Dragan Bender News, Discussion and Highlights

[Saberestar]

He has so many problems in his game. He has to work so much on his game to be an NBA player. So why did we pick him 4th??? The description of Bender ( long term prospect from Europe)sounds like a typical 2nd round pick.
And if it is not a mental thing, but rahter a lack of skills, so why in Hell is he starting and playing 30 minutes? He is far away from being ready to play in the NBA. put him in the G-league to learn the skills.

He is not ready to play those minutes, it is obvious, but the two other options at PF are Chriss and Dudley.......enough said.

It is a lost season already, so not bad to watch if he improves or gains confidence with all of those minutes on the court.

[Revived]

Suns should do something like fining him $25,000 for each game he doesn't take at least 10 shots.

I feel like that something's an outside the box thinker like Steve Kerr would do in this situation. I bet we would never have to worry about his shot attempts anymore if we did that.

[MathiasPW]

The hate is unreal. Lack of skills??? The guy can handle, shoot, pass, and has good defensive awareness, and he has no skills?

I understand the worry about mental issues, but this is completely overblown

[sunsbg]

So the question is will he overcome those mental issues ? If not, you just drafted a bench player with 4th pick = bust. Right now, he looks completely content with not doing much on a basketball court.

Not that impressed by his assists yet - simple passes to shooters(mainly Booker) or Warren drives to the hoop(I think some of those won't be counted as assists in Europe). His handles are really nothing impressive. Defense has always been overrated to me - when did he block someone on the perimeter being 7"1' or made a steal ? He gives too much space to shooters(no surprise Prince made the game winner against him) and was abused by Randle in the paint.

[Saberestar]

The hate is unreal. Lack of skills??? The guy can handle, shoot, pass, and has good defensive awareness, and he has no skills?

I understand the worry about mental issues, but this is completely overblown

Yeah, he lacks basketball skills.

He can handle the ball? No way. He has tried a good number of times (less recently) and the results have been terrible. He can't dribble the ball at the NBA level.

He has any post moves? Not at all, not even a simple move. He needs to learn how to move his feet in the post.

He has any pull up game? No. He just doesn't know to shoot after dribbling the ball, he never does that (not even in Summer League). Not mid range game.

He knows how and when to slash and cut to the basket? No. He needs to learn how to get to the rim from the other side of the ball to create passing lines for the player with the ball. He never does that.

He knows how to rebound on the offensive glass? No. He doesn't have great instincts going for offensive rebounds, so he needs to learn tricks to "push" his defenders to get better position, he needs to learn how to maximize his height for tip ins and put backs.

And he needs to learn to pass and shoot ON THE MOVE. He can do those things with his feet set, but the next step is passing and shooting on the move, at least a few times per game.

He is able to pass the ball and he is a good 3p shooter already. He understands the game and plays with calm. Solid defender, covers ground and I like his basketball IQ on defense, but he needs to get stronger and more agressive on defense too.

I like him over Chriss at this point of their careers, and I think that he can make improvements and be a solid starter in this league in the future.

I would love to watch him as a face up PF/C who can average around 11p/7r/4a/1s/1b in the next future with solid defense and being a floor spacer on offense.

[darealjuice]

You guys continue to call it "mental issues," I call it playing within yourself. Nothing is going to come of him trying to do stuff he isn't ready to consistently yet do like driving hard from the perimeter, shooting pull up jumpers, and throwing difficult passes that lead to turnovers. JJ did it the first half of the season, and these same people were shaking in their boots talking about him being a bust for it. Being aggressive doesn't automatically make you a more productive player, it just makes you more prone to mistakes when you get out of control. It blows my mind that he's nearly a full year younger than the rookie we just drafted at #4, and people already lose their patience and act like someone who was known as a long-term project from day one should be wheeling and dealing 100 games into their NBA career.

The G-League is for finding development time for the players that you can't find rotational minutes for, not sending players down as "punishment" for not developing as quick as you like. I don't get why people constantly post about sending Dragan and Quese to the G-League. Are they really going to get better against watered talent in an environment where everyone is trying to prove they're "The Man"..? Are you really clamoring to see 30 minutes of Jared Dudley's round ass on the floor this season?

