OFFICIAL: Harris, Marjanovic & Scott Traded to 76ers for Shamet, Chandler & Picks

[Quake Griffin]

People ask why the Clippers wait to "tank". I do not look at this team as intentionally tanking. Few superstar FA want to come to a dumpster fire of a team unless its for totally non basketball reasons. I hope Doc was being truthful when he said they are trying to win ALTHOUGH seeing the minute allocation last game made me wonder what was going on.

Has an elite FA ever signed with a 40-43 win team by himself and no other superstars?

I need an example of one EVER doing it.
I do know examples of FAs signing with awful teams.

[Galloisdaman]

People ask why the Clippers wait to "tank". I do not look at this team as intentionally tanking. Few superstar FA want to come to a dumpster fire of a team unless its for totally non basketball reasons. I hope Doc was being truthful when he said they are trying to win ALTHOUGH seeing the minute allocation last game made me wonder what was going on.

Has an elite FA ever signed with a 40-43 win team by himself and no other superstars?

I need an example of one EVER doing it.
I do know examples of FAs signing with awful teams.

From my memory I can not recall exact records but I do think many FA would prefer a competitive team over a dumpster fire. That does not mean exactly 40-43 wins. It just means having a chance at the playoffs or being in the playoffs the prior year.
Mutumbo to the Hawks
Shaq to LA
Horace Grant to Orlando
Pippen to Portland

Who are all the big name FA you know of that signed with teams that had 20 wins or less?

[esqtvd]

If I'm Tobias's agent I'm thrilled by this deal. Not only does he go to one of the best teams in the east but think of how much leverage he has now. Philly/Brand would look kind of bad if Tobias left as a FA after giving up 2 first round picks (albeit futures). That would be hard to explain to the Philly fans so they kind of have Philly management over a barrel.

Same as when Jamal and Austin got big contracts from the capped-out Clippers in 2016. We couldn't sign anyone else above the minimum. It was them or Jimmer Fredette.

Sixers can't fit any other premium FAs under the cap except Tobias and Butler. If they don't mind the lux tax, it's the same as GSW. Signing your own is the only way to legally build up a 3-or-4 star juggernaut. Philly seems to have gone all-in while they still could, with Simmons coming up for the max next year.

https://sixerswire.usatoday.com/2019/02/07/philadelphia-76ers-tobias-harris-trade-cap-space-2019-offseason/

The 76ers upcoming offseason will have historic luxury tax obligations

Jimmy Butler has a player option for $19.84M that he is expected to decline. When he opts out, he will have a $30.66M cap hold that will be on the Sixers books this summer.

Tobias Harris is entering unrestricted free agency with a $22.2M cap hold. Their 2019 first round pick is currently projected at No. 23 overall at the time of this article, so its current projected cap hold is being accounted for as well.

As such, they will operate over the salary cap to re-sign Butler, Harris, Redick and possibly even T.J. McConnell to long term deals using their bird rights. Ultimately, keeping this roster together will cost the Sixers a historic amount when you consider the future luxury tax implications. They will almost certainly be in the luxury tax next season and for years to come as well.

New deals for Butler, Harris and Redick should push the Sixers very close to the luxury tax. Butler and Harris are both eligible for five-year, $190 million deals with the Sixers with starting salaries of $32.7M.

While there is a chance that Butler and Harris could get slightly less than that, one would assume they come very close to it.

[esqtvd]

People ask why the Clippers wait to "tank". I do not look at this team as intentionally tanking. Few superstar FA want to come to a dumpster fire of a team unless its for totally non basketball reasons. I hope Doc was being truthful when he said they are trying to win ALTHOUGH seeing the minute allocation last game made me wonder what was going on.

Has an elite FA ever signed with a 40-43 win team by himself and no other superstars?

I need an example of one EVER doing it.
I do know examples of FAs signing with awful teams.

From my memory I can not recall exact records but I do think many FA would prefer a competitive team over a dumpster fire. That does not mean exactly 40-43 wins. It just means having a chance at the playoffs or being in the playoffs the prior year.
Mutumbo to the Hawks
Shaq to LA
Horace Grant to Orlando
Pippen to Portland

Who are all the big name FA you know of that signed with teams that had 20 wins or less?

PREDICTION: Tobias will not be one of them.

