Butler has requested a trade (Part II)

[Crazy-Canuck]

Honestly, not thrilled with any package from the heat. We are giving up a top 10~15 player for youngish role players. At least guys like lavine or markannen had star potential.

[AirP.]

Miami “last” offer is Richardson + Whiteside with no FRP for Butler + Dieng.

Twolves want FRP.

Miami is not willing to give up FRP to Minnesota.
They may give FRP to SAC to take Dieng.

Let's entertain this idea. How do you guys feel about the return you're getting?

I personally would be down for this trade if Sacramento can take dieng, but we'd be really short up front -- so if i'm miami I try to find a way to get WCS included in the deal.

I don't mind wanting a first round pick, though I don't know that it's enough to hold up the trade over.

Unless Minnesota is already thinking about doing another trade down the road.

[Foye]

I would not take anything the Heat have to offer...

Send him to the Clippers for Tobias Harris


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[ifrosty13]

I would not take anything the Heat have to offer...

Send him to the Clippers for Tobias Harris


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Is that you Thibodeau?

[SO_MONEY]

Miami “last” offer is Richardson + Whiteside with no FRP for Butler + Dieng.

Twolves want FRP.

Miami is not willing to give up FRP to Minnesota.
They may give FRP to SAC to take Dieng.

"If" that is the case we will just say NO and move on. Whiteside is more negitive than Dieng and Richardson just isn't enough for a top 10-15 player.

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[Grubie024]

Those upset about the trade taking a while(it really isn't taking that long for an all-nba player being moved), you can go read how the celtics owner pushed for more assets in the Pierce/KG trade to Brooklyn, sometimes you got to be persistent on getting more. I think we all know Riley really wants a player like Butler and at some point more then likely will give in to get him.

Wyc Grousbeck: I’m going to answer the question I want you to ask, which is about the Brooklyn trade and the way that went. Because it wasn’t a disagreement, but it was an evolution. As I recall — and Danny may remember slightly differently — but as I recall, he came to me with that deal on draft day [in 2013] and said, “We’re going to get two first-round picks from Brooklyn for [Garnett, Pierce, Terry, and White], and take on some contracts.” And I said, “OK, are [the picks] unprotected?” And he said, “Yes, in fact, they are.” I said, “Great. Let’s go get a third pick.” And he goes, “Whoa, whoa, whoa,” but, “All right, I’ll ask.” And he’s not afraid to ask, he wasn’t pushing back. But he went and asked, and he said, “Unbelievable. We got a third pick. This is great.” And I said, “Great. Go get a fourth pick. I think these guys have deal fever — we’re going to keep going until they say no. I think they’ve been told by ownership to get the deal done, so let’s go back.” And Danny sort of gave me a look, like I don’t want to lose the deal by pushing too hard. Normally we try to play down the middle of the road with people, [but] I said, “Go push aggressively for a fourth pick.”

And so he went back, he came back to me and he said, “OK, you’ve got your wish. They’ve said no now … they’re not going to give us a fourth pick.” I said fine, make that fourth pick into a swap. Because swapping a pick doesn’t feel like you’re losing a pick. You still have a pick, and it’s pretty unlikely that we would be able to swap — that would mean we were better than they are. And we think they’re going to be pretty good with this trade. So just get the swap and call it a day. So we got that swap, and that swap turned into Jayson Tatum and another first-round pick — it turned into the number-one pick in [last] year’s draft [which was later traded to Philadelphia]. That’s how the Brooklyn trade evolved as I recall it, which was working together with Danny to get the best possible deal out of Brooklyn.

https://www.theringer.com/2018/5/11/17346416/bill-simmons-podcast-celtics-owner-wyc-grousbeck-brooklyn-trade

That's awesome thanks for sharing!

[KGdaBom]

Miami “last” offer is Richardson + Whiteside with no FRP for Butler + Dieng.

Twolves want FRP.

Miami is not willing to give up FRP to Minnesota.
They may give FRP to SAC to take Dieng.

Let's entertain this idea. How do you guys feel about the return you're getting?

I personally would be down for this trade if Sacramento can take dieng, but we'd be really short up front -- so if i'm miami I try to find a way to get WCS included in the deal.

Id rather have wcs than Whiteside.

very very much so.

[KGdaBom]

Take Whiteside and Richardson for Butler and Dieng and get this circus over with.

It would be nice to get the circus over with, but at the cost of a huge downgrade in talent.

