2018 Free Agency and Trade Discussion continued

[bigfoot]

Again the best option is to waive Daniels since we have a backlog of wing players. Then use one of our exceptions to sign another another player. Either a PG, PF, or C.

Wiliams, Len, or wait for someone to be waived that we like

Edit: **** ... Daniels not Reed

[bwgood77]

This is in response to the original question.

A buyout does NOT impact his cap number unless his deal is stretched or something. But there is no reason to stretch any players unless we want to sign someone else now. No player is going to take a 30% discount for a buyout either (but I assume your numbers were just for the sake of the example).

It does impact the cap number. I looked this up like a week ago. If the buyout is for a contract with multiple seasons left, the buyout number gets prorated over the remaining number of years...if it's one year it would obviously just reduce the cap hit that year. I posted the link to the new CBA and language when I looked it up.

Edit: Here is the clause from page 223 of the CBA..

(5) In the event that a Team and a player agree to amend a Player
Contract to reduce the amount of the player’s protected
Compensation in accordance with Article II, Section 3(n), then: (i)
for purposes of calculating the player’s Salary for the then-current
and any remaining Salary Cap Year covered by the Contract,
notwithstanding any stretch of the player’s protected
Compensation payment schedule, the aggregate reduction in the
player’s protected Compensation shall be allocated pro rata over
the then-current and each remaining Salary Cap Year on the basis
of the remaining unearned protected Base Compensation in each
such Salary Cap Year; and (ii) the Team shall not be permitted to
sign the player to a new Player Contract (or claim the player off of
waivers) before the later of: (x) one (1) year following the date that
the player’s Player Contract with such Team was terminated; or (y)
the July 1 following the last Season of such Player Contract.

http://3c90sm37lsaecdwtr32v9qof-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/2017-NBA-NBPA-Collective-Bargaining-Agreement.pdf

Still Dudley is too smart to give up $3M. He couldn't recoup it by signing with another team. The market is so soft right now. He'd get a vet minimum at best.

I don't think anyone will get bought out. The original posed the question of whether you could buy them out for a $3 million savings on cap and then pay him that much to be an asst coach. I doubt that kind of stuff is allowed. I had actually thought about doing that with Tyson in the past....but was sure that would be against some sort of rule.

[BobbieL]

The Nets are in asset building mode. I wonder if they would be open for Chandler/Daniels for DeMarre Carroll (maybe Faired) if the Suns flip a second rounder. Suns move two players for the price of one roster spot. Nets get another second rounder - odds are - -pretty good pick. All players involved are expirings. Suns buy out either player and sign a guy like Alan Williams and maybe Teodosic or another PG type with the 4.4m exception. Suns may not need Williams if they have Faried.

Flipping a player like Daniels (to the Suns) last year netted us a second rounder
Flipping Dudley or Chandler to another team is going to cost us a first rounder.

Grizzlies were trying to save the cash - hence they attached a second rounder

Chandler for Faried or DeMarre Carroll is a basically a wash. I am just giving the Nets some "sugar" for doing the deal. If they want a second rounder - they take Chandler and Daniels for FAried or Carrol.

Suns have 15 players under roster - unless a team wants Daniels - which would be optimum - just trying to think of ways to move players out to get players in.

[BobbieL]

Again the best option is to waive Daniels since we have a backlog of wing players. Then use one of our exceptions to sign another another player. Either a PG, PF, or C.

Wiliams, Len, or wait for someone to be waived that we like

Edit: **** ... Daniels not Reed

The Suns can sign as many players to veteran deals other then the 4.4m exception. That being said, I don't seem them trying to do very much - maybe two players more added to the roster I guess just a lot depends on this "supposed" conversation Gambo says will happen with Chandler goes as far as other player moves.

[jcsunsfan]

The Nets are in asset building mode. I wonder if they would be open for Chandler/Daniels for DeMarre Carroll (maybe Faired) if the Suns flip a second rounder. Suns move two players for the price of one roster spot. Nets get another second rounder - odds are - -pretty good pick. All players involved are expirings. Suns buy out either player and sign a guy like Alan Williams and maybe Teodosic or another PG type with the 4.4m exception. Suns may not need Williams if they have Faried.

Flipping a player like Daniels (to the Suns) last year netted us a second rounder
Flipping Dudley or Chandler to another team is going to cost us a first rounder.

Grizzlies were trying to save the cash - hence they attached a second rounder

Chandler for Faried or DeMarre Carroll is a basically a wash. I am just giving the Nets some "sugar" for doing the deal. If they want a second rounder - they take Chandler and Daniels for FAried or Carrol.

