Hot Topic - Quite Frankly; All Things Frank

[prophet_of_rage]

With Frank and Mudiay being 6'5 and up what's to stop Fiz from a line up of dsj, mudiay, and Frank? He's tinkered with the line up so much I'll be shocked if he doesn't give it to us.

wouldn't be shocked to see some frank batum out there.

i would love it more if positionless basketball were really applied.

We have talentless basketball!

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[CoolKids]

Is Frank's defense better than Knox's offense?

part 2 - Is Frank's offense better than Knox's defense?

That's a tough call. I couldn't begin to say. Probably, but not by a lot?

I would disagree here. Knox needs to improve his defense for sure...frank is the worst offensive guard in the league getting any meaningful minutes

[blanko]

Smith
Dotson
Trier
Ntilikina

can it work? can it be the starting/bench backcourt of a chip team?

Nope.

But there's a strong chance the team adds Kyrie and/or a SG when they draft 2-6

It is, at the least, a nice bench with depth, with one starter type - DSJr. Frank "might" be a starter IF he comes along and depending on who he's paired with.

Not sure a DSJr/Frank or DSJr/Trier is a champ backcourt, no less playoff. Obviously the rest of the roster matters though.

We are gonna offer our lottery pick/2 dallas picks/dsj/ knox/zo and even one of our picks for AD.

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[thebuzzardman]

Smith
Dotson
Trier
Ntilikina

can it work? can it be the starting/bench backcourt of a chip team?

Nope.

But there's a strong chance the team adds Kyrie and/or a SG when they draft 2-6

It is, at the least, a nice bench with depth, with one starter type - DSJr. Frank "might" be a starter IF he comes along and depending on who he's paired with.

Not sure a DSJr/Frank or DSJr/Trier is a champ backcourt, no less playoff. Obviously the rest of the roster matters though.

We are gonna offer our lottery pick/2 dallas picks/dsj/ knox/zo and even one of our picks for AD.

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Maybe. Who knows. I hope not. AD is great. It's not remotely "Melo all over again". But the way it's similar is gutting depth. Trading away good young players and a pick of ours, plus 2 picks for depth - in effect, 6 or 7 cost controlled players for one guy.

Yup. I hope not.

[thebuzzardman]

With Frank and Mudiay being 6'5 and up what's to stop Fiz from a line up of dsj, mudiay, and Frank? He's tinkered with the line up so much I'll be shocked if he doesn't give it to us.

He would be smart to try it. Dotson and Trier are merely okay. Nice of DSJ to put thebgame on himself but he scored 31 of our 102 points. We don't have for real scorers any more.

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Well, Fiz had Kadeem/DSJr and Trier out there against the Raptors. I'm sure that's as much about the Knick's depth problems as it was also about whatever lineup the Raptors ran out there.

Fiz has shown he'll go 3 guard, and that's not including times Dotson was 3rd guard, since he's a sometimes SF.

Anyway, Fiz'll probably do it. That could be a lot of bricked jumpers though, on any given night. Then again, team is tanking, so why not?

[Greenie]

i expected so much this season. I was too impatient. I thought Frank would mature and catch on quick. Im going to calm down and wait to she how he turns out.

Fizdale never really gave Frank his shot. Fixdale had Frank on a short leash while Mudiay got all the love. I still believe in Frank but I'm not gonna keep banging the drum for him. The Knicks should give him a legitimate shot and then Frank has to do his part like start hitting his open 3s and to stop curling up into a turtle position when things aren't going his way. Hopefully we see movement on both sides.

Frank was getting 30 mins a game at the start of the year. He wasn’t producing nor does he look comfortable playing pg full time. We’ll see what the future holds but he’s frustrating to say the least.


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This.
He was literally starting at PG before Muddy got back.

This is all Frank

[Greenie]

Is Frank's defense better than Knox's offense?

part 2 - Is Frank's offense better than Knox's defense?

That's a tough call. I couldn't begin to say. Probably, but not by a lot?

Even. They’re both non existent

[Greenie]

Nope.

But there's a strong chance the team adds Kyrie and/or a SG when they draft 2-6

It is, at the least, a nice bench with depth, with one starter type - DSJr. Frank "might" be a starter IF he comes along and depending on who he's paired with.

