Wendell Carter Jr - The Block Panther Edition

[Ittna_natas]

Hi all! First post

From my perspective Wendell Carter seems to be somewhat a steal. The thing that separates him from many players is his IQ. Actually, its the same thing that makes Doncic so good. Its not about your quickness nor your 3pt ability, but how you know your own and your teammates abilities. How you can get most of the position within milliseconds.
Article, about offense skills of big in this draft in Stephien, has not been cited many times here, but picture they are drawing is that WCarter can be one of the best big in the draft. https://www.thestepien.com/2018/05/21/big-men-playoff-takeaways-2018-draft/

From the article:
The benefits of having at least a 3-point spacing threat at the five in the modern game has been hashed out pretty expansively, and it shouldn’t be surprising that three of the remaining four teams have feature fives who can space the floor.

Who This Benefits In the 2018 Draft: Jaren Jackson, Jontay Porter, Wendell Carter

If a team can acquire a big who can make quick decisions and capitalize on momentary creases in the defense, that ability, combined with shooting and handling, is gold in the modern game. It’s again not a surprise that Horford and Green are two of the best in the league for bigs at this, if not the two best, and their teams are still alive in late May.

Who This Benefits In the 2018 Draft: Jontay Porter, Wendell Carter

The more players a team can get on the floor who can make a play via dribbling, passing and shooting in the modern game, the harder that team is to guard. A lot of teams of course have backcourts who can do all of these things proficiently, but from the wing and big positions, players with all three abilities are far scarcer.

Who This Benefits In the 2018 Draft: Jontay Porter, Marvin Bagley, Jaren Jackson, Wendell Carter

Conclusion from the article:
Carter’s all-around play paired with just above average athleticism earns him “high floor low ceiling” tabs, but it’s these kinds of versatile playmakers with high IQ and non eye-popping athleticism that draft connoisseurs are likely to underrate.

From my point of view the high iq combined with ability AND willingness to pass the ball makes Carter really nice building block for the future.

I’m quite sure that Carter is and will not be a drag to a team. Meaning, that when players around him get better he will also raise his game.

I image that our core is:
Dunn-xxx(Lavine)-xxx-Markkanen-Carter
Develope those guys 2-3years, add (super)star 3&d and be legitimate threat to any team.

[coldfish]

You know how rookies get much less popular after they have played for a year?

It struck me that a lot of the negativity around WCJ is based around the fact that he played at Duke. As a result, people saw him play a LOT more than they saw some of the other people. You get to see their warts and problems, which normally doesn't occur until after a rookie has played for a year.

If the Bulls had drafted a 19 year old 6'10" kid with a 39" vertical who had 3p range, a wide body, rebounding ability and WCJ's stats out of Southwest Missouri State, I suspect that people would be much, much happier with the pick.

I'm not saying that WCJ is a future stud. I just feel that players out of Duke don't have that new car smell that random players do. The more I read about the kid, the more I like him as a pick.

[bledredwine]

Watched some tape of Carter without Bagley. Completely different player offensively. Seems like he took a backseat when Bagley was in.

That’s awesome. Would you mind linking? I’ve been trying to find footage with little to no avail (mostly highlight videos)

[AshyLarrysDiaper]

You know how rookies get much less popular after they have played for a year?

It struck me that a lot of the negativity around WCJ is based around the fact that he played at Duke. As a result, people saw him play a LOT more than they saw some of the other people. You get to see their warts and problems, which normally doesn't occur until after a rookie has played for a year.

If the Bulls had drafted a 19 year old 6'10" kid with a 39" vertical who had 3p range, a wide body, rebounding ability and WCJ's stats out of Southwest Missouri State, I suspect that people would be much, much happier with the pick.

I'm not saying that WCJ is a future stud. I just feel that players out of Duke don't have that new car smell that random players do. The more I read about the kid, the more I like him as a pick.

I just don’t think that’s true in WCJ’s case. Yes he played on national TV a bunch, but I think only a small minority of Bulls board posters watched multiple Duke games start to finish and have been picking apart his game since November.

Carter isn’t hugely impressive in highlights. That’s one knock on his popularity. The 39 inch vertical comes as a surprise to most because he doesn’t look like a high flyer on the court.

Another is that the consensus among draft analysts is that he doesn’t have extraordinary upside. After a season of tanking, I understand why it’s hard to accept that the guy we drafted has a very slim chance of becoming a top 10 player.

