Season Speculation, Free Agency & Trade Ideas: Our Johnson is finally working

[Crives]

I really feel that if we don't land the #1 pick, we won't keep it. Whether we move it for Holiday or Conley or someone else. Therefore, I don't care as much where we finish because there's only one pick that matters in the grand scheme of things.

Please no Conley

[Crives]

Is this the best morning we have had as Suns fans in the last 5-6 years? Sure feels like it.

[BobbieL]

I really feel that if we don't land the #1 pick, we won't keep it. Whether we move it for Holiday or Conley or someone else. Therefore, I don't care as much where we finish because there's only one pick that matters in the grand scheme of things.

Please no Conley

I think I would give up the non Zion FRP for Jrue Holiday but I am not moving it for Conley unless the Suns were to get back another first. And with Conley coming, that means Tyler Johnson is going. I don't want to over-value Johnson but I am liking his game more and more. He would be a nice bench player for next year.

Players picks that I think will be moved to be able to keep Oubre and Johnson
Jackson
2019 FRP if not Zion
2019 SRP
Okobo or Melton - to make the math work if need be and the other team might want one of them
Bucks pick
2020 FRP with protections
2021 FRP with less protections than 2020

Warren - though he would plug nicely into an Eddie Johnson 6th man role.

[Fo-Real]

So.... I get the 'Ja in a weak conference' stuff... but outside of 3 big games... the Zags play a pretty patsy schedule too. Any concerns the success of Clark is against inferior athletes ?

meanwhile... there is a beast a brewing

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4065660/mfiondu-kabengele

The kind of quiet target that allows you to trade back a few spaces on a pick swap, get an assert and still be able to get the guy that was your target all along. Dude has beast potential. A long and still grwoing pf that actually plays defense, blocks shots, has a great post game when needed and shoots a high 3 point percentage?! 6'10 and possibly still growing, like 7'4 wing span. What better skill Set to put next to Ayton?

[Qwigglez]

If the Wizards fire their GM would the new guy coming in have the green light to clean house?

Could we do something like this on draft day?

Suns get -
Bradley Beal

Wizards get -
Tyler Johnson
Josh Jackson
2019 pick (2-6)
2021 1st (unprotected)
2023 1st (top 5 protected)
2020 Bucks pick

If we landed No 1, we probably don’t need to trade as much. But I’d do it given we’d have our starting five set for the next 6-7 years.

Beal / Booker / Bridges / Oubre / Ayton
Melton / Okobo / Warren / Holmes

Is there another PG/SG who’s under 26-27 years old that we can trade for?

[bwgood77]

What would your thoughts be on the following scenario playing out?

We get the 3rd pick, Zion and Ja are gone, and there are not any trade options available with the pick to get us a truly legit PG or PF. Dallas does not luck out to jump top 4 (though they are certainly working there way into good odds with about a 35% chance of being in top 4 right now...not too much worse than us)...

So lets say we have the 3rd pick, Atlanta gets the 5th or 6th pick and Dallas gets like the 8th pick (which would then convey to Atlanta).

I doubt they would do it, but would you trade the 3rd pick (Barrett) for the 5th or 6th and 8th picks and take Garland and Clarke if possible?

I think I like the idea of trading the pick if isn't Zion for a player and a future FRP. Or maybe attach Jackson to it for a player and FRP and gain 12-14m of cap space.

I am done with young players. That doesn't mean I am giving away just to give away. But the Suns do not need TWO more first round picks. They just don't.

And with Tyler playing the way he is - there is value to him on the roster so I think today, the Suns need to suck it up and just pay him. Bring back Oubre. Maybe Holmes

So that is 6m of cap space. If you can move Jackson and the non Zion FRP -- thats another 13 or 14m or so, net

With 20m - the Suns hopefully can get PG and PF. Granted, if Tyler is traded for Jrue, thats one thing. But otherwise - get a good competent PG and PF. I would like to see a bench of Tyler Johnson, Warren, Holmes and either Bridges or Oubre.

So if there isn't a worthwhile quality PG or PF to trade for with the 3rd pick, you still trade it for best player and future pick you can find instead of taking Barrett?

[bwgood77]

Most of those busts taken high are raw one year guys, or skinny Cs who need to develop. Not guys with multiple years in college and stats that are dominating college basketball as the player is leading one of the best teams in the country. I mean Duke was expected to dominate and maybe be undefeated and Clarke and Gonzaga went in there early and he comes out with 6 blocks, 7-10 from the field and 17 points, going against Zion as Gonzaga upset Duke.