"You can get a million touches on a bottom-five team. But you look at the game and see the shot distribution, the field goal percentages, and at the end of the game, you see 117-110. That's the thing about the league now, everybody gets so caught up in the numbers, but you win, you have fun, there's a joy to the game...it's that little bit of sacrifice everybody has to take, just a little bit, for the greater goal. And that's to be the team we want to be."

https://www.phillyvoice.com/new-look-sixers-stress-togetherness-following-win-tobias-harris-debut/

[Ben Simmons]

only seen him play once and Tobias is already my 3rd favorite player in the NBA (i like Ben Simmons and Jimmy Butler more)

[UKClipperfan]

I was floored when I heard the return for Tobias. I was thinking maybe we re sign him if we strike out on the 2 max FAs we've been targeting while also building around SGA. Now we can low key make a competitive offer for AD. Thats some turnaround. And with how convinced people seem to be that we get Kawhi? Its pretty damn exciting that we now have the assets to trade for a blue chipper to put next to Kawhi or whoever we get. Credit to the FO whatever the outcome.

[Ranma]

Read on Twitter

[Quake Griffin]

People ask why the Clippers wait to "tank". I do not look at this team as intentionally tanking. Few superstar FA want to come to a dumpster fire of a team unless its for totally non basketball reasons. I hope Doc was being truthful when he said they are trying to win ALTHOUGH seeing the minute allocation last game made me wonder what was going on.

Has an elite FA ever signed with a 40-43 win team by himself and no other superstars?

I need an example of one EVER doing it.
I do know examples of FAs signing with awful teams.

From my memory I can not recall exact records but I do think many FA would prefer a competitive team over a dumpster fire. That does not mean exactly 40-43 wins. It just means having a chance at the playoffs or being in the playoffs the prior year.
Mutumbo to the Hawks
Shaq to LA
Horace Grant to Orlando
Pippen to Portland

Who are all the big name FA you know of that signed with teams that had 20 wins or less?

All Star but not elite....46 wins too.
50+ wins.
50+ wins for Orlando but not elite.
Old and not elite and Portland made it to ECF.

I've never seen one sign with a 20 win or less team but as I've stated ITT before, LeBron (twice) and Nash signed with two 30+ win teams and a 29 win team. Both of them could have looked at "losing culture" and said no. They looked under the hood, saw talented players/ building blocks and made their decision....which is what FAs do.

Players want to play with talent....not Mike Scott, Luc Mbah Moute, and Avery Bradley because Ballmer is going full steam ahead to win as much as he can with "seasoned" cheap vets...."seasoned" cheap vets that guys like Kawhi probably won't be playing with much if it all over the life of his deal if he were to sign here.


Knicks currently 11-47 btw.
How many people are filing their objections to Durant and Cryrie signing there because it's a dumpsterfire????
Haven't seen it yet.

[Galloisdaman]

Has an elite FA ever signed with a 40-43 win team by himself and no other superstars?

I need an example of one EVER doing it.
I do know examples of FAs signing with awful teams.

From my memory I can not recall exact records but I do think many FA would prefer a competitive team over a dumpster fire. That does not mean exactly 40-43 wins. It just means having a chance at the playoffs or being in the playoffs the prior year.
Mutumbo to the Hawks
Shaq to LA
Horace Grant to Orlando
Pippen to Portland

Who are all the big name FA you know of that signed with teams that had 20 wins or less?

All Star but not elite....46 wins too.
50+ wins.
50+ wins for Orlando but not elite.
Old and not elite and Portland made it to ECF.

I've never seen one sign with a 20 win or less team but as I've stated ITT before, LeBron (twice) and Nash signed with two 30+ win teams and a 29 win team. Both of them could have looked at "losing culture" and said no. They looked under the hood, saw talented players/ building blocks and made their decision....which is what FAs do.

Players want to play with talent....not Mike Scott, Luc Mbah Moute, and Avery Bradley because Ballmer is going full steam ahead to win as much as he can with "seasoned" cheap vets...."seasoned" cheap vets that guys like Kawhi probably won't be playing with much if it all over the life of his deal if he were to sign here.


Knicks currently 11-47 btw.
How many people are filing their objections to Durant and Cryrie signing there because it's a dumpsterfire????
Haven't seen it yet.

Superstar FA have said they were going to NY for over a decade to help get max $. How many have actually gone?

How many teams have people said Durant and Kyrie are going to in just the last 3 months? How can they play on all those teams at once? Paul George was 100% going to LA as well....but.....

Knicks have been a dumpster fire for years. Who are all the superstars that they have signed there as UFA in the last 10 years? Why didn't Durant choose to sign with the Knicks 3 years ago instead of Golden State?

[Quake Griffin]

From my memory I can not recall exact records but I do think many FA would prefer a competitive team over a dumpster fire. That does not mean exactly 40-43 wins. It just means having a chance at the playoffs or being in the playoffs the prior year.
Mutumbo to the Hawks
Shaq to LA
Horace Grant to Orlando
Pippen to Portland

Who are all the big name FA you know of that signed with teams that had 20 wins or less?