That doesn’t mean he was the wrong pick — I think he was the BPA at 7 and could become an excellent player for us. Just laying out my thinking as to why there’s dampened enthusiasm for this guy.

[coldfish]

You know how rookies get much less popular after they have played for a year?

It struck me that a lot of the negativity around WCJ is based around the fact that he played at Duke. As a result, people saw him play a LOT more than they saw some of the other people. You get to see their warts and problems, which normally doesn't occur until after a rookie has played for a year.

If the Bulls had drafted a 19 year old 6'10" kid with a 39" vertical who had 3p range, a wide body, rebounding ability and WCJ's stats out of Southwest Missouri State, I suspect that people would be much, much happier with the pick.

I'm not saying that WCJ is a future stud. I just feel that players out of Duke don't have that new car smell that random players do. The more I read about the kid, the more I like him as a pick.

I just don’t think that’s true in WCJ’s case. Yes he played on national TV a bunch, but I think only a small minority of Bulls board posters watched multiple Duke games start to finish and have been picking apart his game since November.

Carter isn’t hugely impressive in highlights. That’s one knock on his popularity. The 39 inch vertical comes as a surprise to most because he doesn’t look like a high flyer on the court.

Another is that the consensus among draft analysts is that he doesn’t have extraordinary upside. After a season of tanking, I understand why it’s hard to accept that the guy we drafted has a very slim chance of becoming a top 10 player.

That doesn’t mean he was the wrong pick — I think he was the BPA at 7 and could become an excellent player for us. Just laying out my thinking as to why there’s dampened enthusiasm for this guy.

I tend to think that the draft analysts are just as bad, if not worse, in regards to this. They tear down the known commodities while praising the "gems in the rough".

Good point about the top 10 player though. Personally, I thought that there was just about zero chance the Bulls could get a top 10 NBA player from the 7 spot. I guess my standards were already lowered before the Bulls even picked.

[bennjuiced34]

Watched some tape of Carter without Bagley. Completely different player offensively. Seems like he took a backseat when Bagley was in.

That’s awesome. Would you mind linking? I’ve been trying to find footage with little to no avail (mostly highlight videos)

Georgia Tech, Louisville were 2 of the games. They're on YouTube if you wanna search. Believe Miami(FL) was as well.

[Betta Bulleavit]

I’ve said this before and I will say it again. Carter is an extremely talented player. Had Bagley not reclassified, Carter would have been a consensus top 5 pick and maybe even top 3. Not too many players of his caliber would have been able to handle taking a back seat the way that he did for the greater good of that Duke team. He doesn’t possesse the raw talent that some of these other prospects do. Nor is he the physical specimen that a guys like Bamba or Ayton are. But is BB IQ, work ethic and character make him one of the players that are most likely to maximize the immense talent that he does have. Just wait....

[Dez]

It would be absolutely perfect it he wasn't done growing, grow to 7ft tall Wendell.

[Red Larrivee]

The biggest thing is that he willingly took a backseat to Marvin Bagley after he reclassified. Carter took 10 or more field goal attempts 9 times last season. Bagley took 10 or more FGA 27 times. Carter only took the 5th highest amount of shots on Duke. We're largely talking about a player who had very little plays run for him over the season.

And yet, he still posted comparable numbers to the top big men in this class:

Per 40: 20.2 points, 13.5 rebounds, 3.0 assists, 3.1 blocks, 56% FG, 62.8 TS%.

Those are great numbers for a player who largely played a complimentary role.

And as a shooter, there a ton of upside. His mechanics are very good, He shot 74% from the FT line and 41% from three in college. Granted, the sample size on threes is small (19 makes), but those are more makes than:

Karl Anthony Towns (2)
Joel Embiid (1)
Anthony Davis (3)

Towns made 120 threes last season, Embiid made 66 and Davis made 55. Every player doesn't develop the same, but there's a lot to suggest that Carter could unlock some serious potential offensively.

[BullHeaded]

It would be absolutely perfect it he wasn't done growing, grow to 7ft tall Wendell.

He may be 6'10" but he has a disproportionately high standing reach. That's more important as long as ypu don't rely on blocking shots with your head.

[GimmeDat]

The more I think about this draft the more stoked I am. The more you look past the pining for a true star talent, which went out the window when we didn't tank hard enough, we definitely made the best of our draft positions. Carter is going to be a stud.

