2018/19 ROY/Rookie Discussion Thread (III)

[Buzzard]

See, good game despite poor efficiency and TOs.

Good is not elite Bob. Trae nor Doncic will ever be confused with CP3 or PG-13 on the defensive end of the floor. Which is my whole point about efficiency. Neither will be elite until they are consistently efficient.

That is just the way it is for high value/high usage offensive players.

I will always put winning in front of efficiency. Great clutch time means much more than great 1st Q. You can have very efficient game and poor important possessions.

You sound like Luka and Trae are very similar players. One 6’8, 230, second 6’2, 185? Advanced stats show that they’re very different.

That’s all from me.

They are similar in the way that their teams are going to depend on them on the offensive end of the floor. Surely you see that.

[Bob8]

Good is not elite Bob. Trae nor Doncic will ever be confused with CP3 or PG-13 on the defensive end of the floor. Which is my whole point about efficiency. Neither will be elite until they are consistently efficient.

That is just the way it is for high value/high usage offensive players.

I will always put winning in front of efficiency. Great clutch time means much more than great 1st Q. You can have very efficient game and poor important possessions.

You sound like Luka and Trae are very similar players. One 6’8, 230, second 6’2, 185? Advanced stats show that they’re very different.

That’s all from me.

They are similar in the way that their teams are going to depend on them on the offensive end of the floor. Surely you see that.

I believe that Luka as very good rebounder and good weak side defender will eventually become + team defender.

[LKN]

I will always put winning in front of efficiency. Great clutch time means much more than great 1st Q. You can have very efficient game and poor important possessions.

You sound like Luka and Trae are very similar players. One 6’8, 230, second 6’2, 185? Advanced stats show that they’re very different.

That’s all from me.

They are similar in the way that their teams are going to depend on them on the offensive end of the floor. Surely you see that.

I believe that Luka as very good rebounder and good weak side defender will eventually become + team defender.

Luka is already decent on defense and if he's willing to put in the work he can at least be a good defender (esp from a team standpoint)

[LKN]

Would you beat Lakers without Trae? Of course not. Subpar game means you’re a liability. And Trae was instrumental for the win. Look at top20 TOs list. Almost like looking at the list of best players in the league. Why is that? Because they’re creating for themselves and others, you’re bound to have some TOs doing that. Luka’s 2-pointers are 20% assisted and 3-pointers under 50% assisted. More unassisted shots means lower efficiency. Someone will say he should select shots more wisely and create more for others. That’s true in theory, if you playing for the good team. But if you’re first scorer, rebounder and assistant, playing basically with bench unit, who will take those shots?

Like all other data, efficiency has to be taken in the contex. DAJ has 70% Fg, because he’s that good player? The right approach is eye test, raw and advanced stats and wins. Every single data has some limitations but all 4 together show you pretty accurate picture.

Its not only that. People forget there is a coach involved. You know the dude from the bench telling guys how to play and taking them out and putting them in. It is very probable that the coach:
1. does not care for playoffs in a transition season.
2. Wants to prepare Luka to be "the man" to take games by the neck when they start to compete.
3. Gives him not only free reign but encourages him to take hard shoots so that he can learn what works and what does not work against other teams.

I would be surprised if Luka would have the same shoot selection once they start to contend.

He won’t. He will have KP + 1 or 2 new scoring threats in the starting unit. People just don’t realize how bad Mavs roster is after the trades. I find very unlikely that they can win more than another 10 wins, probably less.

I mean their 2nd best player is Max Kleber I guess? LOL

[E-Balla]

Mitch is just an absolute monster. He's now played 41 career games. He scored double digit points in 5 out of the first 36 games. Starting 5 games ago we've had DSJ on the team. He's scored double digit points each game now with DSJ.

I'm loving it. If this is what Mitch at full strength could consistently play like he'd be the best defensive player in the NBA easily.

