Game 64: Clippers (34-29) host Cavaliers (38-26) on 03/09 @ 10:30 PM

[esqtvd]

threadjack

it's a game thread


we won, LOL

[Ranma]

I contend that his tenure as a GM wasn't as bad as history will make it seem. Trading future picks, playing vets over young guys, all typical singular traits of Front Offices w/veteran latent rosters trying to win a championship. I think his decisions at times were lazy, but there was nothing he did as a GM that was going to It is what it is. If Chris Paul and Blake Griffin don't nut up in game 6 against Houston or Game 5 against OKC we probably evaluate his tenure as a GM differently, I think. If he has one season where both Blake and Chris play 70+ games they get a higher playoff seed and maybe things are different.

That's just how the story goes sometimes though. To the victor go the spoils and praise.

I still don't believe Doc is a good coach. People just want to look at the 30 different starting lineups and give him all the credit, but that's lazy analysis. It ignores the impact of his nepotism with Austin, nonsensical rotations, favoritism towards chucking over defense, inability to make proper adjustments during games, etc. Doc has been fortunate to have lots of hungry, self-motivated players making him look good this year, but without proper coaching, that can only get you so far in the playoff picture. Even with all the trades and injuries, this would be a solid playoff team instead of a bubble team with better coaching.

EDIT: Your post emphasizes why I want either Doc or Austin gone though. If Austin's name was Austin Carter, there would be far fewer complaints about his minutes, or if Doc Rivers was Glenn Smith, there would be a much different view. We would have more talk about how Austin is one of our young hungry guys who has made strides to improve and talking about how he's hitting 39% 3PT on 6 3PA and is just 25 and can still make strides in efficiency, etc.

think the dream would be to move doc to NY for a draft pick or picks. but if that's the case, who would be his replacement? i wouldn't want to drop him as a coach for a worse alternative.

Yes, Doc's tenure as GM was among the worst in the history of sports. Practically all of his moves were highly questionable at the time they were made and benefit of the doubt was given to him on the hope that he would know best to find fits for his own system. The fact that the vast majority of his moves didn't pan out only confirmed how bad they were to begin with, which directly resulted in the Clippers not meeting expectations during his entire reign as President of Basketball Operations. The lack of depth led to overworking our star players, which conceivably contributed to their respective injuries. Those injuries shouldn't serve as an excuse when his actions exacerbated those risks rather than mitigate them.

Beyond the Doc-Austin relationship, I want Doc removed because of his influence on the organization's decision-making process. Even with his level of influence significantly reduced, he still supposedly has input with Lawrence Frank and, as I've mentioned before, the coach-GM relationship plays a significant role. While it varies a bit from sport to sport, the GM and coach are supposed to be on the same page, which is why GMs typically bring in their own coach when they arrive to a new team or vice versa. In our case, Doc actually brought Frank in and Frank was eventually elevated to the GM position.

Doc may no longer be running things with respect to executive personnel decisions, but at the very least, the team is built with him in mind and on how he would best utilize his players. Not to mention that he still has cronies present all throughout the organization, which indicates that he still has influence in other areas of management. Even the notoriously headstrong Danny Ainge apparently gave consideration to Doc in declining to follow through on the swap of Rajon Rondo for Chris Paul when the two worked together in Boston. Now how is an inexperienced GM like Frank, who himself admitted that he still has a lot to learn, going to totally dismiss Doc's input, especially when Doc was the one who brought him into the organization?

Again, the coach-GM relationship is supposed to be synergetic, so even if Frank pays no heed to Doc--which is unrealistic--it seems like an inefficient manner of doing business. Obviously, Jerry West's presence has already made a significant interest difference and maybe the Clippers can move forward in succeeding in spite of Doc's personnel input, I have my doubts given that Doc still retains notable influence in the organization with his cronies still around and his son on the roster.

However, like I've said, we may be worse off in moving on from him in the short term unless we can find a more suitable replacement.

[nickhx2]

i mean the whole jared dudley thing was a litany of errors that still has an impact on this team to this day. it had major impact on pretty much every single playoff series where the team was so close but unable to make it to the next level given roster holes/lack of depth. imagine having extra help in the OKC series. or extra help in the most critical game in clippers history, vs the rockets.

or say we bombed out anyway in the WCF. imagine having those draft picks giving us way more flexibility in the upcoming offseason. all that stuff matters. as paradoxical as it may sound given my initial statement, it's not about winning or losing those playoff series in any vacuum. it's about him artificially minimizing the team's championship windows with move after move.