Milwaukee Brewers v/ Philadelphia Phillies, 8/5/07 - 1:05 PM

Kerb Hohl · Post #141 » by **Kerb Hohl** » Sun Aug 5, 2007 10:11 pm

Well, here is one that I really don't know how we can blame on Yost. I guess Ned could have come out and kicked Wise/Cordero in the balls...that might not have been too bad.

SportsWorld · Post #142 » by **SportsWorld** » Sun Aug 5, 2007 10:13 pm

ALLCAPSGOBUCKS wrote::banghead:

That looks cool actually

Isocleas2 · Post #143 » by **Isocleas2** » Sun Aug 5, 2007 10:17 pm

I'll never make fun of a Cub fan again for choking. Well, probably not, but they get atleast a 2 week pass.

livestrong4ever · Post #144 » by **livestrong4ever** » Sun Aug 5, 2007 10:29 pm

Isocleas2 wrote:I'll never make fun of a Cub fan again for choking. Well, probably not, but they get atleast a 2 week pass.

Or a closer that couldn't get a ball over the plate. Seriously if this was turnbow who did this. Everyone would be calling for this mans head but since iits coco nothing happens.

REDDzone · Post #145 » by **REDDzone** » Sun Aug 5, 2007 10:34 pm

livestrong4ever wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Or a closer that couldn't get a ball over the plate. Seriously if this was turnbow who did this. Everyone would be calling for this mans head but since iits coco nothing happens.

Yep my thoughts exactly...Corderblow?

Kerb Hohl · Post #146 » by **Kerb Hohl** » Sun Aug 5, 2007 10:37 pm

Coco's last 7 outings...

1. Game tying HR by Griffey misses by inches.
2. Blown save vs. Reds.
3. Blown save vs. Cards.
4. Scoreless inning in tie game at home.
5. Save.
6. Game tying home run robbed by Corey Hart.
7. Blown save.

That's 3/6 converting his save opportunities and he is inches away from 1/6.

Yeah, a true all-star. :roll:

trwi7 · Post #147 » by **trwi7** » Sun Aug 5, 2007 11:25 pm

trwi7 wrote:I'm just glad Helms didn't give them the lead. That would be a kick in the balls.

WEFFPIM · Post #148 » by **WEFFPIM** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 12:26 am

Wow, what a fantastic raping to witness in person. Here's my thoughts:

1. How is Wise still in the league?
2. Why is Coco not pulled after he loads the bases?
3. Why could the Brewers not build on Eaton from the 2nd through the 5th innings?
4. My biggest question, and might raise some contradiction: Why not leave Linebrink in to pitch the 9th inning? I know he was due up next in the bottom of the 8th, but the Phillies left Myers in to bat extra innings. Linebrink was dealing.
5. Hey Prince, are we allowed to boo after giving up 5 runs in the top of the 9th inning? I sure did, and about 40,000 others did as well.
6. What has happened with Carlos Villanueva?

That is all, worst loss of the season, I wait for someone to find a worse one.

trwi7 · Post #149 » by **trwi7** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 12:36 am

The only reason Manuel let Myers bat is because they didn't have anybody left on the bench.

Basically agree with everything though.

msiris · Post #150 » by **msiris** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 2:55 am

willeatfire4playoffsinmil wrote:Wow, what a fantastic raping to witness in person. Here's my thoughts:

1. How is Wise still in the league?
2. Why is Coco not pulled after he loads the bases?
3. Why could the Brewers not build on Eaton from the 2nd through the 5th innings?
4. My biggest question, and might raise some contradiction: Why not leave Linebrink in to pitch the 9th inning? I know he was due up next in the bottom of the 8th, but the Phillies left Myers in to bat extra innings. Linebrink was dealing.
5. Hey Prince, are we allowed to boo after giving up 5 runs in the top of the 9th inning? I sure did, and about 40,000 others did as well.
6. What has happened with Carlos Villanueva?

That is all, worst loss of the season, I wait for someone to find a worse one.

Welcome. You have been Yosted on five of the six counts.
I am glad Coco is gone after this year , but then whos next.

goirish2107 · Post #151 » by **goirish2107** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 3:02 am

i think the bullpen conspired to keep my game thread record under .500. they obviously were dealing cuz they got the first 2 outs real easy, then they just served 'em up. unreal. of course this team blows all the momentum they built after the last two games, and especially last night. ugh. just **** ugh.

