Hot Topic - Quite Frankly; All Things Frank

[Spree2Houston]

Frank is a high IQ player who is 5 years away from being a great player. But this team is going to be in win-now mode by next season. He's pretty much gone. Frank is going to be a great player at 25 and we will regret trading him as usual. He is Trevor Ariza 2.0. The Ultimate glue guy on a championship team. I'm hoping we're making the right decision betting on DSjr bc I'm still skeptical about him. DSjr gives me Marbury vibes at times. Empty stats = no wins. But I'll give him the offseason bc it's usually Year 3 where you see a big jump.

[reub]

Frank is a high IQ player who is 5 years away from being a great player. But this team is going to be in win-now mode by next season. He's pretty much gone. Frank is going to be a great player at 25 and we will regret trading him as usual. He is Trevor Ariza 2.0. The Ultimate glue guy on a championship team. I'm hoping we're making the right decision betting on DSjr bc I'm still skeptical of him. DSjr gives me Marbury vibes at times. Empty stats = no wins. But I'll give him the offseason bc it's usually Year 3 where you see a big jump.

See my stats posted above. He's a winning player right now. And will only get better.

[br7knicks]

Am I the only one who is curious to see Frank & Dennis in the backcourt??

no. those of us that know defense helps winning basketball are looking forward to it. the rest couldn't care less. they're hoping the knicks max out guys with no defense, poor efficiency, no passing, and more shooting.

come on. i'm a frankfrooter and that's not fair to generalize.

Hyperbole? Yeah a bit. But defense wins, stats don't.

Based on the last bunch of years, a bunch of people would rather a star come here and put up nice numbers instead of seeing actual winning. As of now, Knox fits the bill of stats, not defense and winning. He doesn't seem to have that fire or desire

[BasicBall]

Frank is a high IQ player who is 5 years away from being a great player. But this team is going to be in win-now mode by next season. He's pretty much gone. Frank is going to be a great player at 25 and we will regret trading him as usual. He is Trevor Ariza 2.0. The Ultimate glue guy on a championship team. I'm hoping we're making the right decision betting on DSjr bc I'm still skeptical of him. DSjr gives me Marbury vibes at times. Empty stats = no wins. But I'll give him the offseason bc it's usually Year 3 where you see a big jump.

This is why I’m eager to pair DSJ in the backcourt with Frank. I really think they’ll play well off each other, we’ll have to deal with the growing pains, but DSJ, Frank, Dotson & Zo is as good a core of young backcourt prospects NY has ever had. Don’t @ me

[br7knicks]

no. those of us that know defense helps winning basketball are looking forward to it. the rest couldn't care less. they're hoping the knicks max out guys with no defense, poor efficiency, no passing, and more shooting.

come on. i'm a frankfrooter and that's not fair to generalize.

I agree, because I know I can’t be the only one who is curious as to what they’d look like playing alongside each other. One thing is certain, both are on their rookie deals so their money is set unlike Mudiay is playing for a contract. For that reason alone you can’t possibly think that Mudiay is playing for THE TEAM!! I’ll also be the first to say that Mudiay has surprised me in spurts, but mostly he’s shown he’s a decent backup at best and in reality he might have 2-3 more years left before he’s out of the league. To me, Frank has all the attributes you want for a winning team...selfless, team oriented, just a real intangible guy...I also think Dennis legitimately likes Frank (same draft class) and wants him to succeed. That to me goes a long way in building a solid team culture...Dennis is clearly a fiery guy and Frank plays with a cool intellect. I think it could be a very interesting pairing. Combine that with solid rotation guys like, Dotson & Alonzo and I am starting to believe NY just might have a very solid backcourt rotation going forward (Kyrie be damned)

I’m just really curious as to how a DSJ - Ntilikina backcourt would look. I just hope we get to see it soon.

Exactly. I couldn't agree more.

To me, mudiay has shown he belongs in nba (wasn't looking that way for a while), but shouldn't be the starter on a great team - Knicks aren't great yet. Mudiay is also looking out for himself more than the team, based on his play. He's also looking for the next contract, so I get it - I just don't want it.

