Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXVII

[payitforward]

Down the fantasy rabbit hole again here we go!

Doesn't it look like AD to LAL is wired? Going to happen, period?

The high order bit here is to try to move Wall based on LA's enthusiasm for a title right now. Get some young talent & get out of the salary handcuffs our fearless leader locked on our wrists.

[pcbothwel]

I think Ted was pretty transparent in his interview the other weak. He likes the tenacity and style in which this team is playing and will not undercut them by selling, but he clearly knows its a "Make the best of a bad situation" sort of team. No way he allows us to trade a young prospect or our pick for an instant upgrade.

That said, I cant see any way in which he pays a 17M tax!!! just by being 5.5M over. It going to be Kieff and cash going out to get under the tax.
Im sure we'll wait until the last minute to show Kieff is healthy and to see what TPE's are created in other trades...

[Kanyewest]

Going back to the idea of drafting Garland, how about making a draft day agreement with Boston to trade Wall for Hayward and filler and one of Boston's 4 1st rounders?

I'd do that in a heartbeat, but Boston wouldn't. They're not going to ask their franchise player to play out of position to make room for an injury-prone Wall and his gigantic contract.

The only way this makes some plausible sense is if Boston trades Kyrie for Davis (because they can't have both Kyrie and Davis on Designated Player extensions).

I don't really think of Kyrie as a PG - though perhaps he and Boston do. I think of Kyrie, Smart and even Rozier all as combo guards. Last season, Smart averaged slightly more assists per minute than Kyrie did, and Rozier has always been labelled a PG.

I think I have more of a problem with Wall fitting alongside Kyrie given that he isn't a good defender and doesn't move very well without the ball. That being said, if anyone is going to figure it out, it would be Brad Stevens.

[payitforward]

I think Ted was pretty transparent in his interview the other weak. He likes the tenacity and style in which this team is playing and will not undercut them by selling, but he clearly knows its a "Make the best of a bad situation" sort of team. No way he allows us to trade a young prospect or our pick for an instant upgrade.

That said, I cant see any way in which he pays a 17M tax!!! just by being 5.5M over. It going to be Kieff and cash going out to get under the tax.
Im sure we'll wait until the last minute to show Kieff is healthy and to see what TPE's are created in other trades...

This seems very sensible -- I sure hope you're right!

[dangermouse]

Looks like the Pelicans roster is for sale.

Kieff + 1st rounder for Randle?

I think he has a player option, so make the first a second rounder and we've got a deal!

[gambitx777]

Lot of top shelf PG's on the market right now. Interesting.

[FAH1223]

Read on Twitter

[pcbothwel]

Read on Twitter

Its hard for me to wrap my head around... We would be the 1st team to ever pay the repeater tax for a Non-Playoff team... Whens the last time a non playoff team even paid the tax, let alone a repeat tax?

How does Ted allow this? I get the bad team/shortcomings. Teams underwhelm every year and Ted isnt a good owner...it happens. But to throw away money for a non contender seems like terrible business.

[TGW]

Looks like the Pelicans roster is for sale.

Kieff + 1st rounder for Randle?

I think he has a player option, so make the first a second rounder and we've got a deal!

Yea I wasn't aware of that. I rescind my offer.

[FAH1223]

Read on Twitter

Its hard for me to wrap my head around... We would be the 1st team to ever pay the repeater tax for a Non-Playoff team... Whens the last time a non playoff team even paid the tax, let alone a repeat tax?

How does Ted allow this? I get the bad team/shortcomings. Teams underwhelm every year and Ted isnt a good owner...it happens. But to throw away money for a non contender seems like terrible business.

Weren’t they a hair under the tax last year? Unless you’re thinking they’ll be in it in 2020

[pcbothwel]

Read on Twitter

Its hard for me to wrap my head around... We would be the 1st team to ever pay the repeater tax for a Non-Playoff team... Whens the last time a non playoff team even paid the tax, let alone a repeat tax?