All Star but not elite....46 wins too.
50+ wins.
50+ wins for Orlando but not elite.
Old and not elite and Portland made it to ECF.

I've never seen one sign with a 20 win or less team but as I've stated ITT before, LeBron (twice) and Nash signed with two 30+ win teams and a 29 win team. Both of them could have looked at "losing culture" and said no. They looked under the hood, saw talented players/ building blocks and made their decision....which is what FAs do.

Players want to play with talent....not Mike Scott, Luc Mbah Moute, and Avery Bradley because Ballmer is going full steam ahead to win as much as he can with "seasoned" cheap vets...."seasoned" cheap vets that guys like Kawhi probably won't be playing with much if it all over the life of his deal if he were to sign here.


Knicks currently 11-47 btw.
How many people are filing their objections to Durant and Cryrie signing there because it's a dumpsterfire????
Haven't seen it yet.

Superstar FA have said they were going to NY for over a decade to help get max $. How many have actually gone?

How many teams have people said Durant and Kyrie are going to in just the last 3 months? How can they play on all those teams at once? Paul George was 100% going to LA as well....but.....

Knicks have been a dumpster fire for years. Who are all the superstars that they have signed there as UFA in the last 10 years? Why didn't Durant choose to sign with the Knicks 3 years ago instead of Golden State?

Not exactly the point.

We are in agreement that FAs don’t want to sign up to dumpster fires. My point is, not all losing situations are dumpsterfires.


The Knicks are a dumpsterfire. A sure one On several levels btw, not just overall W/L record....but somehow no one is shocked they are in the mix and no one would be floored if stars signed there....because they don’t believe this winning culture crap as much as they lead on.

Like I said before. Move the Clippers to Seattle next season and let’s see how much the winning culture attracts Kawhi.

To answer you directly....
Amare signed a max deal there during the summer of LeDecision....he signed there after the Knicks had NINE CONSECUTIVE LOSING SEASONS!

Nine!

Then Melo forced his way there.

[Galloisdaman]

All Star but not elite....46 wins too.
50+ wins.
50+ wins for Orlando but not elite.
Old and not elite and Portland made it to ECF.

I've never seen one sign with a 20 win or less team but as I've stated ITT before, LeBron (twice) and Nash signed with two 30+ win teams and a 29 win team. Both of them could have looked at "losing culture" and said no. They looked under the hood, saw talented players/ building blocks and made their decision....which is what FAs do.

Players want to play with talent....not Mike Scott, Luc Mbah Moute, and Avery Bradley because Ballmer is going full steam ahead to win as much as he can with "seasoned" cheap vets...."seasoned" cheap vets that guys like Kawhi probably won't be playing with much if it all over the life of his deal if he were to sign here.


Knicks currently 11-47 btw.
How many people are filing their objections to Durant and Cryrie signing there because it's a dumpsterfire????
Haven't seen it yet.

Superstar FA have said they were going to NY for over a decade to help get max $. How many have actually gone?

How many teams have people said Durant and Kyrie are going to in just the last 3 months? How can they play on all those teams at once? Paul George was 100% going to LA as well....but.....

Knicks have been a dumpster fire for years. Who are all the superstars that they have signed there as UFA in the last 10 years? Why didn't Durant choose to sign with the Knicks 3 years ago instead of Golden State?

Not exactly the point.

We are in agreement that FAs don’t want to sign up to dumpster fires. My point is, not all losing situations are dumpsterfires.


The Knicks are a dumpsterfire. A sure one On several levels btw, not just overall W/L record....but somehow no one is shocked they are in the mix and no one would be floored if stars signed there....because they don’t believe this winning culture crap as much as they lead on.

Like I said before. Move the Clippers to Seattle next season and let’s see how much the winning culture attracts Kawhi.

To answer you directly....
Amare signed a max deal there during the summer of LeDecision....he signed there after the Knicks had NINE CONSECUTIVE LOSING SEASONS!

Nine!

Then Melo forced his way there.

Amare was the Knicks 5th choice after the guys that mentioned NY previously all declined. The Knicks were not Amare's first choice either. Nobody else would give Amare the $ he was seeking. I think Amare was actually a trade but I understand your point. Sadly despite a great start as a Knick (MVP in his first 40-50 games) his best days were behind him. He could no longer defend.

I agree that not every player is attracted to a winning environment but most of the leagues best guys want to win. Some guys its about $$$. Some about media spotlight. Some about geographical location but I do not think many are attracted to losing.