I also couldn't agree more with the Dsjr and frank. How would Dsjr not want frank? Frank doesn't need the ball, and is smart and knows how to play off the ball. Plus, he's a supposed spot up shooter, which is what Dsjr as he drives and kicks. Plus frank would allow Dsjr to not have to guard the best opposing backcourt player

[reub]

Frank is a high IQ player who is 5 years away from being a great player. But this team is going to be in win-now mode by next season. He's pretty much gone. Frank is going to be a great player at 25 and we will regret trading him as usual. He is Trevor Ariza 2.0. The Ultimate glue guy on a championship team. I'm hoping we're making the right decision betting on DSjr bc I'm still skeptical of him. DSjr gives me Marbury vibes at times. Empty stats = no wins. But I'll give him the offseason bc it's usually Year 3 where you see a big jump.

This is why I’m eager to pair DSJ in the backcourt with Frank. I really think they’ll play well off each other, we’ll have to deal with the growing pains, but DSJ, Frank, Dotson & Zo is as good a core of young backcourt prospects NY has ever had. Don’t @ me

If we stay young next year:

Mitch
Frank
Dot
DSJ
Trier

is a nice place to start.

Add Zion, Ja or Bol Bol. Keep Knox because he has to get better (because he's so bad now).

#Don'tTradeFrank

[br7knicks]

I saw this elsewhere:

"If we take a look at the “mainstays” (more than 50 minutes together), there’s only one lineup with a positive net rating. Can you guess which one? I think you do, if you have been paying attention to this season: it’s the one that got yanked because “we weren’t winning”. Frank/Dot/THJ/Vonleh/Mitch got a net rating of +8.1 in 94 minutes, mostly thanks to a marvelous 98.5 DRtg. Who would have guessed that playing together our best defenders would have been the best way to suck less? The other five lineup that have logged more than 50 minutes are negative net rating ones, with one that sticks out: the very recent DSJ/Dot/Knox/Vonleh/DeAndre, who has a borderline vomit-inducing -30.4 net rating (with an ORtg of – blech – 86.5). Did you recognize those five guys? Yep, it’s our current starting lineup. That whole lineup has a TS% of 47.7. Very well done, coach."

If you took that group and substituted Trier for the dearly departed THJ, I think you have a winning lineup going forward.

Keep Frank/Trade Knox

Stuff like this irks me. I feel like this lineup was clearly the best but Fiz went away from it simply because of his hard on for Mudiay

I’d say keep both Frank and Kev. I never like giving up on players so young, unless it’s a deal that’s clearly favorable.

I don't like giving up on players either. But if a team comes with a player with a better mindset and defense first mentality (Phoenix and Mikal, with their plethora of SGs/SFs), I'll drive Kevin myself

[BasicBall]

Frank is a high IQ player who is 5 years away from being a great player. But this team is going to be in win-now mode by next season. He's pretty much gone. Frank is going to be a great player at 25 and we will regret trading him as usual. He is Trevor Ariza 2.0. The Ultimate glue guy on a championship team. I'm hoping we're making the right decision betting on DSjr bc I'm still skeptical of him. DSjr gives me Marbury vibes at times. Empty stats = no wins. But I'll give him the offseason bc it's usually Year 3 where you see a big jump.

This is why I’m eager to pair DSJ in the backcourt with Frank. I really think they’ll play well off each other, we’ll have to deal with the growing pains, but DSJ, Frank, Dotson & Zo is as good a core of young backcourt prospects NY has ever had. Don’t @ me

If we stay young next year:

Mitch
Frank
Dot
DSJ
Trier

is a nice place to start.

Add Zion, Ja or Bol Bol. Keep Knox because he has to get better (because he's so bad now).

#Don'tTradeFrank

I with it!! #DontTradeFrank & #SellTheTeam while you’re at it!! If they land Zion I’m gonna be ok watching this slow growth continue. Because I like the core and expect Kevin Knox to be better next season..

[B8RcDeMktfxC]

I saw this elsewhere:

"If we take a look at the “mainstays” (more than 50 minutes together), there’s only one lineup with a positive net rating. Can you guess which one? I think you do, if you have been paying attention to this season: it’s the one that got yanked because “we weren’t winning”. Frank/Dot/THJ/Vonleh/Mitch got a net rating of +8.1 in 94 minutes, mostly thanks to a marvelous 98.5 DRtg. Who would have guessed that playing together our best defenders would have been the best way to suck less? The other five lineup that have logged more than 50 minutes are negative net rating ones, with one that sticks out: the very recent DSJ/Dot/Knox/Vonleh/DeAndre, who has a borderline vomit-inducing -30.4 net rating (with an ORtg of – blech – 86.5). Did you recognize those five guys? Yep, it’s our current starting lineup. That whole lineup has a TS% of 47.7. Very well done, coach."

