Hot Topic - Quite Frankly; All Things Frank

[thebuzzardman]

Keep frank and dsj please. Just get rid of mudiay

I really feel like 98% of the fanbase can rally around Mudiay hatred.

ABSOLUTELY. Even though I feel he's outplayed Frank at the position, Frank still has MORE to offer this team overall. Frank, on a good team is valued but, Mud on a good team would be a net negative.

In case you skipped my ebook:
(wouldn't blame you)

Mudiay is one of those guys who makes too many negative plays a game - gives away possession on offense and defense. I mean, there are even more talented versions of players like this, and even when they are MEGA scorers, still are rarely worth it.

Mudiay just completely and totally f*cks up at least 2 defensive possessions ever time he exceeds 20 minutes. Not "oh he got beat, it happens". Not even "well, that seems scheme related" but just F*CKS UP. That's 4 points. And he's also good, to be very very polite, about 4-6 points, around about 4-6 clearly wasted offensive possession. Let's just say 4. And assume teams shoot 50%. There's another 4 points.
-8 points. About the typical margin of NBA victory. THJr was the same way. Burke was a mini, lesser version. Kanter was efficient on offense, routinely gave back at least 6 points a game on defense.

DSJr knuckleheads it a little. Takes a bad shot every game. But not remotely close to Mudiay's infractions on offense. Much better defender - again, will clearly take a play off here and there, but just not completely fail on defense like Mudiay does, often. Frank wrecks possessions on offense by adding a brick to some ball movement, but at least he holds his own on defense and elevates the team defense, to the extent Fizzle's subpar defensive ideas are helped. And yeah, Frank gets beat sometimes too, but rarely. Usually overplaying a quick guard for no reason.

[3toheadmelo]

signing crap players doesn’t mean anything.

also hopefully this means franks gets playing time to regain any value.

Acquiring point guard after point guard after point guard shows that the Knicks don’t have much faith in Frank. It’s clear as day

i never thought frank was a pg, just a player that can make the extra pass.

Me too. I hope I’m wrong on the knicks ready to move on from Frank also. I would like to see a DSJ+Frank lineup. Both of them seem eager to play with each other too

[BLACKFEET 2010]

Frank and Dot to Utah (France West) for their Royce O’Neal and their first this year.

Frank and OJ to Golden State for Jacob Evans and their first.

Frank and Dot to Charlotte (France East) for Marvin Williams (exp) and their first.

Frank for Zhaire Smith and their highest second rounder.

Frank to Atlanta for Deandre Bembry and a second this year.

No.

—Mags

We SERIOUSLY overvalue his worth. Frank too.
Half of those trades would get laughed at by the other teams. And the other half we’d laugh at thinking we’re the ones getting ganked.

At the end of the day Dot’s should be applauded for how much improvement he’s made but when it’s said and done he likely will end up a throw in to a bigger deal.

I don’t hate him I just think Scotty P is gonna feel he can get just as good a player with more upside with a 45th pick if he had it to make. Lotta guys who could potentially replace Dot in the late stages of this chitty draft. And if we don’t get Zion, I’d assume we’d likely be targeting a wing in the lotto should we keep the pick. It’s gonna get really crowded there. It’s not like he’s a 21 year old.

He along with Frank will ultimately be deemed expendable.

Every time I say that word I think of the movie Rambo.
When the girl says “Rambo, you no expendable”, I dunno.

[B8RcDeMktfxC]

Both of them seem eager to play with each other too

I think that is somewhat striking - and speaks well to both of them. Maybe it's a no brainer to not be trapped into a semi-exclusive rivalry there, and, on the surface at least, be "friends", but coming in as young kids, with people saying who knows what to them, I still think it's a good look for both.

[B8RcDeMktfxC]

fwiw, I would be a lot more impressed with Perry if he had taken Mitch with the #8 pick (& Trier at #36). That would have shown insight. Or trade down a little and pick him ~#15 and pick up some assets as well (although this latter is easier said than done - retrospectively no team was taking Mitch in that range, but could you be sure if he was your top choice at #8?).

