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The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers

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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#41 » by GED Education » Fri Feb 1, 2019 4:29 am

JordanBPeterson wrote:Most threads on this forum are reaction threads and I can't see how this one is any different. Sorry OP.

If this thread was created after a win then maybe you have my attention but it's all too predictable right now.

Just a reminder that at the beginning of the season when most people were polled it was revealed that the Raps would likely win less games but it was deemed ok because it's all about the post season.

The shrewd move is actually sticking with the original decision until the end because it's not about saving your ass by playing scared , it's about living with the pot choices at the poker table.

We have the chance to enter the post season with a genuine mvp calibre player for the first time since Vince and with a much more talented roster. You don't throw that away - scared or not.

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Vince was never MVP calibre. This roster has tons of holes. Kawhi is not good enough to carry this team alone. He's proven to be unclutch this season and hasn't meshed with the team at all. But believe all you want. We've seen this story before. It's an early playoff exit...but pretend to be surprised when it happens.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#42 » by JordanBPeterson » Fri Feb 1, 2019 4:36 am

TheAlchemist wrote:
JordanBPeterson wrote:Most threads on this forum are reaction threads and I can't see how this one is any different. Sorry OP.

If this thread was created after a win then maybe you have my attention but it's all too predictable right now.

Just a reminder that at the beginning of the season when most people were polled it was revealed that the Raps would likely win less games but it was deemed ok because it's all about the post season.

The shrewd move is actually sticking with the original decision until the end because it's not about saving your ass by playing scared , it's about living with the pot choices at the poker table.

We have the chance to enter the post season with a genuine mvp calibre player for the first time since Vince and with a much more talented roster. You don't throw that away - scared or not.

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Hey I love Peterson. Amazing dude. If you are Peterson you win, just cause you're Peterson and awesome. Lol.
If you follow JBP then follow the logic of the hero story.

It could blow up in our faces - its not like I'm not aware of that - but cowards for sure never win anything either.

Pain is the price for success. The LeBron embarrassments in the post season, lack of consistency and heartbreak has lead us to this point. That terrible Milwaukee performance was yet another price but I'm happy to pay it because the story isn't over yet.

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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#43 » by MrMcglock » Fri Feb 1, 2019 5:08 am

S ID wrote:I'm sure some people will say you sound ridiculous but the Raptors are 17-12 since starting 20-4.

They've been mediocre for 2 months now.

If we go past the deadline without some sort of a shake up this team is doomed for another 2nd round flame out



We have great pieces we just need a coach that isn't out of his league
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#44 » by PhilBlackson » Fri Feb 1, 2019 5:11 am

MrMcglock wrote:
S ID wrote:I'm sure some people will say you sound ridiculous but the Raptors are 17-12 since starting 20-4.

They've been mediocre for 2 months now.

If we go past the deadline without some sort of a shake up this team is doomed for another 2nd round flame out



We have great pieces we just need a coach that isn't out of his league


...and a PG that actually plays up to his $30M/yr contract.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#45 » by Dalek » Fri Feb 1, 2019 5:34 am

Ackshun wrote:We have pieces but we're playing with a serious lack of chemistry. It's right there in the body language.

We need Val back asap. We need some shooters at 3/4 spots. And we need to stop giving up **** runs and digging ourselves out of 20 point deficits. The playoffs won't bring many of those opportunities if we continue to let it happen.

We're not getting anything worthwhile for KL2 so I don't get the rationale of blowing it up now. Might as well stack the deck for a run. If a superstar is available, do it. If not, fill out the roster the way it needs filling out.

I refuse to believe KL2 is definitively going to the Clippers. Just because some fans brag about having him in the "bag" . Don't care.


This is a quality post. Getting JV back is one part by Toronto is an offensive minded team. When they make shots they play better defense and look like world beaters. Tonight Danny Green was sick and not able to play well. When we lose a shooter it hurts the starters. KLow presses his game and people load up on Kawhi because there is no one to make them pay. I'd love to get a shooter that people game plan for.

You other point is correct about KL2's trade value. Who is going to give you good value for half a season? Maybe one of the contenders might give you their late firsts, but you won't get a lotto pick and are likely to get a couple role players rather than a star.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#46 » by Chandan » Fri Feb 1, 2019 6:14 am

GED Education wrote:Kawhi is not a LeBron level generational talent. People seem to think that here.


the most shocking part is that whenever i watch him, he's borderline bad on defense aside from a steal here and there.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#47 » by Psubs » Fri Feb 1, 2019 6:25 am

S ID wrote:I'm sure some people will say you sound ridiculous but the Raptors are 17-12 since starting 20-4.

