UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy

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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#161 » by REDDzone » Wed Mar 6, 2019 3:47 pm

cowboyronnie wrote:The UFC may not make the competition-value decisions. But why would the fans not? Askren got knocked around, slammed on his head (a wrestler), and pounded stupid. The odds on him winning a re-match with Lawler would surely be lower than his original odds on beating Lawler. He won because of what we all acknowledge was a fluke and an act of God. Not really anyone's fault. But let's not run it back because Askren - a loud-mouth whose biggest win is, like, Lima by UD in Windsor 7 years ago - doesn't want to?


Um yea, that's pretty much exactly it. Askren is an independent contractor. He fights who he wants. He's not a champion who is obligated to fight who the UFC wants him to fight for the belt.

Was that a trick question? Should he be forced to fight?
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#162 » by Susan » Wed Mar 6, 2019 3:51 pm

cowboyronnie wrote:The UFC may not make the competition-value decisions. But why would the fans not? Askren got knocked around, slammed on his head (a wrestler), and pounded stupid. The odds on him winning a re-match with Lawler would surely be lower than his original odds on beating Lawler. He won because of what we all acknowledge was a fluke and an act of God. Not really anyone's fault. But let's not run it back because Askren - a loud-mouth whose biggest win is, like, Lima by UD in Windsor 7 years ago - doesn't want to?


He knows he can take Robbie's worst shots and still be there.

Robbie's arm went limp and he wasn't posting. That was a legit submission and Askren was taking that fight over with his will and technique. Just because Robbie had an incredible moment to start that fight does not mean he was going to keep on battering Askren.

No point in running that back. Askren weathered the storm, let them move on.
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#163 » by REDDzone » Wed Mar 6, 2019 3:57 pm

I just don't understand why it's such a huge deal. This wasn't a title fight that RL got screwed out of. He kind of just shrugged and said he'd like to run it back, but it's not like he's butthurt like TJ was going on every podcast and screaming to everyone who will listen to him about how he got screwed.

The UFC will give RL a big fight next. He's not going to be fighting Mickey Gall because they are both coming off a loss. He wasn't getting a title shot next anyway. He got a big paycheck, he took no damage, he will get a big fight next, it is what it is.
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#164 » by REDDzone » Wed Mar 6, 2019 4:00 pm

Askren will ultimately get his way IMO. Ben said the UFC PR guys told him that his vids/promo materials, etc. were getting by far the most hit on the card, even compared to Woodley and Jones.

Ariel confirmed that it was the same way at ESPN. The stories/vids/interviews, etc. they did on him were getting more clicks than any other fighter.

And that is him fighting a guy that he didn't even antagonize. Wait until he gets matched up with a hothead like Till or Usman. Dana doesn't like Askren but Dana likes money more than he doesn't like Askren.
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#165 » by Jasen777 » Wed Mar 6, 2019 5:49 pm

Headliner wrote:Ya, Askren is an interest case. He's more so interested in head hunting than he is climbing the ranks and earning the title.
I think him and Woodly had the idea that Woodly would win, then fight for 185 and relinquish the title, and that's when Askren could fight for it.
Now that's all up in the air, and he might be more interested in just getting the names on his record as a validation to himself that he is/was always elite.


Askren has campaigned the whole time for the 16 division and him getting a shot there. Maybe his plans will change now since the haven't got around to that division yet and Woodley lost.
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#166 » by Duke4life831 » Wed Mar 6, 2019 10:31 pm

It was a fun fight and I would definitely be down to watch it again, but Im not dying to see it again though. I highly doubt this hurts Lawler in his quest to getting his belt back. WW has plenty of guys for both of these guys to face. Have Woodley and Lawler get a rematch, Askren vs the winner of Till/Masvidal. Santiago Ponzinibbio can be an interesting fight for either guy, who knows how well Pettis looks at 170. Again if they make the rematch, sweet. But Im cool with plenty of different options with both of these guys. This wasnt a title shot, an interim shot or title eliminator shot. So no point of forcing the rematch.
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#167 » by jc23 » Wed Mar 6, 2019 11:20 pm

Dont need an immediate rematch, let them both move on with their career and if they both put together some wins maybe set up a match down the road.
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#168 » by Kurtz » Thu Mar 7, 2019 1:19 am

REDDzone wrote:Askren will ultimately get his way IMO. Ben said the UFC PR guys told him that his vids/promo materials, etc. were getting by far the most hit on the card, even compared to Woodley and Jones.

Ariel confirmed that it was the same way at ESPN. The stories/vids/interviews, etc. they did on him were getting more clicks than any other fighter.

And that is him fighting a guy that he didn't even antagonize. Wait until he gets matched up with a hothead like Till or Usman. Dana doesn't like Askren but Dana likes money more than he doesn't like Askren.


This was the first Askren fight that I've seen, but for those who've seen more - what's Askren's style like? Does he sort of just smother you like Shields used to, or is he capable of delivering fights that would entertain the average viewer?

Dana and co have been moving away from guys like Shields for a while now. They win but they don't entertain the general audience.
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#169 » by Headliner » Thu Mar 7, 2019 12:10 pm

Kurtz wrote:
REDDzone wrote:Askren will ultimately get his way IMO. Ben said the UFC PR guys told him that his vids/promo materials, etc. were getting by far the most hit on the card, even compared to Woodley and Jones.

Ariel confirmed that it was the same way at ESPN. The stories/vids/interviews, etc. they did on him were getting more clicks than any other fighter.

