2018-2019 OKC Thunder Regular Season Pt 1: A Renewed Hope

[Dn4sty]

I'm just glad I'm not the only Porter fan.

I just wish he wasn’t making a gazillon dollars a year

[slick_watts]

I'm just glad I'm not the only Porter fan.

porter is a slightly worse dre defensively with a 40%+ three point and elite mid-range jump shot. he would be perfect here and worth that salary especially since he can play pf. westbrook-porter-george-grant-adams would be crazy, but there's no way we could get him and keep adams-- and even if we traded adams the logistics are complicated by his trade kicker.

neither scenario is realistic during this season. these are summer trades for the thunder imo if they were to happen.

[bondom34]

I'm just glad I'm not the only Porter fan.

I just wish he wasn’t making a gazillon dollars a year

I'm just glad I'm not the only Porter fan.

porter is a slightly worse dre defensively with a 40%+ three point and elite mid-range jump shot. he would be perfect here and worth that salary especially since he can play pf. westbrook-porter-george-grant-adams would be crazy, but there's no way we could get him and keep adams-- and even if we traded adams the logistics are complicated by his trade kicker.

neither scenario is realistic during this season. these are summer trades for the thunder imo if they were to happen.

Agree with both of you, and when I looked at their lineups last year I think he may be more impactful than at least Wall if not Beal last year too. I think he's underrated because of the contract but the fit is like a glove.

[Dn4sty]

Moving a different direction from Beal, how would you guys feel about kicking the tires on Ntilikina?

[alessandrux]

Moving a different direction from Beal, how would you guys feel about kicking the tires on Ntilikina?

Depends on what we would have to give up for him.
Right now I would say he is overpaid and won't help us in the short term.
We are also not good at developpping shots/transform non-shooters into (at least decent) shooters. Therefore, and because I wish the best to all players and hope they all fulfill their potential I don't see that fullfillment happen here.

I think there are many teams who could develop him better and can handle his salary, so unless we want to get rid of Robersons contract (or Patterson), of whom and his health I still have high hopes, we are a bad fit.

[spearsy23]

Moving a different direction from Beal, how would you guys feel about kicking the tires on Ntilikina?

I stan for Frank. He's in the completely wrong situation for himself, but put him next to some high usage guys and let him play defense and make the right play and he'll be a solid player for you.

[Dn4sty]

Moving a different direction from Beal, how would you guys feel about kicking the tires on Ntilikina?

I stan for Frank. He's in the completely wrong situation for himself, but put him next to some high usage guys and let him play defense and make the right play and he'll be a solid player for you.

I am of a similar mindset. I also want to sneakily attempt to build out a young core to avoid a major tear down tank as Russ and company age out.

[Dn4sty]

Moving a different direction from Beal, how would you guys feel about kicking the tires on Ntilikina?

Depends on what we would have to give up for him.
Right now I would say he is overpaid and won't help us in the short term.
We are also not good at developpping shots/transform non-shooters into (at least decent) shooters. Therefore, and because I wish the best to all players and hope they all fulfill their potential I don't see that fullfillment happen here.

I think there are many teams who could develop him better and can handle his salary, so unless we want to get rid of Robersons contract (or Patterson), of whom and his health I still have high hopes, we are a bad fit.

Knicks seem like that they are done with him. I’m not so sure next summer they wouldn’t just let OKC have him (fits into Melo TPE).

I think he could play a lot like Diallo, but be more of a facilitator and create.

Plus I’m all for adding players who have the ability to be plus defenders.

[spearsy23]

Moving a different direction from Beal, how would you guys feel about kicking the tires on Ntilikina?

I stan for Frank. He's in the completely wrong situation for himself, but put him next to some high usage guys and let him play defense and make the right play and he'll be a solid player for you.

I am of a similar mindset. I also want to sneakily attempt to build out a young core to avoid a major tear down tank as Russ and company age out.

All that said, Phoenix should offer Josh Jackson for him. It's a fair deal and he really fits what you'd want at point next to Booker.

