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Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings

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Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#1 » by bwgood77 » Wed Dec 5, 2018 4:19 am

Standings

Raw Scores

How it works:
Spoiler:
Anyone can vote for the 3-2-1 (including other fans from other forums) but you can only vote for the Suns players (or coach).

3 votes to who you think was a the best Suns player.
2 for the second best
and 1 for the 3rd best.

**EDIT: as of January something-or-other 2017, you can now distribute votes for the Nashty and Cactus however you please. You have a total of 6 votes to give out, but now you have the freedom to do what you want with those 6. The only condition which applies is no more than 3 votes can be given to one player in either award. **

In the event of a Suns loss, you are also encouraged to vote for the Cactus of the game:

-3 votes for the player most responsible for the loss
-2 votes for the second most responsible
-1 for the third most responsible

Any votes with more than 3 players listed and not in the required format will not count. Voting will close before the start of the next Suns game.

After the thread closes, the votes will be tallied. The highest scoring total Sun gets 3 points, the next 2, and the third gets 1 point towards their season total. In the event of a tie in a count for a game, if the result of the game is a Suns win, a maximum of 4 players will be awarded points. A tie in the event of a loss will only result in a maximum of 3 players getting awarded points.

The player with the highest total at season's end wins the award!

The same applies for the Cactus of the Year, although of course the lowest tally at year's end takes it.

10+1 Game update wooooooo

bat, where u been?
Making a new scoring system that automatically pushes all y'all scores into the spreadsheet

Why'd it take so long for an update?
I put it down to growing pains, trying to make this thing work better

How does it work?
It tallies everyone's scores and then normalizes them. From there it distributes the scores for the game based on these normalized vote tallies.

Has anything changed in the way I vote?
Not really. Of course, the more standard and consistent the voting style, the better for me to handle. It's still in development so I will begin to handle less standard styles of voting with time.

What are the scoring rules?
Same as usual. We've stopped allowing voting for coach in the official vote as it messes with the consistency of the scoring system. As has always been the case - you cannot give any player in either award a vote bigger than +/-3. If you do, I just cap it at +/- 3.

However you'll now see in the spreadsheet that players are getting decimal scores and now some players are getting scores higher than 3. That's due to the game scaling. The standard score total to hand out is 6. In wins, that goes up, in losses that goes down. And vice versa for the Cactus.

HOWEVER this doesn't affect they way you vote for players- you still get only 6 votes in either award. The scaling comes after the votes are tallied.

Officially, the scores being given out in either award are calculated like this:

6 + 2*(margin/30)

Josh Jackson got a -4.1, whaaaaaaaat?
-6 + 2*-(30/30) = -8
Suns lost by 30 so there were 8 Cactii to give out. Josh just happened to get a majority of them.

How accurate is this new app?
As accurate as a human doing it. Because well, it's still a manual process. I confirm/edit each post's votes to make sure they are correct. It just happens to make things much quicker.


+3 Melton
+2 Holmes
+1 Bender

-2 Ayton
-2 Jackson
-1 Okobo
-1 Crawford
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#2 » by Kdab » Wed Dec 5, 2018 4:32 am

+3 Melton
+2 Holmes
+1 Daniels

-3 Ayton
-2 Jackson
-1 Crawford
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#3 » by Saberestar » Wed Dec 5, 2018 9:07 am

+2 Ariza
+1 Melton
+1 Holmes

-1 Ayton
-1 Okobo
-1 Jackson
-1 Bridges
-1 Crawford
-1 Anderson
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#4 » by m1chal » Wed Dec 5, 2018 10:05 am

Saberestar wrote:+2 Ariza
+1 Melton
+1 Holmes

-1 Ayton
-1 Okobo
-1 Jackson
-1 Bridges
-1 Crawford
-1 Anderson


This seems about right.
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#5 » by bigfoot » Wed Dec 5, 2018 1:46 pm

Nobody deserves a plus for this game ... that was the most pathetic display of basketball in the first half I think I have ever seen and it is a disgrace these guys even collected a paycheck for that **** show.

-3 Ayton ... mental midget
-3 Jackson ... high volume low IQ chucker
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#6 » by bwgood77 » Wed Dec 5, 2018 1:53 pm

bigfoot wrote:Nobody deserves a plus for this game ... that was the most pathetic display of basketball in the first half I think I have ever seen and it is a disgrace these guys even collected a paycheck for that **** show.