And that is him fighting a guy that he didn't even antagonize. Wait until he gets matched up with a hothead like Till or Usman. Dana doesn't like Askren but Dana likes money more than he doesn't like Askren.


This was the first Askren fight that I've seen, but for those who've seen more - what's Askren's style like? Does he sort of just smother you like Shields used to, or is he capable of delivering fights that would entertain the average viewer?

Dana and co have been moving away from guys like Shields for a while now. They win but they don't entertain the general audience.


For the most part The UFC is moving away from that smothering style, but Khabib is proof that when it's done with high technique the average fan is interested in a dominant ground game. I have not watched a lot of Askren but my opinion would be that he is a mix between Shields and Khabib. He smothers like Shields, but he's more dominant/stronger, and will take more risk for the finish, like Khabib.

The just bleed crowd won't enjoy him, but they will love his smack talk, so he's an extremely interesting test case/prototype for the UFC. Fans typically love three things. Style, Dominance, and Persona. He is aces in two of those categories. It's my belief that if he's successful in dominant fashion, that coupled with his Troll like Persona, it will make him a superstar regardless of his style and fans will pay to see him. He's already trended higher than Jon Jones and Usman/Woodly for that PPV. That may be because of controversy, but his interviews before and after have as well.

I also think his dad bod will help gain fans. He looks like a regular joe. It's part of the reason Roy Nelson was so popular. In a sport of 12 packs, Askren looks like he rolled off the couch, shook the Doritos off his chest and just dominated guys. That's entertaining.
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#170 » by Steelo Green » Thu Mar 7, 2019 11:05 pm

Headliner wrote:
Kurtz wrote:
REDDzone wrote:Askren will ultimately get his way IMO. Ben said the UFC PR guys told him that his vids/promo materials, etc. were getting by far the most hit on the card, even compared to Woodley and Jones.

Ariel confirmed that it was the same way at ESPN. The stories/vids/interviews, etc. they did on him were getting more clicks than any other fighter.

And that is him fighting a guy that he didn't even antagonize. Wait until he gets matched up with a hothead like Till or Usman. Dana doesn't like Askren but Dana likes money more than he doesn't like Askren.


This was the first Askren fight that I've seen, but for those who've seen more - what's Askren's style like? Does he sort of just smother you like Shields used to, or is he capable of delivering fights that would entertain the average viewer?

Dana and co have been moving away from guys like Shields for a while now. They win but they don't entertain the general audience.


For the most part The UFC is moving away from that smothering style, but Khabib is proof that when it's done with high technique the average fan is interested in a dominant ground game. I have not watched a lot of Askren but my opinion would be that he is a mix between Shields and Khabib. He smothers like Shields, but he's more dominant/stronger, and will take more risk for the finish, like Khabib.

The just bleed crowd won't enjoy him, but they will love his smack talk, so he's an extremely interesting test case/prototype for the UFC. Fans typically love three things. Style, Dominance, and Persona. He is aces in two of those categories. It's my belief that if he's successful in dominant fashion, that coupled with his Troll like Persona, it will make him a superstar regardless of his style and fans will pay to see him. He's already trended higher than Jon Jones and Usman/Woodly for that PPV. That may be because of controversy, but his interviews before and after have as well.

I also think his dad bod will help gain fans. He looks like a regular joe. It's part of the reason Roy Nelson was so popular. In a sport of 12 packs, Askren looks like he rolled off the couch, shook the Doritos off his chest and just dominated guys. That's entertaining.

If he can create a buzz like Chael did, then he will be great for the UFC.

I don't think he's boring, and he's finished 8 of his last 9 fights, so it's not like he just wrestles and sits on his opponents.

His beef is with Dana because he isn't a company man who just nods his head, and he isn't a draw like a Connor that Dana would be cool with it.
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#171 » by Jasen777 » Fri Mar 8, 2019 1:58 am

Steelo Green wrote:I don't think he's boring, and he's finished 8 of his last 9 fights, so it's not like he just wrestles and sits on his opponents.


A lot of those finishes were in One FC against inferior competition. Though I really enjoyed the beatdowns he put on Koreshkov and Amoussou in Bellator, they weren't exactly praised by casual fans...
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Re: UFC 235 (3/3): Jones vs. Some Guy 

Post#172 » by Headliner » Fri Mar 8, 2019 12:35 pm

Jasen777 wrote:
Steelo Green wrote:I don't think he's boring, and he's finished 8 of his last 9 fights, so it's not like he just wrestles and sits on his opponents.


A lot of those finishes were in One FC against inferior competition. Though I really enjoyed the beatdowns he put on Koreshkov and Amoussou in Bellator, they weren't exactly praised by casual fans...



For sure, but like I mentioned before, fans care about three things. Style, Dominance and Persona. When you fight in those organizations you do not have the spotlight to showcase your Persona like you do when you have a 1000 megaphones in your face like the UFC. He was simply relying on his dominance to attract fans at the point, and even that was able to be called into question because of the level of competition.
Now that he's in the UFC, his persona is going to amplified and marketed, and if he is able to dominate and pile up a few wins, people are going to follow him either to cheer for him to win, or to fall. It's kind of like Conor, he draws in massive numbers, but probably around 40% of them are watching just to hope that he gets smashed.
I personally think if he draws Till or Masidival next, and wins, he gets Usman and that PPV could draw big numbers. It'll be pretty interesting to watch.

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