[getrichordie]

Look at what Paul George can do with Westbrook. Imagine Abrines standing wide open for 3 or Ferguson. Except it’s not Abrines or Ferguson, it’s Bradley Beal. Don’t think it would be hard to incorporate him into offense. He ran motion offense with success in Florida with Donovan IIRC.


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[spearsy23]

Look at what Paul George can do with Westbrook. Imagine Abrines standing wide open for 3 or Ferguson. Except it’s not Abrines or Ferguson, it’s Bradley Beal. Don’t think it would be hard to incorporate him into offense. He ran motion offense with success in Florida with Donovan IIRC.


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Obviously Beal could be successful with Westbrook. The argument, and I'm not sure rather I agree or not, is that you'll reach a point of diminishing returns where none of the three guys are being fully maximized because there's so much overlap in skill set. There's none of those concerns with Adams (or Porter) because the things he does compliment Russ/PG. Nobody is arguing that Beal wouldn't be able to put up good numbers, but those numbers may be hollow if they come at the expense of westbrook's playmaking and George's shooting. Beal is not Klay, you can't relegate him to a role that asks him to get his shots without ever putting the ball on the floor, and if you're going to then why wouldn't you prefer Porter who can do that and play excellent defense at the same time?

[ThunderBolt]

I stan for Frank. He's in the completely wrong situation for himself, but put him next to some high usage guys and let him play defense and make the right play and he'll be a solid player for you.

I am of a similar mindset. I also want to sneakily attempt to build out a young core to avoid a major tear down tank as Russ and company age out.

All that said, Phoenix should offer Josh Jackson for him. It's a fair deal and he really fits what you'd want at point next to Booker.

I would absolutely take a shot on him. He’s only 20 years old so I can’t imagine the Knicks would just dump him. This Knicks front office isn’t a dumb as some of the previous versions. I don’t really see any way we could get him.

What position is he best suited for? He was drafted as a pg but the knicks have used him at the 2 experimentally this season.

[Pillendreher]

League average in TS% is 55.7 btw. We can't just have four guys who are even close to league average when it comes to shooting efficiency. Especially our bench guys just need to be way better than this. Abrines and Patterson take way too many 3s to be this inefficient.

[spearsy23]

I am of a similar mindset. I also want to sneakily attempt to build out a young core to avoid a major tear down tank as Russ and company age out.

All that said, Phoenix should offer Josh Jackson for him. It's a fair deal and he really fits what you'd want at point next to Booker.

I would absolutely take a shot on him. He’s only 20 years old so I can’t imagine the Knicks would just dump him. This Knicks front office isn’t a dumb as some of the previous versions. I don’t really see any way we could get him.

What position is he best suited for? He was drafted as a pg but the knicks have used him at the 2 experimentally this season.

I'd want him as a point guard defensively next to a high usage 2. You don't want him as your primary creator on offense.

[ThunderBolt]

All that said, Phoenix should offer Josh Jackson for him. It's a fair deal and he really fits what you'd want at point next to Booker.

I would absolutely take a shot on him. He’s only 20 years old so I can’t imagine the Knicks would just dump him. This Knicks front office isn’t a dumb as some of the previous versions. I don’t really see any way we could get him.

What position is he best suited for? He was drafted as a pg but the knicks have used him at the 2 experimentally this season.

I'd want him as a point guard defensively next to a high usage 2. You don't want him as your primary creator on offense.

What’s his value right now? He’s been pretty atrocious offensively but I don’t see why the Knicks wouldn’t keep him around unless they can get a frp or other young talent. I don’t see how we could get him without giving up Ferguson or Diallo. That doesn’t really seem worth it.

[slick_watts]

i don't know much about frank ntilikina but everything i can see does not look promising.

[Pillendreher]

Since we talked about this a couple of weeks ago: I was listening to the latest TrueHoop podcast earlier and they touched briefly on the comeback win vs the Nets. So fater praising George, Windhorst immediately - and without any prompt - went in on Russ once again. Lamented that George didn't touch the ball twice in the last 90 seocnds. And he also said that Donovan called timeout before the last shot and that "everybody knew why", ie "RUSSELL WESTBROOK BAD".

