Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXVI

[payitforward]

...Wiz send the great small forward magician Otto The Invisible. ...

This is now my litmus test for whether a poster understands basketball.

Otto was our best player last year & our best player in 2016-17 as well. He's had a down start to the season. Then again, so has Beal -- although yes he's been a little more productive than Otto this year.

Emphasis on "a little." We are 3-9 -- just how good do you think anyone has been?

[nate33]

I think people in here are underrating Wall's trade value. He's averaging 23 and 9, shooting 40% from 3 in his last 5 games. Wall's not a bad player, we just don't have any flexibility to improve the team, and Wall's skill set doesn't match the talent on the team. Ideally we trade Wall, but 1 of Wall or Porter have to go. Beal is worth his contract, but unless we can find a way to get Porter more shot attempts we need to trade him. He doesn't come close to performing to the level of that contract. I'd rather trade Wall than Porter though.

Agreed. Very recently, the Clippers were able to trade away Blake Griffin for Tobias Harris, Avery Bradley and a 1st round pick.

I'd say Wall has roughly equivalent value, perhaps a bit more since the league is moving away from burly power forwards in favor of wiry tweener forwards who can switch onto guards. The only difficult thing is finding a team willing to take on that salary commitment. Those teams are out there, but there's not many of them. You have to catch them at the right time when they're feeling desperate.

[80sballboy]

I will drive Kieff to the airport or right down 95 if the Sixers want him as a stretch four replacement. Is a Philly guy so bye.

http://bleacherreport.com/post/washington-wizards/996822ce-0afa-48d1-8282-d16b8e42f936

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Sac send Randolph, Bjelica and Skal. A couple of 2nds.

Wiz send the great small forward magician Otto The Invisible. We cut Randolph and someone else. Follow it up with trading Morris somewhere for a protected 2nd rounder (worthless).

Wall is unmovable, Beal is too valuable to us and we wont get a good return. Sac need a SF, Otto is young and has shown that he can be a great 2nd/3rd option shooter with a high IQ. Something is going on in DC though. We save money and id LOVE to replace Morris with someone like Bjelica. Brooks is too scared to bench Morris so maybe Ernie can solve this issue with a trade. We get a young athletic big who is buried on that Sactown bench.

Porter is really good. I hope he gets traded just so he can play to his potential.

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[nate33]

I will drive Kieff to the airport or right down 95 if the Sixers want him as a stretch four replacement. Is a Philly guy so bye.

http://bleacherreport.com/post/washington-wizards/996822ce-0afa-48d1-8282-d16b8e42f936

That's good news. Hopefully, all it will take is continued bad play for the rest of November and the team might actually start to think about tanking and reloading.

Knowing Ted, though, I wouldn't expect any trades that are focused on adding talent for the future. My guess is that he would merely look to shed salary and avoid the luxtax. Something like Rivers + Oubre to Sacramento for Ben McLemore is the type of trade I'm thinking of. We would save $10.4M (which gets us completely out of the luxtax, saving Ted like $25M). Sacramento takes Oubre for a test run and gets his RFA rights if they like him.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I will drive Kieff to the airport or right down 95 if the Sixers want him as a stretch four replacement. Is a Philly guy so bye.

http://bleacherreport.com/post/washington-wizards/996822ce-0afa-48d1-8282-d16b8e42f936

That's good news. Hopefully, all it will take is continued bad play for the rest of November and the team might actually start to think about tanking and reloading.

Knowing Ted, though, I wouldn't expect any trades that are focused on adding talent for the future. My guess is that he would merely look to shed salary and avoid the luxtax. Something like Rivers + Oubre to Sacramento for Ben McLemore is the type of trade I'm thinking of. We would save $10.4M (which gets us completely out of the luxtax, saving Ted like $25M). Sacramento takes Oubre for a test run and gets his RFA rights if they like him.

This is a good idea, nate.

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[pcbothwel]

I will drive Kieff to the airport or right down 95 if the Sixers want him as a stretch four replacement. Is a Philly guy so bye.

http://bleacherreport.com/post/washington-wizards/996822ce-0afa-48d1-8282-d16b8e42f936

That's good news. Hopefully, all it will take is continued bad play for the rest of November and the team might actually start to think about tanking and reloading.

