Butler has requested a trade, the saga continues

[minimus]

There is no chance that Houston can trade 4 picks for Jimmy Butler straight up. They have to somehow match butlers salary. That pretty much means that we would be taking Gordon and filler back. If we can't keep Butler, I'm all for Gordon and 4 1st round picks and probably Nene for Butler. Gordon would be a nice fit here I think and he's the same age as Butler.

As a fascinated observer I would be pretty sure that what HOU has in mind is Knight and Chriss and the 4 first round picks which is what Woj is hinting at. This is the element of the BOS/BRK trade that always gets forgotten. BRK had made a huge mistake with Gerald Wallace (among many other things). But the trade was as much about dumping their bad debt as bringing aging vets in for a run.

I am sure the player part of that package is gross to MINN management but I am not sure MINN ownership is going to care. The '23-'25 picks could be gold.

I hope Glen Taylor understands that 4 picks is an investment. He should find someone who can make the most out of them, and clearly it must be NOT Thibs. Also we need a coach who can develop young players.

[DaKid]

There is no chance that Houston can trade 4 picks for Jimmy Butler straight up. They have to somehow match butlers salary. That pretty much means that we would be taking Gordon and filler back. If we can't keep Butler, I'm all for Gordon and 4 1st round picks and probably Nene for Butler. Gordon would be a nice fit here I think and he's the same age as Butler.

As a fascinated observer I would be pretty sure that what HOU has in mind is Knight and Chriss and the 4 first round picks which is what Woj is hinting at. This is the element of the BOS/BRK trade that always gets forgotten. BRK had made a huge mistake with Gerald Wallace (among many other things). But the trade was as much about dumping their bad debt as bringing aging vets in for a run.

I am sure the player part of that package is gross to MINN management but I am not sure MINN ownership is going to care. The '23-'25 picks could be gold.

I was under the impression that neither of them could be traded in combination with another player.

[Jedzz]

I don't want those picks & I doubt Thibs would accept that because he'd get fired before those picks were used.

I thought Taylor said that Layden is handling the trade talks?

That's what I heard, as he asked Thibs to focus on preparing the team for games now. Of course none of that matters.

[Jedzz]

I don't agree with you.
Anthony Bennett a number one pick got out of the league in 2 years.
Beasley nr2 pick was sent to China for 2 years while he is capable to be a 15-20ppg player in every team who gives him oportunity.
I don't think that teams are engaged with high drafted players.
And about Wiggins, the time he got the contract he was a 24ppg scorer while 21 yo.
That had nothing to do with his draft selection order

It's ok if we disagree on this. I agree there are some examples to be found on either side of this.

[sully00]

There is no chance that Houston can trade 4 picks for Jimmy Butler straight up. They have to somehow match butlers salary. That pretty much means that we would be taking Gordon and filler back. If we can't keep Butler, I'm all for Gordon and 4 1st round picks and probably Nene for Butler. Gordon would be a nice fit here I think and he's the same age as Butler.

As a fascinated observer I would be pretty sure that what HOU has in mind is Knight and Chriss and the 4 first round picks which is what Woj is hinting at. This is the element of the BOS/BRK trade that always gets forgotten. BRK had made a huge mistake with Gerald Wallace (among many other things). But the trade was as much about dumping their bad debt as bringing aging vets in for a run.

I am sure the player part of that package is gross to MINN management but I am not sure MINN ownership is going to care. The '23-'25 picks could be gold.

I was under the impression that neither of them could be traded in combination with another player.

A key date in Houston's pursuit of Butler could be next Wednesday, league sources told ESPN's Zach Lowe. That is the two-month anniversary of their acquisition of Brandon Knight and Marquese Chriss from Phoenix, at which point Houston can aggregate one or both of their salaries into trade packages.

[Jedzz]

If they demand Knight is in this, does it mean we are sending someone cheap like Tyus or even Rose the other way? Rose's money makes him easy to insert and his recent play might be what kicked Rockets into this idea. If they fleeced us of Rose quietly as well with this would you be angry? I might.

[KGdaBom]

That future is pretty much inevitable at this point. It's just that it would be nice to have a couple of extra picks for the re-re-re-rebuild.

Why not just pay Butler and keep building up? If Okogie works on his game and can add a decent shot to what he already has, maybe you move Wiggins for a very good vet or multiple good players from a team that's looking to rebuild. As much as we believe Wiggins is a bad value, there are some teams out there devoid of talent or desperate enough to make a move for him.