Not sure a DSJr/Frank or DSJr/Trier is a champ backcourt, no less playoff. Obviously the rest of the roster matters though.

We are gonna offer our lottery pick/2 dallas picks/dsj/ knox/zo and even one of our picks for AD.

Sent from my SM-N960N using Tapatalk

Maybe. Who knows. I hope not. AD is great. It's not remotely "Melo all over again". But the way it's similar is gutting depth. Trading away good young players and a pick of ours, plus 2 picks for depth - in effect, 6 or 7 cost controlled players for one guy.

Yup. I hope not.

Not even. Both Chandler and Gallo needed to be paid. Neither were cost controlled anymore.

Frank
Knox
Dotson
Trier
Picks

For

Davis


Mitch
Davis
Kawhi
Brogdon
Smith

[thebuzzardman]

We are gonna offer our lottery pick/2 dallas picks/dsj/ knox/zo and even one of our picks for AD.

Sent from my SM-N960N using Tapatalk

Maybe. Who knows. I hope not. AD is great. It's not remotely "Melo all over again". But the way it's similar is gutting depth. Trading away good young players and a pick of ours, plus 2 picks for depth - in effect, 6 or 7 cost controlled players for one guy.

Yup. I hope not.

Not even. Both Chandler and Gallo needed to be paid. Neither were cost controlled anymore.

Frank
Knox
Dotson
Trier
Picks

For

Davis


Mitch
Davis
Kawhi
Brogdon
Smith

I get all that. You assume they'll be money left over for Brogdan. Well, I guess if Durant doesn't sign, which "might" be the key to any FA signings at all - we don't know. Since it's all speculation, that's ok. Also, wouldn't the Pels want DSJr in the deal? They already have "highest possible ceiling ever Frank" in JRue.
Dotson doesn't count for anything. There's 50 guys like him all over NBA. I guess for salary matching purposes. I like him. I like players that defend and shoot. Good teams usually have several. Knox, Trier and some picks would have value for the Pels though. How many? I'd assume the minimum is the Knick's first and both of the Mavs. But could be another Knicks pick.

Also, to the point about Gallo and Chandler, the Knicks were soon to be capped out after adding Melo to Stat; I guess it took Chandler (the C) to finish it off, but the team lacked flexibility of assets moving forward.

That would be a concern after any trade for AD. Not that losing Knox or Frank or even DSJr instead of Frank would be the end of the world after - the NBA is mostly about the quality of the starters/ immediate bench, and the team would have that, but the drop off would come quick, in effect the Knicks traded away 3 straight years of 1st round picks, and assuming they retain their picks other than the 2019, that'd be some stuff to use to make moves that fill out the team moving forward, but still feels just a bit light.
I like the concept. Feels like the Knicks are sort of a year or two early to really do it right. Take Philly. Sure, a most extreme example of "doing it right' but added Butler. Then added Harris. Still was able to make other deals, added a pick back IN.
They built the team up before that and STILL had the flexibility and assets to make TWO major deals. And then added in a pick after.

[cuyankees]

We are gonna offer our lottery pick/2 dallas picks/dsj/ knox/zo and even one of our picks for AD.

Sent from my SM-N960N using Tapatalk

Maybe. Who knows. I hope not. AD is great. It's not remotely "Melo all over again". But the way it's similar is gutting depth. Trading away good young players and a pick of ours, plus 2 picks for depth - in effect, 6 or 7 cost controlled players for one guy.

Yup. I hope not.

Not even. Both Chandler and Gallo needed to be paid. Neither were cost controlled anymore.

Frank
Knox
Dotson
Trier
Picks

For

Davis


Mitch
Davis
Kawhi
Brogdon
Smith

Trying her hardest to keep Mitch when you know damn well, he's the 1st guy they ask for.

[Jeff Van Gully]

Maybe. Who knows. I hope not. AD is great. It's not remotely "Melo all over again". But the way it's similar is gutting depth. Trading away good young players and a pick of ours, plus 2 picks for depth - in effect, 6 or 7 cost controlled players for one guy.

Yup. I hope not.

Not even. Both Chandler and Gallo needed to be paid. Neither were cost controlled anymore.