[islanders11040]

Watch on YouTube

[Johnny Firpo]

Luka had a really bad second half, but the whole team laid a collective egg there. I wonder how our rotation and Luka's mindset changes once it's obvious that we have to let go of the playoffs. For some reason I struggle to see Luka doing particularly well on a team that lost the goal to fight for. We'll see, I hope the All-Star weekend will refresh him a little bit, but he'll probably hang out with some superstars and eat some questionable food. All good even if it happens, he's still a kid. I also wonder how KP's evaluation will go, I still have a little hope that he could play this year. Probably a looooong shot.

[Speadge]

Luka had a really bad second half, but the whole team laid a collective egg there. I wonder how our rotation and Luka's mindset changes once it's obvious that we have to let go of the playoffs. For some reason I struggle to see Luka doing particularly well on a team that lost the goal to fight for. We'll see, I hope the All-Star weekend will refresh him a little bit, but he'll probably hang out with some superstars and eat some questionable food. All good even if it happens, he's still a kid. I also wonder how KP's evaluation will go, I still have a little hope that he could play this year. Probably a looooong shot.

That was expected after Mavericks traded all four starters. Whole Mavericks game base on him solely more than ever. This may answers his worse performance in second half last night:

It's funny seeing Luka being aggressively doubled already. Can you imagine have Kristaps on the floor with him in the future? Let alone a potential third star and THJ? Good luck doubling anyone.

[mcmurphy]

Mitch is just an absolute monster. He's now played 41 career games. He scored double digit points in 5 out of the first 36 games. Starting 5 games ago we've had DSJ on the team. He's scored double digit points each game now with DSJ.

I'm loving it. If this is what Mitch at full strength could consistently play like he'd be the best defensive player in the NBA easily.

It's the proof that a good scouting is more important than a good pick (outside of top 5).

I'm sure that is more valuable now Robinson picked at #36 than Knox at #9 or Ntilikina at #8.

[Archx]

Luka had a really bad second half, but the whole team laid a collective egg there. I wonder how our rotation and Luka's mindset changes once it's obvious that we have to let go of the playoffs. For some reason I struggle to see Luka doing particularly well on a team that lost the goal to fight for. We'll see, I hope the All-Star weekend will refresh him a little bit, but he'll probably hang out with some superstars and eat some questionable food. All good even if it happens, he's still a kid. I also wonder how KP's evaluation will go, I still have a little hope that he could play this year. Probably a looooong shot.

Well i can't remember i ever saw a rookie being double teamed at the mid court all game. It was just silly how tight MIA guarded him, almost like he was Harden lol. It's true that he could have hit more shots but at this point i am convinced that it has something to do with the lack of conditioning and strength. And yet, he was 1 assist away from another triple double. He has so much room to improve and to learn it's insane.

D.Wade after the game said ..... "Quote me right where I say this—it’s LeBron James-like from the standpoint of how he’s able to rope that pass to shooters in corners, getting blitzed,” Wade said of Doncic’s passing ability... “There’s not many guys who can do that and put it right there. He does an amazing job of it.”

[shakes0]

Luka had a really bad second half, but the whole team laid a collective egg there. I wonder how our rotation and Luka's mindset changes once it's obvious that we have to let go of the playoffs. For some reason I struggle to see Luka doing particularly well on a team that lost the goal to fight for. We'll see, I hope the All-Star weekend will refresh him a little bit, but he'll probably hang out with some superstars and eat some questionable food. All good even if it happens, he's still a kid. I also wonder how KP's evaluation will go, I still have a little hope that he could play this year. Probably a looooong shot.

I'll tell you something, ever since that trade Dallas has become pretty much unwatchable. That sucks cause I've been enjoying watching Luka all season, but now it's become torture to sit through a Mavs game. Last night I actually gave up in the 2nd quarter and watched Denver vs Sacramento instead.

I might have to say good bye to Luka till next October.

[drekwins]

Luka had a really bad second half, but the whole team laid a collective egg there. I wonder how our rotation and Luka's mindset changes once it's obvious that we have to let go of the playoffs. For some reason I struggle to see Luka doing particularly well on a team that lost the goal to fight for. We'll see, I hope the All-Star weekend will refresh him a little bit, but he'll probably hang out with some superstars and eat some questionable food. All good even if it happens, he's still a kid. I also wonder how KP's evaluation will go, I still have a little hope that he could play this year. Probably a looooong shot.

