The barea affect and ROY, who wins?

[sunsbg]

And that’s exactly the problem when you’re taking C over creating wing. Second can create shots for himself and others, first needs another star to create for him.

I'm taking one of the great Cs of the past over Doncic any day of the week. All of them were two-way players you can build a team around. As good as Doncic has looked on offense, he's a one-way player.

Also historically it's simply harder to fill the C position.

You meant to say, he’s one way rookie.

You didn’t draft great C of the past, but rookie C with suspicion D. It’s a long walk home to a great two way C. Player like Luka can play in Nba without good D, Ayton will be unplayable in playoffs without great D.

Basketball has just changed. There’s no C, who has any kind of important role in playoffs in last years and game is becoming even more quicker and more perimeter oriented. Players like Harden are almost unstoppable now.

I honestly doubt you have watched basketball before Doncic started playing. In the playoffs the game slows down and you always need a good halfcourt offense. A good C just adds to the coach's options.

[Bob8]

I'm taking one of the great Cs of the past over Doncic any day of the week. All of them were two-way players you can build a team around. As good as Doncic has looked on offense, he's a one-way player.

Also historically it's simply harder to fill the C position.

You meant to say, he’s one way rookie.

You didn’t draft great C of the past, but rookie C with suspicion D. It’s a long walk home to a great two way C. Player like Luka can play in Nba without good D, Ayton will be unplayable in playoffs without great D.

Basketball has just changed. There’s no C, who has any kind of important role in playoffs in last years and game is becoming even more quicker and more perimeter oriented. Players like Harden are almost unstoppable now.

I honestly doubt you have watched basketball before Doncic started playing. In the playoffs the game slows down and you always need a good halfcourt offense. A good C just adds to the coach's options.

Please tell me, which C was important in playoffs in last years?

[sunsbg]

You meant to say, he’s one way rookie.

You didn’t draft great C of the past, but rookie C with suspicion D. It’s a long walk home to a great two way C. Player like Luka can play in Nba without good D, Ayton will be unplayable in playoffs without great D.

Basketball has just changed. There’s no C, who has any kind of important role in playoffs in last years and game is becoming even more quicker and more perimeter oriented. Players like Harden are almost unstoppable now.

I honestly doubt you have watched basketball before Doncic started playing. In the playoffs the game slows down and you always need a good halfcourt offense. A good C just adds to the coach's options.

Please tell me, which C was important in playoffs in last years?

There are no great Cs nowadays. I specifically said the great Cs of the past. Not sure you know who I mean as you didn't deny you are watching basketball for a short time. And one can probably make a case for Capela, who is far from a great C.

[Bob8]

I honestly doubt you have watched basketball before Doncic started playing. In the playoffs the game slows down and you always need a good halfcourt offense. A good C just adds to the coach's options.

Please tell me, which C was important in playoffs in last years?

There are no great Cs nowadays. I specifically said the great Cs of the past. Not sure you know who I mean as you didn't deny you are watching basketball for a short time. And one can probably make a case for Capela, who is far from a great C.

I have been watching basketball approximately 40 years.

http://admin.euroleague.net/news/i/7sy7kqg5mvnhjyhp/fantasy-winner-andrej-bizilj-returns-to-the-final-four

[sunsbg]

Please tell me, which C was important in playoffs in last years?

There are no great Cs nowadays. I specifically said the great Cs of the past. Not sure you know who I mean as you didn't deny you are watching basketball for a short time. And one can probably make a case for Capela, who is far from a great C.

I have been watching basketball approximately 40 years.

http://admin.euroleague.net/news/i/7sy7kqg5mvnhjyhp/fantasy-winner-andrej-bizilj-returns-to-the-final-four

Congrats!

Now I find it even stranger you think a Shaq/Admiral/Hakeem will not have an impact used in place of Capela for example.

A big, who can defend and score efficiently will always have a place on the basketball court. A post offense will always be valuable in a playoff game. So your take that only wing player can create for others is weak.

[Bob8]

There are no great Cs nowadays. I specifically said the great Cs of the past. Not sure you know who I mean as you didn't deny you are watching basketball for a short time. And one can probably make a case for Capela, who is far from a great C.

I have been watching basketball approximately 40 years.

http://admin.euroleague.net/news/i/7sy7kqg5mvnhjyhp/fantasy-winner-andrej-bizilj-returns-to-the-final-four

Congrats!