It's not like Clarke is an unknown young inexperienced guy you are projecting and hoping he turns into something. With Garland you could make that case though.

Maybe Kaminsky is a better example. Granted, he wasn't seen as a highly touted prospect, but he was good enough that many teams were interested.
I don't watch enough college (none) to know.

I'm trying to see who will be in the area we can expect to pick.

Zion
Barratt
Morant
Reddish
Clarke

I'm sure there are other guys too. So it'll be good to have guys with potential around when we pick (which could be as late as 5-7).

In a vacuum kaminsky might have been a higher rated prospect but that was a better and deeper draft class. He was viewed as an elite offensive player coming out. His physical limitations on D always capped his overall upside though.

I like Clarke and actually don't view his age as a super negative because the suns could use someone ready to play now. But it does probably limited his upside a bit. But getting a good role player outside of the top 3 or so in this class might be a win. It's just not an inspiring group. That worries me a bit with potential trades because I'm not sure another team is going to be all that stoked to trade a good player for like the 5th pick.

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That's kind of my thought. If we don't get a top 3 pick, I am not sure that pick holds a ton of value for other teams, just like it doesn't hold a ton of value for people here.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Maybe Kaminsky is a better example. Granted, he wasn't seen as a highly touted prospect, but he was good enough that many teams were interested.
I don't watch enough college (none) to know.

I'm trying to see who will be in the area we can expect to pick.

Zion
Barratt
Morant
Reddish
Clarke

I'm sure there are other guys too. So it'll be good to have guys with potential around when we pick (which could be as late as 5-7).

In a vacuum kaminsky might have been a higher rated prospect but that was a better and deeper draft class. He was viewed as an elite offensive player coming out. His physical limitations on D always capped his overall upside though.

I like Clarke and actually don't view his age as a super negative because the suns could use someone ready to play now. But it does probably limited his upside a bit. But getting a good role player outside of the top 3 or so in this class might be a win. It's just not an inspiring group. That worries me a bit with potential trades because I'm not sure another team is going to be all that stoked to trade a good player for like the 5th pick.

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That's kind of my thought. If we don't get a top 3 pick, I am not sure that pick holds a ton of value for other teams, just like it doesn't hold a ton of value for people here.

For sure. That's why I caution people who think trading the pick will be a certainty. If no deal is there then simply grab a guy you like and develop them at what ever pace they are ready. No need to rush that guy in as some kind of savior.

I wonder if jontey Porter could play PF long term. Really like his game and he could be a good long term play if they are sitting at 5+.

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[bwgood77]

So.... I get the 'Ja in a weak conference' stuff... but outside of 3 big games... the Zags play a pretty patsy schedule too. Any concerns the success of Clark is against inferior athletes ?

meanwhile... there is a beast a brewing

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4065660/mfiondu-kabengele

Gonzaga is in a better conference to begin with but plays an extremely tough non conference schedule which is why as a mid major they usually get a high tourney seed. This year they played

Duke
North Carolina
Tennessee
Texas A&M
Illinois
Creighton
Arizona (early when they were undefeated and hadn't lost players yet)

So I am not as concerned about it.

[Waylay13]

I really feel that if we don't land the #1 pick, we won't keep it. Whether we move it for Holiday or Conley or someone else. Therefore, I don't care as much where we finish because there's only one pick that matters in the grand scheme of things.

Please no Conley

I think I would give up the non Zion FRP for Jrue Holiday but I am not moving it for Conley unless the Suns were to get back another first. And with Conley coming, that means Tyler Johnson is going. I don't want to over-value Johnson but I am liking his game more and more. He would be a nice bench player for next year.

Players picks that I think will be moved to be able to keep Oubre and Johnson
Jackson
2019 FRP if not Zion
2019 SRP
Okobo or Melton - to make the math work if need be and the other team might want one of them
Bucks pick
2020 FRP with protections
2021 FRP with less protections than 2020

Warren - though he would plug nicely into an Eddie Johnson 6th man role.

