WWE SmackDown Discussion II

[Spens1]

they want Charlotte to be the female Roman, despite the fact she has no business being a face. She's probably the best heel (well its her or Sasha). But yeah, lets turn our most over female face, that will work.

Road Dogg is legit the worst booker out there, he's an absolute dumbass.

[Dominator83]

Yeah, the Becky heel turn has been great so far. Stop your crying. She's pulling it off well despite what the crowd is doing. Like Stan the Man said above, she cut a great promo, didn't stop once when the crowd tried getting involved. This is pretty much a breathe of fresh air for the division.

Yes, Charlotte is more of a natural heel and pulls it off well but why not let other people give it a go? So far, Becky is f**king nailing it. She will get new music, Shin got new music when he turned heel.

Exactly. Having Charloette turn heel would be too typical. Having Becky play the heel freshens up her character some. Kinda like during the whole Sasha/Bayley thing, if one was going heeling would like to see Bayley do it just for the different look. That match is still gonna happen BTW. With the all women's ppv they're gonna need that match on the card

[Dominator83]

they want Charlotte to be the female Roman, despite the fact she has no business being a face. She's probably the best heel (well its her or Sasha). But yeah, lets turn our most over female face, that will work.

Road Dogg is legit the worst booker out there, he's an absolute dumbass.

Lynch was over as hell at the PPV BECAUSE she went heel. She hasn't been relevant in a while, now she's back in the mainstream

[Scott Hall]

they want Charlotte to be the female Roman, despite the fact she has no business being a face. She's probably the best heel (well its her or Sasha). But yeah, lets turn our most over female face, that will work.

Road Dogg is legit the worst booker out there, he's an absolute dumbass.

Lynch was over as hell at the PPV BECAUSE she went heel. She hasn't been relevant in a while, now she's back in the mainstream

Yeah I've never been interested in Becky Lynch at all her entire career I never got the appeal of her and why
she was so over with the fans and actually sided with WWE management in not pushing her but since this heel
turn she's like a top 3 most interesting character right now.

As for Charlotte just because she's a great heel do we wanna see her end up like the Miz and be a heel for 12 years
and say the same repetitive promos you can only say and do so much being a heel or face for years and years. It's
funny though Charlotte is becoming a heel to some fans because she's so dominant and clearly better then
everyone else.

Speaking of Charlotte she's kind of a hypocrite for calling Carmella a "Diva" and saying she's a diva living in a
Womens era in her promo last week when she goes out and gets like Double D breast implants and she's always
wearing tops showing those puppies off. That's a total "diva" move and doesn't improve her performance in the
ring at all as an athlete and already caused her a unnecessary injury.

[bestnamezRtaken]

That doesn't make her a diva. At all. If you recall, divas had the looks but couldn't wrestle at all. Charlotte calling Carmella a diva implied that she can't really wrestle. Charlotte has both the looks and can wrestle very well. Just because someone gets breast implants doesn't mean they are a diva. It's about how you act too and Carmella acts like a diva all the time. She plays the role very well.

[Scott Hall]

How does Carmella "act" like a Diva?

Getting Breast Implants is all about "Sex Appeal" which is what divas were all about. Charlotte didn't
need them she looked good the way she was. Charlotte actually likes that part of the business she
alluded to it the other day during the photo shoot episode with Ric Flair when they showed an old
photo shoot of her Sasha Banks and Bayley dancing around in Bikini's when they were in NXT

[spykelee]

Good photo shoot. That's a great show actually. The goldust one was... Gold

Sent from my LG-H873 using RealGM mobile app

[Ruzious]

Yeah, the Becky heel turn has been great so far. Stop your crying. She's pulling it off well despite what the crowd is doing. Like Stan the Man said above, she cut a great promo, didn't stop once when the crowd tried getting involved. This is pretty much a breathe of fresh air for the division.

Yes, Charlotte is more of a natural heel and pulls it off well but why not let other people give it a go? So far, Becky is f**king nailing it. She will get new music, Shin got new music when he turned heel.

Exactly. Having Charloette turn heel would be too typical. Having Becky play the heel freshens up her character some. Kinda like during the whole Sasha/Bayley thing, if one was going heeling would like to see Bayley do it just for the different look. That match is still gonna happen BTW. With the all women's ppv they're gonna need that match on the card

Yeah, even back when Rick was the best heel in the NWA and WCW, he was also the best face, and it was refreshing to occasionally (not frequently but occasionally) switch him. We're seeing the same thing with Charlotte, because she's not only great; she's versatile. And she appears to be able to cry on command.

[Ruzious]

How does Carmella "act" like a Diva?

