Front Office Needs to Step Up

[NuggetsWY]

Malone's rotations reminds me of his dad's Toronto Raptor's rotation. His starting PG played 40+ mpg with two other starters at 35-40 mpg and the other starters at 30+ mpg. It wasn't unusual back then. Not playing unless seriously injured was unacceptable. IMO Malone is stuck in a time warp from when coaches controlled their players and most of the plays. It just doesn't work in the modern NBA.

In the modern NBA the stars still get 30+ mpg, but for most teams we're talking 2 or 3 players. It seems to me we are seeing more 25-30 mpg players, even as starters. This is the era of "rest games" and reduced minutes so players aren't worn out by the end of the year.

Assuming Chandler & Barton are gone (not a guarantee), here's my suggestion for a rotation:

30+ mpg Jokic - Harris - Murray
25-30 m Millsap - Lyles
15-25 m Plumlee - Hernangomez - Craig - Beasley

That's 2 centers, 2 PFs, 2 SFs, 3 guards - 9 players and there's still room for other players to get 10-15 mpg once in a while, especially when injuries occur. Injuries are when more players should be used, not fewer.

Plumlee & Millsap are not going to be long-term contributors and as such, other players need to see more PT so they can develop. But Millsap still deserves serious minutes, especially because he can make a rather large difference.

But all of this really goes back to the front office that built this team that Malone is trying to use. If the Nuggets go into next year with Chandler & Barton & Faried & Arthur all on the team - it's an indication that they are content to just make the playoffs. Building for the future, building to be a serious contender - that's what the Nuggets should be looking at.

Will Malone change his coaching style? Doubtful!
Will our front office make any major moves this year? Doubtful.

Current projection for next year? 44 wins because I believe other teams will improve more than we will. (Here's hoping I change that projection by the end of the summer.)

[Ugly0598]

Any movement for a G League franchise? It has helped many teams this season and I feel like Torrey Craig could have been developed better with a team in Colorado or anywhere close by.

[NuggetsWY]

Any movement for a G League franchise? It has helped many teams this season and I feel like Torrey Craig could have been developed better with a team in Colorado or anywhere close by.

The Nuggets' PR people are on top of this, somewhere over a year ago they said they were looking into it and it would happen in the future. Fortunately for them, "future" covers a very long time.

[THE J0KER]

I think the bigger problem than too many minutes for our backcourts is bizarre minutes distribution for our frontcourt players!

Jokic minutes management this season is so dumb. On March 16 Gary Harris was injured and our playoff chances look very bad when Malone finally decided to treat Jokic like a real all-star franchise player with no injury issues (which he is). So, during last 14 games (since March 16) Jokic played 38mpg IN AVERAGE, the same player which in all previous 60+ games this season played only twice 38+ minutes, and almost half games under 31 minutes!? Denver is 30-17 (64%) this season when Jokic played 32+ minutes, and just 13-15 (46%) when he played less than 32 minutes. Also, Faried and Juancho are almost not used at all, Chandler played too many minutes, Plumlee played too many minutes with Jokic on the floor despite it never worked well, and Lyles should get much more minutes after his obvious breakthrough in December.

But I would not blame FO for this, but coach Malone of course. But because this is a thread about Denver FO, I want more put focus on how other FO's reacted to improve their teams during the season. We are the only serious competitor in a battle for Bledsoe with Bucks, our 2018+Mudiay or 2018+Faried offer would beat Bucks 2018+Monroe offer for sure (they don't need Monroe at all), but we tried with Faried+Mudiay offer despite Suns are obviously focused on 1st round picks. We need just a decent SF and solid guard backup, but FO wasted whole season to get any. Tyreke Evans can make difference and help us to reach the playoff, but if we decide that he is not 1st rounder worthy, we should offer Memphis some better alternate offer than Mudiay OR 2nd rounder (should be Mudiay AND 2nd rounder). On the other hand Pelicans in lost position after losing Cousins just after couple days find a solution which helped them to reach playoff (even 2nd round of playoff) getting Mirotic, and same missing piece Utah find in Crowder, Cavs even changed half of the roster when they realize that team has bad chemistry, Sixers when realize that Fultz is still not ready, very improve their bench AFTER trade deadline by signed useful Ilyasova and Belinelli... etc... etc... But our FO can't make any useful improvement during the season, so a 2nd year in the row we are just one single win away from playoff!