[coldfish]

The biggest thing is that he willingly took a backseat to Marvin Bagley after he reclassified. Carter took 10 or more field goal attempts 9 times last season. Bagley took 10 or more FGA 27 times. Carter only took the 5th highest amount of shots on Duke. We're largely talking about a player who had very little plays run for him over the season.

And yet, he still posted comparable numbers to the top big men in this class:

Per 40: 20.2 points, 13.5 rebounds, 3.0 assists, 3.1 blocks, 56% FG, 62.8 TS%.

Those are great numbers for a player who largely played a complimentary role.

And as a shooter, there a ton of upside. His mechanics are very good, He shot 74% from the FT line and 41% from three in college. Granted, the sample size on threes is small (19 makes), but those are more makes than:

Karl Anthony Towns (2)
Joel Embiid (1)
Anthony Davis (3)

Towns made 120 threes last season, Embiid made 66 and Davis made 55. Every player doesn't develop the same, but there's a lot to suggest that Carter could unlock some serious potential offensively.

I was positive before, here are my concerns regarding him:
- Pick and roll. And by that, I am literally talking about the roll. I think he will be fine as a pick and pop guy. He also has the height, shooting and post game to abuse teams if they switch. Its when he rolls to the basket that he doesn't seem to be as much of a threat as he should be.

- Perimeter defense. Both on pick and roll and switches, he seems to outright suck against quick players on the perimeter. Teams will go after him, much like they did Carlos Boozer, unless he fixes that.

Overall, the kid is 19 and wasn't the focus of his team. He has upside from what we saw at Duke. I think he gets waaaay too much grief. He certainly *could* be an all star level player. He isn't a franchise player but those guys are rare. Right now, Markannen is the guy who could be that guy for Chicago.

[SensiBull]

All I can say is that it's a 'glass half full' vs. 'glass half empty' comparison at best, when you look at rebounding numbers between Bagley and Carter.

I don't see a player spending "most of his time on the perimeter" getting 11 rebounds a game in 34 minutes of playing time, and I wouldn't call 9 rebounds per game in an average of 27 minutes "inflated" unless we were talking about a Point Guard.

Both players averaged about a rebound every 3 minutes of regulation. At best it's a wash and, therefore, not a point of comparison or difference.

It's swings and roundabouts after that.

Both shot 40% from the arc, but Bagley averaged 2 attempts per game to Carter's 1. Yet, Carter is the better free throw shooter, considered a more accurate indicator of shooting form, which is noticeable if you see the two shoot.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

More importantly, Carter blocked 2 shots a game to Bagley's 1. For a team that needed rim protection, Carter was the right choice.

Of the bigs in this draft I think Carter was the second best fit for the Bulls after JJJ. Comparing Carter and Bagley reminds me of Horford and Noah, only this time the Bulls got Horford. I was initially down about the pick not because of my evaluation of Carter, he'll be fine, but more because I felt the Bulls didn't maximize opportunities to collect future assets.

I watched the youtube vid of Carter going head to head with Ayton. It looks to me like Lauri's going to have to guard Ayton when he comes to town cause Carter didn't bother Ayton's shot one bit. However, Carter will be very useful protecting the rim when guards (or whoever Zach's defending) get into the lane and we've needed that since we lost Taj.

I agree.

I was also hoping for Bamba to fall, but, JJJ was the only other one worth moving up for in my opinion, and not necessarily by much.

[Red Larrivee]

The biggest thing is that he willingly took a backseat to Marvin Bagley after he reclassified. Carter took 10 or more field goal attempts 9 times last season. Bagley took 10 or more FGA 27 times. Carter only took the 5th highest amount of shots on Duke. We're largely talking about a player who had very little plays run for him over the season.

And yet, he still posted comparable numbers to the top big men in this class:

Per 40: 20.2 points, 13.5 rebounds, 3.0 assists, 3.1 blocks, 56% FG, 62.8 TS%.

Those are great numbers for a player who largely played a complimentary role.

And as a shooter, there a ton of upside. His mechanics are very good, He shot 74% from the FT line and 41% from three in college. Granted, the sample size on threes is small (19 makes), but those are more makes than:

Karl Anthony Towns (2)
Joel Embiid (1)
Anthony Davis (3)

Towns made 120 threes last season, Embiid made 66 and Davis made 55. Every player doesn't develop the same, but there's a lot to suggest that Carter could unlock some serious potential offensively.

