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reality: Is/Can Jacque Jones carry(ing) us?

Is/Can Jacque Jones carry(ing) us?

 
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GYBE
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Post#21 » by GYBE » Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:54 pm

We win when Pie plays.

And again, it's about how players can improve. Pie has destroyed AAA, he just needs regular major league AB's to get accustomed to major league pitching. He is only going to get better. Plus, Pie is a GREAT defender. The difference between him and Jones is a lot bigger than Jones to Murton.

Jones is a proven product. Proven to be mediocre.

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Post#22 » by treyZz » Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:54 pm

IlliniNRG wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



If that's the case, why would you advocate Pie starting in CF? His bat is atrocious. The only reason he'd be starting is for defense.


.285 since call up & gold glove defense.

Get off Jones' sack.
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Post#23 » by RyGuy24 » Sun Aug 12, 2007 7:21 pm

Rodanlee wrote:and my love for jacque keeps growing.... i have the same feelings as you ryguy

I don't think we have the same opinions, if it's between Jones and Murton (even disregarding age), i'm taking Murton every time. I was just trying to point out that Jock isn't as bad as many people make it out to be. I just get the feeling people think he's as bad as Neifi and Macias when that's just not true.
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Post#24 » by treyZz » Sun Aug 12, 2007 7:25 pm

RyGuy24 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-


I don't think we have the same opinions, if it's between Jones and Murton (even disregarding age), i'm taking Murton every time. I was just trying to point out that Jock isn't as bad as many people make it out to be. I just get the feeling people think he's as bad as Neifi and Macias when that's just not true.


Neifi & Macias are probably the only two players I wouldn't trade Jacque for.
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Post#25 » by IlliniNRG » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:11 am

GYBE wrote:We win when Pie plays.

And again, it's about how players can improve. Pie has destroyed AAA, he just needs regular major league AB's to get accustomed to major league pitching. He is only going to get better. Plus, Pie is a GREAT defender. The difference between him and Jones is a lot bigger than Jones to Murton.

Jones is a proven product. Proven to be mediocre.

8)


And thusfar, Pie has shown to be sub-mediocre at a major league level. Whether he "just needs major league at-bats" to become a star is completely unfounded and unproveable. I hope it's true, but in a pennant race sometimes the guy who's proven to be mediocre is your best bet.

To say that we've won with Pie and not with Jones is ridiculously too small of a sample size to mean anything at all. How does Pie help the other players make better contact, or stay healthier, or the pitchers have better control? Can Pie bring Soriano and Ramirez back onto the field? Can he walk on water?

I'm not on anyone's "sack", TreyzZ, and certainly not Jones'. Although thanks for being an ass about it and making no decent argument whatsoever. Wow, Pie is batting .286 since he was last called up. In 14 at-bats. Jones is batting .425 in August (that's 40 at-bats) and you all want to bench him.

Pie is the sexier option for fans right now because he's unknown, he's younger, he's faster, he's more athletic. Unfortunately he can't hit worth a damn and Jones is crushing the ball. Which is why he's playing every day, and Pie isn't.
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Post#26 » by treyZz » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:21 am

Pie hasn't played every day since being called back up? Interesting.

Jones is no doubt hitting the ball well right now, but do you really expect him to keep this up the rest of the way?

I never said Jones should be benched.. I actually stated in another thread Soriano-Pie-Jones should be the OF the rest of the way. (When Alfonso is back; and until he cools which he will)

Pie is the sexier option, because we're tired of seeing Jones' base running blunders & piss poor outfield play.. You didn't happen to catch that play where Holliday stretched a bloop single right in front of Jones into a double today did you? Jones was about 30 feet from 2B & couldn't get the ball to Theriot on 2B on a fly. That is pathetic & there is no arguing he cannot throw & is a huge liability in RF regardless of how good of arm strength he has.