Siefer · Post #152 » by **Siefer** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 4:13 am

I was thinking the same thing about Linebrink. I would have loved to have seen him finish the game, but in all honesty, I'm not putting this game on Yost. Lately he's been doing a good job with the lineups, and managing the bullpen. It's the team as a whole that choked. The lineup shut off once they'd built a lead, and the bullpen coughed the rest of the game up.

livestrong4ever · Post #153 » by **livestrong4ever** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 4:22 am

willeatfire4playoffsinmil wrote:Wow, what a fantastic raping to witness in person. Here's my thoughts:

1. How is Wise still in the league?
2. Why is Coco not pulled after he loads the bases?
3. Why could the Brewers not build on Eaton from the 2nd through the 5th innings?
4. My biggest question, and might raise some contradiction: Why not leave Linebrink in to pitch the 9th inning? I know he was due up next in the bottom of the 8th, but the Phillies left Myers in to bat extra innings. Linebrink was dealing.
5. Hey Prince, are we allowed to boo after giving up 5 runs in the top of the 9th inning? I sure did, and about 40,000 others did as well.
6. What has happened with Carlos Villanueva?

That is all, worst loss of the season, I wait for someone to find a worse one.

.

Took Linebrink so he can pitch tommowor. Dont wear his arm out. If he goes two he prolly wont pitch tommowow Why make him pitch two innings. Dont make sense to me. For the most part wise is a reliable pitcher who is pitching bad his last couple of outings but he still has a 3.21 era. so you know he is gonna snap out of it. So I dont see that as a bad move.

I dont know what you mean by what happen to cv today he pitched good today looking at the box score. He has had a couple of bad l starts after the allstar break but not today

How can you fault the offense for slowing down after scoring 4 runs in the 1st. Its not like they can keep up on that pace the whole game. They also score two more runs

But all in all you can't blame this game on yost for the bullpen blowing
l
And for those of you who are blaming the manger why? Because matt wise who has a 3.21 era and coco couldnt get it done. and you want to take coco out and put turnbow in with the bases load because he has a 13.97 with risp. or put the rookie in. which makes perfect sense.

trwi7 · Post #154 » by **trwi7** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 4:31 am

Took Linebrink so he can pitch tommowor. Dont wear his arm out. If he goes two he prolly wont pitch tommowow

I don't think his arm will be worn out. He just had a week off. He may not even be needed tomorrow which leads back to playing for tomorrow instead of securing the win today.

Why make him pitch two innings.

Why not? He blew through the meat of their order like it was nothing. Why not let him finish?

so you know he is gonna snap out of it.

He's been crap since he beaned that dude for the Reds in the face. Send him to a sports psychologist or something but we have a ton of headcase relievers.

I dont know what you mean by what happen to cv today he pitched good today looking at the box score.

He did fine in his first inning but gave up a walk and a double to start his second inning (so apparently Ned doesn't have a problem using his better relievers for more than one inning) and then Linebrink came in and bailed him out.

How can you fault the offense for slowing down after scoring 4 runs in the 1st. Its not like they can keep up on that pace the whole game. They also score two more runs

I don't really blame the offense. 6 runs should be enough for 90% of the games you play. It's the pitching that has been piss poor lately.

El Duderino · Post #155 » by **El Duderino** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 7:09 am

Why not? He blew through the meat of their order like it was nothing. Why not let him finish?

I'm not a Yost fan,but i have zero problems with how he used the pen today.We have a 6-1 lead heading into the ninth and Linebrink pitched yesterday.In about 98% of the time,even a really crappy relief pitcher should be able to get three outs without giving up five runs,so why send Linebrink back out there for what should have been a garbage time inning?

Plus,we do need to see Wise get back on track,a five run lead seemed a perfect time to me to send Matt out there.Once he gave up those two runs,Ned did the right thing by bringing in Cordero.I can't blame Yost for the fact that with a 3 run lead and two outs,Coco decides to start throwing one slider after another which lead to a couple of walks and a hit batter.All Cordero has to do is stop throwing all those damn sliders,throw his 95mph fastball over the plate and we win the game instead of letting the Phillies load the bases without having to hit their way on.

Earth to Cordero,you have a 96mph fastball,not a 88mph Ben Hendrickson fastball.Throw the damn heat more often and stop getting burned so much on that slider during games where it keeps getting you in trouble.

trwi7 · Post #156 » by **trwi7** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 7:35 am

El Duderino wrote:I'm not a Yost fan,but i have zero problems with how he used the pen today.We have a 6-1 lead heading into the ninth and Linebrink pitched yesterday.In about 98% of the time,even a really crappy relief pitcher should be able to get three outs without giving up five runs,so why send Linebrink back out there for what should have been a garbage time inning?

So if you think a garbage pitcher could get through the inning why would you bring Villanueva and Linebrink into the game with a 5 run lead in the first place?

It just seems like a waste of resources then.

