direct path for him to get what he wanted.


I'm not sure about Paul not being a priority over Griffin, but I'll have to take Ballmer at his word about wanting them both back and willing to pay the money to make it happen. Also, thanks for providing the supporting materials you cited as I missed those somehow.

At the same time, the Durant situation you cited when he was first a free agent is different to his most recent foray into NBA free agency. I was certainly confident that the Clippers had a chance at Durant the first time around and it's great to hear him confirm that we offered an attractive option. He cited the players as being the draw (not the coach/GM), but I now understand even more why he would choose the Warriors by taking advantage of that rare opportunity to join a juggernaut team with good chemistry with a financial path that allowed for it to happen. Golden State benefited greatly from the timing of Curry's ankle injury and the subsequent affordable contract given to him as well as the spike in salary cap.

The Clippers, on the other hand, presented a different situation during Durant's 2nd time around with free agency. He was obviously more familiar and comfortable with Golden State, but the Clippers were seen more as a stagnant team than an up-and-coming one this time around. Add that to the turmoil that was now being reported to the point where Chris Paul actually chose to play for another team for less money than what he could have gotten as an NBPA union president who negotiated a deal that allowed older players to make more money than ever before and it clearly paints two different pictures of the Clippers' state of affairs, respectively.

Doc was finally demoted from being President of Basketball Operations probably in light of the events that transpired that led to Paul's departure. Leadership may have wanted to bring back Paul and Griffin, but it seems clear to me that at least one of those players didn't want to continue with each other under the same conditions. Maybe it was just a matter of Doc's faulty leadership, but there is a sense that there was friction between CP and BG. Things seem to be different now with talk about how camaraderie is being emphasized and at another level than it was before.
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Lowe Favors Cavs Slightly Over Lakers But Field Over Cleveland 

Post#185 » by Ranma » Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:46 pm

Zach Lowe, ESPN (10/13/17)
There is too much smoke, even with Russell Westbrook's mega-extension snuffing one potential superstar cabal in Los Angeles. LeBron could still go there with Paul George, though the Lakers need some high-wire cap gymnastics to open up the requisite $65 million in room. And can LeBron really chase the Warriors with George, Lonzo Ball and whatever flotsam is left after L.A. sheds money?

LeBron still values winning above all else. He wants another title. He needs one to challenge Michael Jordan's GOAT status. The path there with those theoretical Lakers is uncertain.

Put it this way: If you forced me to name which team LeBron is on next season, I'd take the Cavs by a hair over the Lakers. But if you give me Cleveland versus the field, I'm taking the field. LeBron is dominant enough to go anywhere he wants. He could tell almost literally any team, "I'm coming as long you also sign Players X and Y," and that team would make it happen.

Speaking of which: Maybe we should take the Houston threat more seriously. Harden is locked up. Paul is there. Getting off Eric Gordon is easy. Snag a pick in the process, and dumping the Ryan Anderson albatross -- the one that cost them the official Team Banana Boat photographer -- becomes feasible. Trade and renounce everyone else, including potentially Paul for cap purposes, and they are close enough to the double-max for Paul and LeBron that the Texas income tax edge might come into play.

Sound crazy? So did everything that happened this summer. The league's best players have the clout to make anything happen.

(I have no idea where LeBron is going. Nobody does.)

32 Crazy Predictions: LeBron's Future, a Bunch of Trades and More
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Food for Thought 

Post#186 » by Ranma » Fri Oct 27, 2017 9:36 pm

If LeBron James were to join the Clippers with Blake Griffin, they could provide a reasonable facsimile of Magic & Bird on the same team rather than rival opposites. Back in the day, I was hopeful and optimistic that Shaun Livingston and Yaroslav Korolev could provide that type of dynamic of multiple playmakers and ball-handlers, but at a lower level, obviously. With BG & LBJ, that dynamic duo would be much closer to the original old-school gold standards.

