Whether you like it or not, our offense looks much better thanks to Donovan.

[Old Man Game]

Maybe Donovan and Presti honestly share the same warped worldview as it pertains to this roster rather than Donovan just parroting the company line formulated by the boss (Presti).

who knows. the bottom line is that the roster sucks but also the coach isn't using it optimally. fire the coach and maybe we can get one who does, but i suspect we would get the same thing just in different clothes.

sam's evasion during media day on the lack of shooting and how the thunder would deal with that was eye-opening to me. he mentioned jerami grant. maybe he was just talking sam-speak but man the way we use players and develop them lately i really think he believed what he was saying.

most fans think their coach is stupid when it comes to lineups when the team doesn't perform up to expectations.

You get another coach who isn't afraid to adjust style to personnel. If the problem persists we can conclude this is a Presti issue and he can be the next to go.

[getrichordie]

Maybe Donovan and Presti honestly share the same warped worldview as it pertains to this roster rather than Donovan just parroting the company line formulated by the boss (Presti).

who knows. the bottom line is that the roster sucks but also the coach isn't using it optimally. fire the coach and maybe we can get one who does, but i suspect we would get the same thing just in different clothes.

sam's evasion during media day on the lack of shooting and how the thunder would deal with that was eye-opening to me. he mentioned jerami grant. maybe he was just talking sam-speak but man the way we use players and develop them lately i really think he believed what he was saying.

most fans think their coach is stupid when it comes to lineups when the team doesn't perform up to expectations.

You get another coach who isn't afraid to adjust style to personnel. If the problem persists we can conclude this is a Presti issue and he can be the next to go.

Question. What style do you think best fits our current roster if not the style we are seeing now?


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[Pillendreher]

Question. What style do you think best fits our current roster if not the style we are seeing now?

I think the "motion offense" (I think it's what you dubbed it last season) we're currently seeing is best suited for the roster. I also think the "Let's trap the PnR with our Center so he is unable to deter shots near the rim" defensive strategy has been great for us.

[bondom34]

Something better than the "4 guys stand there" offense would generally help.

[getrichordie]

Question. What style do you think best fits our current roster if not the style we are seeing now?

I think the "motion offense" (I think it's what you dubbed it last season) we're currently seeing is best suited for the roster. I also think the "Let's trap the PnR with our Center so he is unable to deter shots near the rim" defensive strategy has been great for us.

Nice sarcasm. But seriously, what system would you install? Everyone wants to criticize Donovan for his offense yet none can offer up a suitable replacement.


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[bondom34]

And to clarify, using this year so far they're middle of the pack in "screen assists" which is consistent with last year. They've "improved" to the 3rd fewest passes per game. And get to the rim at the 21st ranked rate in the NBA.

[bondom34]

The excuse for the coach is literally now "you do his job because he hasn't for 3 years". It's gotten that bad.

[ThunderBolt]

Interesting thread title, “our offense looks much better thanks to Dononvan”. Better than what? The last few years of garbage that he’s apparently not responsible for?

[spearsy23]

Question. What style do you think best fits our current roster if not the style we are seeing now?

I think the "motion offense" (I think it's what you dubbed it last season) we're currently seeing is best suited for the roster. I also think the "Let's trap the PnR with our Center so he is unable to deter shots near the rim" defensive strategy has been great for us.

Nice sarcasm. But seriously, what system would you install? Everyone wants to criticize Donovan for his offense yet none can offer up a suitable replacement.


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Name four offenses without googling it. I doubt many of us could.

[Old Man Game]

who knows. the bottom line is that the roster sucks but also the coach isn't using it optimally. fire the coach and maybe we can get one who does, but i suspect we would get the same thing just in different clothes.

sam's evasion during media day on the lack of shooting and how the thunder would deal with that was eye-opening to me. he mentioned jerami grant. maybe he was just talking sam-speak but man the way we use players and develop them lately i really think he believed what he was saying.

most fans think their coach is stupid when it comes to lineups when the team doesn't perform up to expectations.

You get another coach who isn't afraid to adjust style to personnel. If the problem persists we can conclude this is a Presti issue and he can be the next to go.