[youngthegiant]

My preference of a modern day rotation, is having Millsap being pulled early and playing back up Center. This allows Jokic to play with more wings and gives Millsap a larger role on offense. Nowadays you don't really need a traditional back up center (Denver just spent 14 million on one....smh what a fail) Millsap will be a mismatch for most centers on offense and if a teams back up center is going to be the reason we lose a game, then so be it. I'd even be in on Denver using Lyles at center, something we saw a bit of this season. The way i see it. Jokic won't be on the floor for 15 minutes of any given game. If Denver puts out a crazy small fast offensive unit, it may be enough to continue the momentum and potentially run teams off the court.What we saw this season was malone playing very big lineups that ultimately hindered our guards from getting into the paint. Denver can set themselves nicely with a 9 man rotation and a cheap back up center in case of emergencies.

Jamal Murray(32)/?????(16)
Gary Harris(32)/Will Barton(16)
Juancho Hernangomez(18)/Will Barton(14)/Zhaire Smith(16)
Paul Millsap(15)/Trey Lyles(25)/Juancho Hernangomez(8)
Nikola Jokic(33)/Paul Millsap(15)

[Richard Miller]

My preference of a modern day rotation, is having Millsap being pulled early and playing back up Center.

30 million to be a backup center and pulled early is a disaster.

[skywalker33]

My preference of a modern day rotation, is having Millsap being pulled early and playing back up Center.

30 million to be a backup center and pulled early is a disaster.

He would be a starting PF too, but I'm not in with playing a 6'8" 32yo at C either

[youngthegiant]

My preference of a modern day rotation, is having Millsap being pulled early and playing back up Center.

30 million to be a backup center and pulled early is a disaster.

Malone did that with Jokic this season. He pulled him early and got him back in with the bench unit. Not a big issue, Houston does a similar thing with CP3 and Harden.

[youngthegiant]

My preference of a modern day rotation, is having Millsap being pulled early and playing back up Center.

30 million to be a backup center and pulled early is a disaster.

He would be a starting PF too, but I'm not in with playing a 6'8" 32yo at C either

Cleveland plays Kevin Love at Center. Millsap is way better defensively.

[Richard Miller]

My preference of a modern day rotation, is having Millsap being pulled early and playing back up Center.

30 million to be a backup center and pulled early is a disaster.

Malone did that with Jokic this season. He pulled him early and got him back in with the bench unit. Not a big issue, Houston does a similar thing with CP3 and Harden.

And it was a mistake most of the time, see THE J0KER's post above.

[skywalker33]

30 million to be a backup center and pulled early is a disaster.

He would be a starting PF too, but I'm not in with playing a 6'8" 32yo at C either

Cleveland plays Kevin Love at Center. Millsap is way better defensively.

Love is 6'10 and on the right side of 30yo. Millsaps is better defensively but he would be better PAIRED with Jokic, than separated from him.

[Richard Miller]

He would be a starting PF too, but I'm not in with playing a 6'8" 32yo at C either

Cleveland plays Kevin Love at Center. Millsap is way better defensively.

Love is 6'10 and on the right side of 30yo. Millsaps is better defensively but he would be better PAIRED with Jokic, than separated from him.

Exactly, Love is bigger and played C on and off since his Minnesota days; plus when he plays he's not a backup who gets pulled early.

[youngthegiant]

Cleveland plays Kevin Love at Center. Millsap is way better defensively.

Love is 6'10 and on the right side of 30yo. Millsaps is better defensively but he would be better PAIRED with Jokic, than separated from him.

Exactly, Love is bigger and played C on and off since his Minnesota days; plus when he plays he's not a backup who gets pulled early.

Kevin Love is closer to 6'8 and he has lost a significant amount of weight since Minnesota. You guys act like Millsap is playing the entire game at center. He'll mainly be playing against back up centers and if Jokic is playing 34 mpg, we only need a center for 14 minutes.

[NuggetsWY]

Love is 6'10 and on the right side of 30yo. Millsaps is better defensively but he would be better PAIRED with Jokic, than separated from him.

Exactly, Love is bigger and played C on and off since his Minnesota days; plus when he plays he's not a backup who gets pulled early.

Kevin Love is closer to 6'8 and he has lost a significant amount of weight since Minnesota. You guys act like Millsap is playing the entire game at center. He'll mainly be playing against back up centers and if Jokic is playing 34 mpg, we only need a center for 14 minutes.

Sorry, this discussion seems of no consequence since Malone prefers to play Plumlee as Jokic's backup and play Plumlee alongside Jokic. Millsap isn't going to get a chance to be considered as a center unless Jokic and/or Plumlee are out injured.

[Zaccaibone]

I think we should make an trade to move up in the draft during the offseason,

[Richard Miller]

Love is 6'10 and on the right side of 30yo. Millsaps is better defensively but he would be better PAIRED with Jokic, than separated from him.

