Moderators: bwgood77, lilfishi22, Qwigglez
Mulhollanddrive wrote:I've commented Doncic is escaping scrutiny by not playing on TV I wonder how many people even know how to look up his gamelog? He's made more than 4 shots 4 times out of his last 16 games.
bwgood77 wrote:JMac1 wrote:bwgood77 wrote:
I recall you wanted Hield.
And Kamisky....what does that have to do over analyzing? People didn’t want players because of over analyzing is my point
You don't think our FO should analyze the draft picks? Plenty of big time producers in college haven't panned out, whether it be a Bagley type of production guy like Beasley, or a scorer like Jimmer.
bwgood77 wrote:Waylay13 wrote:JMac1 wrote:
It’s a four man draft. The overly critical made it a two man draft and an overall meh draft, when once it was a stacked draft?!?
Doncic Ayton Bagley And Young are stars and people can say they aren’t which really doesn’t matter, because their game will speak for itself.
Media and Fans and coaches and gms always miss in basketball because they over analyze with all of the BS stats. Football doesn’t have that crap and they miss way less than basketball.
Booker Mitchell Gobert Kahwi Giannis Jordan Gasol Draymond Brogdan Capela Covington Curry Klay.....that’s just the past few years off of the top of my head, insert missed.
Trae does something no one ever did and group think sweeps it under the rug. Some team is gonna get lucky and we will be complaining about JJJ like we do with Bender and Len. Two “top” 5 bigs.
Bagley Bridges Trae and Ayton performed this year. But but but but......excuses. Oh let me add Jamal Murray and Gary Harris to that list. I remember how bad I wanted Murray and people here thought I was crazy.
“We can’t draft him, our backcourt D will stink. He can’t play with Booker, They are redundant. Murray isn’t athletic enough. Murray isn’t a true PG. Murray is a poor mans whatever.......”
Teams aren’t unlucky, they are dumb!
For the most part they arent dumb they simply dont have the ability to see the future. The question with all of these players arent how they did in college but what are they going to be able to do differently in the NBA. What type of learning curve do they have and what is their willingness to continue to learn. There are players who never add a single new skill in the NBA and there are others who are always willing and working to add something new. Booker was only known as a spot up shooter in college and a 6th man who could come in and play off the ball. Today we see that him playing off the ball would be to take a lot of his effectiveness away.
Yeah, using Booker as an example isn't good because people may have compared him to how they compare JJJ because he only put up 10 pts, 2 rebounds and 1 assist in college. He barely played! 21.5 minutes like JJJ (21.8). Why? They were both on deep teams.
bwgood77 wrote:BobbieL wrote:bwgood77 wrote:If you click on the picture twice you can see his top 25 rankings. If you click on spreadsheet link, you need to sort column P from A to Z by clicking on the top of the column.
Doncic by a pretty wide margin
And he loves Jontay Porter and Zhaire Smith...ahead of some big names. And Young, Ayton and Bagley in same tier.
JMac1 wrote:Mitchell is the perfect example, how in the hell did he fall to 13, any fool can see his athleticism and shooting stroke and want to attitude, how ever his RVPM and VORP and whatever else crap doesn’t inform you of that. So if you never seen him play and go off of that stuff, I understand why he fell to 13.
Edit: and handle and suddeness and agility.
Do they have a stat for that stuff? Nope! So let the man fall to 13.....smh.
JMac1 wrote:ATTL wrote:I'm getting back on the trae train if we drop to 4. He has good vision, willing passer, great range. Booker will give him room to operate.
#traetrain
It’s a four man draft. The overly critical made it a two man draft and an overall meh draft, when once it was a stacked draft?!?
Doncic Ayton Bagley And Young are stars and people can say they aren’t which really doesn’t matter, because their game will speak for itself.
Media and Fans and coaches and gms always miss in basketball because they over analyze with all of the BS stats. Football doesn’t have that crap and they miss way less than basketball.
Booker Mitchell Gobert Kahwi Giannis Jordan Gasol Draymond Brogdan Capela Covington Curry Klay.....that’s just the past few years off of the top of my head, insert missed.