Question. What style do you think best fits our current roster if not the style we are seeing now?


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How about the one where guys like Jeremi Grant, a career 30% 3pt shooter, spots up to chuck a bunch of wing threes.

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[ThunderBolt]

I think the "motion offense" (I think it's what you dubbed it last season) we're currently seeing is best suited for the roster. I also think the "Let's trap the PnR with our Center so he is unable to deter shots near the rim" defensive strategy has been great for us.

Nice sarcasm. But seriously, what system would you install? Everyone wants to criticize Donovan for his offense yet none can offer up a suitable replacement.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Name four offenses without googling it. I doubt many of us could.

Motion, triangle, four corners and west coast.You're welcome.

[Old Man Game]

The excuse for the coach is literally now "you do his job because he hasn't for 3 years". It's gotten that bad.

I too believe I should have to have taken snaps at the QB position for a D1 football team to conclude my team's QB sucks. Otherwise what authority do I have to even venture an opinion based on reading results?

[Dn4sty]

who knows. the bottom line is that the roster sucks but also the coach isn't using it optimally. fire the coach and maybe we can get one who does, but i suspect we would get the same thing just in different clothes.

sam's evasion during media day on the lack of shooting and how the thunder would deal with that was eye-opening to me. he mentioned jerami grant. maybe he was just talking sam-speak but man the way we use players and develop them lately i really think he believed what he was saying.

most fans think their coach is stupid when it comes to lineups when the team doesn't perform up to expectations.

You get another coach who isn't afraid to adjust style to personnel. If the problem persists we can conclude this is a Presti issue and he can be the next to go.

Question. What style do you think best fits our current roster if not the style we are seeing now?


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

I think the best offense for this team is going to be “do whatever you can do to get more shots than the other team.”

Basically when you are locked into a starting roster that assumes at most 2 shooters (although Russ can get on streaks), you are going to have to figure out ways to shoot more shots than the team you are playing.

The best OKC team was a suffocating defense combined with an insane offensive rebounding team, who pushed the pace.

I think that is the blueprint as long as the team in locked into this roster. You already have pieces to make parts of it work, but adding a PF who can block shots, play with pace, and shoot the 3 would be massive. Basically if you could find a Serge Ibaka type player to insert into the starting lineup, that would help immensely.

I know that doesn’t sound like an “offense” but in reality this team has to generate as many additional shots as possible in a game.

Also a huge benefit would be FT shooting.

[getrichordie]

You get another coach who isn't afraid to adjust style to personnel. If the problem persists we can conclude this is a Presti issue and he can be the next to go.

Question. What style do you think best fits our current roster if not the style we are seeing now?


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

I think the best offense for this team is going to be “do whatever you can do to get more shots than the other team.”

Basically when you are locked into a starting roster that assumes at most 2 shooters (although Russ can get on streaks), you are going to have to figure out ways to shoot more shots than the team you are playing.

The best OKC team was a suffocating defense combined with an insane offensive rebounding team, who pushed the pace.

I think that is the blueprint as long as the team in locked into this roster. You already have pieces to make parts of it work, but adding a PF who can block shots, play with pace, and shoot the 3 would be massive. Basically if you could find a Serge Ibaka type player to insert into the starting lineup, that would help immensely.

I know that doesn’t sound like an “offense” but in reality this team has to generate as many additional shots as possible in a game.

Also a huge benefit would be FT shooting.

I’m pretty sure that sums up how we’ve been playing. It’s why we were able to hang 120 despite going 9/39 from down town and committing 18 turnovers. Just have to figure out how to play that thing called defense without Roberson. Our team seems allergic to it for the most part. We did well versus Warriors, though.


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[Pillendreher]

Question. What style do you think best fits our current roster if not the style we are seeing now?


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

I think the best offense for this team is going to be “do whatever you can do to get more shots than the other team.”

Basically when you are locked into a starting roster that assumes at most 2 shooters (although Russ can get on streaks), you are going to have to figure out ways to shoot more shots than the team you are playing.

The best OKC team was a suffocating defense combined with an insane offensive rebounding team, who pushed the pace.