Getting Breast Implants is all about "Sex Appeal" which is what divas were all about. Charlotte didn't
need them she looked good the way she was. Charlotte actually likes that part of the business she
alluded to it the other day during the photo shoot episode with Ric Flair when they showed an old
photo shoot of her Sasha Banks and Bayley dancing around in Bikini's when they were in NXT

She even calls herself a diva and says she's proud of it, so... it's hard to say she isn't one. I think Charlotte made a mistake with the implants, because she looked better and sexier without them, and shes so good in the ring that I think that alone is good enough to exempt her from the diva label.

[Scott Hall]

How does Carmella "act" like a Diva?

Getting Breast Implants is all about "Sex Appeal" which is what divas were all about. Charlotte didn't
need them she looked good the way she was. Charlotte actually likes that part of the business she
alluded to it the other day during the photo shoot episode with Ric Flair when they showed an old
photo shoot of her Sasha Banks and Bayley dancing around in Bikini's when they were in NXT

She even calls herself a diva and says she's proud of it, so... it's hard to say she isn't one. I think Charlotte made a mistake with the implants, because she looked better and sexier without them, and shes so good in the ring that I think that alone is good enough to exempt her from the diva label.

Yeah I know what she claimed in the promo I'm just trying to get a better definition of "diva". She might not be a good
wrestler but she wears a one piece in the ring doesn't have implants and doesn't usually play off her looks. That
promo with her claiming she was better looking then Charlotte and Becky was the first time I've heard her mention her
looks. I've never really seen her play off her looks she just tries to be funny and entertaining as possible.

I would actually label Carmella an entertainer more then diva...

To me Divas are Torrie Wilson, Stacy Keibler, Candice Michelle, Eve Torres, Kelly Kelly etc who were there for
only sex appeal and couldn't wrestle or talk. At least Carmella is a fantastic talker and can be wildly entertaining
and she just happens to be hot as hell and you can't teach that

[Ruzious]

How does Carmella "act" like a Diva?

Getting Breast Implants is all about "Sex Appeal" which is what divas were all about. Charlotte didn't
need them she looked good the way she was. Charlotte actually likes that part of the business she
alluded to it the other day during the photo shoot episode with Ric Flair when they showed an old
photo shoot of her Sasha Banks and Bayley dancing around in Bikini's when they were in NXT

She even calls herself a diva and says she's proud of it, so... it's hard to say she isn't one. I think Charlotte made a mistake with the implants, because she looked better and sexier without them, and shes so good in the ring that I think that alone is good enough to exempt her from the diva label.

Yeah I know what she claimed in the promo I'm just trying to get a better definition of "diva". She might not be a good
wrestler but she wears a one piece in the ring doesn't have implants and doesn't usually play off her looks. That
promo with her claiming she was better looking then Charlotte and Becky was the first time I've heard her mention her
looks. I've never really seen her play off her looks she just tries to be funny and entertaining as possible.

I would actually label Carmella an entertainer more then diva...

To me Divas are Torrie Wilson, Stacy Keibler, Candice Michelle, Eve Torres, Kelly Kelly etc who were there for
only sex appeal and couldn't wrestle or talk. At least Carmella is a fantastic talker and can be wildly entertaining
and she just happens to be hot as hell and you can't teach that

Yeah, those are those good points. Most of the diva's weren't entertainers like her. I'll buy that.

[improper]

Exactly. Having Charloette turn heel would be too typical. Having Becky play the heel freshens up her character some. Kinda like during the whole Sasha/Bayley thing, if one was going heeling would like to see Bayley do it just for the different look. That match is still gonna happen BTW. With the all women's ppv they're gonna need that match on the card

My issue is that, after seeing the crowd reaction, they are still going to try to push Becky as the heel in this feud, and it's going to backfire spectacularly because the audience doesn't want to boo her. I have no issue with her turning on Charlotte, or even adding some heel tendencies to her promos, but having her attack the audience that raucously cheered for her the night before was stupid, just was it was stupid to have Rollins do the same thing a night after he returned from injury to a massive pop. It's WWE being typically tone deaf, and all it's going to do is highlight how dumb the announcers are when they talk about how horrible Becky is and how great Charlotte is while the crowd boos the holy hell out of the good guy.

What you guys need to understand is that going against the crowd tends to make these shows worse. When the fans cheer for the heels and boo the faces, it can really screw up entire programs. We've seen this for four goddamn years now with Roman Reigns. It's impossible for any heels to get heat against him, and it's impossible for him to get cheered against any of them. As a result, it makes the whole program feel like amateur hour. NXT is so much better because, by and large, the crowd plays along. Yeah, they cheer for some heels, but you sure as hell don't see the crowd backing Ciampa or Baszler, and it's thus not exactly a surprise that those two have been involved in some of WWE's best feuds this year. When you play to the crowd, the crowd gets hot, and that makes the entire show better. When you don't, the crowd checks out and you get silence, which makes every match feel worse.