Knowing Ted, though, I wouldn't expect any trades that are focused on adding talent for the future. My guess is that he would merely look to shed salary and avoid the luxtax. Something like Rivers + Oubre to Sacramento for Ben McLemore is the type of trade I'm thinking of. We would save $10.4M (which gets us completely out of the luxtax, saving Ted like $25M). Sacramento takes Oubre for a test run and gets his RFA rights if they like him.

This is a good idea, nate.

Sent from my SM-J337T using RealGM mobile app

No chance I throw in Oubre for a Rivers - McLemore swap.... Id at least want a decent 2nd in return.

[payitforward]

A good idea!

Via https://www.spotrac.com/nba/washington-wizards/cap/ we are at $132,801,163 right now -- for 14 guys including Chasson Randle. So, $122.4m after the trade -- but... that's for 13 guys.

So we'd have to add somebody for less than $1.3m, which can be done.

[nate33]

That's good news. Hopefully, all it will take is continued bad play for the rest of November and the team might actually start to think about tanking and reloading.

Knowing Ted, though, I wouldn't expect any trades that are focused on adding talent for the future. My guess is that he would merely look to shed salary and avoid the luxtax. Something like Rivers + Oubre to Sacramento for Ben McLemore is the type of trade I'm thinking of. We would save $10.4M (which gets us completely out of the luxtax, saving Ted like $25M). Sacramento takes Oubre for a test run and gets his RFA rights if they like him.

This is a good idea, nate.

Sent from my SM-J337T using RealGM mobile app

No chance I throw in Oubre for a Rivers - McLemore swap.... Id at least want a decent 2nd in return.

They're all expiring contracts. Effectively, all we'd be trading are RFA rights to pay Oubre a market price in an offseason when a lot of money is bidding up relatively few wing players. If Ted saves $25 MILLION DOLLARS, that's a sacrifice he'd be willing to make.

[pcbothwel]

This is a good idea, nate.

Sent from my SM-J337T using RealGM mobile app

No chance I throw in Oubre for a Rivers - McLemore swap.... Id at least want a decent 2nd in return.

They're all expiring contracts. Effectively, all we'd be trading are RFA rights to pay Oubre a market price in an offseason when a lot of money is bidding up relatively few wing players. If Ted saves $25 MILLION DOLLARS, that's a sacrifice he'd be willing to make.

Nate, As bad as Rivers is McLemore is FAR worse. At the deadline, Rivers will be owed about 3M more than McLemore... I would certainly be willing to pay that difference so the Kings can upgrade in talent at Zero additional cost, but Oubre is an asset.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Double post

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Sac send Randolph, Bjelica and Skal. A couple of 2nds.

Wiz send the great small forward magician Otto The Invisible. We cut Randolph and someone else. Follow it up with trading Morris somewhere for a protected 2nd rounder (worthless).

Wall is unmovable, Beal is too valuable to us and we wont get a good return. Sac need a SF, Otto is young and has shown that he can be a great 2nd/3rd option shooter with a high IQ. Something is going on in DC though. We save money and id LOVE to replace Morris with someone like Bjelica. Brooks is too scared to bench Morris so maybe Ernie can solve this issue with a trade. We get a young athletic big who is buried on that Sactown bench.

possibility thinking. http://meaningring.com/2014/06/07/how-successful-people-think-possibility-thinking-by-john-c-maxwell/

Just about anything IS possible...

I recall the Juwan Howard trade. I also vividly remember the INJURED Gilbert Arenas trade. Wall is DEFINITELY movable. So is Beal.

[nate33]

No chance I throw in Oubre for a Rivers - McLemore swap.... Id at least want a decent 2nd in return.

They're all expiring contracts. Effectively, all we'd be trading are RFA rights to pay Oubre a market price in an offseason when a lot of money is bidding up relatively few wing players. If Ted saves $25 MILLION DOLLARS, that's a sacrifice he'd be willing to make.

Nate, As bad as Rivers is McLemore is FAR worse. At the deadline, Rivers will be owed about 3M more than McLemore... I would certainly be willing to pay that difference so the Kings can upgrade in talent at Zero additional cost, but Oubre is an asset.