Frank
Knox
Dotson
Trier
Picks

For

Davis


Mitch
Davis
Kawhi
Brogdon
Smith

Trying her hardest to keep Mitch when you know damn well, he's the 1st guy they ask for.

oh lawd. keeping smiff AND mitch? can't see it. it's dsj/frank/mitch/knox AND 3-4 1sts def including 2019.

[cuyankees]

Not even. Both Chandler and Gallo needed to be paid. Neither were cost controlled anymore.

Frank
Knox
Dotson
Trier
Picks

For

Davis


Mitch
Davis
Kawhi
Brogdon
Smith

Trying her hardest to keep Mitch when you know damn well, he's the 1st guy they ask for.

oh lawd. keeping smiff AND mitch? can't see it. it's dsj/frank/mitch/knox AND 3-4 1sts def including 2019.

Spot on value wise.

Can't see a better package outside of BOS emptying the cupboard + JT & JB and even then NOP' preference rather than value.

[thebuzzardman]

Not even. Both Chandler and Gallo needed to be paid. Neither were cost controlled anymore.

Frank
Knox
Dotson
Trier
Picks

For

Davis


Mitch
Davis
Kawhi
Brogdon
Smith

Trying her hardest to keep Mitch when you know damn well, he's the 1st guy they ask for.

oh lawd. keeping smiff AND mitch? can't see it. it's dsj/frank/mitch/knox AND 3-4 1sts def including 2019.

I tried to avoid the fact that the team constructed was the "Players Greenie likes All Star team"
And by likes, I mean by how they play, just so there's no confusion. But yeah, Pels would be like "Mitch please. And a helping of DSJr".

[Greenie]

Maybe. Who knows. I hope not. AD is great. It's not remotely "Melo all over again". But the way it's similar is gutting depth. Trading away good young players and a pick of ours, plus 2 picks for depth - in effect, 6 or 7 cost controlled players for one guy.

Yup. I hope not.

Not even. Both Chandler and Gallo needed to be paid. Neither were cost controlled anymore.

Frank
Knox
Dotson
Trier
Picks

For

Davis


Mitch
Davis
Kawhi
Brogdon
Smith

I get all that. You assume they'll be money left over for Brogdan. Well, I guess if Durant doesn't sign, which "might" be the key to any FA signings at all - we don't know. Since it's all speculation, that's ok. Also, wouldn't the Pels want DSJr in the deal? They already have "highest possible ceiling ever Frank" in JRue.
Dotson doesn't count for anything. There's 50 guys like him all over NBA. I guess for salary matching purposes. I like him. I like players that defend and shoot. Good teams usually have several. Knox, Trier and some picks would have value for the Pels though. How many? I'd assume the minimum is the Knick's first and both of the Mavs. But could be another Knicks pick.

Also, to the point about Gallo and Chandler, the Knicks were soon to be capped out after adding Melo to Stat; I guess it took Chandler (the C) to finish it off, but the team lacked flexibility of assets moving forward.

That would be a concern after any trade for AD. Not that losing Knox or Frank or even DSJr instead of Frank would be the end of the world after - the NBA is mostly about the quality of the starters/ immediate bench, and the team would have that, but the drop off would come quick, in effect the Knicks traded away 3 straight years of 1st round picks, and assuming they retain their picks other than the 2019, that'd be some stuff to use to make moves that fill out the team moving forward, but still feels just a bit light.
I like the concept. Feels like the Knicks are sort of a year or two early to really do it right. Take Philly. Sure, a most extreme example of "doing it right' but added Butler. Then added Harris. Still was able to make other deals, added a pick back IN.
They built the team up before that and STILL had the flexibility and assets to make TWO major deals. And then added in a pick after.

We lacked flexibility after summer 2010.
We couldn’t have signed Melo outright.

People forget the cap situation here. It truly does stay fuqed up. This summer will be the first time ever that our cap isn’t trash.

[thebuzzardman]

Not even. Both Chandler and Gallo needed to be paid. Neither were cost controlled anymore.