If you took that group and substituted Trier for the dearly departed THJ, I think you have a winning lineup going forward.

Take that for data

[GONYK]

I understand people not being high on Frank. I don't understand why people feel that it's imperative to trade him.

[Tron Carter]

I understand people not being high on Frank. I don't understand why people feel that it's imperative to trade him.

his value is so low rn. i don’t get the urgency.

[Greenie]

I understand people not being high on Frank. I don't understand why people feel that it's imperative to trade him.

Young players have to show SOMETHING.
Look at Mitch.

Both Frank and Knox are hard and damn near impossible to watch.

It’s not that they’re young. It’s their performance and that’s 100% on them.

[GONYK]

I understand people not being high on Frank. I don't understand why people feel that it's imperative to trade him.

Young players have to show SOMETHING.
Look at Mitch.

Both Frank and Knox are hard and damn near impossible to watch.

It’s not that they’re young. It’s their performance and that’s 100% on them.

Doesn't really address the question

[stuporman]

DSJr is exactly what I thought, a guy who will get some stats in an exciting way but not all that efficiently, maybe as much as 18-6 eventually but isn't really a player that contributes to a winning team.

Frank probably won't ever get that much but he's a guy who will more quietly contribute to a winning team.

So the Knicks will trade the winner and keep the loser cementing themselves as the perpetually losing franchise that goes for flash over substance. This is almost a given at this point from this mess of a organization.

[Richard4444]

I understand people not being high on Frank. I don't understand why people feel that it's imperative to trade him.

his value is so low rn. i don’t get the urgency.

I only think we need more cap space if we will try to bring 2 Max FA. We have some nice assets that we probably cant bring back if dont shred more salary. And 4,9M Franks salary is a good salary to trade because Frank is a really risk project that could take long to archieve his potencial.

I am ok shredding Knox 4,4 salary instead. He is less risky project but he is not a great suit in a win now team.

[Knicks Byke]

frank could be bruce bowen light.

[br7knicks]

DSJr is exactly what I thought, a guy who will get some stats in an exciting way but not all that efficiently, maybe as much as 18-6 eventually but isn't really a player that contributes to a winning team.

Frank probably won't ever get that much but he's a guy who will more quietly contribute to a winning team.

So the Knicks will trade the winner and keep the loser cementing themselves as the perpetually losing franchise that goes for flash over substance. This is almost a given at this point from this mess of a organization.

Correct. This franchise will get rid of the winning contributors in place of the big name who will put up stats, but inefficiently and without wins.

People don't realize that you don't need /can't have hall of fame players at every position. You need guys like frank who are defense first and don't need the ball, but are smart and know the game.

That said, I still need frank to show more. I don't get how people want to get rid of him before seeing he and Dsjr together for at least a full year

[whocares1]

I understand people not being high on Frank. I don't understand why people feel that it's imperative to trade him.

Young players have to show SOMETHING.
Look at Mitch.

Both Frank and Knox are hard and damn near impossible to watch.

It’s not that they’re young. It’s their performance and that’s 100% on them.

Kevin Knox was rookie of the month. He HAS shown something.

[spree8]

Frank has shown flashes he can be something special.. Knox too, but they’re not at all consistent.. that will come in time provided they’re properly groomed... something I’m not so sure this franchise is capable of. If this was San Antonio tho...

[HEZI]

DSJr is exactly what I thought, a guy who will get some stats in an exciting way but not all that efficiently, maybe as much as 18-6 eventually but isn't really a player that contributes to a winning team.

Frank probably won't ever get that much but he's a guy who will more quietly contribute to a winning team.

So the Knicks will trade the winner and keep the loser cementing themselves as the perpetually losing franchise that goes for flash over substance. This is almost a given at this point from this mess of a organization.

Whats stopping Frank from doing that on the Knicks? He hasnt done much winning here so how is he a winner?