Pie is the answer in CF for a winning team - Not Jacque.
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Post#27 » by Rodanlee » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:23 am

I second that motion Illinois NRG
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Post#28 » by treyZz » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:26 am

Rodanlee wrote:I second that motion Illinois NRG


What "motion" is that?
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Post#29 » by Posey H8er » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:27 am

A Soriano-Pie-Jones outfield is speedy as well. Unlike a Murton/Jones/Derosa/Floyd mixture with bad defense. Plus Soriano-Pie-Jones all deserve to be in the lineup (You could make a case against Pie, but I want to keep him for speed, clutchness, and sexiness.)


How many players do we get when the rosters expand? And of that number, how many do you think will be hitters and pitchers?
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Post#30 » by Rodanlee » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:40 am

we get 40 I believe and i think that's september 1st... i think they'd probably bring up quite a few pitchers especially to spell relief in games where the cubs are winning by a ton or getting their asses kicked... i think they also might bring up a 3rd catcher or someone along those lines like geovany soto...


and treyZz, i second the motion to keep jones in the starting lineup instead of pie... i always thought that they should keep pie down until september or next year...
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Post#31 » by GYBE » Mon Aug 13, 2007 3:39 pm

IlliniNRG wrote:And thusfar, Pie has shown to be sub-mediocre at a major league level.


In very few AB's, yes.

Whether he "just needs major league at-bats" to become a star is completely unfounded and unproveable.


I'm not saying he's going to become a star. But there just aren't many cases of 22 year olds in AAA with nearly 1.000 OPS who just can't hit at all. He's had too much minor league success at a young age to be this bad.

To say that we've won with Pie and not with Jones is ridiculously too small of a sample size to mean anything at all. How does Pie help the other players make better contact, or stay healthier, or the pitchers have better control? Can Pie bring Soriano and Ramirez back onto the field? Can he walk on water?


Because he's a fun guy who brings a youthful energy to the clubhouse. Check out Soriano's numbers when playing with Pie...when Pie was up, it was coincidentally during his big hot streak. Since Pie being sent down, Alfonso has struggled. The team doesn't even look like they're having fun a lot of the time recently.

I'm not on anyone's "sack", TreyzZ, and certainly not Jones'. Although thanks for being an ass about it and making no decent argument whatsoever. Wow, Pie is batting .286 since he was last called up. In 14 at-bats. Jones is batting .425 in August (that's 40 at-bats) and you all want to bench him.

Pie is the sexier option for fans right now because he's unknown, he's younger, he's faster, he's more athletic. Unfortunately he can't hit worth a damn and Jones is crushing the ball. Which is why he's playing every day, and Pie isn't.


For the record, I do think Jones should keep playing until Soriano is back. By then, he'll have undoubtedly cooled off. Look, any MLB player is going to have hot streaks, and Jones was bound for a huge one since he started off so horrifically. But when he cools down again, I think Pie and Murton will be the better players.

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Post#32 » by IlliniNRG » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:06 pm

treyZz wrote:Pie hasn't played every day since being called back up? Interesting.

Jones is no doubt hitting the ball well right now, but do you really expect him to keep this up the rest of the way?

I never said Jones should be benched.. I actually stated in another thread Soriano-Pie-Jones should be the OF the rest of the way. (When Alfonso is back; and until he cools which he will)

Pie is the sexier option, because we're tired of seeing Jones' base running blunders & piss poor outfield play.. You didn't happen to catch that play where Holliday stretched a bloop single right in front of Jones into a double today did you? Jones was about 30 feet from 2B & couldn't get the ball to Theriot on 2B on a fly. That is pathetic & there is no arguing he cannot throw & is a huge liability in RF regardless of how good of arm strength he has.

Pie is the answer in CF for a winning team - Not Jacque.


I suppose the best way I could argue for Pie to play over Jones is to say that Jones sucks and we can't win with him - whether we can win with Pie out there still remains to be seen. As a fan I'd rather see Pie out there too, believe me - he's much more entertaining, and there's always the chance he'll make a great play out there. But since we're playing armchair manager, I'm saying we should play the proven guy.

At this point in time, when our offense is struggling as bad as it is, I would still argue that we should play the better hitter. Maybe once we get Ramirez and Soriano back we can afford a black hole in the lineup.

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