[Preacherpj]

He has so many problems in his game. He has to work so much on his game to be an NBA player. So why did we pick him 4th??? The description of Bender ( long term prospect from Europe)sounds like a typical 2nd round pick.
And if it is not a mental thing, but rahter a lack of skills, so why in Hell is he starting and playing 30 minutes? He is far away from being ready to play in the NBA. put him in the G-league to learn the skills.

Why in the world would you want to put Bender in the G-League during a season that is obviously lost? Whats the harm in him getting those mins right now? Let him take some lumps and hopefully develop.

I think people need to adjust their view of Bender; yes he was the 4th overall pick -- but that doesn't really matter now.

Can he develop into a winning piece for this team? That's really the important question, he's very likely never going to be a stud; that doesn't mean he's going to be a bust. I said it before, but he's already showing big improvement in his 3PT%s, he can play some defense and he can make smart passes - if he keeps developing maybe he becomes some type of Toni Kukoish player, maybe Detlef Schrempf with a little less scoring, and that's not a bust - not remotely.

But you have to have patience, he's 20 years old, came from a Euro team where he didn't play a ton, missed a huge chunk of his first year with injury and spent the first part of his career under Earl Watson. Like what did people expect here???

[bwgood77]

The hate is unreal. Lack of skills??? The guy can handle, shoot, pass, and has good defensive awareness, and he has no skills?

I understand the worry about mental issues, but this is completely overblown

Yeah, he lacks basketball skills.

He can handle the ball? No way. He has tried a good number of times (less recently) and the results have been terrible. He can't dribble the ball at the NBA level.

He has any post moves? Not at all, not even a simple move. He needs to learn how to move his feet in the post.

He has any pull up game? No. He just doesn't know to shoot after dribbling the ball, he never does that (not even in Summer League). Not mid range game.

He knows how and when to slash and cut to the basket? No. He needs to learn how to get to the rim from the other side of the ball to create passing lines for the player with the ball. He never does that.

He knows how to rebound on the offensive glass? No. He doesn't have great instincts going for offensive rebounds, so he needs to learn tricks to "push" his defenders to get better position, he needs to learn how to maximize his height for tip ins and put backs.

And he needs to learn to pass and shoot ON THE MOVE. He can do those things with his feet set, but the next step is passing and shooting on the move, at least a few times per game.

He is able to pass the ball and he is a good 3p shooter already. He understands the game and plays with calm. Solid defender, covers ground and I like his basketball IQ on defense, but he needs to get stronger and more agressive on defense too.

I like him over Chriss at this point of their careers, and I think that he can make improvements and be a solid starter in this league in the future.

I would love to watch him as a face up PF/C who can average around 11p/7r/4a/1s/1b in the next future with solid defense and being a floor spacer on offense.

Way off on the bolded, particularly the 2nd part bolded. Have you watched all of our games?

He shows some pretty good stuff from 35 seconds to a minute and here....and throughout..maybe stuff you missed in games you missed.

Watch on YouTube

[bwgood77]

You guys continue to call it "mental issues," I call it playing within yourself. Nothing is going to come of him trying to do stuff he isn't ready to consistently yet do like driving hard from the perimeter, shooting pull up jumpers, and throwing difficult passes that lead to turnovers. JJ did it the first half of the season, and these same people were shaking in their boots talking about him being a bust for it. Being aggressive doesn't automatically make you a more productive player, it just makes you more prone to mistakes when you get out of control. It blows my mind that he's nearly a full year younger than the rookie we just drafted at #4, and people already lose their patience and act like someone who was known as a long-term project from day one should be wheeling and dealing 100 games into their NBA career.

The G-League is for finding development time for the players that you can't find rotational minutes for, not sending players down as "punishment" for not developing as quick as you like. I don't get why people constantly post about sending Dragan and Quese to the G-League. Are they really going to get better against watered talent in an environment where everyone is trying to prove they're "The Man"..? Are you really clamoring to see 30 minutes of Jared Dudley's round ass on the floor this season?

