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John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III

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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1201 » by Illmatic12 » Fri Mar 2, 2018 5:58 pm

tontoz wrote:
Illmatic12 wrote:
tontoz wrote:Wall has missed 26 games total this season. We have won 16 of them with Sato (who had minimal NBA experience) and Frazier ( a vet min player) replacing Wall's minutes.

That is a 50 win pace. I never would have thought that possible. It definitely makes me question whether Wall's negative possessions we're having a bigger impact than I realized.

Why would that be surprising, now that we know John was playing hurt and struggling on one knee? The point is that he has the ability to be better than he was to start the season, as long as he comes back fully healthy and in shape.



His injury isn't the reason that he continues to take mid-range shots without anyone else touching the ball. His injury did stop his one man fast breaks or chase down blocks. It didn't stop him from playing hero ball late in games.

Wall's big problem is between his ears and getting healthy won't make it go away.

I simply don’t agree with your characterization. Wall’s biggest problem this season has been health. There is no way to create a narrative about his play this season without factoring in the fact that he was injured and playing in pain.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1202 » by tontoz » Fri Mar 2, 2018 6:21 pm

Illmatic12 wrote:
tontoz wrote:
Illmatic12 wrote:Why would that be surprising, now that we know John was playing hurt and struggling on one knee? The point is that he has the ability to be better than he was to start the season, as long as he comes back fully healthy and in shape.



His injury isn't the reason that he continues to take mid-range shots without anyone else touching the ball. His injury did stop his one man fast breaks or chase down blocks. It didn't stop him from playing hero ball late in games.

Wall's big problem is between his ears and getting healthy won't make it go away.

I simply don’t agree with your characterization. Wall’s biggest problem this season has been health. There is no way to create a narrative about his play this season without factoring in the fact that he was injured and playing in pain.



I am not "creating a narrative". I am pointing out facts. He has been making the same mistakes for years, not just this year.

As I already posted he took over 6 mid-range shots per game last season, his career year, while shooting 38.6%.

His pain this season didn't stop him from his breakneck fastbreaks or chase down blocks.

There is no denying that Wall has made bad, selfish plays a routine part of his game.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1203 » by DCZards » Fri Mar 2, 2018 6:33 pm

tontoz wrote:
I am not "creating a narrative". I am pointing out facts. He has been making the same mistakes for years, not just this year.

As I already posted he took over 6 mid-range shots per game last season, his career year, while shooting 38.6%.

His pain this season didn't stop him from his breakneck fastbreaks or chase down blocks.

There is no denying that Wall has made bad, selfish plays a routine part of his game.


There is also no denying that John Wall is a damn good NBA player. In fact, all-NBA third team last season. And, if he's healthy and cuts down on the silly mistakes and bad plays that you rightfully point out, Wall can be one of the top NBA PGs for the next several years to come. That's a good thing for the Zards and its fans.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1204 » by tontoz » Fri Mar 2, 2018 6:40 pm

DCZards wrote:
tontoz wrote:
I am not "creating a narrative". I am pointing out facts. He has been making the same mistakes for years, not just this year.

As I already posted he took over 6 mid-range shots per game last season, his career year, while shooting 38.6%.

His pain this season didn't stop him from his breakneck fastbreaks or chase down blocks.

There is no denying that Wall has made bad, selfish plays a routine part of his game.


There is also no denying that John Wall is a damn good NBA player. In fact, all-NBA third team last season. And, if he's healthy and cuts down on the silly mistakes and bad plays that you rightfully point out, Wall can be one of the top NBA PGs for the next several years to come. That's a good thing for the Zards and its fans.


If is a very big word in this case, and becomes bigger as each year passes.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1205 » by payitforward » Sat Mar 3, 2018 2:48 am

Shanghai Kid wrote:
CobraCommander wrote:
Shanghai Kid wrote:Its a fact that Sato is playing at a higher level then Wall did last year? Am I a Wall fanatic if I disagree with that objective fact?

But I do agree with the rest of your post.

I thought he was joking about Sato playing at a higher level than Wall last year when i thought...wow Wall made a AllNBA team and avg 23 and 11...some of the Sato Hyperbole is over the top...I love WhiteWall but wow...better than a ALLNBA team nod ?? Wow y’all officially trippin now....LOL

Yeah ill have what PayItForward is havin...