Griffin also isn't the sharpshooter that Bird was, but people forget that Larry Legend didn't take that many 3-pointers relative to the percentage of his overall field goals. Today's proliferation of shots beyond the arc along with Griffin's newfound confidence in his 3-point shot might actually have him catching up to Bird's career 3-pointers made totals (649). BG has 90 career 3-point makes and already 10 for the 2017-18 season through only 4 games.


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Re: LeBron James? 

Post#187 » by Forte IV » Fri Oct 27, 2017 9:46 pm

That Korolev name drop lol
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Choice Between DJ and LBJ/PG13? 

Post#188 » by Ranma » Tue Oct 31, 2017 3:59 am

Are the Clippers basically conceding the free agency of LeBron James and Paul George? I'll tell you one thing, I ain't choosing DeAndre Jordan over either of them or any actual star player, for that matter. I'm sure the Clippers are going to make a play for both LBJ and PG13, but it's notable that Lowe reports that the Clippers were specifically targeting the summers of 2019 and 2020 to sign free agents. Klay Thompson for 2019 makes a lot of sense given the West connection and Kawhi Leonard could be available in 2020.

But it's worth noting that there was no mention of LeBron or George in the pitch to re-sign Griffin, who prioritized bringing DJ back this summer. Hopefully, it's just a case of telling Blake what he wants to hear in order to get his signature on the dotted line because committing a big long-term contract to Jordan is an unwise and risky proposition regardless of which free agents we may or may not be targeting.


Zach Lowe, ESPN (10/30/17)
The most pressing question: What to do with Jordan, who can hit free agency this summer? Re-sign him for $25 million or more, and the Clippers could have $60-70 million devoted to two big men in the summers of 2019 and 2020 -- moments they have targeted to strike in free agency. They'd have to strip the roster bare to (maybe) carve out max space for that elusive star free agent.

A bigger-than-expected cap jump would help. Even given one, they'd have to trade Danilo Gallinari to open any space in the summer of 2019. They also have long-term decisions to make on Rivers and Beverley, who will seek a raise in 2019-20 if he keeps playing like this. Going all-in on Griffin-Jordan could be a ticket to a bunch of 45- to 48-win seasons.

Clips Keep Winning Without CP3 and Start Work on 'Unfinished Business'
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LeBron's Impending Free Agency 

Post#189 » by Ranma » Fri Feb 2, 2018 6:16 pm

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The Logo & LeBron 

Post#190 » by Ranma » Sat Feb 3, 2018 8:44 pm

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House Broken 

Post#191 » by Ranma » Thu Feb 8, 2018 6:04 pm

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Picturing LeBron in LA 

Post#192 » by Ranma » Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:30 am

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Re: LeBron James? 

Post#193 » by donemilio21 » Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:34 pm

Lebron would elevate the Clippers, there is no doubt.
But as a basketball fan, I don't like all these where would Lebron go discussion that keep going. I honestly hope he signs a 5 year deal with Cavs and retires in Cleveland at this point.
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#LABron Billboards Paid for by Accident Attorney 

Post#194 » by Ranma » Thu Mar 8, 2018 2:49 am

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Re: LeBron James? 

Post#195 » by esqtvd » Thu Mar 8, 2018 5:07 am

most Clipper fans are waiting til the offseason before talking megalongshot LeBron crap
or the draft, with zero idea where we draft

even Bron doesn't know where he's going
or even if he's going
this is such a waste of time

frankly if I were going to join and lead a fetus team to victory I'd so much rather play with Simmons and Embiid than anyone in Los Angeles [Clipper or Laker]

they're fun

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Re: LeBron James? 

Post#196 » by Forte IV » Thu Mar 8, 2018 6:07 am

Philly makes the most sense for Bron
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Re: LeBron James? 

Post#197 » by nickhx2 » Thu Mar 8, 2018 6:11 am

if lebron wants to maximize his chances for championships for the rest of his career (while earning big money) he should go to philly.
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Re: LeBron James? 