Yeah, G league is a stupid idea. He needs to play with his teammates against pro competition and learn from our coaches. Not gonna learn things in the G league. Someone even mentioned Josh Jackson should be in the G league at one point. Absurd.

[MathiasPW]

The hate is unreal. Lack of skills??? The guy can handle, shoot, pass, and has good defensive awareness, and he has no skills?

I understand the worry about mental issues, but this is completely overblown

Yeah, he lacks basketball skills.

He can handle the ball? No way. He has tried a good number of times (less recently) and the results have been terrible. He can't dribble the ball at the NBA level.

He has any post moves? Not at all, not even a simple move. He needs to learn how to move his feet in the post.

He has any pull up game? No. He just doesn't know to shoot after dribbling the ball, he never does that (not even in Summer League). Not mid range game.

He knows how and when to slash and cut to the basket? No. He needs to learn how to get to the rim from the other side of the ball to create passing lines for the player with the ball. He never does that.

He knows how to rebound on the offensive glass? No. He doesn't have great instincts going for offensive rebounds, so he needs to learn tricks to "push" his defenders to get better position, he needs to learn how to maximize his height for tip ins and put backs.

And he needs to learn to pass and shoot ON THE MOVE. He can do those things with his feet set, but the next step is passing and shooting on the move, at least a few times per game.

He is able to pass the ball and he is a good 3p shooter already. He understands the game and plays with calm. Solid defender, covers ground and I like his basketball IQ on defense, but he needs to get stronger and more agressive on defense too.

I like him over Chriss at this point of their careers, and I think that he can make improvements and be a solid starter in this league in the future.

I would love to watch him as a face up PF/C who can average around 11p/7r/4a/1s/1b in the next future with solid defense and being a floor spacer on offense.

Maybe we are just discussing wording here.
To say he has no basketball skills to me is absurd.
To claim he does not have all the necessary skills to be the do-it-all superstar (which is what I took from your last post) is agreeable, but also kinda obvious to me.

While I do disagree to some of your points, I am not the owner of the truth and we will have to wait and see. He IS still a project, after all.

[Saberestar]

The hate is unreal. Lack of skills??? The guy can handle, shoot, pass, and has good defensive awareness, and he has no skills?

I understand the worry about mental issues, but this is completely overblown

Yeah, he lacks basketball skills.

He can handle the ball? No way. He has tried a good number of times (less recently) and the results have been terrible. He can't dribble the ball at the NBA level.

He has any post moves? Not at all, not even a simple move. He needs to learn how to move his feet in the post.

He has any pull up game? No. He just doesn't know to shoot after dribbling the ball, he never does that (not even in Summer League). Not mid range game.

He knows how and when to slash and cut to the basket? No. He needs to learn how to get to the rim from the other side of the ball to create passing lines for the player with the ball. He never does that.

He knows how to rebound on the offensive glass? No. He doesn't have great instincts going for offensive rebounds, so he needs to learn tricks to "push" his defenders to get better position, he needs to learn how to maximize his height for tip ins and put backs.

And he needs to learn to pass and shoot ON THE MOVE. He can do those things with his feet set, but the next step is passing and shooting on the move, at least a few times per game.

He is able to pass the ball and he is a good 3p shooter already. He understands the game and plays with calm. Solid defender, covers ground and I like his basketball IQ on defense, but he needs to get stronger and more agressive on defense too.

I like him over Chriss at this point of their careers, and I think that he can make improvements and be a solid starter in this league in the future.

I would love to watch him as a face up PF/C who can average around 11p/7r/4a/1s/1b in the next future with solid defense and being a floor spacer on offense.

Way off on the bolded, particularly the 2nd part bolded. Have you watched all of our games?

He shows some pretty good stuff from 35 seconds to a minute and here....and throughout..maybe stuff you missed in games you missed.

