Juancho Hernangomez should still be considered the PF of the future

youngthegiant · Post #1 » by **youngthegiant** » Tue Mar 13, 2018 11:06 pm

To add to roller coaster season Denver has had, one of the most underwhelming decisions by Malone was to bench sophmore forward Juancho Hernangomez. Talk about a wasted season for a guy that had shown flashes of being an excellent fit next to Jokic. Watching him play on Friday made me realized just how great of a fit he is next to Jokic. He is an elite 3pt shooter, hustles all over the floor, moves great without the ball and even shows potential of being able to switch in the Pick and Roll. Trey Lyles is good but he plays more of an iso/post up game which imo is better suited off the bench when Jokic is off the floor. Juancho's game is very much how Gary harris played last season. Taking only great shots and playing to his strengths which also align with Jokic's skills.

skywalker33 · Post #2 » by **skywalker33** » Tue Mar 13, 2018 11:19 pm

youngthegiant wrote:To add to roller coaster season Denver has had, one of the most underwhelming decisions by Malone was to bench sophmore forward Juancho Hernangomez. Talk about a wasted season for a guy that had shown flashes of being an excellent fit next to Jokic. Watching him play on Friday made me realized just how great of a fit he is next to Jokic. He is an elite 3pt shooter, hustles all over the floor, moves great without the ball and even shows potential of being able to switch in the Pick and Roll.

For the record, it wasn't Malone that benched Juancho, it was him recovering from Mono that kept him out much of the season. I agree it was a wasted season for him but it also allowed Trey Lyles an opportunity to blossom while Millsap was out too. I am thinking Juancho is not just anointed PF of the future, he'll have to earn that and battle it out with Lyle IMO. I would be hard pressed to call Juancho an elite 3pt shooter as of right now, he did miss all 3 shot from beyond the arc when he got a chance to play the other night against the Lakers. Both are versatile, can shoot and play a well-rounded game, it will be interesting to see what happens next year. I could see Juancho playing more SF next year but I could also see the Nuggets trading one of Juancho or Lyles too .

Post #3 » by **NuggetsWY** » Wed Mar 14, 2018 12:11 am

Sure Hernangomez missed the beginning of the season because of illness, but surely by now he could be playing. But we're used to Malone holding young players out of games.

Is he the PF of the future? Maybe - but maybe Lyles is and don't forget Lydon, whom we've barely seen. Those three are all similar size but play very different games. Could they be a three-headed set of forwards? Not sure, but at least one of them should make a decent PF on a team with two guards and a center that will dominate.

skywalker33 · Post #4 » by **skywalker33** » Wed Mar 14, 2018 12:56 am

NuggetsWY wrote:Sure Hernangomez missed the beginning of the season because of illness, but surely by now he could be playing. But we're used to Malone holding young players out of games.

Is he the PF of the future? Maybe - but maybe Lyles is and don't forget Lydon, whom we've barely seen. Those three are all similar size but play very different games. Could they be a three-headed set of forwards? Not sure, but at least one of them should make a decent PF on a team with two guards and a center that will dominate.

That feels like a cheap shot WY, most every coach will stick to their rotation once they're established, it's not uncommon. Mono is a debilitating illness that sucks energy for even the best of athletes so it's easily conceivable to believe Juancho wasn't really ready until Dec/Jan. at the earliest. Heard he then suffered another minor injury/issue that kept him down again, where is that Malone's fault ??

Now I am all for giving Malone his due, but this doesn't fit IMO. I am sure Malone would've loved to have Juancho for this whole season but it wasn't in the cards.

Post #5 » by **NuggetsWY** » Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:17 am

skywalker33 wrote:
NuggetsWY wrote:Sure Hernangomez missed the beginning of the season because of illness, but surely by now he could be playing. But we're used to Malone holding young players out of games.

Is he the PF of the future? Maybe - but maybe Lyles is and don't forget Lydon, whom we've barely seen. Those three are all similar size but play very different games. Could they be a three-headed set of forwards? Not sure, but at least one of them should make a decent PF on a team with two guards and a center that will dominate.

That feels like a cheap shot WY, most every coach will stick to their rotation once they're established, it's not uncommon. Mono is a debilitating illness that sucks energy for even the best of athletes so it's easily conceivable to believe Juancho wasn't really ready until Dec/Jan. at the earliest. Heard he then suffered another minor injury/issue that kept him down again, where is that Malone's fault ??