They've been mediocre for 2 months now.

If we go past the deadline without some sort of a shake up this team is doomed for another 2nd round flame out


Coincides with the JV injury.

The team is 23-7 with JV and 14-9 since.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#48 » by J-Roc » Fri Feb 1, 2019 11:56 am

I'm down with trading him. He is not staying past this season. And we are not going to the Finals. So what would we normally do with an expiring asset in this circumstance?
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#49 » by AussieRaptor » Fri Feb 1, 2019 12:22 pm

Eh. I get what you’re saying, but I would rather offer up Lowry, OG, FVV/Wright, Powell, CJ, etc. See what pieces we can get to ADD with Kawhi and make a serious run. If he leaves, he leaves.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#50 » by ratul » Fri Feb 1, 2019 12:34 pm

Kyle just needs better conditioning and he will get the lift back on his 3 point shot.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#51 » by whoknows » Fri Feb 1, 2019 1:00 pm

Relax, Kawhi is not traded for 2 reasons:
- nobody would give you anything of value for a player who signs to LA in summer
- Masai would look stupid to do it

We'll get Val back and things get glued together before playoffs time (only time that matters).
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#52 » by Green Backpack » Fri Feb 1, 2019 1:03 pm

Lol there's not a chance in hell this is happening...
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#53 » by GordanFreeman » Fri Feb 1, 2019 1:16 pm

TheAlchemist wrote:
PhilBlackson wrote:Send him to the Clippers for SGA + a pick + filler or something.

Unless we make some miracle trade, looking at Lowry just makes it clear this is all in vein. He's cooked and is clearly gonna cost us come Playoff even worse than ever. I'm not saying that out of any emotion. I had no faith in him last year when everybody flamed me for it and now you're all seeing that he is in fact declining and I just don't want to waste time pretending with this dude. Either trade Kyle or end the Kawhi experiment because this could end ugly.


You know Kyle was my favorite player.

And if this trade was well received by him, instead of him being a malicious little cu** , it would make the world of difference.

Lowry actively recruiting Kawhi, and trying his level best, would DEFINITELY of helped a lot.

But he's being a punk b**** that he is usually, bordering on toxic, and now cannot play his way out of a cardboard box.

And that's one of if not the main issue. Lowry is not Lowry, and it looks like he won't be even in the playoffs. Anyone remember 2 years ago, how he couldn't handle Derozan being the main cog in our offence? Came back before the playoffs and straight played horrible.

I don't see it getting any better.


I dont know why anyone would be surprised that he reacted the way he did when his bf was traded. Especially his fans. Lowry's who he is. Who he's been for his whole life. His character isn't going to change now.

As for his drop off in production, it's clear he's not well physically. You don't go from playing like a superstar to an inefficient 3rd option for no reason.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#54 » by SirKen » Fri Feb 1, 2019 1:21 pm

TheAlchemist wrote:This isn't really a knee-jerk reaction thread, although we just got beaten pretty badly by Miluwakee.

But coming into this season, we took a gamble, put all our eggs into one basket, to woo a superstar to stay on our team.

It worked to some degree and we really have been one of the best teams in the league until recently.

But a couple things have become crystal clear;

#1. We lack a really defined second option. This can go into two parts, the decline of Kyle Lowry and the gap Pascal Siakim/Ibaka have to becoming a legitimate #2 option. On top of that, our offensive system has not really integrated both Lowry and Kawhi together at all.

All the time off between the two, has made things kind of awkward if anything. Lowry not dominating as usual, Kawhi isolating a lot and not passing as much.

It kind of shows that Kawhi does not want to really integrate as much with the team, as he lacks in the facilitating department.

#2. Kawhi looks like he will not re-sign. Say what you want about the new house, say what you want about the non commitment, but we really have not had ANY indication that Kawhi wants to stay. He wears his own branding wherever he goes and doesn't show the team spirit a player should at all.

Listening to even Danny Green talk about Kawhi buying a house in SoCal, you can get the sense that Kawhi doesn't want to live here for most of the season.

I'm pretty much guranteed that he will bolt.