I think that is the blueprint as long as the team in locked into this roster. You already have pieces to make parts of it work, but adding a PF who can block shots, play with pace, and shoot the 3 would be massive. Basically if you could find a Serge Ibaka type player to insert into the starting lineup, that would help immensely.

I know that doesn’t sound like an “offense” but in reality this team has to generate as many additional shots as possible in a game.

Also a huge benefit would be FT shooting.

I’m pretty sure that sums up how we’ve been playing. It’s why we were able to hang 120 despite going 9/39 from down town and committing 18 turnovers. Just have to figure out how to play that thing called defense without Roberson. Our team seems allergic to it for the most part. We did well versus Warriors, though.


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No, that's not how an NBA offense is going to work if you want to win. You can't just build your whole offensive approach around Steven Adams grabbing offensive rebounds and the defense getting deflections. We saw how that worked out last season when the other team stopped turning the ball over. We have the Spurs on the ground and they came back because of our offense collapsed in that one game; they simply took better care of the ball and that was it.

This is last season if you substract points off turnovers per 100 possessions and 2nd chance points per 100 possessions from each team's ORtG:

1. Golden State Warriors - 85,3 ORtG adj
2. Houston Rockets - 84,6 ORtG adj
3. Cleveland Cavaliers - 84,4 ORtG adj
4. Toronto Raptors - 82,4 ORtG adj
5. New Orleans Pelicans - 81 ORtG adj
6. Minnesota Timberwolves - 80,1 ORtG adj
7. Denver Nuggets - 80 ORtG adj
8. Portland Trail Blazers - 80 ORtG adj
9. Dallas Mavericks - 79,6 ORtG adj
10. LA Clippers - 79,6 ORtG adj
----------------------------------------------------
11. Brooklyn Nets - 79,5 ORtG adj
12. Charlotte Hornets - 79,5 ORtG adj
13. Milwaukee Bucks - 79,3 ORtG adj
14. Boston Celtics - 78,5 ORtG adj
15. Utah Jazz - 78,3 ORtG adj
16. Philadelphia 76ers - 78 ORtG adj
17. Orlando Magic - 77,9 ORtG adj
18. Washington Wizards - 77,8 ORtG adj
19. Miami Heat - 77,6 ORtG adj
20. Indiana Pacers - 77,5 ORtG adj
----------------------------------------------------
21. New York Knicks - 77,2 ORtG adj
22. Chicago Bulls - 77 ORtG adj
23. Detroit Pistons - 76,5 ORtG adj
24. San Antonio Spurs - 76,1 ORtG adj
25. Los Angeles Lakers - 76 ORtG adj
26. Oklahoma City Thunder - 75,6 ORtG adj
27. Sacramento Kings - 75,2 ORtG adj
28. Phoenix Suns - 75 ORtG adj
29. Atlanta Hawks - 74,3 ORtG adj
30. Memphis Grizzlies - 73,4 ORtG adj

That is pathetic for a team that has two top 15 players on its squad. And out of those bottom 10 teams, the Spurs were the only Playoff team. All the other squads were basically tanking the **** out of the season.

[slick_watts]

That is pathetic for a team that has two top 15 players on its squad. And out of those bottom 10 teams, the Spurs were the only Playoff team. All the other squads were basically tanking the **** out of the season.

here's the problem with blaming all of this on the coach and none of this on the roster. in 2015-16 the thunder were 1st in ORB%, 4th in eFG%, and 5th in FT/FGA. and the #2 offense in the nba. this is with thousands of minutes accounted for by dion waiters, kyle singler, randy foye, nick collison, and cameron payne.

paul george might be a top 15 player, i don't know. but on offense, he's not really all that great. his value is having value on both ends and the fact that he may or may not be a top 15 player is kind of moot in this comparison of offenses. he's way worse than kevin durant.

overall, i think you're just getting a little too worked up over one thing and not considering all of the factors. billy has led an elite offense before and the thing that has changed since then is the roster has become a lot worse, and westbrook has taken center stage.

[Pillendreher]

That is pathetic for a team that has two top 15 players on its squad. And out of those bottom 10 teams, the Spurs were the only Playoff team. All the other squads were basically tanking the **** out of the season.

here's the problem with blaming all of this on the coach and none of this on the roster.