I think he recently said that Rubio and someone Im forgetting was better then Wall also.

The hyperbole is strong with Payitforward.

I almost never say that one player "is better" than another -- at least not when we're talking about good players. What I usually say is that one player is having, or had, a better season than another player.

In the case of Sato, what I said was that his play over the last 14 games is at a particularly high level. A level higher than John's overall season last year. There is no hyperbole in that whatsoever; it's just numbers & nothing else.

Moreover, as I also pointed out, there's no evidence that Satoransky can sustain that level of play (especially not as teams start spending more time prepping for him & have more video to watch as they do that preparation).

Plus, I also pointed out that last year -- like any year of any player -- Wall had stretches of play below what his overall season level turned out to be, & also stretches of play above his overall season level. I'm sure some of those "above" stretches were at a level higher than what Sato has been doing these last few weeks.

If all of that is too much for you to think about, hey, don't strain yourself, ok? As to where John Wall sits among PGs of this era -- John on his career I mean -- he has been extremely good. If you think he's been among the top 4-6, however, you're just fooling yourself. Or, more accurately, you're just a fan: every team's fans think their players are better than they are, & that their team is better than it is.

Last year, for example, John's best year, pretty much anyone not a Wizards fan would find it obvious that Chris Paul, James Harden, Steph Curry, Kyle Lowry, Russell Westbrook, Mike Conley & even Jeff Teague had better seasons than John did -- in some cases a whole lot better.

Now... if you're a true believer, I'm sure that can't be true. In that case, whatever you do, don't look at the numbers; they'll make you sad.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1206 » by payitforward » Sat Mar 3, 2018 2:59 am

Shanghai Kid wrote:
P'Oed wrote:John Wall closed out the Atlanta Hawks singlehandedly on the road in a game 6 playoff game with 42 points. In fact, his playoff performances last year were all around impressive. I love what Sato is doing as much as anyone but as we all know, playoff basketball is quite different. Do we win that first round series last year with this year's version of Sato? I'm not sure. Maybe? But John willed the team to the second round. That's hard to argue.

30/10 on 60% TS, probably the best 6 game stretch of his career and it happened in the playoffs.

But in truth, Sato would have swept them Hawks!

Wall was absolutely tremendous vs. Atlanta. I couldn't agree more. In fact, he had a terrific year last year altogether. &, on his career, he's been an outstanding NBA player.

Moreover, John is only 27 &, assuming a full recovery from his knee problems, he should be an excellent player for many years to come. I also think he's a high quality person. He cares about his community, he thinks hard about his life & the person he should be & can be.

To the degree that I know anything "real" about him, I have an extremely high regard for John Wall. If you think I'm a "hater" in any sense, you aren't paying any attention.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1207 » by payitforward » Sat Mar 3, 2018 3:04 am

OTOH, is he worth $40+m a year for the amount he, as a player, can make the Washington Wizards a better team? No, he sure isn't -- he's a hell of a good basketball player, but there probably aren't 5 players in the league who are good enough to warrant that kind of $$.

Which means that, if the deal made sense, I'd trade Wall in a minute. Has nothing to do w/ what I think of him as a person.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1208 » by CobraCommander » Sat Mar 3, 2018 3:18 am

payitforward wrote:
Shanghai Kid wrote:
CobraCommander wrote:I thought he was joking about Sato playing at a higher level than Wall last year when i thought...wow Wall made a AllNBA team and avg 23 and 11...some of the Sato Hyperbole is over the top...I love WhiteWall but wow...better than a ALLNBA team nod ?? Wow y’all officially trippin now....LOL

Yeah ill have what PayItForward is havin...

I think he recently said that Rubio and someone Im forgetting was better then Wall also.

The hyperbole is strong with Payitforward.

I almost never say that one player "is better" than another -- at least not when we're talking about good players. What I usually say is that one player is having, or had, a better season than another player.

In the case of Sato, what I said was that his play over the last 14 games is at a particularly high level. A level higher than John's overall season last year. There is no hyperbole in that whatsoever; it's just numbers & nothing else.

Moreover, as I also pointed out, there's no evidence that Satoransky can sustain that level of play (especially not as teams start spending more time prepping for him & have more video to watch as they do that preparation).