Why didn't he let Suppan pitch longer? We had the lead and he only had 83 pitches and he wasn't in trouble.

Then he brings Villanueva in during a 5 run game instead of Spurling and he gets by fine then allows him to go out again and he allows the first two batters to reach so he has to go get Linebrink, then instead of just using him and saving the rest of the bullpen he decides to use ANOTHER arm (and people wonder why the bullpen is overworked) who just happens to be a headcase right now.

So he has to go to his closer who ends up throwing 40 pitches which makes him unavailable tomorrow.

Now we have to go to extras where you need the bullpen even more so Turnbow has to pitch for the third consecutive day which means he may be unavailable tomorrow.

After we fail to score we need to use Parra on short rest making him unavailable for a couple days due to his long outing earlier this week and this outing.

So basically tomorrow our bullpen consists of an Shouse, Spurling, Villanueva, an overworked Cordero, an overworked Turnbow, and overworked Linebrink and an unavailable Parra.

Instead if he just lets Shouse, or Linebrink finish the game then everybody is available tomorrow except for Shouse and Linebrink.

El Duderino · Post #157 » by **El Duderino** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 8:06 am

So if you think a garbage pitcher could get through the inning why would you bring Villanueva and Linebrink into the game with a 5 run lead in the first place?

He wisely brought in Linebrink because Villanueva has struggled lately and after allowing the first two hitters to reach,then it's time to nip things in the bud before Villanueva possibly imploded like has has of late.I'm sure Ned would have rather not used Linebrink at all,but CV forced his hand.

Why didn't he let Suppan pitch longer? We had the lead and he only had 83 pitches and he wasn't in trouble.

Suppan may have been gassed.In between the 5th/6th inning,the camera showed Suppan getting soaked down with a cold towel and he was breathing heavy,it was muggy today.In the 6th he had given up hits to 3 of 4 hitters along with a wild pitch,i doubt Suppan was gonna come out for the 7th inning regardless if he got the third out in the 6th or Shouse did.

Then he brings Villanueva in during a 5 run game instead of Spurling and he gets by fine then allows him to go out again and he allows the first two batters to reach so he has to go get Linebrink, then instead of just using him and saving the rest of the bullpen he decides to use ANOTHER arm (and people wonder why the bullpen is overworked) who just happens to be a headcase right now.

I liked using Villanueva in the 7th.The guy has been struggling some,i'd rather see Ned throw him out there while we had a 5 run lead instead of say a 2 run lead.A good time to try and see if CV could get himself back on track without having to worry that one bad pitch by him could cost the lead.So he cruised through the 7th and Ned put him back in the 8th hoping one more clean inning not only restores some confidence in Villanueva,it saves one more inning for Linebrink/Turnbow.A leadoff walk though followed by a double to Iguchi forced the hand on Ned.All CV had to do was not walk Rollins to leadoff that inning.

So he has to go to his closer who ends up throwing 40 pitches which makes him unavailable tomorrow.

Wise is going to be needed for this team.If our manager is going to be ripped for putting in a guy with a 3.5 ERA and a five run lead,then a manager has no chance in the eyes of fans.Cordero only threw 40 pitches because Wise screwed up and forced Ned to pull him and because Cordero turns into nibble man with two outs and nobody on with a three run lead.

Instead if he just lets Shouse, or Linebrink finish the game then everybody is available tomorrow except for Shouse and Linebrink.

1.You just assume Shouse/Linebrink would have got in no trouble and cruised through the rest of the game.

2.Ned didn't want to use Linebrink in the first place,much less use him two innings so he's unavailable the next two days.

3.If Wise can't be trusted to get used with a 5 run lead with nobody and instead we should make our new setup man throw second inning with that big lead,when can Wise only be used?Only a 7 run lead or more?Down 6 runs?

Post #158 » by **ReasonablySober** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 2:52 pm

I can't fault Nedly for anything today. When you enter the 9th with a 5 run lead you should be able to win the game.

Isocleas2 · Post #159 » by **Isocleas2** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 3:22 pm

The only move which I question is not letting Linebrink finish the game. He looked amazing in the 8th and this was his "coming out" game for the fans, and for Linebrink in some ways. He should have been allowed to close and then we'd have a fully rested Turnbow+Coco for today's series opener.

And yes I was thinking that before Wise+Coco choked and we lost the game.

Post #160 » by **ReasonablySober** » Mon Aug 6, 2007 3:44 pm

I think putting Wise in there was a good move, it just didn't work out. He's been struggling so getting him out there with a five run lead made sense in my opinion. Linebrink is going to be needed in tight ballgames in big situations. Protecting a five run lead shouldn't have to be one of those situations.