How does Ted allow this? I get the bad team/shortcomings. Teams underwhelm every year and Ted isnt a good owner...it happens. But to throw away money for a non contender seems like terrible business.

Weren’t they a hair under the tax last year? Unless you’re thinking they’ll be in it in 2020

No, we were over in 15/16, 17/18, and 18/19 (Currently). Thats 3 times in 4 years which makes us repeat offenders.
It just doesnt compute.
We are 5.5M over the tax. If we were to trade Morris (8.6M) for someone making 3M, we would save 5.5M in salary plus another 16M in tax!!!
So having Morris instead of that player... (I.E Yogi Ferrell ) cost Ted 21 MILLION DOLLARS !!!

PLUS. It would affect our ability to go over the tax in the next 2-3 years... It simply doesnt make sense

[Illmatic12]

Its hard for me to wrap my head around... We would be the 1st team to ever pay the repeater tax for a Non-Playoff team... Whens the last time a non playoff team even paid the tax, let alone a repeat tax?

How does Ted allow this? I get the bad team/shortcomings. Teams underwhelm every year and Ted isnt a good owner...it happens. But to throw away money for a non contender seems like terrible business.

Weren’t they a hair under the tax last year? Unless you’re thinking they’ll be in it in 2020

No, we were over in 15/16, 17/18, and 18/19 (Currently). Thats 3 times in 4 years which makes us repeat offenders.
It just doesnt compute.
We are 5.5M over the tax. If we were to trade Morris (8.6M) for someone making 3M, we would save 5.5M in salary plus another 16M in tax!!!
So having Morris instead of that player... (I.E Yogi Ferrell ) cost Ted 21 MILLION DOLLARS !!!

PLUS. It would affect our ability to go over the tax in the next 2-3 years... It simply doesnt make sense

This is inaccurate. The Wizards have only paid the luxury tax one time in the history of the franchise, which was 2017-18 (last year)

[pcbothwel]

Wait... we need to figure this out. I have the Lux tax at 84.7M in 15-16... and we were at 86M... what am I missing?

If you are right, and I do believe you, it still means that we cant go over next year without being a repeat offender. Which means we would need Dwight to decline his Option in order for us to retain Sato & Bryant... or stretch Mahinmi which would be a HUGE mistake.

While not AS dire... it still makes zero sense to be over the tax when dumping Morris is the easy solution to save Ted money now and the future while giving our FO flexibility

[FAH1223]

Wait... we need to figure this out. I have the Lux tax at 84.7M in 15-16... and we were at 86M... what am I missing?

If you are right, and I do believe you, it still means that we cant go over next year without being a repeat offender. Which means we would need Dwight to decline his Option in order for us to retain Sato & Bryant... or stretch Mahinmi which would be a HUGE mistake.

While not AS dire... it still makes zero sense to be over the tax when dumping Morris is the easy solution to save Ted money now and the future while giving our FO flexibility

$5M in dead cap money wouldn't be a huge mistake for a couple years

Luxury tax is gonna be north of $132M in 2020, $143M in 2021.

[Illmatic12]

Wait... we need to figure this out. I have the Lux tax at 84.7M in 15-16... and we were at 86M... what am I missing?

If you are right, and I do believe you, it still means that we cant go over next year without being a repeat offender. Which means we would need Dwight to decline his Option in order for us to retain Sato & Bryant... or stretch Mahinmi which would be a HUGE mistake.

While not AS dire... it still makes zero sense to be over the tax when dumping Morris is the easy solution to save Ted money now and the future while giving our FO flexibility

This shows $85M, and includes some non-guaranteed players from that season so I am pretty sure the actual amount by the end of the year was under the tax line:

https://hoopshype.com/salaries/washington_wizards/2015-2016/

26. WASHINGTON WIZARDS: ONE TIME
The Wizards are coming off the first year where they had to pay the luxury tax, and it looks like this year will be the same, as they’re sixth in highest payrolls, due to the max contracts dolled out to John Wall, Bradley Beal and Otto Porter Jr. Last season, Washington made the playoffs but were ousted in the first round. This year, they’re off to a rough start, though they have turned it around recently. It’ll be interesting to note how many more years of mediocrity their front office is willing to pay for.