[KGdaBom]

We trade Butler we aren't making the playoffs for at least five years and maybe another 13. I'm with Thibs on not trading Butler unless the value is at least reasonable. I like making the playoffs. We are stuck with Wiggins for another five years before we can upgrade if we lose Jimmy.

[AmitabhaBuddha]

Why is the narrative that our front office is messed up? It seems like the simpler narrative is that Miami doesn't have the assets to get Butler. They just don't have good assets.

Whats exciting about this offer?? None of these assets are exciting or all that useful. Have Butler sit at home until another team gets off to a slow start and gets motivated to make a trade, or he expires next summer down $50 million. Pretend like he doesn't exist. We have enough okay prospects needing minutes. Where are these players going to play?

[theGreatRC]

In a perfect world, we get Bam & Jrich, but that's not happening

We're most likely getting JRich and Whiteside, but maybe Thibs is pushing for Dragic in the deal and not Bam anymore? Then ships Teague to a third team and Dieng to Miami with Jimmy?

[shangrila]

Miami “last” offer is Richardson + Whiteside with no FRP for Butler + Dieng.

Twolves want FRP.

Miami is not willing to give up FRP to Minnesota.
They may give FRP to SAC to take Dieng.

Let's entertain this idea. How do you guys feel about the return you're getting?

I personally would be down for this trade if Sacramento can take dieng, but we'd be really short up front -- so if i'm miami I try to find a way to get WCS included in the deal.

I'd be ok with it, though I'd really push for that 1st rounder. Would help bridge the value gap a little plus the FO seems to draft well even with late picks, so there's that.

[Klomp]

Honestly, not thrilled with any package from the heat. We are giving up a top 10~15 player for youngish role players. At least guys like lavine or markannen had star potential.

Dunn had star potential? And people can say what they want about LaVine's potential and upside, but he was still coming off of ACL surgery and would miss the first half of the season. There's also the fact of Butler having one less season on his contract than when Chicago traded him.

[Loyal[]Wolf]

I would not take anything the Heat have to offer...

Send him to the Clippers for Tobias Harris


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Is that you Thibodeau?

Yes. How did you know?

[twix2500]

We trade Butler we aren't making the playoffs for at least five years and maybe another 13. I'm with Thibs on not trading Butler unless the value is at least reasonable. I like making the playoffs. We are stuck with Wiggins for another five years before we can upgrade if we lose Jimmy.

Your core is only 22 yrs old. I don't think it's a bad idea to be lotto bound one more yr. Around 24 and 25 is when players start maturing to compete on a high level. Getting one more elite prospect is not really all that bad. Might be an insurance if Wiggins is indeed a flop.

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[Klomp]

Honestly, not thrilled with any package from the heat. We are giving up a top 10~15 player for youngish role players. At least guys like lavine or markannen had star potential.

I would be more concerned about Richardson's current role player status in Miami if he were 28 years old and not 25 like he actually is.

[miwolvesfan]

Supposedly this guy is connected to the Heat players.


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Jimmy’s coming..

[KGdaBom]

We trade Butler we aren't making the playoffs for at least five years and maybe another 13. I'm with Thibs on not trading Butler unless the value is at least reasonable. I like making the playoffs. We are stuck with Wiggins for another five years before we can upgrade if we lose Jimmy.

Your core is only 22 yrs old. I don't think it's a bad idea to be lotto bound one more yr. Around 24 and 25 is when players start maturing to compete on a high level. Getting one more elite prospect is not really all that bad. Might be an insurance if Wiggins is indeed a flop.

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We won't be lotto bound one year. It will likely be another 13. Wiggins is indeed a flop. I'm sick of having Lottery picks. I hope we never earn one again, but we will likely be having them for another 13 years. That is if Butler is indeed traded.

[theGreatRC]

Richardson will have a big role here. Assuming Thibs stays past this season, he'll try to mold him into another Jimmy Butler because from what i'm hearing, Richardson plays hard and plays defense and Thibs gets Thibaboners for those kinds of players.

[KGdaBom]

In a perfect world, we get Bam & Jrich, but that's not happening

We're most likely getting JRich and Whiteside, but maybe Thibs is pushing for Dragic in the deal and not Bam anymore? Then ships Teague to a third team and Dieng to Miami with Jimmy?

I don't get Miami Trading Dragic. Tyler Johnson sucks as a PG. Why waste getting Jimmy by trading Dragic?