Russ took two shots in the 4th quarter. One was the horrible 3 with 3 minutes to go and the other one was the layup attempt with 30 seconds to go where he got fouled, but didn't get the call. That's it. He had 5 assists, no turnovers and a USG rate of below 9 % in the 4th quarter comeback. Meanwhile George took 2 out of 3 total shots when on the floor in the 4th quarter. But instead of saying that Westbrook realized that he needed to step back and made sure his team was getting what it needed at that moment, he - once again- just trashes him. When asked by MacMahon about the amount of shots by Westbrook in the 4th quarter, Windhorst admitted that he didn't know. Imagine my shock.

Color me unsurprised as well with regard to the validity of the "George didn't touch the ball"-bib. This is the last two minutes:

1. Harris misses a layup. George grabs the rebound, drives hard to the rim, probably gets fouled by Allen and still makes the shot. 1 point game with 1:44 to go.
2.Crabbe steps out of bounds. Russ brings the ball up the floor, Ferguson sets a screen for George and Russ passes him the ball with 20 seconds on the shotclock. Grant sets a screen for George, George misses the pull-up 3. Schröder gets the offensive rebound, passes to Westbrook with 11 seconds on the shotclock. Russ passes to George at the 3pt line with 6 seconds to go. George misses a pull up 2, Westbrook tries to secure the rebound but fails.
3.Thunder force a miss, Grant grabs the rebound and pushes it up the floor. Passes to Westbrook who then takes the ball to the rim -as already mentioned - and misses.
4.The Nets miss and the rest is history.

He's just making **** up. The layup attempt was probably not the best shot the team was going to get, but Russell Westbrook attacking the rim one on one against a guy that can't guard him is not bad enough to trash Russ for it. He should have gone to the FT line, but didn't. Tough luck.

Oh and regarding the timeout - this is what the situation on the court looked like:



It's not like we had a clear cut fastbreak opportunity. It was a very sensible decision by Donovan because they did not have a good opportunity to score in a scramble like that. Instead of mentioning that, it's "I need to get my shot in"-time yet again. Like if Dennis Schröder had the ball, Donovan would have been absolutely happy with whatever shot they take.

He's biased and he knows it. He even said people could call him a cynical son of a bitch. This is not cynicism though; this is just biased hating while cloaking oneself in this aura of credibilty.

[ThunderBolt]

Windhorst is still mad that George signed his extension. He was genuinely upset when it happened.

As far as local media go, if you want an objective opinion I prefer Erik Horne. The new girl Maddie Lee seems decent. For talk radio I’m pretty impressed with Dusty Dvoracek. He’s not a basketball guy but has pretty levelheaded takes and seems to understand the game more than just ball watching.

[getrichordie]

Look at what Paul George can do with Westbrook. Imagine Abrines standing wide open for 3 or Ferguson. Except it’s not Abrines or Ferguson, it’s Bradley Beal. Don’t think it would be hard to incorporate him into offense. He ran motion offense with success in Florida with Donovan IIRC.


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Obviously Beal could be successful with Westbrook. The argument, and I'm not sure rather I agree or not, is that you'll reach a point of diminishing returns where none of the three guys are being fully maximized because there's so much overlap in skill set. There's none of those concerns with Adams (or Porter) because the things he does compliment Russ/PG. Nobody is arguing that Beal wouldn't be able to put up good numbers, but those numbers may be hollow if they come at the expense of westbrook's playmaking and George's shooting. Beal is not Klay, you can't relegate him to a role that asks him to get his shots without ever putting the ball on the floor, and if you're going to then why wouldn't you prefer Porter who can do that and play excellent defense at the same time?

I highly disagree with that there is a detrimental overlap in skill set. Westbrook has been great this year at getting everyone involved. If anything, adding Beal maximizes Westbrook’s strengths and minimize his weaknesses on offense.

Defenses would have to pick their poison.

Yeah, I definitely reject the notion that Beal wouldn’t bolster our offense and improve it significantly.

At the very worst, you would just stagger Beal and Westbrook’s minutes on floor. Is that a bad thing?


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[bondom34]

I've always liked Horne. Seems pretty reasonable as far as most team's local guys go.