Showdown: Defensive Prime: Lebron James or Michael Jordan

[LeBird]

It's LeBron and it isn't even close. The poll goes to show you how much media brain-washing affects perception.

[GusFring]

It's LeBron and it isn't even close. The poll goes to show you how much media brain-washing affects perception.

Yeah you're a good example as you seem pretty brainwashed. If Lebron was a better defender than MJ he probably would have the hardware and less finals losses to back it up. I know this is a prime question but have you seen LeBron defend the last two years in the playoffs? Its comical.

[Sark]

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

[mademan]

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Call em skeptical, but I think you can prove anybodies a bad defender if all you do is take clips of their worst defensive moments.

And nobody thinks 2018 Lebron is great defensively.

[mademan]

It's LeBron and it isn't even close. The poll goes to show you how much media brain-washing affects perception.

Yeah you're a good example as you seem pretty brainwashed. If Lebron was a better defender than MJ he probably would have the hardware and less finals losses to back it up. I know this is a prime question but have you seen LeBron defend the last two years in the playoffs? Its comical.

No he wouldnt.

[KTM_2813]

You've got to love a thread where:

1) People are supposed to compare players in their defensive primes, but we are shown videos of LeBron in 2014 and 2018, neither of which fall under his defensive prime.

2) We are told that supporting Jordan in this comparison makes us brainwashed.

3) We are also told that supporting LeBron in this comparison makes us brainwashed.

Love you guys, but this is YouTube comment section-level chaos.

[Amare_1_Knicks]

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Call em skeptical, but I think you can prove anybodies a bad defender if all you do is take clips of their worst defensive moments.

And nobody thinks 2018 Lebron is great defensively.

Exactly. No one thought 2018 Lebron was playing good defense(most of the time), and even in 2014, I don’t think that was one of his better defensive seasons.

But again, random clips can make anyone look bad.

[henshao]

They're not just random clips though. They're 8 and 9 minute clips from just Finals performances. Game tape kind of stuff. If you only had 9 minutes worth of defensive lapses from a whole season, then I would say sure it's invalid, but from just one series is kind of alarming, let alone two series.

The guarding 1-5 myth does need to die. Even Lebron is only human. Nobody can put up Hakeem defensive numbers and Jordan offensive numbers in the same game.

That being said Lebron is the more versatile 2-4 defender. At roughly Karl Malone's size he can bother just about anybody in the phone booth but with roughly Pippen quickness he can hang with most guys and keep them within arm's length.

Jordan however I consider the better 2-3 defender. If someone is roughly his size you can just say "sic'em, MJ" and they are going to have a bad night. I also feel he played better defense for longer. Lebron stopped playing or perhaps being able to play elite D at what, 29?

[Bidofo]

They're not just random clips though. They're 8 and 9 minute clips from just Finals performances. Game tape kind of stuff. If you only had 9 minutes worth of defensive lapses from a whole season, then I would say sure it's invalid, but from just one series is kind of alarming, let alone two series.

The same YouTube channel has a 17 minute video of "LeBron's Overrated Defense Exposed - 2016 NBA Finals". Based on a video like that and his YouTube name, I've little doubt that this channel has a bias against LeBron, and I wouldn't particularly trust his judgement.

Fwiw, I think in 2018 his defense was atrocious, but in 2017 it was fine in the playoffs until the Finals, understandably.

[Sark]

You've got to love a thread where:

1) People are supposed to compare players in their defensive primes, but we are shown videos of LeBron in 2014 and 2018, neither of which fall under his defensive prime.

2) We are told that supporting Jordan in this comparison makes us brainwashed.

3) We are also told that supporting LeBron in this comparison makes us brainwashed.

Love you guys, but this is YouTube comment section-level chaos.

2014 is not Lebron's defensive prime?

[Brooklyn_Ball33]

I also think LeBron is one of the smartest defenders of all time as well...like he's a mini-Garnett in terms of being able to read what the offense is doing and predicting what they're about to do and figuring out what he needs to do in order to blow up the play. Jordan wasn't on that level in terms of defensive IQ.

It's always incredible to me when people assert that Lebron had better defensive IQ than Jordan, when I've seen Jordan be 2 steps ahead of plays on defense and break up sets by knowing where to be perfectly much more frequently than I've seen Lebron do.

[KTM_2813]

You've got to love a thread where:

1) People are supposed to compare players in their defensive primes, but we are shown videos of LeBron in 2014 and 2018, neither of which fall under his defensive prime.

2) We are told that supporting Jordan in this comparison makes us brainwashed.

3) We are also told that supporting LeBron in this comparison makes us brainwashed.

Love you guys, but this is YouTube comment section-level chaos.

2014 is not Lebron's defensive prime?

No, I don't think so. It certainly falls under the umbrella of his general prime, but his defensive prime was probably 2009-2013. From a subjective standpoint, I remember 2014 being the first season where I was genuinely surprised if LeBron had a great defensive performance. Here are some other reference points. None are definitive but I think they start to paint a picture.

From 2009-2013: 1st Team All-Defense
2014: 2nd Team All-Defense

From 2009-2013: 2.1-3.6 BPM
2014: 0.9 BPM

Introduction to ESPN RPM, which notes that James was actually a negative during the 2014 regular season: http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/10740818/introducing-real-plus-minus