Watch on YouTube

I watch every single minute of every game.

He has made those things just a couple of times in all the season long. A few exceptions to the rule.

It's OK because I think he can improve in all of that....but AT THIS MOMENT he doesn't have those skills.

[bwgood77]

Yeah, he lacks basketball skills.

He can handle the ball? No way. He has tried a good number of times (less recently) and the results have been terrible. He can't dribble the ball at the NBA level.

He has any post moves? Not at all, not even a simple move. He needs to learn how to move his feet in the post.

He has any pull up game? No. He just doesn't know to shoot after dribbling the ball, he never does that (not even in Summer League). Not mid range game.

He knows how and when to slash and cut to the basket? No. He needs to learn how to get to the rim from the other side of the ball to create passing lines for the player with the ball. He never does that.

He knows how to rebound on the offensive glass? No. He doesn't have great instincts going for offensive rebounds, so he needs to learn tricks to "push" his defenders to get better position, he needs to learn how to maximize his height for tip ins and put backs.

And he needs to learn to pass and shoot ON THE MOVE. He can do those things with his feet set, but the next step is passing and shooting on the move, at least a few times per game.

He is able to pass the ball and he is a good 3p shooter already. He understands the game and plays with calm. Solid defender, covers ground and I like his basketball IQ on defense, but he needs to get stronger and more agressive on defense too.

I like him over Chriss at this point of their careers, and I think that he can make improvements and be a solid starter in this league in the future.

I would love to watch him as a face up PF/C who can average around 11p/7r/4a/1s/1b in the next future with solid defense and being a floor spacer on offense.

Way off on the bolded, particularly the 2nd part bolded. Have you watched all of our games?

He shows some pretty good stuff from 35 seconds to a minute and here....and throughout..maybe stuff you missed in games you missed.

Watch on YouTube

I watch every single minute of every game.

He has made those things just a couple of times in all the season long.

It's OK because I think he can improve in all of that....but AT THIS MOMENT he doesn't have these skills.

So you don't think the part from 35 seconds to a minute show the skill and ability to slash and cut to the basket or have a pull up game? I think it does. He has them. He just needs to use them.

[sunsbg]

Not playing so passive. This is all Bender's critics are expecting from him. JJ was overly-aggressive and he learned from it. This is part of the development.

[Saberestar]

Way off on the bolded, particularly the 2nd part bolded. Have you watched all of our games?

He shows some pretty good stuff from 35 seconds to a minute and here....and throughout..maybe stuff you missed in games you missed.

Watch on YouTube

I watch every single minute of every game.

He has made those things just a couple of times in all the season long.

It's OK because I think he can improve in all of that....but AT THIS MOMENT he doesn't have these skills.

So you don't think the part from 35 seconds to a minute show the skill and ability to slash and cut to the basket or have a pull up game? I think it does. He has them. He just needs to use them.

Those are just a couple of plays, it is not enough. We have seen a lot of games from Bender, he doesn't make that on a constant basis, not even close.

This is like to put a vid with all the triples that Warren has made this season and I can say that he is a 3p shooter. He is not. He can improve, but at this moment he is not.

[sunsbg]

I watch every single minute of every game.

He has made those things just a couple of times in all the season long.

It's OK because I think he can improve in all of that....but AT THIS MOMENT he doesn't have these skills.

So you don't think the part from 35 seconds to a minute show the skill and ability to slash and cut to the basket or have a pull up game? I think it does. He has them. He just needs to use them.

Those are just a couple of plays, it is not enough. We have seen a lot of games from Bender, he doesn't make that on a constant basis, not even close.

This is like to put a vid with all the triples that Warren has made this season and I can say that he is a 3p shooter. He is not. He can improve, but at this moment he is not.

+1

I'm sure Milicic and Tskitishvili had good plays here and there. In the end they had "mental issues" that made them busts.

[bwgood77]

I watch every single minute of every game.

He has made those things just a couple of times in all the season long.

It's OK because I think he can improve in all of that....but AT THIS MOMENT he doesn't have these skills.

