2018 NBA Draft Talk

[MartinToVaught]

Well, the point is, we have already gone backwards, let's not deny it. The Golden Age is over.

We have DJ, who's half a great player. We have Austin and Pat Bev, who are marginal NBA starters/solid rotation players. 2 and maybe all 3 of them will soon be out of here.

As for the "new core," we have Tobias, who's a nice player who may become a 20-point scorer but probably not a 25-point guy. Gallo, who may or may not play 60 games. A terrific 6th-man who unfortunately plays no D and is only 6'-foot even. Harrell, who is hell on wheels but at only 6'8" is strictly 2nd-unit material. That's it. 1½ starters, a 6th man and an 8th man.

We have assorted 2nd-round/G-league types, all of whom are not only unproven but are tweeners. And 2 draft picks coming in what is admittedly called a deep draft, but as you see, the estimible TucsonClip is getting cold feet about the 2nd-tier prospects we're in position to draft.

Hey, I said I don't expect anyone here to agree with me about swapping the #12 [and probably DJ to make salaries match] for a proven--albeit flawed--all-star like DeRozan, but at least let's admit we're staring at the abyss. Again.

After 7 consecutive very enjoyable seasons [yes, including last year!], I'm just not ready to jump into the abyss. Again. I think the #12 is cheap for a 4-time all-star, and TOR may be in the mood to deal.

[Would I trade both picks? No. Can't think of anyone short of a Finals MVP I would trade both for. Not saying to forget about the future. I'm just not ready to endure the "Process" Philly and the Lakers just went through.]

Trading for an overpaid fake star like DeRozan would really put us into the "abyss." The only thing DeRozan's proven is that he can't shoot, can't defend, won't play team ball and doesn't show up in the playoffs. I honestly think Tobias is a better player than him at this point.

[Quake Griffin]

I, for one, cannot co-sign wasting the last 4 years of the best front office mind in North American sports history (if not, damn near) trivial pursuits like Demar Derozan in order to win what....46-50 games at best next year?

Process please.

[Forte IV]

ESPN latest mock has us passing on Miles Bridges, Lonnie Walker and Zhaire Smith in favor of Jerome Robinson

[esqtvd]

I, for one, cannot co-sign wasting the last 4 years of the best front office mind in North American sports history (if not, damn near) trivial pursuits like Demar Derozan in order to win what....46-50 games at best next year?

Process please.

Talking about one mid-round draft pick. And I trust Jerry but when we suck total asss, put a smile your face.

Careful what you ask for.

[Forte IV]

I wouldn't mind Robinson actually

[MartinToVaught]

I, for one, cannot co-sign wasting the last 4 years of the best front office mind in North American sports history (if not, damn near) trivial pursuits like Demar Derozan in order to win what....46-50 games at best next year?

Process please.

Talking about one mid-round draft pick. And I trust Jerry but when we suck total asss, put a smile your face.

Careful what you ask for.

I mean, you do realize that we would suck with DeRozan and his terrible contract, right?

[connseanery]

Robinson was one of the worst defenders in NCAA last season. Lacking both technique and effort. Don't know what it would say about the the front office if they made a decision at 12, 13 that was so counter to what they stated to be their goals of looking for toughness and 2 way versatility.

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[esqtvd]

I, for one, cannot co-sign wasting the last 4 years of the best front office mind in North American sports history (if not, damn near) trivial pursuits like Demar Derozan in order to win what....46-50 games at best next year?

Process please.

Talking about one mid-round draft pick. And I trust Jerry but when we suck total asss, put a smile your face.

Careful what you ask for.

I mean, you do realize that we would suck with DeRozan and his terrible contract, right?

I think we'd be a 5-8 seed. DeRozan's a winner albeit not a champion.

This is all we could expect when we re-signed Blake and got Gallo and Milos anyway. Ballmer's in his 60s and I'm not sure he wants to suffer The Process for 3-4 years until it starts to pay off [if at all]--and which BTW the NBA is going to short-circuit by changing the draft rules to discourage tanking.

[MartinToVaught]

I think we'd be a 5-8 seed. DeRozan's a winner albeit not a champion.

DeRozan has the sixth-worst career playoff eFG% in the modern era and about the same career playoff TS% as Jamal Crawford:

http://bkref.com/tiny/Q0zCR

Keep in mind, his whole game is based around chucking. He doesn't create for others, he doesn't defend. And his chucking doesn't work against playoff defenses.

Yeah, he's a real "winner."

[esqtvd]

I think we'd be a 5-8 seed. DeRozan's a winner albeit not a champion.

DeRozan has the sixth-worst career playoff eFG% in the modern era and about the same career playoff TS% as Jamal Crawford:

http://bkref.com/tiny/Q0zCR

Keep in mind, his whole game is based around chucking. He doesn't create for others, he doesn't defend. And his chucking doesn't work against playoff defenses.

Yeah, he's a real "winner."

easy with the there,

you don't seem to understand the concept of a "conversation starter"

I said I didn't expect anyone to agree

but I'd rather be a marginal playoff team while we're waiting for the GSW dynasty to wind down rather than go through the hell that Philly and the Lakers just did

[TheNewEra]

I’m all in for Lonnie Walker at 13. Not sure who at 12 Knox might be gone

[Forte IV]

Robinson was one of the worst defenders in NCAA last season. Lacking both technique and effort. Don't know what it would say about the the front office if they made a decision at 12, 13 that was so counter to what they stated to be their goals of looking for toughness and 2 way versatility.

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Thanks for the insight. I was only basing my judgement off highlights I saw and liked his offensive game.