I am fairly sure that Warren wont be on the Suns next year (remember the rumor that Sarver wanted him last summer). He doesnt fit with the disruptive defense that seems to be where the Suns are going.
I also believe that Jackson will be next year.
Bender no chance that he will be on the team next year.
I think there is a good chance that we keep Johnson over buying him out.
Crawford should be move to wearing a suit next year and being on the bench for some team.
I would like to see us keep Oubre and Holmes.

[Qwigglez]

So I just read that the Suns starting lineup with Bender is a minus 13 in our last 7 games however if you replace Bender with Bridges that lineup is a plus 49 in 40 minutes played.

Also didn’t realize the Mavs have lost 10 of their last 11 games. Which is probably why I haven’t been hearing a lot about the golden boy lately.

[BobbieL]

So I just read that the Suns starting lineup with Bender is a minus 13 in our last 7 games however if you replace Bender with Bridges that lineup is a plus 49 in 40 minutes played.

Also didn’t realize the Mavs have lost 10 of their last 11 games. Which is probably why I haven’t been hearing a lot about the golden boy lately.

I think this means that PF is probably a higher need than PG. I think Tyler could handle it next year with Melton and Okobo as opposed to overpaying for a guy like Rozier. Than if they have the exception - maybe get a veteran than.

[Saberestar]

So I just read that the Suns starting lineup with Bender is a minus 13 in our last 7 games however if you replace Bender with Bridges that lineup is a plus 49 in 40 minutes played.

Also didn’t realize the Mavs have lost 10 of their last 11 games. Which is probably why I haven’t been hearing a lot about the golden boy lately.

Yeah, Bender is not playing well but we need him some minutes on the court because Warren is out and to be able to play Jackson less minutes per game.

And well, the Mavs traded all their veterans to try to lose games and have their pick next season. Doncic is playing amazing basketball leading the team...they are just waiting for next season.

[RedIndian]

We're at 82 mil next year provided we renounce all our free agents. Assuming we keep Oubre, his cap hold is 9.6 mil, so that brings us up to 91 mil.

Now, my moves would be as follows:

1. Do my Jackson + Warren trade to the Cavs for Nance Jr + Osman. I'd throw in our 2019 second rounder if that's what's needed to make it work. That deal also saves us a couple of million in cap space.

2. Draft Morant.

3. Sign Mirotic to 4 years / 60 million. We should just about have the cap space to do this. Would have to renounce everyone except Oubre though.

4. Sign Oubre to 4 years / 50 million. We can go over the cap to sign him, so there's some flexibility on his deal here.

Roster next year:

Ayton/Nance Jr
Mirotic/Osman
Oubre/Bridges
Booker/Melton
Johnson/Morant

Could also try and flip Johnson + Morant for Jrue if we're inclined to go down that route.

I think that team can win 40-45 games next year.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

So I just read that the Suns starting lineup with Bender is a minus 13 in our last 7 games however if you replace Bender with Bridges that lineup is a plus 49 in 40 minutes played.

Also didn’t realize the Mavs have lost 10 of their last 11 games. Which is probably why I haven’t been hearing a lot about the golden boy lately.

IDK, man. It's hard to blame these slow starts on Bender. Booker getting roasted both ways was the reason we got down 10 early last night, for instance.

Starting Bender has been a great move to my eye. Just having a second interior defender out there with the starters has been a major improvement. Nice that Bridges has found that corner 3 since being moved to the bench. Bender just needs to keep working on his long ball. He'll get there.

The priority is the 4, sure. But I haven't seen any non-draft solutions to this problem that look very appealing.

[BobbieL]

We're at 82 mil next year provided we renounce all our free agents. Assuming we keep Oubre, his cap hold is 9.6 mil, so that brings us up to 91 mil.

Now, my moves would be as follows:

1. Do my Jackson + Warren trade to the Cavs for Nance Jr + Osman. I'd throw in our 2019 second rounder if that's what's needed to make it work. That deal also saves us a couple of million in cap space.

2. Draft Morant.

3. Sign Mirotic to 4 years / 60 million. We should just about have the cap space to do this. Would have to renounce everyone except Oubre though.

4. Sign Oubre to 4 years / 50 million. We can go over the cap to sign him, so there's some flexibility on his deal here.

Roster next year:

Ayton/Nance Jr
Mirotic/Osman
Oubre/Bridges
Booker/Melton
Johnson/Morant

Could also try and flip Johnson + Morant for Jrue if we're inclined to go down that route.

I think that team can win 40-45 games next year.