Whatever long-term plans the WWE has...who cares? They present a show in front of a live audience, and when the audience isn't buying what they're selling, they need to change their damn plans. We've seen the consequences of this with Roman, and now they're just doing it all over again with Charlotte.

What they should have obviously done here is given Becky and edge and a mean streak but kept her in the right. Charlotte slithered her way into Becky's title match and stole her win, and so Becky is pissed and wants payback. Easy story to sell with Becky as the wronged party, but instead they'll just go against the crowd BFYTW and this program will end up bombing as a result when Charlotte inevitably retains at the end of it to the sound of the crowd crapping over it.

[Dominator83]

Exactly. Having Charloette turn heel would be too typical. Having Becky play the heel freshens up her character some. Kinda like during the whole Sasha/Bayley thing, if one was going heeling would like to see Bayley do it just for the different look. That match is still gonna happen BTW. With the all women's ppv they're gonna need that match on the card

My issue is that, after seeing the crowd reaction, they are still going to try to push Becky as the heel in this feud, and it's going to backfire spectacularly because the audience doesn't want to boo her. I have no issue with her turning on Charlotte, or even adding some heel tendencies to her promos, but having her attack the audience that raucously cheered for her the night before was stupid, just was it was stupid to have Rollins do the same thing a night after he returned from injury to a massive pop. It's WWE being typically tone deaf, and all it's going to do is highlight how dumb the announcers are when they talk about how horrible Becky is and how great Charlotte is while the crowd boos the holy hell out of the good guy.

What you guys need to understand is that going against the crowd tends to make these shows worse. When the fans cheer for the heels and boo the faces, it can really screw up entire programs. We've seen this for four goddamn years now with Roman Reigns. It's impossible for any heels to get heat against him, and it's impossible for him to get cheered against any of them. As a result, it makes the whole program feel like amateur hour. NXT is so much better because, by and large, the crowd plays along. Yeah, they cheer for some heels, but you sure as hell don't see the crowd backing Ciampa or Baszler, and it's thus not exactly a surprise that those two have been involved in some of WWE's best feuds this year. When you play to the crowd, the crowd gets hot, and that makes the entire show better. When you don't, the crowd checks out and you get silence, which makes every match feel worse.

Whatever long-term plans the WWE has...who cares? They present a show in front of a live audience, and when the audience isn't buying what they're selling, they need to change their damn plans. We've seen the consequences of this with Roman, and now they're just doing it all over again with Charlotte.

What they should have obviously done here is given Becky and edge and a mean streak but kept her in the right. Charlotte slithered her way into Becky's title match and stole her win, and so Becky is pissed and wants payback. Easy story to sell with Becky as the wronged party, but instead they'll just go against the crowd BFYTW and this program will end up bombing as a result when Charlotte inevitably retains at the end of it to the sound of the crowd crapping over it.

Well the thing is, the crowd went nuts for her at the PPV BECAUSE she went heel. Nobody cared about her as a face, atleast not recently

[bestnamezRtaken]

So you are a psychic now? Or Mr. Expert-at-Booking? Just give it a chance buddy. Or stop watching and only watch NXT, lol.

[improper]

Well the thing is, the crowd went nuts for her at the PPV BECAUSE she went heel. Nobody cared about her as a face, atleast not recently

The crowd didn't cheer her because she turned heel. The crowd was firmly behind Becky the entire match. They popped because her attacking Charlotte was something that was actually interesting for her to do, whereas prior to this they've cheered and cheered for her but WWE has done jack sh*t with her.

So you are a psychic now? Or Mr. Expert-at-Booking? Just give it a chance buddy. Or stop watching and only watch NXT, lol.

I pretty much have stopped. I haven't watched Raw or Smackdown in months, just read re-caps. The only two non-NXT WWE events I've watched the past two months are Summerslam (which was fine) and Extreme Rules (which was a horrendous pile of flaming dog sh*t).

At any rate, I'm not a psychic or an expert, but I do have plenty of experience with common sense, and that's something WWE booking could use a hell of a lot more of.

[LLJ]

Charlotte isn't turning heel because the WWE has her as the female FOTC. Maybe even over Ronda.
The problem is that Charlotte isn't as over as Becky, and never was, even when Becky was much colder back in May. You could even argue that Charlotte hasn't been as over as Asuka or Naomi, who are less over than Becky but still generally liked by certain crowds more passionately than Charlotte is.