Dude, Jimmy doesn't want to be here and demanded a trade. Obviously i would prefer if Jimmy was willing to stay but he isn't and he made that incredibly clear to the whole world repeatedly.

If Jimmy stays here all season and we have some success I don't think it matters that he says he wants a trade. Come next season the Wolves can offer him $50 million more than anybody else. As long as we don't lowball him he would come back is what I believe. Of course that is a gamble.

[KGdaBom]

With the Towns supermax and Wiggins max the team is probably going to be living or dying on how well they draft one player each year. If you want to keep any kind of vet presence on the team that will take remainders of cap. Will need draft talent on cheap deals that can play.

you think Towns is gonna make an All-NBA team this year?

Good point. It doesn't look like that is going to happen.

[KGdaBom]

If they demand Knight is in this, does it mean we are sending someone cheap like Tyus or even Rose the other way? Rose's money makes him easy to insert and his recent play might be what kicked Rockets into this idea. If they fleeced us of Rose quietly as well with this would you be angry? I might.

I don't think so. Knight's contract for this year is $14,631,250. They would actually have to send about $1.7 million more in contracts to us to make the deal work.

[Macwolf527]

We see 4 1st round picks and we automatically assume that’s a good deal, but none of those picks are guaranteed stars or even starters in this league based on where Houston is expected to finish in the standings.
We have to assume that each of those picks will be at 20 or lower, with the best chance on a return on the 2023 and 2025 picks. And even those could end up being high based on what Houston does with their roster
in the future. All of that puts the focus back on the players coming from Houston in the trade. Knight and Chriss have no value to your roster and moving them will cost you picks. Gordon can opt out and resign elsewhere
in the offseason, which is why he rejected Houston’s off to resign him for $80 million over 4 years. So there’s a chance we could lose him in the off-season. Tucker is 33 years old, enough said. Houston has nothing that I
want, so the the only way this deal makes sense is to involve another team with assets that can help us. Then and only them, do those picks come into play, so 4 picks, is not really 4 picks if you’re trying to get a quality deal
done. It’s very misleading.

[ifrosty13]

Since as a Heat fan we've committed so much time to this I wanted to share my opinion.

News are coming out at the Wolves aren't interested because they'd be getting Knight and Chriss, but what I find interesting is that none of the reports seem to mention any type of protection, which leads me to assume that there was some protection as in -- Lottery protected on the last pick and would turn into a second rounder or something along those lines, hence why the Wolves didn't jump on it immediately.
I also found it interesting that Woj mentioned on ESPN that they expect the Heat to counter offer and now I wake up to this;

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Now I'm not going to sit here and say that this was a strategy to get the Heat back on the table, but if it is and it brings us closer to a solution then I'm all for it.

I still have my doubts that Minnesota would keep him West and help Houston build a monster team.

[Zeitgeister]

I REALLY don't think Thibs cares for a bunch of draft picks, I have to wonder if he suspects he'll be canned soon, certainly not enough time to make good on all of those draft picks. He definitely isn't going to trade Jimmy Butler for some assets that might help him win games 5 years from now, which he probably will not be around for.

[Note30]

Hence me saying if they get 1 or 2 lottery picks.

Anyways, in 7 years you'll be dealing with Towns having left Minnesota already with them missing the playoffs every year after Butler was traded.

That future is pretty much inevitable at this point. It's just that it would be nice to have a couple of extra picks for the re-re-re-rebuild.

Why not just pay Butler and keep building up? If Okogie works on his game and can add a decent shot to what he already has, maybe you move Wiggins for a very good vet or multiple good players from a team that's looking to rebuild. As much as we believe Wiggins is a bad value, there are some teams out there devoid of talent or desperate enough to make a move for him.

Because he's said multiple times he's not going to sign here for one.
Secondly, KAT is the cornerstone of this franchise not butler and the two despise each other
Because when you have massive contracts it is very difficult to build effectively.
Third, Butler isn't a top 5 player. He's good, but he's not LeBron, Curry, Kawhi, Durant, AD, or Giannis.
He's basically the Damian Lillard of wings (and that's coming from a guy who loves Lillard)

[wesleyt95]

There is no chance that Houston can trade 4 picks for Jimmy Butler straight up. They have to somehow match butlers salary. That pretty much means that we would be taking Gordon and filler back. If we can't keep Butler, I'm all for Gordon and 4 1st round picks and probably Nene for Butler. Gordon would be a nice fit here I think and he's the same age as Butler.

As a fascinated observer I would be pretty sure that what HOU has in mind is Knight and Chriss and the 4 first round picks which is what Woj is hinting at. This is the element of the BOS/BRK trade that always gets forgotten. BRK had made a huge mistake with Gerald Wallace (among many other things). But the trade was as much about dumping their bad debt as bringing aging vets in for a run.