I was positive before, here are my concerns regarding him:
- Pick and roll. And by that, I am literally talking about the roll. I think he will be fine as a pick and pop guy. He also has the height, shooting and post game to abuse teams if they switch. Its when he rolls to the basket that he doesn't seem to be as much of a threat as he should be.

- Perimeter defense. Both on pick and roll and switches, he seems to outright suck against quick players on the perimeter. Teams will go after him, much like they did Carlos Boozer, unless he fixes that.

Overall, the kid is 19 and wasn't the focus of his team. He has upside from what we saw at Duke. I think he gets waaaay too much grief. He certainly *could* be an all star level player. He isn't a franchise player but those guys are rare. Right now, Markannen is the guy who could be that guy for Chicago.

This is fair. Overall, Carter is encouraging because his flaws can be corrected, he doesn't really have an area of doom to his game and he grades high in categories that can lead to high lineup value. He does well in a lot of the small things that go a long way towards winning games. Plus, it's a bonus that you know he compliments Markkanen without overlap.

I don't think he's Boozer bad on the pick and roll, but I think it's a combination of foot speed and technique. Some of it looks at least correctable.

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[DanTown8587]

Any conversation about Carter starts and ends with how he plays and how he impacts Lauri. My problem with Carter is not so much him but what he does to the rest of the team around him, mostly Lauri offensively and how well he helps the team defensively as the last line of defense.

I see a lot of “Carter does this and that individually” but basketball is a team sport and unless you’re a top flight star, the biggest thing is what you do to your teammates and the team game and not your own production.

[Ugly Duckling]

The one thing I would caution some of you about is raising your expectations too high when it comes to WCJ. He went from being underrated to overrated. The mind has a tendency to reconcile and justify the inevitable. I've watched a lot of tape on him and yes, he looks good and I'm happy with the pick. But we need to temper our expectations or we're bound to be disappointed. His lateral quickness is definitely an issue and will prevent him from effectively switching onto perimeter players. That makes him a defensive liability in the new era. His shot can be tentative and needs improvement. He also needs to be more aggressive. He's a skilled big, but it's too early for Horford comparisons

[Red Larrivee]

Any conversation about Carter starts and ends with how he plays and how he impacts Lauri. My problem with Carter is not so much him but what he does to the rest of the team around him, mostly Lauri offensively and how well he helps the team defensively as the last line of defense.

I see a lot of “Carter does this and that individually” but basketball is a team sport and unless you’re a top flight star, the biggest thing is what you do to your teammates and the team game and not your own production.

If we're looking at that, there's a lot more to suggest he positively affects the team game than not. It just so happens that Carter's individual production was good too.

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[Ben Wilson25]

Opinions of WCJ the draft pick will be colored by opinions of the current roster. If you think Lauri is a good #2 or #3 option and were hoping to come out of this draft with a #1 option you will be disappointed. I personally think Lauri is going to be a top 10 player and top 5 offensive player in the NBA so coming out of the draft with a center who has complimentary skills and all-star upside is great.

I realize my opinion of Lauri is an outlier but for his age and size he has an advanced offensive arsenal. He showed me in Eurobasket and his MSG matchup with Porzingis that he can elevate his game on the big stage. His shot and body show me he has a work ethic. We’ll see how it develops. You never know.

[MrFortune3]

The more I think about this draft the more stoked I am. The more you look past the pining for a true star talent, which went out the window when we didn't tank hard enough, we definitely made the best of our draft positions. Carter is going to be a stud.

I think WCJ has true star talent, he may seem to be a lower potential ceiling player than others but the dude is very talented and has untapped potential.
Guys like him with their high basketball IQ tend to surprise in the league.

[Dez]

Any conversation about Carter starts and ends with how he plays and how he impacts Lauri. My problem with Carter is not so much him but what he does to the rest of the team around him, mostly Lauri offensively and how well he helps the team defensively as the last line of defense.

I see a lot of “Carter does this and that individually” but basketball is a team sport and unless you’re a top flight star, the biggest thing is what you do to your teammates and the team game and not your own production.

Well considering what I've read/seen (which granted isn't a lot) he was happy to take a backseat when Bagley reclassified and came to Duke and do what the team needed him to do.

I don't think there will be any issues on that front.