The LeBron Thread (merged)

laloo · Post #41 » by **laloo** » Sat Oct 6, 2018 5:09 am

Sport science of this era, take a look at tennis - federer defying age, nadal defying playing style and many more such examples from recent times. Times are changing, science is improving. There's a bigger window nowadays for the top athletes who are utterly dedicated to their craft and willing to take care of their body.

Cappy_Smurf · Post #42 » by **Cappy_Smurf** » Sun Oct 7, 2018 4:46 am

Of all the players mentioned by the OP, Karl Malone is probably the closest thing to LeBron physically. Malone was still a hell of a player at 40 before being injured.

And also, pretty much every team in the league has to worry about injuries to their key guys, regardless of age. Certainly not a reason to trade away the best player in the league after you've been striking out for several years in free agency. It's almost as if some people get so used to dealing with adversity that they don't know what to do with themselves once they finally catch a break. And yes, every team in the league would love to have been in the Laker's shoes this last off season.

DS17 · Post #43 » by **DS17** » Sun Oct 7, 2018 5:53 am

miles i think you need to chill the funk out!!!!!!!!

We got the best player in the WORLD.
Thanks.

Post #44 » by **milesfides** » Mon Oct 8, 2018 12:23 am

Can’t be the best in the world and play average defense (for two straight seasons and two straight playoffs!).

Give me elite two-way players just entering their prime such as Kawhi Leonard and Anthony Davis.

I’d rather build around them than a 34-year-old, high-mileage, one-way player. Already saw that movie starring Kobe Bryant. The reputation always outlives the man.

lakerz12 · Post #45 » by **lakerz12** » Mon Oct 8, 2018 1:23 am

If he can give us two really good years and help lure a top FA, the second two years of his contract will be worth it.

If he avoids injury somehow, he'll still be a top 10 player at worst for the entire contract.

Also, he will be a great mentor to BI, Kuzma, Ball and Hart. Hopefully.

SlimShady83 · Post #46 » by **SlimShady83** » Mon Oct 8, 2018 5:39 am

lakerz12 wrote:If he can give us two really good years and help lure a top FA, the second two years of his contract will be worth it.

If he avoids injury somehow, he'll still be a top 10 player at worst for the entire contract.

Also, he will be a great mentor to BI, Kuzma, Ball and Hart. Hopefully.

That's the whole point I think? - avoiding injury he shouldn't be playing 30 minutes a game at least limit him to back to back games or something

1 little slip and the dude will go down.

lakerz12 · Post #47 » by **lakerz12** » Mon Oct 8, 2018 5:49 am

EZ GG LOSER wrote:
lakerz12 wrote:If he can give us two really good years and help lure a top FA, the second two years of his contract will be worth it.

If he avoids injury somehow, he'll still be a top 10 player at worst for the entire contract.

Also, he will be a great mentor to BI, Kuzma, Ball and Hart. Hopefully.

That's the whole point I think? - avoiding injury he shouldn't be playing 30 minutes a game at least limit him to back to back games or something

1 little slip and the dude will go down.

He shouldn't be playing 30 minutes a game? How are they supposed to win? He has to play 30 mins...

"1 little slip and the dude will go down". What!? We're talking about one of the most durable players in the league. Even at 34. Let's not go crazy, overboard here.

Spanish_Laker · Post #48 » by **Spanish_Laker** » Mon Oct 8, 2018 8:16 pm

milesfides wrote:Can’t be the best in the world and play average defense (for two straight seasons and two straight playoffs!).

Give me elite two-way players just entering their prime such as Kawhi Leonard and Anthony Davis.

I’d rather build around them than a 34-year-old, high-mileage, one-way player. Already saw that movie starring Kobe Bryant. The reputation always outlives the man.

Both will play for the Lakers next season, the first via free agency and the second one via trade (Ingram will be gone). I think we will have a Big 3 very soon.

Post #49 » by **milesfides** » Tue Oct 23, 2018 5:43 pm

Lebron has played poor defense so far, and is a major culprit of our defensive problems. And he’s not even guarding the opponent’s best player. But he’s not helping on defense. Even on rotations, he’ll rotate once then quit. And he certainly doesn’t hustle back in transition. He’d much rather complain about calls then getting back on defense.

The other Lakers will make mistakes, but you can see their hustle. They’re fighting and playing hard.

Not Lebron though. I wonder when anybody will call him out on it. Maybe Rondo.

Sedale Threatt · Post #50 » by **Sedale Threatt** » Tue Oct 23, 2018 6:26 pm

That's definitely disappointing, although not wholly surprising given what we've seen the past few years. You can't expect him to fly around the court like he used to. But you can still play with basic effort.

Which means you can't lose track of freaking Bryn Forbes on a key defensive possession that you're being hid to help conserve your energy just because you're not paying attention. (We had a handful of those late, with Hart and obviously Ball on the Mills shot also falling asleep, that really, really hurt.)

There was one play in particular on an entry pass, I think to Aldridge, that really stood out. He actually made a great read and was in position to contest or at least help, but he instead just made a half-assed steal attempt and Aldridge scored easily.

Again, there's not much you can do about motors declining as players age. (I can think of at least one former Laker who fits that bill.) But at least be solid.

Post #51 » by **milesfides** » Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:23 pm

It hasn't been a decline, it's been a free fall from DPOY candidate to post-achilles Kobe:

Windhorst says LeBron's defense has been 'horrific'
http://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=18985218
Brian Windhorst doesn't think LeBron James should be taking shots at teammates because James is having the worst defensive season of his career.

