Nikola Jokić and best Bigmen passers of all time

[70sFan]

How it's possible Jokic foul at 6:07?

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It's clear offensive foul and refs should call situations like that more often. It was never legal and as far as I know, it's still not.

[GYK]

without question it's Joker or Wilt. difficulty of passes but how involved(volume of passes).

[Mickey8]

How it's possible Jokic foul at 6:07?

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Unbeliveable call.

Love Jokic, 2nd favorite player, I can see offensive foul. Do you guys honestly don't see it? He doesn't go back up, creates space with his arm/elbow/shoulder (can't see it which body part, but it's obvious that he does).

He was hacked like three times on that play before they called offensive foul on him all three Deng, Towns and Gibson have fouled him.

[Johnny Firpo]

He was hacked like three times on that play before they called offensive foul on him all three Deng, Towns and Gibson have fouled him.

Probably, but they weren't as visible than what Jokic did.

[Fencer reregistered]

A lot depends on what kinds of passing we value most. I'm impressed by effective inside passing,for example, because it requires 360 degree court vision, quickness, accuracy, and an understanding of how plays unfold.

Outlet passing is pretty important.

It used to be important that bigs passed well out of the post. That's probably less important in the modern era, because there's less post scoring and also passing to a 3-pt shooter may be easier than what was needed before.

Bigs do more guard-like drive-and-dish passing than ever before. If somebody said the two GOAT bigs at it were Jokic and Horford, I wouldn't be surprised, because it's a much bigger part of the big-man game than it used to be.

Nobody these days passes on the fast break as well as the 1980s Celtics did. Bird was of course the best at that, but even McHale has some highlights in that area, notwithstanding his reluctance to ever pass the ball once he was standing still.

It is of course to pass well out of whichever of the PnR, give-and-go, or whatever is prevalent in your era.

[Manimal]

Watching it from this angle...not a single guy expected Jokic to make that pass, including the Nuggets bench. And yet he did, and in such a critical moment of the game.

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Which is almost as good as this pass...

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[I beg to differ]

Best all time is 36 year old Magic Johnson.

[Mickey8]

He was hacked like three times on that play before they called offensive foul on him all three Deng, Towns and Gibson have fouled him.

Probably, but they weren't as visible than what Jokic did.

Its not probably , they did it and Tony Brothers an awful ref was watching all of the action , he had the best angle , it was very visible for him but he decided to blow the whistle for the offensive foul which came much later.

[Mickey8]

A lot depends on what kinds of passing we value most. I'm impressed by effective inside passing,for example, because it requires 360 degree court vision, quickness, accuracy, and an understanding of how plays unfold.

Outlet passing is pretty important.

It used to be important that bigs passed well out of the post. That's probably less important in the modern era, because there's less post scoring and also passing to a 3-pt shooter may be easier than what was needed before.

Bigs do more guard-like drive-and-dish passing than ever before. If somebody said the two GOAT bigs at it were Jokic and Horford, I wouldn't be surprised, because it's a much bigger part of the big-man game than it used to be.

Nobody these days passes on the fast break as well as the 1980s Celtics did. Bird was of course the best at that, but even McHale has some highlights in that area, notwithstanding his reluctance to ever pass the ball once he was standing still.

It is of course to pass well out of whichever of the PnR, give-and-go, or whatever is prevalent in your era.

Well you don't watch Nuggets enough, Jokic have every pass in the book and then some more.

[Mickey8]

Watching it from this angle...not a single guy expected Jokic to make that pass, including the Nuggets bench. And yet he did, and in such a critical moment of the game.

Read on Twitter

Which is almost as good as this pass...

Watch on YouTube

When the ball is out of bound and Denver have possession, Jokic is always rushing the ref to give him the ball so he can make quick pass ,I think Denver players are always aware of that , they probably talking about that in practice.

[Fencer reregistered]

Watching it from this angle...not a single guy expected Jokic to make that pass, including the Nuggets bench. And yet he did, and in such a critical moment of the game.

Read on Twitter

Which is almost as good as this pass...

Watch on YouTube

When the ball is out of bound and Denver have possession, Jokic is always rushing the ref to give him the ball so he can make quick pass ,I think Denver players are always aware of that , they probably talking about that in practice.

Good throwback to the 1980s. Bird, Parish, Magic et al. did that kind of stuff frequently.

[Fencer reregistered]

Well you don't watch Nuggets enough, Jokic have every pass in the book and then some more.

Then why do people make passing-highlight videos for him without including that stuff?

[Nuntius]

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Another Serbian big with guards skill who's excellent passer . I know this should be in the NBA draft thread but I am comparing him with Jokic little bit , definitely NBA prospect.

Hey, he plays for Olympiacos! Thanks for the clip. I haven't paid enough attention to our domestic league but this guy definitely seems promising.

[Sulico]

Arvydas Sabonis is the best passing big of all time but I'd put Jokić at #2. He's right up there, too.

Sabonis had 964 total career assists in 7 seasons

Jokic has 782 in 2 1/2 seasons.

Jokic > Sabonis and its not even close

Were you already born when Sabonis played or at least saw him play? Your example is pure "stathead" approach. Sabonis came to the league after heavy injuries well over his prime. He played limited minutes for the Blazers as opposed to the heavy ones played by Jokic. the pure quality of Sabas game/passing was higher than Jokic's. however, Jokic is very close, but no there yet.