Trae does something no one ever did and group think sweeps it under the rug. Some team is gonna get lucky and we will be complaining about JJJ like we do with Bender and Len. Two “top” 5 bigs.
Bagley Bridges Trae and Ayton performed this year. But but but but......excuses. Oh let me add Jamal Murray and Gary Harris to that list. I remember how bad I wanted Murray and people here thought I was crazy.
“We can’t draft him, our backcourt D will stink. He can’t play with Booker, They are redundant. Murray isn’t athletic enough. Murray isn’t a true PG. Murray is a poor mans whatever.......”
Teams aren’t unlucky, they are dumb!
WeekapaugGroove wrote:?s=19
Bamba is the type that could shoot up boards when he meets with teams. Such unique length and if he's hittijg 3s in workouts some gms will look past his so so play at Texas.
bwgood77 wrote:Doncic playing well so far. On pace for 14/14/4. Would lead the team in rebounding and be up there with Randolph in points.
bwgood77 wrote:JMac1 wrote:Mitchell is the perfect example, how in the hell did he fall to 13, any fool can see his athleticism and shooting stroke and want to attitude, how ever his RVPM and VORP and whatever else crap doesn’t inform you of that. So if you never seen him play and go off of that stuff, I understand why he fell to 13.
Edit: and handle and suddeness and agility.
Do they have a stat for that stuff? Nope! So let the man fall to 13.....smh.
No, but you would have hated him in the draft after his freshman year where he averaged 7.4 ppg, 3.4 rpg and 1.7 apg shooting 25% from 3.
The only guy who clearly looked like he had the IQ and basketball savvy beyond what a freshman should be capable of this year is Young.
Some of the others dominated in some respects due to sheer physical dominance, but most of them showed some serious weaknesses or limitations.
Not to say Trae doesn't have weaknesses, but many can be attributed to situation, context, teammates, pressure after dominating like no one has in a long time, etc. The other weaknesses mostly boil down to size and potential limitations on defense, but he's effective at jumping in passing lanes and if he can look for steals in a disciplined fashion, he might not be as bad as people think. Plus he wouldn't be expending as much energy on offense trying to carry the whole team every game.
Kerrsed wrote:WeekapaugGroove wrote:?s=19
Bamba is the type that could shoot up boards when he meets with teams. Such unique length and if he's hittijg 3s in workouts some gms will look past his so so play at Texas.
I was just going to post this.
DAMMIT! And i already wrote him off as who i think will be a bust and drop in the draft, but seriously, if he can hit 3's like that in actual game time with defenders and half out of breath from running up and down the court, well than that would be a game changer.
But still, i would have to see him do stuff like this in a game, like at the combine, as just standing there with no pressure and not winded at all doesnt mean all that much, as it is under 2 completely different circumstances.
But dont get me wrong, its still impressive and better than i can shoot from 3.
Saberestar wrote:bwgood77 wrote:Doncic playing well so far. On pace for 14/14/4. Would lead the team in rebounding and be up there with Randolph in points.
I have seen the full game and he has played a really bad game.
He made a great highlight, but other than that he played a poor game on both sides of the court.
WeekapaugGroove wrote:Kerrsed wrote:WeekapaugGroove wrote:?s=19
Bamba is the type that could shoot up boards when he meets with teams. Such unique length and if he's hittijg 3s in workouts some gms will look past his so so play at Texas.
I was just going to post this.
DAMMIT! And i already wrote him off as who i think will be a bust and drop in the draft, but seriously, if he can hit 3's like that in actual game time with defenders and half out of breath from running up and down the court, well than that would be a game changer.
But still, i would have to see him do stuff like this in a game, like at the combine, as just standing there with no pressure and not winded at all doesnt mean all that much, as it is under 2 completely different circumstances.
But dont get me wrong, its still impressive and better than i can shoot from 3.
I always take these empty gym workouts with a grain of salt; hell Yi Jillian dominated a chair and got picked in the top 10
I was just saying with Bamba he's such a rare guy physically that when he gets in person with teams there will be a certain 'wow' factor with him that could put him back in top 5 discussion.
He's not in my personal top 5 but I do think he's a big swing type pick that I wouldn't kill them for making.