It's not about the actual salary. It's about the effective salary for luxtax contribution. Rivers is owed $12.6M. McLemore is owed $5.5M. That's a $7M savings. Factoring luxtax, it's about $20M.

[Wiz99]

Do we know of any interest from Washington or Minnesota in a Wall/Butler deal? Unless we do I can't see comparing the values of the players involved.

Woj reports Wizards were 1 of 3 teams Minnie had intensive talks with.

Can you imagine they DIDN’T talk about Wall?

Of course not. There is no way this Wizards regime would entertain thoughts of a Wall-trade . I don't know what Wizards franchise you guys have been following if you think John has ever been in trade talks.

According to Woj, the Wolves asked about Beal and were summarily declined.

Which just proves the point that Wall is currently untradeable.

We’re entering a classic Wizards/Bullets phase... the one that follows the high of “Hell yah! We’ve got [fill in gap with Webber & Howard, Jordan and a #1 pick big man, Arenas and L Boogie, Wall and Beal] and with a couple moves we’re contenders!”

These **** have done it over and over and over.

[gambitx777]

Sac send Randolph, Bjelica and Skal. A couple of 2nds.

Wiz send the great small forward magician Otto The Invisible. We cut Randolph and someone else. Follow it up with trading Morris somewhere for a protected 2nd rounder (worthless).

Wall is unmovable, Beal is too valuable to us and we wont get a good return. Sac need a SF, Otto is young and has shown that he can be a great 2nd/3rd option shooter with a high IQ. Something is going on in DC though. We save money and id LOVE to replace Morris with someone like Bjelica. Brooks is too scared to bench Morris so maybe Ernie can solve this issue with a trade. We get a young athletic big who is buried on that Sactown bench.

possibility thinking. http://meaningring.com/2014/06/07/how-successful-people-think-possibility-thinking-by-john-c-maxwell/

Just about anything IS possible...

I recall the Juwan Howard trade. I also vividly remember the INJURED Gilbert Arenas trade. Wall is DEFINITELY movable. So is Beal.

Wall to the Jazz for rubio, grayson allen, and tony bradley, maybe a second
Makes sense or them, they are not a big market they get a all star locked in for years in a position of need and they are not losing anything right now. this trade makes them better, <wall is worlds better than rubio, and bradley and allen are not cracking that line up right now or doing anything that the team will miss.
then do
Porter to the kings, for randolph, maclemore, giles, and skal. Randolph and maclemore don't play, Skal is healthy and out of the rotation, and giles is barely playing for the team.
Use that second to move mahinmi if possible and cut that contract that we get in return. Cut randolph, MaClemore, Jason Smith, and Morris.
Eat that money move alone.
Rubio/rivers/Sato
Beal/Allen/Mcrae
Obure/Brown/Robinson
Giles/Skal/Green
Howard/bradley/Bryant
You have mahinmi if you can't get rid of him but You should be able too.
Thats a cheap young team without cap issues, we can resign every one we want too and have some room to go out next off season. Go all in on beal as the leader of the team.

[dangermouse]

...Wiz send the great small forward magician Otto The Invisible. ...

This is now my litmus test for whether a poster understands basketball.

Otto was our best player last year & our best player in 2016-17 as well. He's had a down start to the season. Then again, so has Beal -- although yes he's been a little more productive than Otto this year.

Emphasis on "a little." We are 3-9 -- just how good do you think anyone has been?

Its like you didnt read the rest of my post or something.

16-17 Otto was great but that player is vapor now. He's a ghost. 13 games in and he's done nothing. Not in our losses and not in our few wins. He is probably the second worst defender in the starting lineup, maybe even the worst, when he used to be one of the best. Is he injured? Then he should rest. Is it the coaching system or something else? Then we should move him now because lord knows Brooks isnt going to make any adjustments or change anything, and we're stuck with Brooks.