Total amount: $7.0 million
Record in tax seasons: 43-39 (52.4 percent)
Playoffs in tax seasons: One appearance, zero series won

https://hoopshype.com/2018/11/16/how-many-times-has-each-nba-team-paid-the-luxury-tax/

I believe the repeater penalty only comes to play when paying the tax 3 times in 4 seasons. So they aren't up against it yet, but it seems pretty clear that they will look at moving Porter's contract off the books in the offseason imo.

[pcbothwel]

Wait... we need to figure this out. I have the Lux tax at 84.7M in 15-16... and we were at 86M... what am I missing?

If you are right, and I do believe you, it still means that we cant go over next year without being a repeat offender. Which means we would need Dwight to decline his Option in order for us to retain Sato & Bryant... or stretch Mahinmi which would be a HUGE mistake.

While not AS dire... it still makes zero sense to be over the tax when dumping Morris is the easy solution to save Ted money now and the future while giving our FO flexibility

$5M in dead cap money wouldn't be a huge mistake for a couple years

Luxury tax is gonna be north of $132M in 2020, $143M in 2021.

Mahinmi is a solid backup Center with a great attitude/work ethic. You only waive unplayable players or malcontents.

Our best option is to hope Dwight can come back for a few weeks at the end of the year, but have him opt out with no playing time prospects.

[Kanyewest]

Wait... we need to figure this out. I have the Lux tax at 84.7M in 15-16... and we were at 86M... what am I missing?

If you are right, and I do believe you, it still means that we cant go over next year without being a repeat offender. Which means we would need Dwight to decline his Option in order for us to retain Sato & Bryant... or stretch Mahinmi which would be a HUGE mistake.

While not AS dire... it still makes zero sense to be over the tax when dumping Morris is the easy solution to save Ted money now and the future while giving our FO flexibility

This shows $85M, and includes some non-guaranteed players from that season so I am pretty sure the actual amount by the end of the year was under the tax line:

https://hoopshype.com/salaries/washington_wizards/2015-2016/

26. WASHINGTON WIZARDS: ONE TIME
The Wizards are coming off the first year where they had to pay the luxury tax, and it looks like this year will be the same, as they’re sixth in highest payrolls, due to the max contracts dolled out to John Wall, Bradley Beal and Otto Porter Jr. Last season, Washington made the playoffs but were ousted in the first round. This year, they’re off to a rough start, though they have turned it around recently. It’ll be interesting to note how many more years of mediocrity their front office is willing to pay for.

Total amount: $7.0 million
Record in tax seasons: 43-39 (52.4 percent)
Playoffs in tax seasons: One appearance, zero series won

https://hoopshype.com/2018/11/16/how-many-times-has-each-nba-team-paid-the-luxury-tax/

I believe the repeater penalty only comes to play when paying the tax 3 times in 4 seasons. So they aren't up against it yet, but it seems pretty clear that they will look at moving Porter's contract off the books in the offseason imo.

Yeah Wizards traded Nicholson and a first for Bojan which got the Wizards under the tax for that season.

[pcbothwel]

Wait... we need to figure this out. I have the Lux tax at 84.7M in 15-16... and we were at 86M... what am I missing?

If you are right, and I do believe you, it still means that we cant go over next year without being a repeat offender. Which means we would need Dwight to decline his Option in order for us to retain Sato & Bryant... or stretch Mahinmi which would be a HUGE mistake.

While not AS dire... it still makes zero sense to be over the tax when dumping Morris is the easy solution to save Ted money now and the future while giving our FO flexibility

This shows $85M, and includes some non-guaranteed players from that season so I am pretty sure the actual amount by the end of the year was under the tax line:

https://hoopshype.com/salaries/washington_wizards/2015-2016/

26. WASHINGTON WIZARDS: ONE TIME
The Wizards are coming off the first year where they had to pay the luxury tax, and it looks like this year will be the same, as they’re sixth in highest payrolls, due to the max contracts dolled out to John Wall, Bradley Beal and Otto Porter Jr. Last season, Washington made the playoffs but were ousted in the first round. This year, they’re off to a rough start, though they have turned it around recently. It’ll be interesting to note how many more years of mediocrity their front office is willing to pay for.