Jokic played 32, 31, 27, 21 MPG in his 4 years in NBA.
Sabas played 32, 27, 25, 25 MPG in his 4 best years in NBA.

Stop lying to fit your narrative.
Yes, I was born to see Sabas. Yes, I've seen him pre NBA. No, Jokic is much better passer.
Sabas was crazy skilled player and willing passer at the same time. Jokic was born with this. Just like LeBron was born with his freakish body and Steph with his magical hands. Jokic have unnatural vision and soft touch, combination we never saw from bigs in this league before.

[UcanUwill]

Sabonis had 964 total career assists in 7 seasons

Jokic has 782 in 2 1/2 seasons.

Jokic > Sabonis and its not even close

Were you already born when Sabonis played or at least saw him play? Your example is pure "stathead" approach. Sabonis came to the league after heavy injuries well over his prime. He played limited minutes for the Blazers as opposed to the heavy ones played by Jokic. the pure quality of Sabas game/passing was higher than Jokic's. however, Jokic is very close, but no there yet.

Jokic played 32, 31, 27, 21 MPG in his 4 years in NBA.
Sabas played 32, 27, 25, 25 MPG in his 4 best years in NBA.

Stop lying to fit your narrative.
Yes, I was born to see Sabas. Yes, I've seen him pre NBA. No, Jokic is much better passer.
Sabas was crazy skilled player and willing passer at the same time. Jokic was born with this. Just like LeBron was born with his freakish body and Steph with his magical hands. Jokic have unnatural vision and soft touch, combination we never saw from bigs in this league before.

Sabonis was definitely born with it too, but I am not sure why his assists numbers were so low in the NBA considering. I understand offense didnt flow through him In Jokic case, but he was so aware and precise with the ball, his low assist numbers still confuses me.

[Ryoga Hibiki]

Jokic played 32, 31, 27, 21 MPG in his 4 years in NBA.
Sabas played 32, 27, 25, 25 MPG in his 4 best years in NBA.

Stop lying to fit your narrative.
Yes, I was born to see Sabas. Yes, I've seen him pre NBA. No, Jokic is much better passer.
Sabas was crazy skilled player and willing passer at the same time. Jokic was born with this. Just like LeBron was born with his freakish body and Steph with his magical hands. Jokic have unnatural vision and soft touch, combination we never saw from bigs in this league before.

Jokic is arguably a better passer, but he's not a much better passer.
The difference in assist total is linked to the different role they played in the offence, Jokic has way more touches in an offence built around ball movement and him as a hub, in his early years in the NBA Sabonis had guys like Rider playing ISO or Stoudamire pounding the ball for half the possession.

[stoo]

Jokic played 32, 31, 27, 21 MPG in his 4 years in NBA.
Sabas played 32, 27, 25, 25 MPG in his 4 best years in NBA.

Stop lying to fit your narrative.
Yes, I was born to see Sabas. Yes, I've seen him pre NBA. No, Jokic is much better passer.
Sabas was crazy skilled player and willing passer at the same time. Jokic was born with this. Just like LeBron was born with his freakish body and Steph with his magical hands. Jokic have unnatural vision and soft touch, combination we never saw from bigs in this league before.

Jokic is arguably a better passer, but he's not a much better passer.
The difference in assist total is linked to the different role they played in the offence, Jokic has way more touches in an offence built around ball movement and him as a hub, in his early years in the NBA Sabonis had guys like Rider playing ISO or Stoudamire pounding the ball for half the possession.

the difference in number of assists is because it was different game, and because Jokic is kind of player you can use in a way he's been used... Try to use any other big in his role and u won't have same result

[Fencer reregistered]

Stop lying to fit your narrative.
Yes, I was born to see Sabas. Yes, I've seen him pre NBA. No, Jokic is much better passer.
Sabas was crazy skilled player and willing passer at the same time. Jokic was born with this. Just like LeBron was born with his freakish body and Steph with his magical hands. Jokic have unnatural vision and soft touch, combination we never saw from bigs in this league before.

I ask again -- if Jokic is so much better than anybody else who's ever played, why is the collection of passing skills shown on his highlight videos so inferior to those shown on Larry Bird's? And why isn't there anything on them that Al Horford hasn't also done recently?

[Mickey8]

They are not inferior they are superior and Bird was SF not the PF or Center.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

They are not inferior they are superior and Bird was SF not the PF or Center.

.

Bird was really a power forward. I guess it is my self imposed job to set people straight about Bird. I was a big Cedric Maxwell fan before Bird arrived. I understand what happened.

Bird played power forward and center in college but Cedric Maxwell, a power forward was the best returning Celtic Bird's rookie year so the Celtic's media guide refereed to Bird as a small forward. Cedric Maxwell ended up switching to small forward on defense. Bird gave defending small forwards a try but it did not work because Bird's feet were too slow when defending drives. Size and strength wise Bird was a power forward and he rebounded better than most power forwards.

McHale was also a power forward. Since they played together so much it is natural to call one of them a small forward. Neither one of them were good at defending small forwards. Both of them were good at defending power forwards. McHale was OK at defending small forwards and therefore McHale got stuck defending the small forwards most of the time while Bird defended power forwards most of the time.

But fans and even media focus on offense not defense. On Ofense McHale was a great inside scorer and McHale had no small forward type game. Bird was also a very good inside scorer.

On offense Bird had guard skills. Bird's guard skills and the fact he played with McHale is why Bird is considered a small forward but Bird's natural position was power forward and that is the position he would play for most teams if you added him to current rosters.