Post#198 » by esqtvd » Thu Mar 8, 2018 7:05 am

nickhx2 wrote:if lebron wants to maximize his chances for championships for the rest of his career (while earning big money) he should go to philly.


True, Nick, if he doesn't want to pull a Durant. Which I still find understandable, but unheroic. Understandable as a human being [the Christian connection] but as a sportsman, inexcusable for joining the team that just beat you in the playoffs. I''m with Stephen A all the way on this one. Join the Clippers or the Bucks. Not the Evil Empire.

If you're unhappy in OKC, join any other team than the champs.


I'll let CP off the hook since Harden hasn't won jackspit and I'll even let LeBron's "Decision" off the hook because he only joined D-Wade's empty shell and got Bosh to come aboard. Bron rebuilt that Miami team, and CP is really no frontrunner, teaming up with fellow playoff choker The Beard. Gotta wish the two of them well.

In my business we call it putting two turkeys together to try and make an eagle. [I've used that one before and I'll keep using it re CP-The Beard. Let's see if it works.]



Back to topic:

I'd even be cool with Bron joining the Lakers since there's no D-Wade or Harden there to even join. And Bron joining the Clippers would be the biggest piece of vainglory ever. We got nuthin', let's face it. Neither do the Lakers. Not one championship player in sight.

Philly already has two. Cleveland has only two and that's only if you count Kevin Love. :-?

I'm from Philly--it's not all that bad a place to live in. Bron could conquer his 3rd city. He would make the Finals once again, and mebbe even beat the Evil Empire.
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Re: LeBron James? 

Post#199 » by Neddy » Thu Mar 8, 2018 7:13 am

esqtvd wrote:most Clipper fans are waiting til the offseason before talking megalongshot LeBron crap
or the draft, with zero idea where we draft

even Bron doesn't know where he's going
or even if he's going
this is such a waste of time

frankly if I were going to join and lead a fetus team to victory I'd so much rather play with Simmons and Embiid than anyone in Los Angeles [Clipper or Laker]

they're fun

Image


yes they are fun, and they are talented bunch for sure, but they are not developed enough for Bron to have a shot at a championship now. Simmons has no real range of any kind, it will force LeBron being the primary spot up shooter as JJ won't be coming back if the king is coming to Phillie. Embiid unfortunately, I think is going to be a high risk for injuries going forward. he may have a very similar career arc to our own Blake's career path, having the first year erased with a season ending injury before the rookie season even starts, then comes back with strong second year/rookie debut year, followed up by many seasons of brilliant at times but injury prone prime years, then regress once he gets max pay.
ehhhhh f it.
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Re: LeBron James? 

Post#200 » by esqtvd » Thu Mar 8, 2018 10:30 pm

Neddy wrote:
esqtvd wrote:most Clipper fans are waiting til the offseason before talking megalongshot LeBron crap
or the draft, with zero idea where we draft

even Bron doesn't know where he's going
or even if he's going
this is such a waste of time

frankly if I were going to join and lead a fetus team to victory I'd so much rather play with Simmons and Embiid than anyone in Los Angeles [Clipper or Laker]

they're fun

Image


yes they are fun, and they are talented bunch for sure, but they are not developed enough for Bron to have a shot at a championship now. Simmons has no real range of any kind, it will force LeBron being the primary spot up shooter as JJ won't be coming back if the king is coming to Phillie. Embiid unfortunately, I think is going to be a high risk for injuries going forward. he may have a very similar career arc to our own Blake's career path, having the first year erased with a season ending injury before the rookie season even starts, then comes back with strong second year/rookie debut year, followed up by many seasons of brilliant at times but injury prone prime years, then regress once he gets max pay.



I agree about The Process depending on Embiid's health. But LeBron would prob only sign for one year so the long term wouldn't be a factor. Just saying if he's gonna take on a project, Philly would be more fun and I like Simmons and Embiid a lot more than I like Lonzo and Ingraham.

Houston is also an interesting play, maybe the only situation that can beat the GSWs.
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