I think if you have Nance - you might need PG more than Mirotic. I would not want a rookie in Morant with that group also. Maybe Tyler Johnson could hold the fort a year but I still think I would want experience at the PG position.

[WeekapaugGroove]

So I just read that the Suns starting lineup with Bender is a minus 13 in our last 7 games however if you replace Bender with Bridges that lineup is a plus 49 in 40 minutes played.

Also didn’t realize the Mavs have lost 10 of their last 11 games. Which is probably why I haven’t been hearing a lot about the golden boy lately.

IDK, man. It's hard to blame these slow starts on Bender. Booker getting roasted both ways was the reason we got down 10 early last night, for instance.

Starting Bender has been a great move to my eye. Just having a second interior defender out there with the starters has been a major improvement. Nice that Bridges has found that corner 3 since being moved to the bench. Bender just needs to keep working on his long ball. He'll get there.

The priority is the 4, sure. But I haven't seen any non-draft solutions to this problem that look very appealing.

Aminu is my favorite realistic target. Isn't awesome at anything but does most things pretty well.

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[RedIndian]

We're at 82 mil next year provided we renounce all our free agents. Assuming we keep Oubre, his cap hold is 9.6 mil, so that brings us up to 91 mil.

Now, my moves would be as follows:

1. Do my Jackson + Warren trade to the Cavs for Nance Jr + Osman. I'd throw in our 2019 second rounder if that's what's needed to make it work. That deal also saves us a couple of million in cap space.

2. Draft Morant.

3. Sign Mirotic to 4 years / 60 million. We should just about have the cap space to do this. Would have to renounce everyone except Oubre though.

4. Sign Oubre to 4 years / 50 million. We can go over the cap to sign him, so there's some flexibility on his deal here.

Roster next year:

Ayton/Nance Jr
Mirotic/Osman
Oubre/Bridges
Booker/Melton
Johnson/Morant

Could also try and flip Johnson + Morant for Jrue if we're inclined to go down that route.

I think that team can win 40-45 games next year.

I think if you have Nance - you might need PG more than Mirotic. I would not want a rookie in Morant with that group also. Maybe Tyler Johnson could hold the fort a year but I still think I would want experience at the PG position.

Tyler Johnson + 2019 pick + Milwaukee pick should be able to land us Jrue if we want to go down that route. It really depends how high we are on someone like Morant.

But I'd like to go for Mirotic regardless. He's the perfect PF to open up space for Ayton inside, and he's not a terrible defender or rebounder either. In fact, if you just replaced Bender with Mirotic in our current line-up, I think we'd immediately become a very dangerous team.

[bwgood77]

So I just read that the Suns starting lineup with Bender is a minus 13 in our last 7 games however if you replace Bender with Bridges that lineup is a plus 49 in 40 minutes played.

Also didn’t realize the Mavs have lost 10 of their last 11 games. Which is probably why I haven’t been hearing a lot about the golden boy lately.

Yeah, Mavs odds on getting Zion have shot up to pretty high (8.3%) and may get higher. They are tied with Washington for 6-7th worst but if they can get to 6th worst they have 9% chance at #1 pick. If we keep playing the way we are, we will likely end up at 12.5% chance.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

So I just read that the Suns starting lineup with Bender is a minus 13 in our last 7 games however if you replace Bender with Bridges that lineup is a plus 49 in 40 minutes played.

Also didn’t realize the Mavs have lost 10 of their last 11 games. Which is probably why I haven’t been hearing a lot about the golden boy lately.

IDK, man. It's hard to blame these slow starts on Bender. Booker getting roasted both ways was the reason we got down 10 early last night, for instance.

Starting Bender has been a great move to my eye. Just having a second interior defender out there with the starters has been a major improvement. Nice that Bridges has found that corner 3 since being moved to the bench. Bender just needs to keep working on his long ball. He'll get there.

The priority is the 4, sure. But I haven't seen any non-draft solutions to this problem that look very appealing.

Aminu is my favorite realistic target. Isn't awesome at anything but does most things pretty well.

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Personally, I'd prefer to stick with Bender. Dragan's improving and developing; he's got great tools; he's still super young. Loved watching him get those blocks on Giannis a few nights ago. I get that Aminu is solid but Dragan could be more, and I don't think an unreasonable amount of development is necessary for Dragan to reach and surpass Aminu's level of play.