Sreister wrote:JMac1 wrote:ATTL wrote:I'm getting back on the trae train if we drop to 4. He has good vision, willing passer, great range. Booker will give him room to operate.
#traetrain
It’s a four man draft. The overly critical made it a two man draft and an overall meh draft, when once it was a stacked draft?!?
Doncic Ayton Bagley And Young are stars and people can say they aren’t which really doesn’t matter, because their game will speak for itself.
Media and Fans and coaches and gms always miss in basketball because they over analyze with all of the BS stats. Football doesn’t have that crap and they miss way less than basketball.
Booker Mitchell Gobert Kahwi Giannis Jordan Gasol Draymond Brogdan Capela Covington Curry Klay.....that’s just the past few years off of the top of my head, insert missed.
Trae does something no one ever did and group think sweeps it under the rug. Some team is gonna get lucky and we will be complaining about JJJ like we do with Bender and Len. Two “top” 5 bigs.
Bagley Bridges Trae and Ayton performed this year. But but but but......excuses. Oh let me add Jamal Murray and Gary Harris to that list. I remember how bad I wanted Murray and people here thought I was crazy.
“We can’t draft him, our backcourt D will stink. He can’t play with Booker, They are redundant. Murray isn’t athletic enough. Murray isn’t a true PG. Murray is a poor mans whatever.......”
Teams aren’t unlucky, they are dumb!
Wait, what? What sort of evidence do you have to support the claim that NFL never miss? It's such a grossly over simpification to say that NFL doesn't care about analytics and NBA does, so that's why there are differences in hits and misses. I'm not even intelligent enough explain every way that it's an over simplification, but I know that THAT. Let me explain what I do understand.
NFL do miss. A lot. Especially when it comes to an NFL QB. I don't think I really need to explain this very much, and it actually leads me to my next point.
Before I get to this, I want to preface this by saying this is all GENERALLY SPEAKING statements.
Anyway, NBA players are more close with QBs than any other position on the football field. Why? Because both require multifaceted thought processes. Sure there are other positions in the NFL that require it (think MLB, Safetys), but there is a lot more SKILL oriented positions in the NFL (think WR, Linemen, CBs) that are basically 1 on 1 match ups and are much more can I out do that guy?
The same thing goes on in the NBA. NBA players require skill and the ability to read 1 on 1 match ups, help defense.. I could go on and on but it all comes down to having the knowledge and ability to adapt in split second instances. I've had a ton of coaches in my life (2 year college ball player myself, plus obviously many during AAU and whatnot) and the biggest thing any of them ever told me was basketball is a game of reactions. The moment you think, you're gone. It's this that makes basketball players so good, it's not that they're better shooters, it's not that they have better handles, it's that they know what to do, when to do it, and how to counter the other guy from doing what they want to do to stop YOU from doing it.
It all comes down to basketball players, generally, are a much harder player to gauge, same with QBs in the NFL. You need to be able to get in the mind of a ball player and figure out if they have that "IT" factor that allows them to adapt better than the next guy.
Now, there's probably way more psychology out there than that, and I'm sure there are people out there that pretend they know the right thing to look at when it comes to analytics and obviously don't, but to think that more data is hurting people is crazy to think about. Data is king. It's using it that's the hard part.
/End Rant.
JMac1 wrote:WeekapaugGroove wrote:Kerrsed wrote:
I was just going to post this.
DAMMIT! And i already wrote him off as who i think will be a bust and drop in the draft, but seriously, if he can hit 3's like that in actual game time with defenders and half out of breath from running up and down the court, well than that would be a game changer.
But still, i would have to see him do stuff like this in a game, like at the combine, as just standing there with no pressure and not winded at all doesnt mean all that much, as it is under 2 completely different circumstances.
But dont get me wrong, its still impressive and better than i can shoot from 3.
I always take these empty gym workouts with a grain of salt; hell Yi Jillian dominated a chair and got picked in the top 10
I was just saying with Bamba he's such a rare guy physically that when he gets in person with teams there will be a certain 'wow' factor with him that could put him back in top 5 discussion.
He's not in my personal top 5 but I do think he's a big swing type pick that I wouldn't kill them for making.
And Kristaps looked good in the gym too