This presents the WWE with a dilemma. They want to start getting Charlotte ready for her big match with Ronda down the line, and she isn't over enough. Naturally, they do it in the worst possible way. By taking their most popular Smackdown woman (Becky) and turning her heel, and putting their 2nd most liked babyface (Asuka) in virtual cryostasis while this plays out. The WWE is at its terrible best when sabotaging the people around their "Chosen One" and if their Chosen One isn't getting the reactions they want, they kneecap the people around them in all sorts ways that ends up making things even worse.

The problem is that they couldn't just leave enough alone. Charlotte may have been 3rd most over woman on Smackdown, but she was getting solid crowd reactions and was well liked. But then they do this stupid False Hero thing with Becky for the past 2 months and then think the crowd will get on Charlotte's side when Becky turns. Instead they opened up a backlash that could well damage both women in the long run. We know Becky isn't winning this feud, so after she loses to Charlotte several times, her heat will diminish. And Charlotte still won't be any more over, in fact even less than she was before this all happened, which is not what you want on the road to WM35.

This is through no fault of the performers. Becky is doing "fine" as a heel, the problem is her fanbase is built in over 3 years and they really got excited with her recent push so she will never elicit the proper heel reactions in this feud. Charlotte is pushed like Roman (maybe even stronger considering how many title reigns she has), but is generally more likeable than Roman. The problem is that you're taking someone who has been very successful in the WWE, pushed extremely strong, and is perceived to be coming from a background of privilege and asking crowds to see her as the Good Guy, while the other women around her come from more disparate backgrounds and had to make their own names without the help of a famous father--how could you not root for them over Charlotte?

[improper]

If they're doing Rousey/Charlotte (which they probably are), wouldn't it make more sense for Charlotte to turn heel? Because someone has to be the heel in that match-up, and it's hard to see the crowd turning on Rousey in favor of Charlotte. Rousey is far more over right now than Charlotte has ever been.

[LLJ]

If they're doing Rousey/Charlotte (which they probably are), wouldn't it make more sense for Charlotte to turn heel? Because someone has to be the heel in that match-up, and it's hard to see the crowd turning on Rousey in favor of Charlotte. Rousey is far more over right now than Charlotte has ever been.

Because they want Charlotte as the female FOTC. You know she tied Trish in title reigns with this win, right? She's probably going to get her 8th against Ronda too.

They value Ronda a helluva lot as you can see at SummerSlam. But they probably (rightly) are cautious that Ronda will be around that long or this is some short high for her. So they'd rather establish Charlotte who they can build around for longer and isn't going anywhere. I'm almost sure Charlotte will be a face going into WM35, as will Ronda.

This is basically like a Roman situation with a more likeable wrestler, but still about jamming through something fans don't want.

[improper]

Because they want Charlotte as the female FOTC. You know she tied Trish in title reigns with this win, right? She's probably going to get her 8th against Ronda too.

They value Ronda a helluva lot as you can see at SummerSlam. But they probably (rightly) are cautious that Ronda will be around that long or this is some short high for her. So they'd rather establish Charlotte who they can build around for longer and isn't going anywhere. I'm almost sure Charlotte will be a face going into WM35, as will Ronda.

This is basically like a Roman situation with a more likeable wrestler, but still about jamming through something fans don't want.

It really is impressive how they just completely refuse to learn from previous mistakes.

[LLJ]

Because they want Charlotte as the female FOTC. You know she tied Trish in title reigns with this win, right? She's probably going to get her 8th against Ronda too.

They value Ronda a helluva lot as you can see at SummerSlam. But they probably (rightly) are cautious that Ronda will be around that long or this is some short high for her. So they'd rather establish Charlotte who they can build around for longer and isn't going anywhere. I'm almost sure Charlotte will be a face going into WM35, as will Ronda.

This is basically like a Roman situation with a more likeable wrestler, but still about jamming through something fans don't want.

It really is impressive how they just completely refuse to learn from previous mistakes.

The hilarious thing is the Smackdown women's division is so thin on female faces already. There's not a lot of options left. With Naomi being relegated to jobber duties, and Asuka being MIA for weeks and possibly for even longer if this Charlotte-Becky thing drags out into Evolution, there won't be many *intentional* babyfaces left for crowds to cheer on. Surprise surprise the WWE just backed themselves into a corner (again).

4 months ago I was saying Smackdown for all its problems at least had 4 popular face women who were actually all over, unlike with RAW where they have almost completely killed their babyfaces aside from Ronda. Looks like Smackdown are now playing catch up