Now I find it even stranger you think a Shaq/Admiral/Hakeem will not have an impact used in place of Capela for example.

1. You don’t have Shaq/Admiral/Hakeem
2. Even Capela was non factor in some of last years playoffs and Huston was nonetheless only 1 injury less away of the finals. Meaning Harden+Paul+average C would be probably enough for the title.

[sunsbg]

I have been watching basketball approximately 40 years.

http://admin.euroleague.net/news/i/7sy7kqg5mvnhjyhp/fantasy-winner-andrej-bizilj-returns-to-the-final-four

Congrats!

Now I find it even stranger you think a Shaq/Admiral/Hakeem will not have an impact used in place of Capela for example.

1. You don’t have Shaq/Admiral/Hakeem
2. Even Capela was non factor in some of last years playoffs and Huston was nonetheless only 1 injury less away of the finals. Meaning Harden+Paul+average C would be probably enough for the title.

Go find where I said that. Read my edited reply above to understand what I meant in my original reply.

And yeah, I have noticed for Doncic fans there are no other important players than him on the team.

2. also meaning a team filled with all time great wings can't win if not for an injury on the other team

[Bob8]

Congrats!

Now I find it even stranger you think a Shaq/Admiral/Hakeem will not have an impact used in place of Capela for example.

1. You don’t have Shaq/Admiral/Hakeem
2. Even Capela was non factor in some of last years playoffs and Huston was nonetheless only 1 injury less away of the finals. Meaning Harden+Paul+average C would be probably enough for the title.

Go find where I said that. Read my edited reply above to understand what I meant in my original reply.

And yeah, I have noticed for Doncic fans there are no other important players than him on the team.

2. also meaning a team filled with all time great wings can't win if not for an injury on the other team

My point is, that you cannot draft great Cs of the past. But if you want to play that game, for today’s Nba it’s still better to draft great guard/wing of the past, Jordan/LeBron/Curry and even Harden.

[sunsbg]

1. You don’t have Shaq/Admiral/Hakeem
2. Even Capela was non factor in some of last years playoffs and Huston was nonetheless only 1 injury less away of the finals. Meaning Harden+Paul+average C would be probably enough for the title.

Go find where I said that. Read my edited reply above to understand what I meant in my original reply.

And yeah, I have noticed for Doncic fans there are no other important players than him on the team.

2. also meaning a team filled with all time great wings can't win if not for an injury on the other team

My point is, that you cannot draft great Cs of the past. But if you want to play that game, for today’s Nba it’s still better to draft great guard/wing of the past, Jordan/LeBron/Curry and even Harden.

When I say great C of the past and you think Ayton, it's not my fault.

Ok, you didn't get my point. We already drafted LeBron of the future in JJ. I hope you get what I'm trying to say

[Bob8]

Go find where I said that. Read my edited reply above to understand what I meant in my original reply.

And yeah, I have noticed for Doncic fans there are no other important players than him on the team.

2. also meaning a team filled with all time great wings can't win if not for an injury on the other team

My point is, that you cannot draft great Cs of the past. But if you want to play that game, for today’s Nba it’s still better to draft great guard/wing of the past, Jordan/LeBron/Curry and even Harden.

When I say great C of the past and you think Ayton, it's not my fault.

Ok, you didn't get my point. We already drafted LeBron of the future in JJ. I hope you get what I'm trying to say

that Luka is wing's equivalent of great Cs of the pas, but you like Shaq more?

[sunsbg]

My point is, that you cannot draft great Cs of the past. But if you want to play that game, for today’s Nba it’s still better to draft great guard/wing of the past, Jordan/LeBron/Curry and even Harden.

When I say great C of the past and you think Ayton, it's not my fault.

Ok, you didn't get my point. We already drafted LeBron of the future in JJ. I hope you get what I'm trying to say

that Luka is wing's equivalent of great Cs of the pas, but you like Shaq more?

So close

Btw let's see how Cousins will fit in the fast paced Warriors, would be pretty telling who's right in this debate.

[bwgood77]

You meant to say, he’s one way rookie.

You didn’t draft great C of the past, but rookie C with suspicion D. It’s a long walk home to a great two way C. Player like Luka can play in Nba without good D, Ayton will be unplayable in playoffs without great D.

