Zach Lavine: Offered 4/80 from Kings update p26 Bulls Matched

[CoreyVillains]

18 Mil a year will be 16.5% of the cap when it jumps to 109 next year. That doesn't cripple you or hamper your ability to pursue the big FA's next year. Sure you'd love to sign him to something in the 12-15 range but the difference in money won't prevent management from going after guys.

[keloms]

If GarPax give Lavine a 4/72M . . . . .

I don't know. No point in making empty threats. I guess I'll complete that sentence. If GarPax give Lavine a 4/72M deal, I will bitch about them anonymously on the internet.

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[nomorezorro]

i'm less concerned about year 2 of the contract and more concerned about the potential years 3-4, when the bulls should be much further along in their rebuild and, ideally, a legitimately desirable landing spot for free agents

i don't care about wasting $18 million on zach lavine when we're nowhere near contending. but you're being naive if you don't think he could hamstring our ability to make a push toward the top of the conference in 2020 or whatever

[dice]

18 Mil a year will be 16.5% of the cap when it jumps to 109 next year. That doesn't cripple you or hamper your ability to pursue the big FA's next year. Sure you'd love to sign him to something in the 12-15 range but the difference in money won't prevent management from going after guys.

it makes it tough to sign 2 big fish. and impossible give them a decent supporting cast unless he really improves his game

simply put the money is much better spent on good players than even the best we have seen from lavine in his career to date

[holv03]

Lavine will get something like 4 yrs 75M. I don't know why people would complain about it specially if he becomes an all-star player and takes us to the playoffs (a big IF). People need to remember that next season the cap will be jumping to 109M which gives us the option to add a big star FA. Also if Dunn, Lauri and Lavine all have break out seasons then we might just need to add one big FA instead of two. If Carter and Hutchison have big rookie years then we could be in a way better position.

[Brothaman33]

I'm just gonna choose to not moan about it. 18 Mil a year isn't as crazy of a number as it used to be, it just isn't. He'll be 24 years old with a full off season under his belt. It is not unreasonable to think he will be better then last year. Lets see how good.

[dice]

Based on KC's article and the apparent likelihood that the Bulls want to sign Zach to a long term contract, I have been trying to figure out the most we can pay him on a four year deal, while keeping our core pieces (Lauri, Dunn, Carter, Hutch and next year's pick) plus having room for two max FAs next summer. By my calculations, the most we can pay Zach is 4/56, or 14 M per year (which coincides with the low end of the rumored Bulls' preferred contract amount).

Assumptions:
Stretch Asik and Felicio next summer and renounce everyone else (including Portis and Val). LaVine's 4/56 contract (staying within the 8 % raise rule): 14M, 12.88 M, 14 M, 15.12 M.

Here are my salary cap numbers:

22,319,231 (Lauri, Dunn, Carter, Hutch plus the stretch amounts for Asik and Felicio)
12,880,000 (LaVine)
4,450,810 (5 roster charges)
4,200,000 (2019 10th pick at 120%)
65,400,000 (two max FAs, assuming both are 7-9 year vets and receive 30% of 109 M cap)

Total: 109,250,041

That's 250K over the projected 109 M cap, which we can deal with by shaving the max FA guys or the pick. Of course, we don't know what pick we will have next year, so this is not 100% a sure thing, but picking at 10 seems like a reasonable projection. We also don't know with certainty what the cap will be, but right now it is projected to be 109 M.

Maybe this is what the Bulls have in mind.

if the reports on what they are willing to pay lavine are accurate, the FO obviously doesn't have two max FAs in their gameplan

[tgmxd]

Lavine will get something like 4 yrs 75M. I don't know why people would complain about it specially if he becomes an all-star player and takes us to the playoffs (a big IF). People need to remember that next season the cap will be jumping to 109M which gives us the option to add a big star FA. Also if Dunn, Lauri and Lavine all have break out seasons then we might just need to add one big FA instead of two. If Carter and Hutchison have big rookie years then we could be in a way better position.

So they wouldn’t have room for Kyrie and Butler then?

[chrispatrick]

Lavine will get something like 4 yrs 75M. I don't know why people would complain about it specially if he becomes an all-star player and takes us to the playoffs (a big IF). People need to remember that next season the cap will be jumping to 109M which gives us the option to add a big star FA. Also if Dunn, Lauri and Lavine all have break out seasons then we might just need to add one big FA instead of two. If Carter and Hutchison have big rookie years then we could be in a way better position.

By no means do you have to agree, but the reason why people would complain is quite clear. Giving $75M to an objectively pretty bad player (statistically speaking, particularly advanced stats/metrics) is an unsurprising reason for complaints.

Again, not disrespecting your opinion, but the logic for why someone wouldn't want to give that contract to LaVine given his past performance is unsurprising.

[coldfish]

Lavine will get something like 4 yrs 75M. I don't know why people would complain about it specially if he becomes an all-star player and takes us to the playoffs (a big IF). People need to remember that next season the cap will be jumping to 109M which gives us the option to add a big star FA. Also if Dunn, Lauri and Lavine all have break out seasons then we might just need to add one big FA instead of two. If Carter and Hutchison have big rookie years then we could be in a way better position.

Lavine is the current Bulls Rorschach test. People are definitely seeing different things here.