Not sure why Melton doesn't. He had shot 33% coming into that game and shot 75% overall and from 3 with 5 assists and a +24.
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#7 » by ImNotMcDiSwear » Wed Dec 5, 2018 3:54 pm

+3 Melton
+2 Holmes
+1 Daniels

-3 Okobo
-2 Bridges
-1 Jackson
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#8 » by lilfishi22 » Thu Dec 6, 2018 1:04 am

bwgood77 wrote:+3 Melton
+2 Holmes
+1 Bender

-2 Ayton
-2 Jackson
-1 Okobo
-1 Crawford

Looks about right to me
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#9 » by GoodBehavior » Thu Dec 6, 2018 7:25 pm

lilfishi22 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:+3 Melton
+2 Holmes
+1 Bender

-2 Ayton
-2 Jackson
-1 Okobo
-1 Crawford

Looks about right to me


Okobo was the worse player on the team. When the starting point guard has a grand total of 1 assist, 2 to, 5pf, and couldn't keep guard anyone in 26 minutes (worse +/- at -22), that's a problem. He's a -2/-3. At worst, it's a three way tie between Okobo/Ayton/Jackson for the least impact player.
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#10 » by bwgood77 » Thu Dec 6, 2018 8:20 pm

GoodBehavior wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:+3 Melton
+2 Holmes
+1 Bender

-2 Ayton
-2 Jackson
-1 Okobo
-1 Crawford

Looks about right to me


Okobo was the worse player on the team. When the starting point guard has a grand total of 1 assist, 2 to, 5pf, and couldn't keep guard anyone in 26 minutes (worse +/- at -22), that's a problem. He's a -2/-3. At worst, it's a three way tie between Okobo/Ayton/Jackson for the least impact player.


Okobo wasn't good, thus the minus, but I don't mind the fouls because he was trying to defend unlike Ayton who seemed to watch and got zero fouls (while Holmes fouled out trying to stop people inside). The +/- of all starters was bad. Jackson had 4 turnovers.

But part of this is relative to expectations. Okobo started for the first time, after never going against starters. I never was too harsh in the Cactus votes early for Jackson last year or for Ayton to start the year because they are rookies getting going, but at this point I expect more after starting and playing as much as they have.
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#11 » by lilfishi22 » Thu Dec 6, 2018 10:27 pm

GoodBehavior wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:+3 Melton
+2 Holmes
+1 Bender

-2 Ayton
-2 Jackson
-1 Okobo
-1 Crawford

Looks about right to me


Okobo was the worse player on the team. When the starting point guard has a grand total of 1 assist, 2 to, 5pf, and couldn't keep guard anyone in 26 minutes (worse +/- at -22), that's a problem. He's a -2/-3. At worst, it's a three way tie between Okobo/Ayton/Jackson for the least impact player.

But he's not a starting PG. I don't expect starting PG production or impact from him. I don't fault him for not being ready but due to circumstances he's been trusted into a starting spot.
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#12 » by GoodBehavior » Thu Dec 6, 2018 10:55 pm

lilfishi22 wrote:
GoodBehavior wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:Looks about right to me


Okobo was the worse player on the team. When the starting point guard has a grand total of 1 assist, 2 to, 5pf, and couldn't keep guard anyone in 26 minutes (worse +/- at -22), that's a problem. He's a -2/-3. At worst, it's a three way tie between Okobo/Ayton/Jackson for the least impact player.

But he's not a starting PG. I don't expect starting PG production or impact from him. I don't fault him for not being ready but due to circumstances he's been trusted into a starting spot.


I actually like Okobo. I think he's going to be fine in the long run, just like Ayton. And just like Mikal. All three rookies had a rough game. It is what it is. This is not a knee jerk reaction to a bad game, he simply had a bad game as an observation. It doesn't matter if he started the game or came from the bench. Whether he's classified as a SG or PG, doesn't matter to me. He looked lost on both ends of the court. Fox and the Kings attacked him seemingly every time and he was non-existent on the offensive end.
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Re: Nashty & Cactus: Game 24 vs the Kings 

Post#13 » by lilfishi22 » Thu Dec 6, 2018 11:17 pm

GoodBehavior wrote:
lilfishi22 wrote:
GoodBehavior wrote:
Okobo was the worse player on the team. When the starting point guard has a grand total of 1 assist, 2 to, 5pf, and couldn't keep guard anyone in 26 minutes (worse +/- at -22), that's a problem. He's a -2/-3. At worst, it's a three way tie between Okobo/Ayton/Jackson for the least impact player.

But he's not a starting PG. I don't expect starting PG production or impact from him. I don't fault him for not being ready but due to circumstances he's been trusted into a starting spot.


I actually like Okobo. I think he's going to be fine in the long run, just like Ayton. And just like Mikal. All three rookies had a rough game. It is what it is. This is not a knee jerk reaction to a bad game, he simply had a bad game as an observation. It doesn't matter if he started the game or came from the bench. Whether he's classified as a SG or PG, doesn't matter to me. He looked lost on both ends of the court. Fox and the Kings attacked him seemingly every time and he was non-existent on the offensive end.

But that's why guys like Holmes get +1's some times even with low rebound or low scoring games, because he palys with effort and that's the expectation from a guy coming off the bench who's not particularly skilled. Maybe you have a different scoring criteria but for me, it's all about what I expect from the player. It's why I'm sometimes particularly harsh on Ayton, Booker or even TJ (more so last season) even when they have neutral games because expectations of them is higher.

I never thought Okobo or even Melton should be a starting PG on a lottery team at this stage in his development but he is because of what we are so I don't judge him like he's a worthy starting caliber PG who put up 6/3/1 with the worst +/- on the team.

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