I am sure the player part of that package is gross to MINN management but I am not sure MINN ownership is going to care. The '23-'25 picks could be gold.

I hope Glen Taylor understands that 4 picks is an investment. He should find someone who can make the most out of them, and clearly it must be NOT Thibs. Also we need a coach who can develop young players.

Thibs has a great eye for late first round talent, Butler was 30th overall. Also you never know the deal could backfire on Houston (Similar to BKN-BOS) with the picks ending up being teens or even lotto for a year.

[mplsfonz23]

Why not just pay Butler and keep building up? If Okogie works on his game and can add a decent shot to what he already has, maybe you move Wiggins for a very good vet or multiple good players from a team that's looking to rebuild. As much as we believe Wiggins is a bad value, there are some teams out there devoid of talent or desperate enough to make a move for him.

Dude, Jimmy doesn't want to be here and demanded a trade. Obviously i would prefer if Jimmy was willing to stay but he isn't and he made that incredibly clear to the whole world repeatedly.

If Jimmy stays here all season and we have some success I don't think it matters that he says he wants a trade. Come next season the Wolves can offer him $50 million more than anybody else. As long as we don't lowball him he would come back is what I believe. Of course that is a gamble.

I think Jimmy is gone. No matter what. He doesn't want to be here, so if he has to leave $50 million on the table, he will accept $120 million from a team of his choice. So don't be fooled, nobody would be laughing at him for that move. In fact, if he did that, he would really make the Wolves look bad. (How bad is our FO that you would be willing to give up $50 mil just to leave?)

The Houston deal gives us a little more leverage to field better offers, but they can not wait too long. Thibs knows when JB is gone he's next, so look for him to try and strong arm Layden.
We need Taylor to be a businessman now more than ever.

[Worm Guts]

Are they all supposedly Houston picks? Are they owed picks from anyone else?

[mplsfonz23]

That future is pretty much inevitable at this point. It's just that it would be nice to have a couple of extra picks for the re-re-re-rebuild.

Why not just pay Butler and keep building up? If Okogie works on his game and can add a decent shot to what he already has, maybe you move Wiggins for a very good vet or multiple good players from a team that's looking to rebuild. As much as we believe Wiggins is a bad value, there are some teams out there devoid of talent or desperate enough to make a move for him.

Because he's said multiple times he's not going to sign here for one.
Secondly, KAT is the cornerstone of this franchise not butler and the two despise each other
Because when you have massive contracts it is very difficult to build effectively.
Third, Butler isn't a top 5 player. He's good, but he's not LeBron, Curry, Kawhi, Durant, AD, or Giannis.
He's basically the Damian Lillard of wings (and that's coming from a guy who loves Lillard)

And adding 4 picks in the future helps to stabilize that. As long as you draft well. (Crossed fingers)

[CptCrunch]

Are they all supposedly Houston picks? Are they owed picks from anyone else?

Houston doesn't own any first round picks coming in.

[Worm Guts]

Are they all supposedly Houston picks? Are they owed picks from anyone else?

Houston doesn't own any first round picks coming in.

That's interesting, they'd have to be unprotected then for the Wolves to have any surety of receiving all 4 picks (the farthest out you can trade I believe is 7 years). An unprotected pick from Houston 2025 would sort of be like a lottery ticket. There's no way to know how good they will be that far in the future (Harden and Butler would be well past their primes, and Paul retired).

[minimus]

As a fascinated observer I would be pretty sure that what HOU has in mind is Knight and Chriss and the 4 first round picks which is what Woj is hinting at. This is the element of the BOS/BRK trade that always gets forgotten. BRK had made a huge mistake with Gerald Wallace (among many other things). But the trade was as much about dumping their bad debt as bringing aging vets in for a run.

I am sure the player part of that package is gross to MINN management but I am not sure MINN ownership is going to care. The '23-'25 picks could be gold.

I hope Glen Taylor understands that 4 picks is an investment. He should find someone who can make the most out of them, and clearly it must be NOT Thibs. Also we need a coach who can develop young players.

Thibs has a great eye for late first round talent, Butler was 30th overall. Also you never know the deal could backfire on Houston (Similar to BKN-BOS) with the picks ending up being teens or even lotto for a year.

I agree. I like Dunn, Patton, Okogie and KBD as prospects. I would be happy to have Thibs as HC assistant + player scout. But I don't want Thibs to run GM job and HC job.