He had the opportunity for Mitch at #36 because Magic, whilst an all time great player, is a clueless, smiling zombie of a GM and gamed himself. Howtf do you take Wagner there?

And then 10 teams were too inflexible to think about their opportunity. Not, interestingly, that all of the players taken were terrible - or even necessarily end up with worse careers than Mitch - e.g., if Mitch never makes a bucket from outside 3' ever in his career. For example,

#26 Landry Shamet
#33 Jalen Brunson

are both having good rookie years.

So, yes, I do think Perry is capable of making decisions on the fly (which is a good thing in itself) and some of them are decent (even better). I'm just sceptical of the longer term planning.

[NY 567]

If Fiz's deluded mind, he's gotten Mudiay right, and so Frank is expendable.

[BLACKFEET 2010]

And if we do trade him, we need to target a four.
That positionless crap gets us killed on the boards.

[B8RcDeMktfxC]

If Fiz's deluded mind, he's gotten Mudiay right, and so Frank is expendable.

I don't think Fiz has used Frank correctly, but more concerning is why Perry didn't step in there (in private of course).

Fiz's view on Frank is moot at the moment since Frank is out (and tbh I'm sceptical he'll be back this month - none of the few medical updates give any indication he's near to returning). A greater worry would be whether Perry thinks Fiz has gotten the Beetiay right, and so Frank is expendable.

[WargamesX]

"Knicks plan on exploring trade scenes for Frank Ntilikina" -

"Knicks plan on exploring trade scenarios for Frank Ntilikina"

[BLACKFEET 2010]

Frank and Dot to Utah (France West) for their Royce O’Neal and their first this year.

Frank and OJ to Golden State for Jacob Evans and their first.

Frank and Dot to Charlotte (France East) for Marvin Williams (exp) and their first.

Frank for Zhaire Smith and their highest second rounder.

Frank to Atlanta for Deandre Bembry and a second this year.

Frank and Batum to the Mavs; Timmy to the Hornets; Hornets FRP to the Knicks (afaics Trade Machine allows this)

[edit] The Hornets are #10 pick at the moment, but only 1 game behind the 8th seed in the East. On the other hand the #12, #13 and #14 picks (Lakers, T'Wolves and Sacramento) are basically already out of the play-offs, so I expect that Hornets pick to end up in the #12-#14 range. Is that a decent price for Timmy?

Nobody wants Tim without a sweetener.
Dallas is straight outta those.
Charlotte is looking for a way to give Kemba some win now help and a reason to stay. And Timmy to put it kindly wouldn’t exactly be that.

Honestly his acquisition may quite possibly have the opposite effect.

I could see them targeting at least an Andre Drummond or Evan Fournier level guy should they attempt to move Batum’s crazy contract.

[Knickgm2190]

Frank is statistically the worst guard in the NBA. The front office should be fired if they don't trade him if a first round pick is offered. Truth is no one is giving a first for him.

[Greenie]

Knicks regime is really eager to rid themselves of everything Phil, but at least they aren't gifting players away.

Frank isn't worth a 1st, but I'd bet a playoff team would probably off a mid 20's for him. Does OKC have theirs? he can learn from his ceiling….Andre Roberson.

Good Comp

I always call him Tony Allen but this is better

[B8RcDeMktfxC]

Frank and Dot to Utah (France West) for their Royce O’Neal and their first this year.

Frank and OJ to Golden State for Jacob Evans and their first.

Frank and Dot to Charlotte (France East) for Marvin Williams (exp) and their first.

Frank for Zhaire Smith and their highest second rounder.

Frank to Atlanta for Deandre Bembry and a second this year.

Frank and Batum to the Mavs; Timmy to the Hornets; Hornets FRP to the Knicks (afaics Trade Machine allows this)

[edit] The Hornets are #10 pick at the moment, but only 1 game behind the 8th seed in the East. On the other hand the #12, #13 and #14 picks (Lakers, T'Wolves and Sacramento) are basically already out of the play-offs, so I expect that Hornets pick to end up in the #12-#14 range. Is that a decent price for Timmy?

Nobody wants Tim without a sweetener.
Dallas is straight outta those.
Charlotte is looking for a way to give Kemba some win now help and a reason to stay. And Timmy to put it kindly wouldn’t exactly be that.