Basketball has just changed. There’s no C, who has any kind of important role in playoffs in last years and game is becoming even more quicker and more perimeter oriented. Players like Harden are almost unstoppable now.

I honestly doubt you have watched basketball before Doncic started playing. In the playoffs the game slows down and you always need a good halfcourt offense. A good C just adds to the coach's options.

Please tell me, which C was important in playoffs in last years?

Embiid is pretty important. I think Jokic will be important to the Nuggets this year. Gobert was important last year

[Bob8]

I honestly doubt you have watched basketball before Doncic started playing. In the playoffs the game slows down and you always need a good halfcourt offense. A good C just adds to the coach's options.

Please tell me, which C was important in playoffs in last years?

Embiid is pretty important. I think Jokic will be important to the Nuggets this year. Gobert was important last year

Embiid was pretty bad in important moments against Boston and Gobert was -62 in Huston series. Jokic might do something, but his game is total anomaly, he has nothing in common with classic bigs.

[3toheadmelo]

1. You don’t have Shaq/Admiral/Hakeem
2. Even Capela was non factor in some of last years playoffs and Huston was nonetheless only 1 injury less away of the finals. Meaning Harden+Paul+average C would be probably enough for the title.

Go find where I said that. Read my edited reply above to understand what I meant in my original reply.

And yeah, I have noticed for Doncic fans there are no other important players than him on the team.

2. also meaning a team filled with all time great wings can't win if not for an injury on the other team

My point is, that you cannot draft great Cs of the past. But if you want to play that game, for today’s Nba it’s still better to draft great guard/wing of the past, Jordan/LeBron/Curry and even Harden.

my guy i've seen you in multiple team boards trying to convince everyone Doncic is the best. give it a break already. we get it, luka is great. no one is disagreeing with that. but it's not a crime that someone prefers a player like Ayton over Doncic. there is a reason why people are starting to hate luka stans and this is a classic example of why it's like that. just let Ayton and Doncic be great in their own ways.

[Bob8]

Go find where I said that. Read my edited reply above to understand what I meant in my original reply.

And yeah, I have noticed for Doncic fans there are no other important players than him on the team.

2. also meaning a team filled with all time great wings can't win if not for an injury on the other team

My point is, that you cannot draft great Cs of the past. But if you want to play that game, for today’s Nba it’s still better to draft great guard/wing of the past, Jordan/LeBron/Curry and even Harden.

my guy i've seen you in multiple team boards trying to convince everyone Doncic is the best. give it a break already. we get it, luka is great. no one is disagreeing with that. but it's not a crime that someone prefers a player like Ayton over Doncic. there is a reason why people are starting to hate luka stans and this is a classic example of why it's like that. just let Ayton and Doncic be great in their own ways.

dear knicks fan, thank you to follow me around team boards and giving me advices. you know where you can s..............

the most likely outcome is, they will both be good but neither will be great.

[lilfishi22]

I think the margin for error for a big man is so much smaller than a wing these days. A big man *has* to be able to play good D because they are generally the last line of defense and the anchor of a team's defense. A big man has to bring something more than just efficient points near the basket because the game is so perimeter orientated these days. A big man has to be able to put the ball on the floor to get to a level of offensive versatility that would allow them to be effective consistently. A big man has to be able to run (rim running).

The game is so fast now (NBA regular season pace in 2000 was in the low-90's, today's playoff pace is eclipses that comfortably) and while the average big man athlete is different (faster, quicker laterally) to the ones of yesteryear, the rule changes has made it a lot more difficult for even the new-age big men of today to stay in games. It's easier to scheme out a big man than it is a wing.

For a wing, they need to be able to shoot, they need to be able to run a PnR, they need to be able to pass confidently (+have great court vision), they need to be able to create space and they need to be able to take advantage of the perimeter mismatch. These days you can be an MVP level candidate as a wing with only good enough team defense.

If you took Ayton because you think he not only fits in tomorrow's NBA but will excel in it then fair enough. I wasn't nearly as confident but seeing Ayton's improving defense the last couple of weeks, I'm feeling a bit more hopeful

[Jamaaliver]

IDK if anyone's already mentioned it:

But I'm pretty sure Ben Simmons has both these guys beat...

[Jstock12]

Not sure why there's even a thread. Not even a question at this point, unless Luka REALLY falls off. I mean a historically brutal rookie wall or something, but I just can't imagine it happening with his skillset and IQ.