2017-18 NBA Playoffs - Week 2

[NBA Fan 1234]

What's the logic behind having to ask any player to play off the bench? If the coach think's that's what's best, a player shouldn't really have a say in the situation. Those that fight it aren't team players.

100% agreed.

[god shammgod]

everybody gets old. it is what it is.

[Deeeez Knicks]

Keeping Melo may have actually helped our tank

[Greenie]

You can't just dismiss advanced stats, though. Like all stats, they need to have context surrounding them, but straightforward ones like TS% are almost always clear enough to use.

I agree the team is playing poorly. I just think that if Donovan wants to get to game 7, he needs to start Pat Pat (or, I guess, Grant). I'd really limit Melo's minutes generally speaking, to be honest. No reason to keep him on the court the way he's playing.

I can and will continue to dismiss advanced stats. Just more stats to say you don’t watch.


Bench Melo. I don’t care.

[Greenie]

Advanced stats are useful, though. Melo has the lowest TS% on the entire team...by a good amount, too.

Starting Pat Pat spaces the floor more and gives them a better defensive presence than Melo does. Grant gives the team someone who can get to the FT line, defend better, and allow PG and RW to do their things without hurting the team on offense. It's not like they don't have options. The thing is, Melo is Melo and won't go to the bench - or Donovan doesn't feel like he can put him on the bench. Fact is, he doesn't help the team when he's playing anymore. He's still atrocious on defense, stands around when he doesn't have the ball, still isolates way too often (and takes too many jumpers out of isolation), and he's even missing open jumpers he gets.

Felton has actually been a decent backup PG this year. I agree they can use more depth and shooting and that KOQ/Lee would have fit what they need perfectly. Not sure why they haven't even tried Dakari (they have nothing to lose), but it is what it is.

Spent 2 hours talking with one of my friends on the phone before the series started and had Utah in 6, so I'm not surprised at all.

I don’t like advanced stats at all. Never will. Raw stats are fine by me.

I can’t defend Melo in this series as he’s playing bad. I’m really just saying the team is playing bad.

I don’t know about not being able to put Melo on the bench. They never asked. Maybe they should and if he says no then buy him out if he says no. Melo is about to be 34. It’s over. That hurts because I watched him literally wast away here while being blamed for everything. He should have never came to NY he would have a ring.

What's the logic behind having to ask any player to play off the bench? If the coach think's that's what's best, a player shouldn't really have a say in the situation. Those that fight it aren't team players. Even Kobe realized it was time to retire when he was told his minutes needed to be cut in order to give young players more playing time.

That’s the same as asking players if they are ok with coming off the bench.

[Greenie]

Keeping Melo may have actually helped our tank

Not really.
Same record IMO.

[NBA Fan 1234]

You can't just dismiss advanced stats, though. Like all stats, they need to have context surrounding them, but straightforward ones like TS% are almost always clear enough to use.

I agree the team is playing poorly. I just think that if Donovan wants to get to game 7, he needs to start Pat Pat (or, I guess, Grant). I'd really limit Melo's minutes generally speaking, to be honest. No reason to keep him on the court the way he's playing.

I can and will continue to dismiss advanced stats. Just more stats to say you don’t watch.


Bench Melo. I don’t care.

The context is watching the games. People should not watch games without using stats and people should not be using stats without watching games. You get the full picture from using both. That's how teams like the Warriors and players like Harden have success.

Anyways, you do you. Obviously not going to force you to use even simple advanced stats, let alone Synergy (which is the eye test grouped together, somewhat) or other analytics...I just think it's odd to dismiss something like that.

FWIW, I am watching the games.

I'm out.

[Phish Tank]

everybody gets old. it is what it is.

[Phish Tank]

You can't just dismiss advanced stats, though. Like all stats, they need to have context surrounding them, but straightforward ones like TS% are almost always clear enough to use.

I agree the team is playing poorly. I just think that if Donovan wants to get to game 7, he needs to start Pat Pat (or, I guess, Grant). I'd really limit Melo's minutes generally speaking, to be honest. No reason to keep him on the court the way he's playing.

I can and will continue to dismiss advanced stats. Just more stats to say you don’t watch.


Bench Melo. I don’t care.

The context is watching the games. People should not watch games without using stats and people should not be using stats without watching games. You get the full picture from using both. That's how teams like the Warriors and players like Harden have success.

Anyways, you do you. Obviously not going to force you to use even simple advanced stats, let alone Synergy (which is the eye test grouped together, somewhat) or other analytics...I just think it's odd to dismiss something like that.

FWIW, I am watching the games.

I'm out.