Suns have 15 players under roster - unless a team wants Daniels - which would be optimum - just trying to think of ways to move players out to get players in.

The Lakers should want Daniels. That team desperately needs shooters.

[bigfoot]

The Nets are in asset building mode. I wonder if they would be open for Chandler/Daniels for DeMarre Carroll (maybe Faired) if the Suns flip a second rounder. Suns move two players for the price of one roster spot. Nets get another second rounder - odds are - -pretty good pick. All players involved are expirings. Suns buy out either player and sign a guy like Alan Williams and maybe Teodosic or another PG type with the 4.4m exception. Suns may not need Williams if they have Faried.

Flipping a player like Daniels (to the Suns) last year netted us a second rounder
Flipping Dudley or Chandler to another team is going to cost us a first rounder.

Grizzlies were trying to save the cash - hence they attached a second rounder

Chandler for Faried or DeMarre Carroll is a basically a wash. I am just giving the Nets some "sugar" for doing the deal. If they want a second rounder - they take Chandler and Daniels for FAried or Carrol.

Suns have 15 players under roster - unless a team wants Daniels - which would be optimum - just trying to think of ways to move players out to get players in.

They simplest way is for Sarver to give McD the go ahead to waive Daniels outright. Sarver eats his $3.2M contract. We'd still be over the cap, just barely. Then use bi-annual or non-taxpayer mid-level exception to sign someone else for one year. That's like $3.3M or $8.2M to sign another vet.

[jcsunsfan]

I think the Clippers are going to cut Teodesic, in spite of this article. https://www.eurohoops.net/en/nba-news/710392/the-la-clippers-are-keeping-milos-teodosic/ and the Suns are planning to sign him. They are just waiting for him to be available.

His deal is only partially guaranteed and they have too many players. He is a quality, wiley vet who shoots decently and is a passing wizard. He won't cost us much to sign.

[BobbieL]

Flipping a player like Daniels (to the Suns) last year netted us a second rounder
Flipping Dudley or Chandler to another team is going to cost us a first rounder.

Grizzlies were trying to save the cash - hence they attached a second rounder

Chandler for Faried or DeMarre Carroll is a basically a wash. I am just giving the Nets some "sugar" for doing the deal. If they want a second rounder - they take Chandler and Daniels for FAried or Carrol.

Suns have 15 players under roster - unless a team wants Daniels - which would be optimum - just trying to think of ways to move players out to get players in.

They simplest way is for Sarver to give McD the go ahead to waive Daniels outright. Sarver eats his $3.2M contract. We'd still be over the cap, just barely. Then use bi-annual or non-taxpayer mid-level exception to sign someone else for one year. That's like $3.3M or $8.2M to sign another vet.

Pretty sure the Suns only have the 4.4m exception since they were well under the cap to start free agency.


Sarver can still waive Daniels to open a roster spot. I think we all are thinking Shaq and Reed will be kept, hence the need for a spot if the 4.4 exception is used


I was jacking around with capulator - if the thunder traded for Daniels Chandler and Dudley for melo, they would save like 8m - stretching the three guys as opposed to just stretching Melo because of lower salaries for the three compared to melo Granted they might buyout and stretch melo which saves them money too

Granted they have no assets to do that but it would be away for the suns to clear three roster spots if they wanted

[BobbieL]

I think the Clippers are going to cut Teodesic, in spite of this article. https://www.eurohoops.net/en/nba-news/710392/the-la-clippers-are-keeping-milos-teodosic/ and the Suns are planning to sign him. They are just waiting for him to be available.

His deal is only partially guaranteed and they have too many players. He is a quality, wiley vet who shoots decently and is a passing wizard. He won't cost us much to sign.

I would be very surprised if both Beverly and Teodosic are kept. Today is the day so who knows

[bigfoot]

Grizzlies were trying to save the cash - hence they attached a second rounder

Chandler for Faried or DeMarre Carroll is a basically a wash. I am just giving the Nets some "sugar" for doing the deal. If they want a second rounder - they take Chandler and Daniels for FAried or Carrol.

Suns have 15 players under roster - unless a team wants Daniels - which would be optimum - just trying to think of ways to move players out to get players in.

They simplest way is for Sarver to give McD the go ahead to waive Daniels outright. Sarver eats his $3.2M contract. We'd still be over the cap, just barely. Then use bi-annual or non-taxpayer mid-level exception to sign someone else for one year. That's like $3.3M or $8.2M to sign another vet.

Pretty sure the Suns only have the 4.4m exception since they were well under the cap to start free agency.