Now I am all for giving Malone his due, but this doesn't fit IMO. I am sure Malone would've loved to have Juancho for this whole season but it wasn't in the cards.

Cheap shot? Maybe - I'd cut other coaches more slack than I will Malone. I understand an illness that sucks energy out of someone. I'm still struggling with mine (but I'm a fat old man, so it's a little different). The way Malone's rotation is going, I can see Hernangomez not getting much PT but he certainly could have gotten some garbage time. But as I've said before, I think Malone is too competitive. He not only wants to win every game, which is fine, but he seems terrified of losing, even with a 20 pt lead and at the same time, if we're 20 pts down, he never gives up trying to win. Those aren't necessarily bad traits but there are always games where the outcome is fairly certain. If nothing else, when the opposing coach empties his bench, that's a fairly strong hint regarding the outcome. None of these coaches likes to lose. They didn't get to where they are by being casual about losing.

Powder Blue · Post #6 » by **Powder Blue** » Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:19 am

NuggetsWY wrote:Sure Hernangomez missed the beginning of the season because of illness, but surely by now he could be playing. But we're used to Malone holding young players out of games.

Is he the PF of the future? Maybe - but maybe Lyles is and don't forget Lydon, whom we've barely seen. Those three are all similar size but play very different games. Could they be a three-headed set of forwards? Not sure, but at least one of them should make a decent PF on a team with two guards and a center that will dominate.

Book is still out on Junacho, he’s F’d with all the PF’S on this roster, barely played with Milsap out, hard to see him being his replacement....I’ll also go ahead and say we can forget about Lydon.

MidMountain · Post #7 » by **MidMountain** » Wed Mar 14, 2018 6:13 pm

I had read that his Mono relapsed when he tried to come back too early the first time.

Post #8 » by **NuggetsWY** » Wed Mar 14, 2018 7:07 pm

MidMountain wrote:I had read that his Mono relapsed when he tried to come back too early the first time.

That'd be a real bummer. I had a different disease and struggled with that issue. The doctors declared me healed, but I still struggle with the energy issue. It's why I just can't get down to Denver at all. I keep wanting to, but ...

If that's his problem, I get it. Hopefully he'll get a good chance next year. He certainly looked good last year.

skywalker33 · Post #9 » by **skywalker33** » Wed Mar 14, 2018 8:15 pm

NuggetsWY wrote:
MidMountain wrote:I had read that his Mono relapsed when he tried to come back too early the first time.

That'd be a real bummer. I had a different disease and struggled with that issue. The doctors declared me healed, but I still struggle with the energy issue. It's why I just can't get down to Denver at all. I keep wanting to, but ...

If that's his problem, I get it. Hopefully he'll get a good chance next year. He certainly looked good last year.

It’d be really mutiny material if he doesn’t get a good look, wouldn’t be surprised to see him start at SF

HoopsMalone · Post #10 » by **HoopsMalone** » Thu Mar 15, 2018 12:44 am

I was pretty high on him after the rookie year he had. Showed real promise.

Im willing to just call this year a washout because he had mono and that can affect your conditioning for a LONG time.

But if he looks like this next year, then absolutely not. He's way too bad of a defender on a team already starting Jamal Murray. That's no bueno

There's actually a thread about Jokic's lack of defense on the GB. Jokic is a very good defender he's just surrounded by too many poor ones like Murray, Barton, etc

U hova · Post #11 » by **U hova** » Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:01 am

his defense is bad beyond his lack of physical strength - he gets caught with his head turned or with a missed rotation too often.

HoopsMalone · Post #12 » by **HoopsMalone** » Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:05 am

HoopsMalone wrote: He's way too bad of a defender on a team already starting Jamal Murray. That's no bueno

Okay wow. I gotta call myself out here. I was trying to analyze what was wrong with the Nuggets and noticed Hernangomez is not that bad of a defender. I dont know why I thought he was so bad on that end last year...

Anyway, PF of the future is still a little much for me. I think he will be a rotation guy in this league, I'm just not sure if he'll be a good one or a marginal one.

Post #13 » by **NuggetsWY** » Thu Mar 15, 2018 4:26 am

Jokic tries to help on defense - with everyone. But the Nuggets' defensive scheme either doesn't work that way or no one else is working that way.

Nuggets are terrible defending P-n-R and especially on switching back when there are mismatches. I'm not going to blame anyone player unless they are terrible on one-on-one. Defensive stats can be misleading. Barton has decent enough defensive stats but the eye-test says his man can drive past him almost any time and he frequently looks lost on defense - but at least he usually hustles.