[connseanery]

Robinson was one of the worst defenders in NCAA last season. Lacking both technique and effort. Don't know what it would say about the the front office if they made a decision at 12, 13 that was so counter to what they stated to be their goals of looking for toughness and 2 way versatility.

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk

Thanks for the insight. I was only basing my judgement off highlights I saw and liked his offensive game.

His offense is strong. I think on that side the only question is how well can he actually penetrate. He's not extremely explosive so he'll end up setting up for a lot of step backs. He was able to score (and do so efficiently) against some of the strongest defenses in NCAA though.

If they went with him, maybe mgmt thinks the defense is fixable. At least he isn't tiny like Trae Young but doesn't seem to be a Jerry West type guy atleast.

[MartinToVaught]

easy with the there,

you don't seem to understand the concept of a "conversation starter"

I said I didn't expect anyone to agree

but I'd rather be a marginal playoff team while we're waiting for the GSW dynasty to wind down rather than go through the hell that Philly and the Lakers just did

The problem with your "conversation starter" is that there's not much else to be said when the facts and stats prove the exact opposite of your opinion. "Winners" don't perform as poorly as DeRozan does in the playoffs on such a consistent basis.

If we're going to wait out Golden State, we're better off getting as much young talent as possible through the draft, so our team can be ready to rise once the Warriors start to fall off. Thanks to the new lottery rules starting next year, we don't have to go full Sixers Process, but there's still no upside to being a low-seeded playoff team built around a fake star like DeRozan. I'd much rather use our trade assets to move up and draft Doncic.

[esqtvd]

easy with the there,

you don't seem to understand the concept of a "conversation starter"

I said I didn't expect anyone to agree

but I'd rather be a marginal playoff team while we're waiting for the GSW dynasty to wind down rather than go through the hell that Philly and the Lakers just did

The problem with your "conversation starter" is that there's not much else to be said when the facts and stats prove the exact opposite of your opinion. "Winners" don't perform as poorly as DeRozan does in the playoffs on such a consistent basis.

DeRozan was the best player on a 59-win team. Nobody said anything about going far in the playoffs. In fact, just the opposite.

You are not listening.

[MartinToVaught]

easy with the there,

you don't seem to understand the concept of a "conversation starter"

I said I didn't expect anyone to agree

but I'd rather be a marginal playoff team while we're waiting for the GSW dynasty to wind down rather than go through the hell that Philly and the Lakers just did

The problem with your "conversation starter" is that there's not much else to be said when the facts and stats prove the exact opposite of your opinion. "Winners" don't perform as poorly as DeRozan does in the playoffs on such a consistent basis.

DeRozan was the best player on a 59-win team. Nobody said anything about going far in the playoffs. In fact, just the opposite.

You are not listening.

Lowry is a better player than him. And the real strength of their team was their stacked bench. There's a reason why Raptors fans refer to DeMar as "DeBrick" and beg their front office to trade him.

And if it's not about either going far in the playoffs or rebuilding, what's the point? There is zero upside to spinning our wheels in mediocrity. It's a waste of everyone's time. The best-case scenario with DeMar is losing in the first round of the playoffs and then losing our first-round pick to the Celtics. It's not worth it.

[Forte IV]

Here are some thoughts. Assuming guys they didn't workout are gone (Sexton, Trae, SGA). I think they go either Lonnie, Miles, or Knox depending which of those three if available. I think guys Like Troy Brown, Robert Williams, Jerome Robinson, and the two PGs we worked out are trade down targets.

[Dunken Dave]

I'd like to keep both picks this year and get two players to help with the rebuild.....making the PO's, should be our immediate goal-----we're not realistically winning a title with GS and Hou in the west as it stands now. If we were healthy, we would have made it this past season. I think the most important this year re our PO hopes is DJ's decision.
As for the draft if we came out with Walker and Knox I'd be very happy....

[nickhx2]

knox seems pretty high value lately. i imagine we can snag him then trade down for extras if he drops to us. i mean i like the potential but i'm afraid he's one of those guys who'll never pan out.

[esqtvd]

The problem with your "conversation starter" is that there's not much else to be said when the facts and stats prove the exact opposite of your opinion. "Winners" don't perform as poorly as DeRozan does in the playoffs on such a consistent basis.

DeRozan was the best player on a 59-win team. Nobody said anything about going far in the playoffs. In fact, just the opposite.

You are not listening.

Lowry is a better player than him. And the real strength of their team was their stacked bench. There's a reason why Raptors fans refer to DeMar as "DeBrick" and beg their front office to trade him.

And if it's not about either going far in the playoffs or rebuilding, what's the point? There is zero upside to spinning our wheels in mediocrity. It's a waste of everyone's time. The best-case scenario with DeMar is losing in the first round of the playoffs and then losing our first-round pick to the Celtics. It's not worth it.

If the cost is only the #12, it's cheap for a 4-time all-star at a very affordable $28M a year and the pick probably won't make and definitely won't break the franchise.

And winning seasons are not a waste of anyone's time. Losing seasons are. We are not winning a title in the next 3 or 4 years anyway. We can either be miserable or not. That's why Ballmer agreed to get Gallo and re-sign Blake. It's easy to argue some mythical bright future against a modest present, but Ballmer's 62 years old and 3-4 years of misery is a concrete possibility.

That much we need to admit. Beyond Tobias, we ain't got much, and he's yet to even score 20 ppg, let alone make an all-star team.

You're entitled to disagree with playing it safe trading for an established vet like DeRozan, and I don't say you're wrong. It's a matter of taste and preference, and in the end it's Ballmer's taste and preference that's the last word. I wouldn't blame him in the least if he chose winning seasons--as he already did once by retaining Blake and Gallo.