Plus, I also pointed out that last year -- like any year of any player -- Wall had stretches of play below what his overall season level turned out to be, & also stretches of play above his overall season level. I'm sure some of those "above" stretches were at a level higher than what Sato has been doing these last few weeks.

If all of that is too much for you to think about, hey, don't strain yourself, ok? As to where John Wall sits among PGs of this era -- John on his career I mean -- he has been extremely good. If you think he's been among the top 4-6, however, you're just fooling yourself. Or, more accurately, you're just a fan: every team's fans think their players are better than they are, & that their team is better than it is.

Last year, for example, John's best year, pretty much anyone not a Wizards fan would find it obvious that Chris Paul, James Harden, Steph Curry, Kyle Lowry, Russell Westbrook, Mike Conley & even Jeff Teague had better seasons than John did -- in some cases a whole lot better.

Now... if you're a true believer, I'm sure that can't be true. In that case, whatever you do, don't look at the numbers; they'll make you sad.

You are actually a true prisoner of the moment...but thats fine...on the realGM forum they had a poll about the best point guard in the east...another about top points...want to guess where Wall ranked in the east (by a wide margin this year)...guess...but yeah...i guess you are right because you said it...John was on a ALLNBA team last year...but yeah a bunch of other guys had better years that didnt make AllNBA teams...that makes a ton of sense :).

Harden, Curry, Westbrook all did...none of those other guys did...but yeah take Sato, Conley, Teague and Lowry over Wall... :roll:
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1209 » by Shanghai Kid » Sat Mar 3, 2018 3:19 am

My only takeaway is that Jeff Teague had a better season than Wall last year.

Welp I'm out.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1210 » by CobraCommander » Sat Mar 3, 2018 3:33 am

Shanghai Kid wrote:My only takeaway is that Jeff Teague had a better season than Wall last year.

Welp I'm out.


Good point...why do i even communicate when someone says something like that!
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1211 » by Dat2U » Sat Mar 3, 2018 10:50 am

You think folks here dislike Wall, go check out what Wolves fans think about Teague.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1212 » by Wizardspride » Sun Mar 4, 2018 10:38 pm

Read on Twitter

President Donald Trump referred to African countries, Haiti and El Salvador as "shithole" nations during a meeting Thursday and asked why the U.S. can't have more immigrants from Norway.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1213 » by Shanghai Kid » Sun Mar 4, 2018 11:13 pm

I think Wall come back against New York in 3 weeks. That would give us 10 games to reincorporate him.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1214 » by long suffrin' boulez fan » Mon Mar 5, 2018 2:49 am

It’s like when your wife and kids go out of town for a few days. At first it’s great. Eat whatever you want, hang out with friends, stay up too late. Then you get kind of bored and are ready for them to come back.

I’m ready for John, pull up jumpers with 18 seconds left on the shot clock and all.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1215 » by Wizardspride » Mon Mar 5, 2018 8:47 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=20

President Donald Trump referred to African countries, Haiti and El Salvador as "shithole" nations during a meeting Thursday and asked why the U.S. can't have more immigrants from Norway.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1216 » by long suffrin' boulez fan » Tue Mar 6, 2018 1:24 am

double post
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1217 » by TGW » Tue Mar 6, 2018 2:36 am

Wizardspride wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20


I beg to differ. The Pels are better without Cousins. The brow doesn't need that guy taking poor shots, turning the ball over a million times, and not playing defense.
Some random troll wrote:Not to sound negative, but this team is owned by an arrogant cheapskate, managed by a moron and coached by an idiot. Recipe for disaster.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1218 » by CobraCommander » Wed Mar 7, 2018 1:29 am

TGW wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20


I beg to differ. The Pels are better without Cousins. The brow doesn't need that guy taking poor shots, turning the ball over a million times, and not playing defense.


Yeah trade Boogie to Washington
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1219 » by Wizardspride » Wed Mar 7, 2018 9:24 pm

Read on Twitter

President Donald Trump referred to African countries, Haiti and El Salvador as "shithole" nations during a meeting Thursday and asked why the U.S. can't have more immigrants from Norway.
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Re: John Wall Appreciation Thread - Part III 

Post#1220 » by Wizardspride » Thu Mar 8, 2018 2:47 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=20

President Donald Trump referred to African countries, Haiti and El Salvador as "shithole" nations during a meeting Thursday and asked why the U.S. can't have more immigrants from Norway.

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