Total amount: $7.0 million
Record in tax seasons: 43-39 (52.4 percent)
Playoffs in tax seasons: One appearance, zero series won

https://hoopshype.com/2018/11/16/how-many-times-has-each-nba-team-paid-the-luxury-tax/

I believe the repeater penalty only comes to play when paying the tax 3 times in 4 seasons. So they aren't up against it yet, but it seems pretty clear that they will look at moving Porter's contract off the books in the offseason imo.

Yeah Wizards traded Nicholson and a first for Bojan which got the Wizards under the tax for that season.

Wrong year. That was 16/17.... I was referring to 15/16... Either way, I cant see Ted paying the 8.5M in tax along with the 5.5M in salary.
So getting under the tax saves Ted 14M... thats a lot of dough... even if you consider the actual cash savings (We've paid 60% of the teams salaries so far), he'd still save over 12M...

[nate33]

Wrong year. That was 16/17.... I was referring to 15/16... Either way, I cant see Ted paying the 8.5M in tax along with the 5.5M in salary.
So getting under the tax saves Ted 14M... thats a lot of dough... even if you consider the actual cash savings (We've paid 60% of the teams salaries so far), he'd still save over 12M...

Agreed.

I cannot even fathom why they wouldn't trade Morris for cap relief. The team has done fine without Morris. In fact, they're quite clearly better without him than with him. And he's not going to be retained going forward anyhow. Why on Earth would there be any reticence on trading him? You and I have both proposed deals where the Wizards can save as much as $3.5M in a Morris trade, even more if they give him to Utah for a TPE. That seems like a no-brainer. It's not even a tank move. It's a win-now move that also saves money. The ONLY reason not to trade Morris is if nobody wants him, which is a distinct possibility.

There is at least an argument for retaining Ariza. He's a good influence on team chemistry and he has helped shore up the defense. There really isn't any hope of making the playoffs without him. Ted could actually be sincere in refusing to tank, thinking that building a winning culture is more important than a few luxtax dollars or a slot or two in the draft lottery. I think that's shortsighted, but at least it's not blatantly illogical. It only becomes infuriating if Ted turns around and sacrifices even more future assets next year to save money because of the money he lost this year by keeping Ariza.

I think Jeff Green is the one I could go either way on. The thing about Green is that I think it's entirely possible that if he stays on the roster through the season, he could also be on the roster next year on a low cost contract. He also seems to be a stable locker room guy and a useful veteran. I'd rather have 2 more years of Jeff Green at, say, $4M per, than whatever low 2nd round pick we might get if we traded him.

[Kanyewest]

This shows $85M, and includes some non-guaranteed players from that season so I am pretty sure the actual amount by the end of the year was under the tax line:

https://hoopshype.com/salaries/washington_wizards/2015-2016/



https://hoopshype.com/2018/11/16/how-many-times-has-each-nba-team-paid-the-luxury-tax/

I believe the repeater penalty only comes to play when paying the tax 3 times in 4 seasons. So they aren't up against it yet, but it seems pretty clear that they will look at moving Porter's contract off the books in the offseason imo.

Yeah Wizards traded Nicholson and a first for Bojan which got the Wizards under the tax for that season.

Wrong year. That was 16/17.... I was referring to 15/16... Either way, I cant see Ted paying the 8.5M in tax along with the 5.5M in salary.
So getting under the tax saves Ted 14M... thats a lot of dough... even if you consider the actual cash savings (We've paid 60% of the teams salaries so far), he'd still save over 12M...

I think it was when Webster was waived and he had a partial guarantee (and the Wizards used the stretch provision). Also traded Humphries and Blair for Morris midseason.

By the way, Webster is still on the books for 800 + K this season.