Frank
Knox
Dotson
Trier
Picks

For

Davis


Mitch
Davis
Kawhi
Brogdon
Smith

I get all that. You assume they'll be money left over for Brogdan. Well, I guess if Durant doesn't sign, which "might" be the key to any FA signings at all - we don't know. Since it's all speculation, that's ok. Also, wouldn't the Pels want DSJr in the deal? They already have "highest possible ceiling ever Frank" in JRue.
Dotson doesn't count for anything. There's 50 guys like him all over NBA. I guess for salary matching purposes. I like him. I like players that defend and shoot. Good teams usually have several. Knox, Trier and some picks would have value for the Pels though. How many? I'd assume the minimum is the Knick's first and both of the Mavs. But could be another Knicks pick.

Also, to the point about Gallo and Chandler, the Knicks were soon to be capped out after adding Melo to Stat; I guess it took Chandler (the C) to finish it off, but the team lacked flexibility of assets moving forward.

That would be a concern after any trade for AD. Not that losing Knox or Frank or even DSJr instead of Frank would be the end of the world after - the NBA is mostly about the quality of the starters/ immediate bench, and the team would have that, but the drop off would come quick, in effect the Knicks traded away 3 straight years of 1st round picks, and assuming they retain their picks other than the 2019, that'd be some stuff to use to make moves that fill out the team moving forward, but still feels just a bit light.
I like the concept. Feels like the Knicks are sort of a year or two early to really do it right. Take Philly. Sure, a most extreme example of "doing it right' but added Butler. Then added Harris. Still was able to make other deals, added a pick back IN.
They built the team up before that and STILL had the flexibility and assets to make TWO major deals. And then added in a pick after.

We lacked flexibility after summer 2010.
We couldn’t have signed Melo outright.

People forget the cap situation here. It truly does stay fuqed up. This summer will be the first time ever that our cap isn’t trash.

True all that. I don't compare the Melo situation in terms of assets - Chandler and Gallo had to go, it was the price of Melo, and the cap wouldn't allow it - so I get they had to trade for him. Or sign him after renouncing those guys. Not going to quibble over details for the 1000th time about Mozgov etc (picks).

Just more about the state of the team during his tenure due to bad cap/asset management. Obviously this is different, as a stronger team with 'some' more assets are present, but I have real doubts the team would maintain the right kind of flexibility a post AD trade. Surely it's a better, more balanced team, offense/defense, then the Melo/Stat team. I'd just rather get lucky, draft Zion, and build with a pair of FA's and him, as it would retain assets, if not cap flexibility. Which could traded for by moving drafted guys over the ensuing 4 years.

[DimesandKnicks]

After watching a few games (not enough o make a proper evaluation I know), I'd still rather have Frank. Particularly after watching last game and observing Smith Jr.'s body language and looking for refs to bail him out after every wild layup. Accountability is a huge part of getting better.

[DOT]

I'd rather have both tbh

Only problem I have with the concept of a DSJ/Frank backcourt is that DSJ isn't big enough to switch onto 2s consistently, which does limit our defensive potential, but it is what it is. Stylistically, they can compliment each other well enough, especially given what I've seen of DSJ's willingness to move the ball. Plus, they seem like good friends off the court, so maybe we get some of that chemistry to translate on court.

Just have to get them to work on getting some consistency with their jump shots, but they're like 20, I'm not that impatient. I'll keep saying it until we end up getting rid of one or both of them, but they have the potential to be a better version of the Kemba/Batum backcourt

[KnixinSix]

Man I am a little worried about the tank if dsjr plays like this. fiz started putting Frank on the best players like harden, Paul George and westbrook and he was playing them really good. Frank slowing down the other teams best player and dsjr going off could result in some wins.

And Frank pick and roll defense is technically the best in the league when he has a shotblocker behind him. now he will have two with deandre and mitch.

So long as we remain in the bottom 4, we each get a 14% chance, right?

True. I don't think we are at risk of falling out of the top four. But 1 seed is a guarantee of a top 5 pick.

Thenewlotteryoddsarewhack

Even with worst record you have a 48 percent chance of picking 5

[BasicBall]

If Knicks do get that number 1 overall pick, I ain’t too sure I’d trade it for AD....I’d damn sure trade anything other than that number 1 for AD.

But I really don’t think I’d trade Zion for AD!! That kid is special!!

And for the record I’m kinda excited about seeing a backcourt of Frank and DSJ cause I ain’t too keen on Kyrie either. I’d take KD & Kawhi first actually.

[taj2133]

I need to see frank improve and let his game do the talking because i need to see some drastic improvement the next 25 games.