Exactly, Love is bigger and played C on and off since his Minnesota days; plus when he plays he's not a backup who gets pulled early.

Kevin Love is closer to 6'8 and he has lost a significant amount of weight since Minnesota. You guys act like Millsap is playing the entire game at center. He'll mainly be playing against back up centers and if Jokic is playing 34 mpg, we only need a center for 14 minutes.

Backup centers get around 5 mil or so, see Baynes etc, if he's supposed to play that, it's better he gets shipped asap.

[MidMountain]

Exactly, Love is bigger and played C on and off since his Minnesota days; plus when he plays he's not a backup who gets pulled early.

Kevin Love is closer to 6'8 and he has lost a significant amount of weight since Minnesota. You guys act like Millsap is playing the entire game at center. He'll mainly be playing against back up centers and if Jokic is playing 34 mpg, we only need a center for 14 minutes.

Backup centers get around 5 mil or so, see Baynes etc, if he's supposed to play that, it's better he gets shipped asap.

Those guys aren't also the starting PF for 15-20 mpg like Millsap would be. The main idea is to stagger Jokic and Millsap so that one of them is always on the court and the ball movement doesn't stop.

[Richard Miller]

Kevin Love is closer to 6'8 and he has lost a significant amount of weight since Minnesota. You guys act like Millsap is playing the entire game at center. He'll mainly be playing against back up centers and if Jokic is playing 34 mpg, we only need a center for 14 minutes.

Backup centers get around 5 mil or so, see Baynes etc, if he's supposed to play that, it's better he gets shipped asap.

Those guys aren't also the starting PF for 15-20 mpg like Millsap would be. The main idea is to stagger Jokic and Millsap so that one of them is always on the court and the ball movement doesn't stop.

Well then, he can be on court as PF when Jokic is out as well... I don't get what is Millsap as "backup C" supposed to do that he can't do already (in his current role)?

[The Rebel]

The front office has been talking about consolidating the roster for almost 2 years now, and as I said in the trade thread it is pretty obvious that Malone wants an 8 man rotation for a long time.

So who is the rotation that we are looking at?

Jokic, Murray, Harris, and Millsap are all going to be starters and Malone will play them 32 mpg+ or combined I think they will get more than the 129 minutes they got last year.

If they are still with the team than we know that Barton and Plumlee will get 32 mpg and 20 mpg pretty much guaranteed.

Add those together at that is going to be 171-190 minutes per game with only 240 minutes available each game that does not leave much room for others.

We need a backup PG that guy will likely get 25 mpg at a minimum.

Meaning there will only be about 25-30 mpg available for a 8th-15th guys.

So the front office needs to make some moves if they want the young guys to get more minutes and they need to make moves to fill in the roster around Jokic.

Personally I still lean towards letting Barton walk, I hope to see Chandler opt out, and I would still prefer to see them trade Plumlee for a 15 mpg center, and then get a project center to be a 3rd stringer/ Dleaguer. I would still love to see Juancho and craig being the 2 SFs that can compete for the minutes. I think they need to get a good scoring backup PG, and then I would like to see them dump Plumlee.

Leaving a lineup of
Murray/ Scoring backup PG/ Morris
Harris/ Beasley
Craig/ Juancho
Millsap/ Lyles
Jokic/ defensive C/ project

You would have Beasley and the backup PG fighting for minutes in the backcourt
Juancho, craig, and Beasley competing for SF minutes
Lyles and Juancho will compete for PF backup Minutes
and your defensive center will be used more as just a backup Center.

While the bench would not be perfect, I think with guys competing for minutes you will find out what you have while being an improved bench. Plus it would get the salary cap under better control.

[skywalker33]

Some things that are becoming more apparent are that Malone has particular types of players that he wants for his system and that the FO have their own type of players that fits more with Jokic-ball. This clearly indicates there is a clear disconnect between the FO and Malone, their vision of how the team will win is going different directions. Malone isn't utilizing the team he has properly and the FO isn't making player moves to get players. While Malone has clearly helped improve the team (+13 wins over two seasons), his tenure with this team is limited. I feel the FO is wanting this team to learn all it can from Malone before it moves on, search for a coach that can identify and utilize Jokic ball while continuing to learn to win. Should Malone learn a way to utilize Jokic-ball to it's fullest, he may get to come back but I see him set in his way. Potentially I see yet another year of missing the playoffs because of Malone ( I don't see him as a coach who understands the X's and O's or player management), his firing and yet another new coach.