Official WTF was Theo thinking in bringing in Eric Gagne

GreenerPastures · Post #1 » by **GreenerPastures** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 2:11 am

WTF WAS HE THINKING IN BRINGING IN ERIC GAGNE

He's fat, he throws way too many balls, and he gives Canada, an otherwise good country, a terrible name.

TheOWNED worked his magic again. Great work, Theo. You just gave up a legitimate southpaw who's young and has a bright future. No, not in the likes of Buccholz / Lester. But he was winning games.

LOL at Papelbon sitting in the bullpen and watching the game dreary eyed. UGH

mr_sunshine · Post #2 » by **mr_sunshine** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 2:17 am

He's such a piece of ****. I've ALWAYS hated Gagne. He has no velocity left and can't get anything over other than his fastball. Francona just needs to **** stop using him. Right now I'd rather have Piniero....

GreenerPastures · Post #3 » by **GreenerPastures** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 3:07 am

But the fact is, you can't blame one without blaming the other. Theo and Francona are to blame to some degree, but the real onus is on Gagne to come through in these situations. He isn't this minor leaguer who's been given expectations to come through at a level he has no experience in. He has dominated as a relief pitcher in the past. He won the Cy Young award as a relief pitcher for Christ sakes. That says something. I don't care if that happened four years ago. When you have a lead going into the ninth, it is your responsibility to preserve the lead. And he is fully capable of doing that.

On a related note, Gagne is kind of like Keith Foulke in the sense that he has dominated in this role in the past without extraordinary stuff

HeelSox · Post #4 » by **HeelSox** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 4:01 am

Keith Foulke had a nice changeup.

Markos · Post #5 » by **Markos** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 4:18 am

We need to change the thread title to Eric gagne sucks....its worked for others

Post #6 » by **Bleeding Green** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 5:26 am

I think this thread has the potential to be hilarious in October.

Kason Gabbard is very expendable, David Murphy the same. Beltre is 5 years away. Eric Gagne has a record of proven success, some of it to an otherworldly extent.

Painful stuff to watch in the short term, but have some faith in a guy once in a while. It's not like he's some **** without a track record. Mariano Rivera started the season like this: 6.2 IP, 12.15 ERA. Since then 45.1 IP, 2.18 ERA. Gee, it looks like relievers can go through bad stretches. Who'dathunk?

Stop looking at these super small samples and taking stuff from them. It's annoying and it's just dumb.

theknicks414 · Post #7 » by **theknicks414** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 5:27 am

not trying to troll, but interesting stats:

6.0 14 10 10 3 8
6.0 2 0 0 2 9

those are the lines of Gagne and Joba Chamberlain. I for one will admit I wanted the Yankees to get Gagne but Joba seems to be the real deal.

Post #8 » by **Bleeding Green** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 5:32 am

There isn't anything interesting about those, really.

Joba Chamberlain is excellent, though.

Markos · Post #9 » by **Markos** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 8:40 am

theknicks414 wrote:not trying to troll, but interesting stats:

6.0 14 10 10 3 8
6.0 2 0 0 2 9

those are the lines of Gagne and Joba Chamberlain. I for one will admit I wanted the Yankees to get Gagne but Joba seems to be the real deal.

Did they rewrite the rules of statistics that considers 6 IP a good sample size

He is a good pitcher, no doubt, but dont forget the league hasnt had a good look at him and he was in A ball this year

Post #10 » by **Chach** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 3:07 pm

GreenerPastures wrote:On a related note, Gagne is kind of like Keith Foulke in the sense that he has dominated in this role in the past without extraordinary stuff

Dude, you seriously just lost all credibility with this statement? You're saying Gagne won a Cy Young without extraordinary stuff? Did you even watch baseball when Gagne was at the top of his game? Not only was his fastball in the mid 90s but it was his third best pitch behind his change and curve. That is the DEFINITION of extraordinary stuff. Are you going to tell me Clay Buchholz lacks extraordinary stuff because, like Gagne, his 91-94 MPH fastball with life is his third best pitch?

Don't blame Theo for this. If you want to hate on Gagne, hate on him for not performing but Theo traded spare parts (Gabbard has no future in the organization) for the best closer on the trade market to work as a set-up man for our pen. He is currently having trouble locating his change and curve, his best pitches, so he's getting lit up.