Honestly his acquisition may quite possibly have the opposite effect.

Hush, man. Shhhhhhh. Think of that sweet #13 pick. The Mavs board are convinced Timmy's going to be a very good, non-bad contract, 3rd/4th option. That view might just spread around the league. And Kemba does need someone to do some scoring

[BLACKFEET 2010]

If Fiz's deluded mind, he's gotten Mudiay right, and so Frank is expendable.

I don't think Fiz has used Frank correctly, but more concerning is why Perry didn't step in there (in private of course).

Fiz's view on Frank is moot at the moment since Frank is out (and tbh I'm sceptical he'll be back this month - none of the few medical updates give any indication he's near to returning). A greater worry would be whether Perry thinks Fiz has gotten the Beetiay right, and so Frank is expendable.

I dunno man, both coaches Frank has had here have had him up close and decided to go against their boss’s wishes and NOT play the kid? I don’t even think it’s a work hard thing because apparently he’s a bit of a gym rat. But the results aren’t there.

Maybe he’s not that good, maybe he’s not that good yet but they don’t seem to prioritize his development in what is a development year. And he hasn’t wrestled anything away from anyone (neither has Knox, I know).

There is something to what we all see.
They obviously don’t care much for what he brings to the table. They’ve probably got his mind all twisted up in the process too. It’s unfortunate too but I can’t emphatically say everyone around the Knicks is just dumb because they’re not playing this jewel of a prospect.

[B8RcDeMktfxC]

Frank is statistically the worst guard in the NBA.

Math is hard.

Another one to the ignore list.

[Knickgm2190]

Knicks regime is really eager to rid themselves of everything Phil, but at least they aren't gifting players away.

Frank isn't worth a 1st, but I'd bet a playoff team would probably off a mid 20's for him. Does OKC have theirs? he can learn from his ceiling….Andre Roberson.

Good Comp

I always call him Tony Allen but this is better

Frank has a ways to go before he is as good defensively as a Tony Allen, Marcus Smart, and Andre Roberson. While his defense is above average, it isnt elite. At least not yet.

[BLACKFEET 2010]

Frank and Batum to the Mavs; Timmy to the Hornets; Hornets FRP to the Knicks (afaics Trade Machine allows this)

[edit] The Hornets are #10 pick at the moment, but only 1 game behind the 8th seed in the East. On the other hand the #12, #13 and #14 picks (Lakers, T'Wolves and Sacramento) are basically already out of the play-offs, so I expect that Hornets pick to end up in the #12-#14 range. Is that a decent price for Timmy?

Nobody wants Tim without a sweetener.
Dallas is straight outta those.
Charlotte is looking for a way to give Kemba some win now help and a reason to stay. And Timmy to put it kindly wouldn’t exactly be that.

Honestly his acquisition may quite possibly have the opposite effect.

Hush, man. Shhhhhhh. Think of that sweet #13 pick. The Mavs board are convinced Timmy's going to be a very good, non-bad contract, 3rd/4th option. That view might just spread around the league. And Kemba does need someone to do some scoring

My bad

[Capn'O]

Who is "knicksrebuilder" and how do we stop him/her from posting threads?

We're out in front on this one.

[Greenie]

There's 2 guys who are inconsistent offensively and not great playmakers.

One of those guys plays defense.

I'll keep the guy who plays defense and is a good team player as opposed to the legendary Dennis "poor man's Steve Francis" Smith Jr.

Too bad they play different positions...

[Greenie]

Knicks regime is really eager to rid themselves of everything Phil, but at least they aren't gifting players away.

Frank isn't worth a 1st, but I'd bet a playoff team would probably off a mid 20's for him. Does OKC have theirs? he can learn from his ceiling….Andre Roberson.

Good Comp

I always call him Tony Allen but this is better

Frank has a ways to go before he is as good defensively as a Tony Allen, Marcus Smart, and Andre Roberson. While his defense is above average, it isnt elite. At least not yet.

I agree, but that’s his ceiling.
Marcus Smart isn’t Roberson. Different levels to this.