#3. We lack the star or firepower to make the eastern conference finals. Say what you want, but we really have no star power, system, second option or even been playing like a powerhouse team.

and IF these facts are true, we really should sell at the deadline. Not only Kawhi, we should sell everyone.

We only have one season to "woo" this guy, and if we aren't dominating or have a great team to begin with, I hardly doubt we will re-sign him.

A shrewd general manager would see this very clearly, and stockpile assets. We can use the Anthony Davis Sweepstakes as leverage to get what we want.

If LA is being shutout for Anthony Davis, why not send that same package they where for Anthony Davis, and use it to get Kawhi? Hell they can sign someone in the off-season and make a great team for themselves.

Want Kyle Lowry as a 1.5 year rental? or Ibaka? Send us some decent assets.

Danny Green is expiring. Send a crappy contract and a first rounder, we'll take it.

THE POINT of this post is ; We have a chance of having a sustainable championship caliber team, if we leverage our assets this year

And the possibility of being sellers should really not be dismissed as hearsay.


Agree with you hundred percent. I don't think trading our depth for Anthony Davis will be enough either. I think this team would do better with a two way player that could perform within the offense the bench mob and non-Kawhi team shown us in the last two years.

I am not that high on Ingram and Kuzma yet. I think we should go to Clippers for package centered around Harris + fillers + pick first.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#55 » by SirKen » Fri Feb 1, 2019 1:25 pm

JordanBPeterson wrote:Most threads on this forum are reaction threads and I can't see how this one is any different. Sorry OP.

If this thread was created after a win then maybe you have my attention but it's all too predictable right now.

Just a reminder that at the beginning of the season when most people were polled it was revealed that the Raps would likely win less games but it was deemed ok because it's all about the post season.

The shrewd move is actually sticking with the original decision until the end because it's not about saving your ass by playing scared , it's about living with the pot choices at the poker table.

We have the chance to enter the post season with a genuine mvp calibre player for the first time since Vince and with a much more talented roster. You don't throw that away - scared or not.

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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#56 » by Smalltown » Fri Feb 1, 2019 1:27 pm

The rebuild is coming. Y'all want to rush it. Enjoy the ride. 1-2 more seasons and we won't be sniffing 50 wins and all b1tching and moaning about the glory years. A chance to win it all is better than a chance at an expedited rebuild.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#57 » by tradejosehesux » Fri Feb 1, 2019 1:31 pm

This is still the all-in season. There is no way in hell that Masai leaves this team "as is" past the trade deadline. It's abundantly clear that this team needs at least an all-star caliber player as a second scoring option and probably a sharp shooter to come off the bench (a reliable version of CJ).
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#58 » by LBJKB24MJ23 » Fri Feb 1, 2019 1:42 pm

PhilBlackson wrote:
MrMcglock wrote:
S ID wrote:I'm sure some people will say you sound ridiculous but the Raptors are 17-12 since starting 20-4.

They've been mediocre for 2 months now.

If we go past the deadline without some sort of a shake up this team is doomed for another 2nd round flame out



We have great pieces we just need a coach that isn't out of his league


...and a PG that actually plays up to his $30M/yr contract.


its just a PG that needs to play up to his contract. Lowry's got an ego and will sulk if he doesn't get his minutes.

Nurse can only play him without him disrupting the locker room.

With all that being said, its time to ship Lowry out.
raf1995 wrote:I just don’t think he has that kind of potential. I think we will regret not trading him for a haul in a few years when he’s a mid-tier starter with nice playmaking and defense and a shaky jumper.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#59 » by RalphWiggum » Fri Feb 1, 2019 1:45 pm

Raps in 4 wrote:We need to pick a direction and **** commit to it.

Either trade Kawhi and hit the reset button now or trade for a second option and go all in.
Tough choice but I %100 agree. It would be tough for Masai to sell to the public but it might be time to start over.
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Re: The case to trade Kawhi at the deadline and why we should be sellers 

Post#60 » by RalphWiggum » Fri Feb 1, 2019 1:46 pm

TrustFundBaby wrote:I'm frustrated too but this is a huge overreaction

First, MIL needs to actually win a playoff series before we crown them East champs

Second, we can still make moves, like buyout candidates or a trade For players like Mitotic

We have a chance at the finals, It's best to just go for it.

If he walks he walks
It's not about the bucks it about us. We gotta get JV back and then quickly evaluate where we're at.

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