LeBron James: The Most Unreliable Defender in the NBA
https://medium.com/@jakepaynting/lebron-james-the-most-unreliable-defender-in-the-nba-ef8bf4c819dd
The Cleveland Cavaliers don’t look like themselves this season thanks to their suspect defense, but it has been King James that has been at the forefront of their defensive woes.

One Defensive Stat Shows LeBron is Either Getting Lazy or Declining ...
https://thebiglead.com/2018/02/06/lebron-james-defense-lazy-rpm/
Feb 6, 2018 - LeBron James has fallen all the way to 31st in Defensive Real Plus-Minus, is he the real problem for the Cleveland Cavaliers?

Dr Aki · Post #52 » by **Dr Aki** » Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:44 pm

Whoever made this is savage

https://streamable.com/db3lg

Post #53 » by **milesfides** » Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:37 pm

Lebron is making us a worse defensive team than last year.

Spanish_Laker · Post #54 » by **Spanish_Laker** » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:00 pm

milesfides wrote:Lebron is making us a worse defensive team than last year.

Nah, that's Luke's weird rotations and lack of real backup PF/C.

Sedale Threatt · Post #55 » by **Sedale Threatt** » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:05 pm

Why not all of the above?

J_T · Post #56 » by **J_T** » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:23 pm

milesfides wrote:The likelihood of Lebron suffering a catastrophic injury soon is statistically almost a sure thing.

Define "sure thing". Define also "catastrophic injury". Define "soon". And while at that, I think a definition of "statistically" could be useful, as I'm pretty sure it's not the same as mine.

Post #57 » by **Kilroy** » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:28 pm

LeBron doesn't play defense... But outside of McGee and Ball, we don't have any natural defensive players. Ingram has been playing solid D, but he's not a natural defender either.
We know Rondo and Lance can play D in the playoffs, but right now, we're lacking defensive personnel to cover for LeBron if he's not going to focus on that end of the floor.
And unfortunately, we're also lacking the outside shooting he needs to be successful.

I feel like Ingram is close to hitting his outside shots... They look good, and he's using his length to shoot over people, they just aren't falling for him right now, but he had a good percentage last night, so maybe he'll be more clutch as he gets more confidence.
I'm not going to trust Balls shot until he starts hitting it regularly, because it just looks so awkward.

Point is, it's not LeBron's fault we're losing... No, he's not as dominant here as I thought he'd be, but he's doing what we need him to, for us to win. It's the rest of the guys... Including Luke and his rotations that aren't... Most importantly, Magic and Rob didn't build a viable team around him... And they need to own that going into December when we can start trading the Beasley's of the world.

iamworthy · Post #58 » by **iamworthy** » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:38 pm

Read on Twitter

?s=21

Sedale Threatt · Post #59 » by **Sedale Threatt** » Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:49 pm

Kilroy wrote:LeBron doesn't play defense... But outside of McGee and Ball, we don't have any natural defensive players. Ingram has been playing solid D, but he's not a natural defender either.
We know Rondo and Lance can play D in the playoffs, but right now, we're lacking defensive personnel to cover for LeBron if he's not going to focus on that end of the floor.
And unfortunately, we're also lacking the outside shooting he needs to be successful.

I feel like Ingram is close to hitting his outside shots... They look good, and he's using his length to shoot over people, they just aren't falling for him right now, but he had a good percentage last night, so maybe he'll be more clutch as he gets more confidence.
I'm not going to trust Balls shot until he starts hitting it regularly, because it just looks so awkward.

Point is, it's not LeBron's fault we're losing... No, he's not as dominant here as I thought he'd be, but he's doing what we need him to, for us to win. It's the rest of the guys... Including Luke and his rotations that aren't... Most importantly, Magic and Rob didn't build a viable team around him... And they need to own that going into December when we can start trading the Beasley's of the world.

I generally agree with all of that. There are a LOT of factors contributing to our poor start. And it's still early; a lot of this could be just down to lack of cohesion, which is critical for any defense.

Also, you have to have a tremendous amount of discipline to bring it on D when you're playing at such a high pace, which we clearly lack. It's so easy to get wrapped up in running running running that you start to leak out and completely lose focus on fundamental responsibilities like blocking out and the like. (Which is something the Warriors still don't get enough credit for. Then again, it helps to have Draymond Green.)

But the thing is, we were pretty damn solid last year, and while Randle was good, I don't think he was THAT good to account for the slide. (Again, still early.)

There are multiple possessions per game that even James Harden would be embarrassed about. Last night, LeBron didn't even try to get back on D after a few turnovers or bad shots and the Wolves scored easily. You just can't have that. I firmly believe that the best player sets the tone, and when everyone else sees him loafing, they're going to follow suit.

I've said this before, will say it again: At his age, with all of his responsibility on the other end, it's simply unreasonable to expect him to play like he did in his younger days.

But you can still play with good effort and awareness, and he just isn't doing that at the moment.

Sedale Threatt · Post #60 » by **Sedale Threatt** » Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:09 pm

iamworthy wrote:

Read on Twitter
?s=21

Per NBA.com, we're also 7.8 points per 100 possessions worse on D when he's not on the floor, our third best differential behind Rondo and McGee. (Conversely, he's got our third-worst offensive differential, behind McGee and Ball, who is at an abysmal minus 16.0.)

So hey, what do I know?