Sarver can still waive Daniels to open a roster spot. I think we all are thinking Shaq and Reed will be kept, hence the need for a spot if the 4.4 exception is used


I was jacking around with capulator - if the thunder traded for Daniels Chandler and Dudley for melo, they would save like 8m - stretching the three guys as opposed to just stretching Melo because of lower salaries for the three compared to melo Granted they might buyout and stretch melo which saves them money too

Granted they have no assets to do that but it would be away for the suns to clear three roster spots if they wanted

Suns could do Dudley and Chandler straight up for Anthony and then stretch those two. The Thunder would reduce their tax bill from $150 mil to $47mil. Question is would we want Carmelo at PF for one year and would he want to play here and waive his no trade clause?

[Gorilla Warfare]

Please god no to Melo.

[BobbieL]

Please god no to Melo.

You do realize the Suns would wave Melo- not that it’s happeming. Just would move three players

[TOO]

Please god no to Melo.

You do realize the Suns would wave Melo

He asked if the Suns would want Melo for a year...

[AtheJ415]

A lot of this discussion is pointless. Daniels does not need to be moved. We would simply waive him, and if we do that it is simply to sign Sauce, who we can fit into the min exception. The only delay here is probably to see if Bev or another PG (Collison?) gets waived, because 4.4 mil is probably about right for Bev who would want a place to start so he can get a big deal next year.

[BobbieL]

A lot of this discussion is pointless. Daniels does not need to be moved. We would simply waive him, and if we do that it is simply to sign Sauce, who we can fit into the min exception. The only delay here is probably to see if Bev or another PG (Collison?) gets waived, because 4.4 mil is probably about right for Bev who would want a place to start so he can get a big deal next year.

But will Sarver waive him? Will he eat 3.2 to keep Shaq

[Cutter]

I'll disown this franchise if they sign Melo.

[AtheJ415]

A lot of this discussion is pointless. Daniels does not need to be moved. We would simply waive him, and if we do that it is simply to sign Sauce, who we can fit into the min exception. The only delay here is probably to see if Bev or another PG (Collison?) gets waived, because 4.4 mil is probably about right for Bev who would want a place to start so he can get a big deal next year.

But will Sarver waive him? Will he eat 3.2 to keep Shaq

It's a sunk cost and thus entirely irrelevant. If you're Sarver all you care about is who is the better player for this team long-term, and if the answer is Shaq you waive him. In no scenario whatsoever unless we morph into the Divac-led Kings would you include picks or take on long-term salary to dump a guy who makes that little. You see if somebody will give you something for him. If they won't, then you waive him. It is that simple.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Reed has shown enough to guarantee his deal but ultimately no reason to make final 15 type decisions now. You don't need to be at that number for months. Hell injuries could sort that out on it's own. Look at last year the suns had all of knight, Reed, and Williams get serious injuries between right now and camp. That kind of thing happens. Go into camp and let guys like Reed, Daniels, shaq and maybe a couple of of other guys battle it out for roster spots. Competition is good at the back end of the roster. Some contracts are a sunk cost, if guys like Dudley or Chandler or Daniels don't deserve a spot just release them in October. Shaq is non guaranteed so if he doesn't win a roster spot so be it but even if a guy like Daniels or Reed gets beat well that's just how it goes. Even a guy like knight if he just sucks then **** it just move on because if he's bad he has no trade value anyway so why hold his spot. I think mcd has done a bad job at the back of the roster, it's always filled with worthless players. Even last year they should have just released Monroe instead of Jones. Sometimes you just need to cut your losses.

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[WeekapaugGroove]

A lot of this discussion is pointless. Daniels does not need to be moved. We would simply waive him, and if we do that it is simply to sign Sauce, who we can fit into the min exception. The only delay here is probably to see if Bev or another PG (Collison?) gets waived, because 4.4 mil is probably about right for Bev who would want a place to start so he can get a big deal next year.

But will Sarver waive him? Will he eat 3.2 to keep Shaq

It's a sunk cost and thus entirely irrelevant. If you're Sarver all you care about is who is the better player for this team long-term, and if the answer is Shaq you waive him. In no scenario whatsoever unless we morph into the Divac-led Kings would you include picks or take on long-term salary to dump a guy who makes that little. You see if somebody will give you something for him. If they won't, then you waive him. It is that simple.

Absolutely. They already got a 2nd round pick for taking Daniels so just cutting him is fine. As I mentioned above no reason to do it now unless another team wants him. I'm not a Daniels fan because he's a 1 skill player but since that skill is shooting I'd wait until the last second to actually cut him.

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[Hesh]

Okafor still hasn't been picked up by any team yet