So you don't think the part from 35 seconds to a minute show the skill and ability to slash and cut to the basket or have a pull up game? I think it does. He has them. He just needs to use them.

Those are just a couple of plays, it is not enough. We have seen a lot of games from Bender, he doesn't make that on a constant basis, not even close.

This is like to put a vid with all the triples that Warren has made this season and I can say that he is a 3p shooter. He is not. He can improve, but at this moment he is not.

I'm just saying he has those skills. He is very skilled. He just doesn't use it. He was coached incorrectly for over a year. He's made major progress this year in several areas and showed he has those skills, not often, but showed he has them.

Somebody's poor shooting % isn't a comparison. It's not like Bender tries to do those drives to the basket or pull up and fails all the time...he just doesn't do it....when he has, he has looked good doing it.

[darealjuice]

Not playing so passive. This is all Bender's critics are expecting from him. JJ was overly-aggressive and he learned from it. This is part of the development.

Bender will develop from it too. Defenses changed a bit on him since his 3-point shot started falling consistently, and he hasn't developed his skills enough to consistently counter how teams play him now. Teams know that he's not the most comfortable off the dribble yet, so they can close hard on him to contest shots without the fear of him faking and driving by them. They can even switch a guard on him because he's not strong enough to post up most veteran players and his post game is limited to simple hook shots and finding shooters/cutters right now. Josh has that athleticism and ball handling that makes it tough to guard him, no one is having trouble guarding a big guy that can only shoot 3s and isn't comfortable attacking off the dribble consistently.

That all can change quickly though. The hardest parts are done: he knows how to shoot very well, he plays sound defense (especially for a 20 year old), and he knows the game. He's flashed the ball handling skills he needs to be more than a spot up shooter on the perimeter, and in another offseason or two he'll be much more comfortable giving a pump fake for a one-dribble pull up or attacking the rim than he is now. Even if some of his passes aren't the most impressive, it's tough to deny that he has very good court vision, and that's a huge advantage for the tallest player on the floor. He wasn't going to go from a 7 foot string bean to a chiseled man in a year or two, that takes time for huge ass dudes that play high intensity basketball every single day. This was always going to take time, anything else would have been a very welcome surprise. The upside for a 20 year old 7 footer that's already comfortable defending most positions, shoots 38% from 3 on almost 4 attempts a game, and has had more assists in the last 5 games than he did his entire rookie year is clear as day and worth some patience, as frustrating as it can be at times.

I can understand starting to give up and lose patience for Quese (even if I haven't). 6'9" athletic players with developing shots, foul problems, and questionable basketball IQ aren't exactly the rarest players. I'll take Dragan's problems of being underdeveloped and too passive/unselfish at this stage in his career with his upside every single day.

[lilfishi22]

I know our depth upfront is pretty shallow so it's not saying a whole lot but I think Bender is our most skilled big, by far. He's clearly more well-rounded than everyone else and he has a significantly higher BBIQ than Chriss, the only other big with a 3PT shot. He's obviously not as good compared to specialist rebounders like Len/Chandler/Sauce but he's a better perimeter defender, shooter and way more well-rounded scorer than all 3.

I've seen him do things on the court like the turnaround Dirk fadeaway, putting the ball on the floor like Demarcus (without the fancy dribbling) to the hoop and he shoots the 3 ball at a very proficient rate. The guy by all measures is a very skilled big man which is what you expect these days. His issue is consistency in showing off those skills and his seemingly self-imposed role as a pure 3PT catch and shooter.

But to say he isn't skilled is probably not right.

[Ettorefm]

Awesome game last night.

32 minutes, 3 points, 3 rebounds, 1 assist and 3 fouls on 1-4 shooting.

That's a Derek Fisher game.

[Dambo]

I'm sorry, but I really hope we trade Dragan this offseason. As I'm from Israel I also saw him play in Maccabi the entire year before he was drafted. Yes it's true that he is tall and got some potential to be a decent player off the bench, but he's got a bigger potenatial to be a bust imo.