[nate33]

Wall to the Jazz for rubio, grayson allen, and tony bradley, maybe a second
Makes sense or them, they are not a big market they get a all star locked in for years in a position of need and they are not losing anything right now. this trade makes them better, <wall is worlds better than rubio, and bradley and allen are not cracking that line up right now or doing anything that the team will miss.
then do
Porter to the kings, for randolph, maclemore, giles, and skal. Randolph and maclemore don't play, Skal is healthy and out of the rotation, and giles is barely playing for the team.
Use that second to move mahinmi if possible and cut that contract that we get in return. Cut randolph, MaClemore, Jason Smith, and Morris.
Eat that money move alone.
Rubio/rivers/Sato
Beal/Allen/Mcrae
Obure/Brown/Robinson
Giles/Skal/Green
Howard/bradley/Bryant
You have mahinmi if you can't get rid of him but You should be able too.
Thats a cheap young team without cap issues, we can resign every one we want too and have some room to go out next off season. Go all in on beal as the leader of the team.

The Jazz have always been a prudent, cost-conscious team. I don't see them swapping Rubio for Wall. I'm also not thrilled with the return on the deal for us. Instead of a solid player like Rubio returned in a Wall trade, I want crappy players and a pick. That way, we would tank this year and earn ourselves a high lotto pick as well. I might still do your deal, but I really like my Phoenix trade (where we get Ryan Anderson and a pick) better.

I wouldn't try to dump Porter right now. With Wall gone, there is no pressure to unload additional salary. We'd have all the luxtax room we need to retain anyone we want. All dumping Porter would do is give us a small amount of cap room in a year when there is way too much money chasing not enough talent. Besides, trading Porter right now would be selling low. The Porter of the last two seasons was a very good player and arguably worth that contract (or at least close to it). I'd at least wait until Porter gets over whatever injury is bothering him before shopping him.

Mahinmi is still unmovable unless we attach a 1st round pick to him. With Wall gone, moving him is no longer necessary. I'd just ride out that contract. I'm not interested in the free agency market in 2019 anyhow. Better to wait until 2020 (which is why I'd advocate trading Wall for Ryan Anderson's contract, which also expires in 2020).

[dangermouse]

I will drive Kieff to the airport or right down 95 if the Sixers want him as a stretch four replacement. Is a Philly guy so bye.

http://bleacherreport.com/post/washington-wizards/996822ce-0afa-48d1-8282-d16b8e42f936

That'd be fantastic, but what do they have left to send back? I like Korkmaz

[Ruzious]

I will drive Kieff to the airport or right down 95 if the Sixers want him as a stretch four replacement. Is a Philly guy so bye.

http://bleacherreport.com/post/washington-wizards/996822ce-0afa-48d1-8282-d16b8e42f936

Philly does seem to have a hole at PF - since trading Saric. Going with the Wilson Chandler/Mike Muscala combo seems risky. But having Ben Simmons means you can do all kinds of things to match up. I could see them wanting an enforcer type - like Morris - to protect their stars.

[dckingsfan]

...Wiz send the great small forward magician Otto The Invisible. ...

This is now my litmus test for whether a poster understands basketball.

Otto was our best player last year & our best player in 2016-17 as well. He's had a down start to the season. Then again, so has Beal -- although yes he's been a little more productive than Otto this year.

Emphasis on "a little." We are 3-9 -- just how good do you think anyone has been?

Its like you didnt read the rest of my post or something.

16-17 Otto was great but that player is vapor now. He's a ghost. 13 games in and he's done nothing. Not in our losses and not in our few wins. He is probably the second worst defender in the starting lineup, maybe even the worst, when he used to be one of the best. Is he injured? Then he should rest. Is it the coaching system or something else? Then we should move him now because lord knows Brooks isnt going to make any adjustments or change anything, and we're stuck with Brooks.

And Porter's usage is back down to 15%. His minutes are down to 28 per game as well.

Remember last year when he would be the focus of the second unit. Now that is Rivers/Green.

So, it's the coach and the system - IMO. So, yes. Move him and Satoransky as well... Thinking that the Spurs would take them but they don't have the assets. Where is Millie anyway - we won two.

Okay, Sacramento - we would still get 7th or 8th this season (give how bad the east is and Shumpert would actually be a better fit with Rivers, and then reset next year with cap space take of about $73M):
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ya7zvfuc

Guess we could add Frank Mason as well... but he wouldn't play, just saying. So probably Jackson instead of Mason...