It's not my intention to ignore the roster. The lack of shooting is clearly a roster problem. The lack of offensive execution is a coaching problem.

overall, i think you're just getting a little too worked up over one thing and not considering all of the factors. billy has led an elite offense before

So what? The coach "led" them to an "elite offense", but now that they've turned into a bottom 5 offense (if you disregard the out-possessioning), it's a roster problem? You can't praise him for the team being great offensively with two top 5 offensive players on the squad (duh) and then blame it on the roster when he is unable to get the team perform at an even average rate with just one of those guys on the squad. That's just selective assigning praise and blame in a way that only makes him look good.

This is his 3rd season without Durant on the team, not his 1st. The roster isn't the best in the league and they don't need to be a top 3 team in every category, but it sure as hell needs to be much better than the crap they're putting on the floor. But alas, nothing is going to change, because the strategy is to just let them play, after all.

[slick_watts]

So what? The coach "led" them to an "elite offense", but now that they've turned into a bottom 5 offense (if you disregard the out-possessioning)

wait what? hold on. lol. we're judging billy donovan on the offense after we take the best things out of the offense? are you serious?

i wonder how our offense would look compared to all the other teams if you just took away all jumpshooting. remove it. lol. i can't get over this.

You can't praise him for the team being great offensively with two top 5 offensive players on the squad (duh) and then blame it on the roster when he is unable to get the team perform at an even average rate with just one of those guys on the squad. That's just selective assigning praise and blame in a way that only makes him look good.

again, what are you talking about. the thunder had the 7th ranked offense last season. that's a little bit better than an 'average rate'.

But alas, nothing is going to change, because the strategy is to just let them play, after all.

nothing is going to change with the thunder unless sam presti has incentive to change it.

[getrichordie]

That is pathetic for a team that has two top 15 players on its squad. And out of those bottom 10 teams, the Spurs were the only Playoff team. All the other squads were basically tanking the **** out of the season.

here's the problem with blaming all of this on the coach and none of this on the roster.

It's not my intention to ignore the roster. The lack of shooting is clearly a roster problem. The lack of offensive execution is a coaching problem.

overall, i think you're just getting a little too worked up over one thing and not considering all of the factors. billy has led an elite offense before

So what? The coach "led" them to an "elite offense", but now that they've turned into a bottom 5 offense (if you disregard the out-possessioning), it's a roster problem? You can't praise him for the team being great offensively with two top 5 offensive players on the squad (duh) and then blame it on the roster when he is unable to get the team perform at an even average rate with just one of those guys on the squad. That's just selective assigning praise and blame in a way that only makes him look good.

This is his 3rd season without Durant on the team, not his 1st. The roster isn't the best in the league and they don't need to be a top 3 team in every category, but it sure as hell needs to be much better than the crap they're putting on the floor. But alas, nothing is going to change, because the strategy is to just let them play, after all.

Welcome to not having a Durant and having a top 10 player who can only shoot mid-range jump shots and drive to the hole. Gotta have people who can shoot around him and George and Abrines isn’t enough.

I mean... name one team that has a franchise player who doesn’t have more than two shooters that can make it out of the first round. And Patterson isn’t it. He hasn’t shown he can be that guy yet.




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[Pillendreher]

So what? The coach "led" them to an "elite offense", but now that they've turned into a bottom 5 offense (if you disregard the out-possessioning)

wait what? hold on. lol. we're judging billy donovan on the offense after we take the best things out of the offense? are you serious?

i wonder how our offense would look compared to all the other teams if you just took away all jumpshooting. remove it. lol. i can't get over this.

Of course I'm serious. Drop this pathetic act of yours. You've been harping on this for a year now ("They're a bad offense based on four factors"), yet now this doesn't matter. Time and time again you've talked about this. This is really getting tiresome.

You can't praise him for the team being great offensively with two top 5 offensive players on the squad (duh) and then blame it on the roster when he is unable to get the team perform at an even average rate with just one of those guys on the squad. That's just selective assigning praise and blame in a way that only makes him look good.

again, what are you talking about. the thunder had the 7th ranked offense last season. that's a little bit better than an 'average rate'.

Again with the opportunistic heel turn.