IMO, Lavine just isn't that good. Like, I would prefer that he isn't signed at all level. I hope he sticks to his guns and asks for like 5/130 or something and he takes the QO.

[chrispatrick]

Lavine will get something like 4 yrs 75M. I don't know why people would complain about it specially if he becomes an all-star player and takes us to the playoffs (a big IF). People need to remember that next season the cap will be jumping to 109M which gives us the option to add a big star FA. Also if Dunn, Lauri and Lavine all have break out seasons then we might just need to add one big FA instead of two. If Carter and Hutchison have big rookie years then we could be in a way better position.

By no means do you have to agree, but the reason why people would complain is quite clear. Giving $75M to an objectively pretty bad player (statistically speaking, particularly advanced stats/metrics) is an unsurprising reason for complaints.

Again, not disrespecting your opinion, but the logic for why someone wouldn't want to give that contract to LaVine given his past performance is unsurprising.

[pylb]

I don't know why people would complain about it specially if he becomes an all-star player and takes us to the playoffs (a big IF).

That's exactly the reason, it's a big IF. In the likely event that he never becomes an all-star player, then we'll be overpaying if we're spending more than ~MLE money.

[dice]

I'm just gonna choose to not moan about it. 18 Mil a year isn't as crazy of a number as it used to be, it just isn't. He'll be 24 years old with a full off season under his belt. It is not unreasonable to think he will be better then last year. Lets see how good.

no, it's not. if you're comparing to last year's free agent market, it's within the realm of sanity. in this year's market it's not

the kings are now apparently not interested in offering lavine. our competition is scarce to re-sign a player who has had a mostly awful career to date. the main fear (for most people) at this point is him taking the QO and a big offer next offseason

[dice]

I don't know why people would complain about it specially if he becomes an all-star player and takes us to the playoffs (a big IF).

That's exactly the reason, it's a big IF. In the likely event that he never becomes an all-star player, then we'll be overpaying if we're spending more than ~MLE money.

obviously nobody would be complaining if he becomes an all-star (even in the talent-deprived east). but that seems like a real longshot unless we give him as many shots as he wants and he puts up a big ppg average

[RememberLu]

LaVine has a ton of potential, he just needs to be coached. Fred has to earn his money just like LaVine does. Zach needs to humble himself and get rid of the ego because his game isn't developed enough to think he can just be the #1 option alpha personality guy on this team.

[dumbell78]

I'm just gonna choose to not moan about it. 18 Mil a year isn't as crazy of a number as it used to be, it just isn't. He'll be 24 years old with a full off season under his belt. It is not unreasonable to think he will be better then last year. Lets see how good.

no, it's not. if you're comparing to last year's free agent market, it's within the realm of sanity. in this year's market it's not

the kings are now apparently not interested in offering lavine. our competition is scarce to re-sign a player who has had a mostly awful career to date. the main fear (for most people) at this point is him taking the QO and a big offer next offseason

We're in competition with ourselves, just like Felicio (and Niko). They are just taking their sweet ass time, hopefully this thing ends soon.

[greenl]

LaVine has a ton of potential, he just needs to be coached.

Hard disagree. Competent shooter. Decent ball handler. His comp coming out was JR Smith. I believe that's his ceiling. His bball IQ is exceedingly low. His defense is non-existent. He's an ideal bum slaying 6th or 7th man microwave. I don't believe athleticism translates into potential. But as Coldfish wrote, we all see something different in Lavine.

[Red8911]

Lavine will get something like 4 yrs 75M. I don't know why people would complain about it specially if he becomes an all-star player and takes us to the playoffs (a big IF). People need to remember that next season the cap will be jumping to 109M which gives us the option to add a big star FA. Also if Dunn, Lauri and Lavine all have break out seasons then we might just need to add one big FA instead of two. If Carter and Hutchison have big rookie years then we could be in a way better position.

Let’s not forget though that Portis( if reports are correct)will sign an extension too. Also Dunn is coming in a couple years.

[RememberLu]

LaVine has a ton of potential, he just needs to be coached.

Hard disagree. Competent shooter. Decent ball handler. His comp coming out was JR Smith. I believe that's his ceiling. His bball IQ is exceedingly low. His defense is non-existent. He's an ideal bum slaying 6th or 7th man microwave. I don't believe athleticism translates into potential. But as Coldfish wrote, we all see something different in Lavine.

Don't you think IQ can be coached up? Fred has to get Zach to play more of a team game, and humble him a little bit by treating him like just one of the young players that needs to be coached, instead of like an entitled star.

J.R. Smith btw, has a ring. And for the longest time Bulls fans were tossing his name about with the likes of O.J. Mayo and Arron Afflalo to be our starting 2 guard for those D.Rose era Thibs teams.

[dice]

Lavine will get something like 4 yrs 75M. I don't know why people would complain about it specially if he becomes an all-star player and takes us to the playoffs (a big IF). People need to remember that next season the cap will be jumping to 109M which gives us the option to add a big star FA. Also if Dunn, Lauri and Lavine all have break out seasons then we might just need to add one big FA instead of two. If Carter and Hutchison have big rookie years then we could be in a way better position.

Let’s not forget though that Portis( if reports are correct)will sign an extension too. Also Dunn is coming in a couple years.

cap space presumably won't be an issue when dunn is up for negotiation. we'll hopefully have a big name free agent already signed and be using bird rights to go over the cap with dunn