And in case you didn't see the first game, Papelbon had to throw over 20 pitches in an inning and a third. The reason he has been healthy all year is because Tito hasn't been reckless in his usage of Papelbon this season. I'd saying pitching him twice in one day and throwing close to 40 pitches would classify as reckless. The reason that we have Okajima and Gagne is so that we don't have to abuse Papelbon like you are proposing. Gagne is too good to not come around. mahalo
~Chach~

The Rondo Show · Post #11 » by **The Rondo Show** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 3:24 pm

Chach wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Don't blame Theo for this. If you want to hate on Gagne, hate on him for not performing but Theo traded spare parts (Gabbard has no future in the organization) for the best closer on the trade market to work as a set-up man for our pen. He is currently having trouble locating his change and curve, his best pitches, so he's getting lit up.

Exactly. The trade was very good. Theo traded a guy who had a future as a long reliever in Boston (Gabbard), a 4th or 5th outfielder (David Murphy) and a nice young prospect with lots of potential, but one who is at least 5 years away from the majors, if he ever makes it at all (like all those 16-18 year olds signed, it's unlikely he will). They really lost nothing and acquired a really good reliever.

It sucks that Gagne has been as brutal as he has been as a Red Sox, but that was a fine trade by Theo. Gagne just isn't pitching like he's capable of.

HeelSox · Post #12 » by **HeelSox** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 3:55 pm

so to answer your quest....theo was thinking.

"I'll trade absolutly nothing and make the best bullpen in the majors even better....who can beat us after the 6th inning with Timlin, Okajima, Gagne, Papelbon?"

Post #13 » by **Flaming Mo** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 5:01 pm

Well, Gagne is obviously struggling to adjust to Boston. Now why in goddamn hell does Francona puts him in a one run game against a very tough team, instead of using Gagne in a 4 run game earlier that day?!? It was stupid and Papelbon should have gotten the "tougher" save...

Post #14 » by **sunshinekids99** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 5:05 pm

Papelbon came into a game with two on and a three run lead in the 8th. Obviously I would have rather seen Okajima get a chance to get out of that inning then use Gagne or Timlin with the 4 run lead. But I also really have no problem with Tito making sure he won the first game.

HeelSox · Post #15 » by **HeelSox** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 3:45 am

Oh...so now Francona is expected to tell the future and know that the 2nd game would be a one run game so he should save papelbon?

mr_sunshine · Post #16 » by **mr_sunshine** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 8:44 am

kobeSTOPkobeDONT wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

It sucks that Gagne has been as brutal as he has been as a Red Sox, but that was a fine trade by Theo. Gagne just isn't pitching like he was capable of.

Fixed. I really think Gagne is tanked. Hopefully I'm wrong and he does well though!

The Rondo Show · Post #17 » by **The Rondo Show** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 2:19 pm

mr_sunshine wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Fixed. I really think Gagne is tanked. Hopefully I'm wrong and he does well though!

You are wrong. Look at how good he was with the Rangers. He isn't the guy who throws 100 MPH and is completely unhittable anymore, but he is still one of the better relievers in the league. He is just pitching **** right now. It happens.

The Rondo Show · Post #18 » by **The Rondo Show** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 2:21 pm

HeelSox wrote:Oh...so now Francona is expected to tell the future and know that the 2nd game would be a one run game so he should save papelbon?

No, you save Papelbon because game 1 wasn't even all that close and there is a chance you'll actually need him in game 2. He wasn't needed in game 1 after he got that 1 out in the bottom of the 8th (and I'm sure Okajima could've got it, too) on 2 pitches and the lead increased to 4.

HeelSox · Post #19 » by **HeelSox** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 3:16 pm

I like Francona's thinking of make sure you at least get one...especially when you have Eric Gagne in the bullpen.....he'll be fine.
Don't be that guy who started the "Dustin Pedroia sucks" thread.

The Rondo Show · Post #20 » by **The Rondo Show** » Sun Aug 19, 2007 3:27 pm

HeelSox wrote:I like Francona's thinking of make sure you at least get one...especially when you have Eric Gagne in the bullpen.....he'll be fine.
Don't be that guy who started the "Dustin Pedroia sucks" thread.

I think he'll be fine, too.

That said, with how he is pitching, he clearly can't be trusted right now. It was dumb to use up both Okajima and Papelbon in a game that really wasn't all that close.