[Quake Griffin]

Superstar FA have said they were going to NY for over a decade to help get max $. How many have actually gone?

How many teams have people said Durant and Kyrie are going to in just the last 3 months? How can they play on all those teams at once? Paul George was 100% going to LA as well....but.....

Knicks have been a dumpster fire for years. Who are all the superstars that they have signed there as UFA in the last 10 years? Why didn't Durant choose to sign with the Knicks 3 years ago instead of Golden State?

Not exactly the point.

We are in agreement that FAs don’t want to sign up to dumpster fires. My point is, not all losing situations are dumpsterfires.


The Knicks are a dumpsterfire. A sure one On several levels btw, not just overall W/L record....but somehow no one is shocked they are in the mix and no one would be floored if stars signed there....because they don’t believe this winning culture crap as much as they lead on.

Like I said before. Move the Clippers to Seattle next season and let’s see how much the winning culture attracts Kawhi.

To answer you directly....
Amare signed a max deal there during the summer of LeDecision....he signed there after the Knicks had NINE CONSECUTIVE LOSING SEASONS!

Nine!

Then Melo forced his way there.

Amare was the Knicks 5th choice after the guys that mentioned NY previously all declined. The Knicks were not Amare's first choice either. Nobody else would give Amare the $ he was seeking. I think Amare was actually a trade but I understand your point. Sadly despite a great start as a Knick (MVP in his first 40-50 games) his best days were behind him. He could no longer defend.

I agree that not every player is attracted to a winning environment but most of the leagues best guys want to win. Some guys its about $$$. Some about media spotlight. Some about geographical location but I do not think many are attracted to losing.

They’re not.

They’re attracted to good scenarios and quality players they think they can win with.

[esqtvd]

The Knicks are an exception anyway, the largest city and the largest market in the US, still with a rabid fan base, and according to Forbes, the most valued franchise in the NBA at $4 billion.

Still, not much luck in the FA dept.


The real question is whether if the Clips let themselves tank, FAs would want to waste years of their prime waiting for the team to become a contender.

[Quake Griffin]

Every time it happens, it’s an exception. Just lol.

Lol at the real question.
As if that question is off the table with a Clipper team hovering around .500.

[Quake Griffin]

Gallo...

CP3 also agreed with Neil Oshey to opt into the 2nd and last year left on his deal, so Neil Oshey would go through with the trade to the Clips.

In short, while not an FA, he chose to be here.

Clippers were 32-50.
4 or 5 straight years no playoffs.

CP chose Blake Griffin and DeAndre over the idea of LAC being a losing culture.

They choose good players and scenarios for them.
Not W/L records.
Definitely not Avery Bradley or Mike Scott. Just lol.

[esqtvd]

Every time it happens, it’s an exception. Just lol.

Lol at the real question.
As if that question is off the table with a Clipper team hovering around .500.

LOL is not an argument. And yes, the NYK certainly are an exception. STILL it's not helping attract FAs. LOL yourself...

As for hovering around .500, that's where we need to be. If we were tanking, that would be a negative. If we make the playoffs, we lose the 17th [or worse] pick. BFD.

Even if the 17th became a player, it'd take 2-3 years, when the FA's contract is almost up. The 17th draft pick doesn't mean squat to a FA.

[Quake Griffin]

Every time something cuts against your argument, calling it an exception is not an argument.
LOLing at a lack of an argument works just fine here and it works just fine a few posts up.

Just lol.

Having more tradeable assets for a capped out team (hopefully we get 2 FAs) moving forward > Being capped out and having no options (See Lob City Clips).

[esqtvd]

Every time something cuts against your argument, calling it an exception is not an argument.
LOLing at a lack of an argument works just fine here and it works just fine a few posts up.

Just lol.

Having more tradeable assets for a capped out team (hopefully we get 2 FAs) moving forward > Being capped out and having no options (See Lob City Clips).

You're talking about the 17th pick. Or worse. BFD.

It all sounds good until you look at the specifics. But playing well and losing the 17th pick is not going to move the meter--except maybe positively. The 17th pick is not going to make an impact for years. If ever. FAs don't care about the 17th pick.

[Quake Griffin]

They will care about having as many assets as possible to help a capped out team get better.

They won’t sign up for Lob City cap hell.

Get over it.

[Galloisdaman]

I think Jerry West and this organization have tried hard to keep the identity of the Clippers as a strong one. The Clippers were a joke for decades. They do not want that reputation to come back. Leave that to some of the other franchises. There are many factors FA look at with the first factor often being $$$ but being a well run franchise is among those factors.