I'll tell you something, ever since that trade Dallas has become pretty much unwatchable. That sucks cause I've been enjoying watching Luka all season, but now it's become torture to sit through a Mavs game. Last night I actually gave up in the 2nd quarter and watched Denver vs Sacramento instead.

I might have to say good bye to Luka till next October.

That's the Tim Hardaway Jr. effect. It doesn't get better.

[NYKHardKnock]

Read on Twitter

DJ/CLINT? Nooo he playing like that ATM, we need to re-evaluate his potential

Spoiler:

Orlando Magic Dwight Howard — potential

[PhilBlackson]

I still really like Bagley's potential.

They just need to work on his ballhandling and passing like they did with Giannis and Siakam. Especially given his rebounding ability so he can rip & run like they do. Obviously continuing to improve his shooting touch will just open up the floor for him and that will be scary given his speed at that height. Definitely will be keeping an eye on him as he evolves.

[WalterBenjamin]

If Luka is your PG you are giving up penetration compared to Trae. Is the addition of a biger player with Luka enough to override the same offensive game of Trae with a aditional 3 D wing that plays better defense than Luka for his position. I wouldnt jump to conclusions to early who adds more flexibility to a team striving for a championship.

[Bob8]

Luka had a really bad second half, but the whole team laid a collective egg there. I wonder how our rotation and Luka's mindset changes once it's obvious that we have to let go of the playoffs. For some reason I struggle to see Luka doing particularly well on a team that lost the goal to fight for. We'll see, I hope the All-Star weekend will refresh him a little bit, but he'll probably hang out with some superstars and eat some questionable food. All good even if it happens, he's still a kid. I also wonder how KP's evaluation will go, I still have a little hope that he could play this year. Probably a looooong shot.

I'll tell you something, ever since that trade Dallas has become pretty much unwatchable. That sucks cause I've been enjoying watching Luka all season, but now it's become torture to sit through a Mavs game. Last night I actually gave up in the 2nd quarter and watched Denver vs Sacramento instead.

I might have to say good bye to Luka till next October.

The trade was great rebuilding move. It also gave opportunity for a players they count on for the future to play more. And it gave them solid chances to retain the pick without true tanking. But yes, unfortunately this last 25 games will be very difficult to watch.

[Johnny Firpo]

If Luka is your PG you are giving up penetration compared to Trae. Is the addition of a biger player with Luka enough to override the same offensive game of Trae with a aditional 3 D wing that plays better defense than Luka for his position. I wouldnt jump to conclusions to early who adds more flexibility to a team striving for a championship.

Luka is excellent at getting to the rim, I don't see this as an issue at all.

[Oscar9992]

Updated Rookie Ladder Week 15:

1. Luka Doncic (Has been 1'st since 1'st Week!!!)
2. Trae Young
3. Deandre Ayton
4. Marvin Baigley
5. Colin Sexton

Jaren Jackson suddenly falls out of Top 5!

http://www.nba.com/rookie-ladder

[mcmurphy]

Updated Rookie Ladder Week 15:

1. Luka Doncic (Has been 1'st since 1'st Week!!!)
2. Trae Young
3. Deandre Ayton
4. Marvin Baigley
5. Colin Sexton

Jaren Jackson suddenly falls out of Top 5!

http://www.nba.com/rookie-ladder

I don't know in what galaxy Sexton is better of JJ... I prefere Robinson over Sexton

[WalterBenjamin]

If Luka is your PG you are giving up penetration compared to Trae. Is the addition of a biger player with Luka enough to override the same offensive game of Trae with a aditional 3 D wing that plays better defense than Luka for his position. I wouldnt jump to conclusions to early who adds more flexibility to a team striving for a championship.

Luka is excellent at getting to the rim, I don't see this as an issue at all.

Compared to who? Not close to elite players at driving to the rim.