I'm still trying to add context to advanced stats, but it's a steeper learning curve for me. I tend to rely more on watching the game.

Right now, Melo's in a tough position. He's too old and lost all the separation he once had 4 years ago to create room for himself to make shots. Also, his favorite shot (the long mid-range shot) isn't there because Russ and George also like shooting those shots and the space is clogged. Also, Melo doesn't have the ball in his hands anymore and he's forced to develop rhythm as a catch and shoot player, something he's never been in his entire career. Without an off-the-ball game, he pretty much becomes useless out there even as a stretch forward. Combine all that with the fact that neither Russ or George are high % shooters, it becomes a problem.

Defensively, his age has killed him. He can't matchup with the quicker stretch forwards out there. In the past, stretch forwards have been able to give him a hard time. Crowder's a perfect example of that in the past and now. It makes his viability in small ball very limited.

You're probably better off having Melo get his touches off the bench or use him in a bit of a point forward role, but the bench unit becomes slow then. And that becomes a problem against any and all of the great teams.

[sushibear]

Damn I actually want thunder to win now. I love getting behind underdogs and russ has always been one of my favorite players.

If I was donovan, I would sit melo the whole series. It's night and day when he's not out there. Grant and Patterson can switch off guys and can actually protect the rim. They also go strong to the basket. Attack gobert, make him get into foul trouble early.

BTW melo has been awful offensively and defensively this series. He also has not had an assist for four games already.

[Knicksfan1992]

everybody gets old. it is what it is.

except for that cyborg in Cleveland apparently

[god shammgod]

everybody gets old. it is what it is.

except for that cyborg in Cleveland apparently

it'll happen to him too and we'll see it. everybody always stays too long too. at those salaries, why wouldn't you ?

[sushibear]

everybody gets old. it is what it is.

34 is old? Damn melo making nba players early in thier 30's look bad lol.
This is why I appreciate guys like a mj, lebron, kg, pierce, kobe, Nash, dirk, carter, Duncan and co.
Seperates from guys like a marbury, rose, amare, dwight kind of players.

[bokoli]

What's the logic behind having to ask any player to play off the bench? If the coach think's that's what's best, a player shouldn't really have a say in the situation. Those that fight it aren't team players.

100% agreed.

its culture of frontin and being alpha and all that bs..and when you have a guy not talented enough but still into it you are in trouble like okc is with westbrook cause jazz is kicking their iso ass in 6th game..melo was rescued by prime billups coming in and playing winning basketball in couple of nuggets series, other than that forgettable carrer..

[Reign23]

everybody gets old. it is what it is.

this

[Kinglee]

Keeping Melo may have actually helped our tank

Not really.
Same record IMO.

More wins. I think Melo play has more to do with the role than him regressing. Dude was still scoring 20 easily last year. It's hard to make a shot when u see the ball once every 20 minutes. Not a shot, but literally a touch once every 20 minutes

[Kinglee]

I don't even care about what Melo is doing specifically. I just want OKC to win the championship lol

[NBA Fan 1234]

Keeping Melo may have actually helped our tank

Not really.
Same record IMO.

More wins. I think Melo play has more to do with the role than him regressing. Dude was still scoring 20 easily last year. It's hard to make a shot when u see the ball once every 20 minutes. Not a shot, but literally a touch once every 20 minutes

He’s missing shots and getting the same mid-range faceups he was getting last year. He could still score 20 with the Knicks, but his defense would look even worse in NY and his efficiency would plummet as well.

As for touches - 54 per game this year in 32 MPG, 59.9 in 34.3 MPG last year. Haven’t checked playoffs and I’m sure they’ve gone down, but with good reason...

[Greenie]

Keeping Melo may have actually helped our tank

Not really.
Same record IMO.

More wins. I think Melo play has more to do with the role than him regressing. Dude was still scoring 20 easily last year. It's hard to make a shot when u see the ball once every 20 minutes. Not a shot, but literally a touch once every 20 minutes

I can agree with that to a certain extent, but Melo is old with A LOT of miles on his body. He has maybe a year or two left in the league.

[Greenie]

What's the logic behind having to ask any player to play off the bench? If the coach think's that's what's best, a player shouldn't really have a say in the situation. Those that fight it aren't team players.

100% agreed.

its culture of frontin and being alpha and all that bs..and when you have a guy not talented enough but still into it you are in trouble like okc is with westbrook cause jazz is kicking their iso ass in 6th game..melo was rescued by prime billups coming in and playing winning basketball in couple of nuggets series, other than that forgettable carrer..

A top 20 scorer of all-time, ncaa champion and 5 time gold medalist had a forgettable career?