I just think it's either a terrible defensive scheme or a terrible implementation/teaching of the defensive scheme.

youngthegiant · Post #14 » by **youngthegiant** » Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:42 pm

U hova wrote:his defense is bad beyond his lack of physical strength - he gets caught with his head turned or with a missed rotation too often.

I think he has shown flashes of being a really good pnr defender. When he switches, he has shown moments of being able to stay in front of his man. Did a good job on Kevin Durant last season.

Zaccaibone · Post #15 » by **Zaccaibone** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 12:07 pm

It will be extreme for get any playing time even if we are blowing out an team.

skywalker33 · Post #16 » by **skywalker33** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 10:22 pm

youngthegiant wrote:
U hova wrote:his defense is bad beyond his lack of physical strength - he gets caught with his head turned or with a missed rotation too often.
I think he has shown flashes of being a really good pnr defender. When he switches, he has shown moments of being able to stay in front of his man. Did a good job on Kevin Durant last season.

One game doesn't get him on the All-Defensive team

Post #17 » by **NuggetsWY** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 10:35 pm

skywalker33 wrote:
youngthegiant wrote:
U hova wrote:his defense is bad beyond his lack of physical strength - he gets caught with his head turned or with a missed rotation too often.
I think he has shown flashes of being a really good pnr defender. When he switches, he has shown moments of being able to stay in front of his man. Did a good job on Kevin Durant last season.

One game doesn't get him on the All-Defensive team

Watch it Sky - you're talking about my favorite forward on the Nuggets! :lol:

The biggest problem with his defense is that he's on the Nuggets and they clearly don't have a defensive scheme. Some players try to play help defense but that leaves their man open. How many times do we see one player switch off and the other guy stay with his man, leaving one man open? Our guards trail over picks no matter who the player they are guarding is - it's a one-size-fits-all approach. So his defense fits just fine, especially when you consider Malone plays Barton & D.Harris as his end-of-game defensive specialists. :banghead:

Post #18 » by **The Rebel** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:01 pm

NuggetsWY wrote:
skywalker33 wrote:
youngthegiant wrote: I think he has shown flashes of being a really good pnr defender. When he switches, he has shown moments of being able to stay in front of his man. Did a good job on Kevin Durant last season.

One game doesn't get him on the All-Defensive team

Watch it Sky - you're talking about my favorite forward on the Nuggets!

The biggest problem with his defense is that he's on the Nuggets and they clearly don't have a defensive scheme. Some players try to play help defense but that leaves their man open. How many times do we see one player switch off and the other guy stay with his man, leaving one man open? Our guards trail over picks no matter who the player they are guarding is - it's a one-size-fits-all approach. So his defense fits just fine, especially when you consider Malone plays Barton & D.Harris as his end-of-game defensive specialists.

The real issue with his defense is that he does not loo like he is hustling fast enough, that is how you determine defense according to Malone, even if it is fake hustle.

Post #19 » by **NuggetsWY** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:25 pm

The Rebel wrote:
NuggetsWY wrote:
skywalker33 wrote:One game doesn't get him on the All-Defensive team

Watch it Sky - you're talking about my favorite forward on the Nuggets!

The biggest problem with his defense is that he's on the Nuggets and they clearly don't have a defensive scheme. Some players try to play help defense but that leaves their man open. How many times do we see one player switch off and the other guy stay with his man, leaving one man open? Our guards trail over picks no matter who the player they are guarding is - it's a one-size-fits-all approach. So his defense fits just fine, especially when you consider Malone plays Barton & D.Harris as his end-of-game defensive specialists.

The real issue with his defense is that he does not loo like he is hustling fast enough, that is how you determine defense according to Malone, even if it is fake hustle.

Quoting a coach is a bottom 10 defensive coach - every year he has been a head coach? You did mean to use a green font - right?

skywalker33 · Post #20 » by **skywalker33** » Mon May 7, 2018 4:53 pm

Sorry to bump an older thread but here's another great analysis from Adam Mares, this time about Juancho

https://www.denverstiffs.com/2018/5/6/17325952/is-juancho-hernangomez-part-of-denvers-long-term-plans

I thought this was a great listen, let me know your thoughts .Some interesting points I heard

- Is Juancho a Malone type guy ? (Again, is Malone good for Jokic-ball is the better question )
- He needs to get about 1500mins this season, I wonder of he (and Beasley) play in SL to get better
= He's great at off-ball movement (is that how Jokic-ball succeeds ?)