Igor fired - New Coaching Search Discussion

WeekapaugGroove · Post #441 » by **WeekapaugGroove** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:40 am

I wouldn't kill the Monty Williams hire but I do find it kind of funny that just a few years ago NO couldn't wait to fire him for running a basic system and stagnating ADs growth to now being the 'hot' candidate like he Phil Jackson or something. Time cures all I guess.

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BobbieL · Post #442 » by **BobbieL** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:59 am

WeekapaugGroove wrote:I wouldn't kill the Monty Williams hire but I do find it kind of funny that just a few years ago NO couldn't wait to fire him for running a basic system and stagnating ADs growth to now being the 'hot' candidate like he Phil Jackson or something. Time cures all I guess.

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He got fired in NO but bob kemp and Gina Mizell both think he got a bad deal.

Since than - assistant in OKC and Philly, worked for Pop a year. He might be better prepared this time.

I do like Vanterpool reading about him today, the video BWG posted.

Revived · Post #443 » by **Revived** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 5:45 am

bwgood77 wrote:

Read on Twitter

I like Vanterpool better than Monty Williams because Vanterpool figured out a way to develop a top 10 defense despite having two bad defensive players in the starting backcourt.

If the Suns get Morant, then that's what we will be looking like as well.

Crives · Post #444 » by **Crives** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 5:51 am

Revived wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:

Read on Twitter

I like Vanterpool better than Monty Williams because Vanterpool figured out a way to develop a top 10 defense despite having two bad defensive players in the starting backcourt.

If the Suns get Morant, then that's what we will be looking like as well.

Would be nice if he helped bring in Aminu as well

Years90Suns · Post #445 » by **Years90Suns** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 8:53 am

Frank Lee wrote:Jeebus.... you guys are gettin really muddy now.

Is there a chance that this is a good thing ? Aside from the long felt animosity towards Sarver (that I shared in the pre-enlightenment age) I contend the Front Office is better now that McDisparagingComments is gone, that Jones is in charge, that Bower (an experienced hire) is with us....AND that a new coaching search is on. (Heck even fan fav Zwicker is working for us) The roster was miraculously trimmed of dead weight while adding two legit contributors mid season that actually semi-turned-the-corner for us. A small ray of sunshine, but one that was/is severely under rated. But no credit to Bob.

I look at this a long process of weeding out what has plagued us for the past 5 yrs. Both the prospective coaches , Williams and Vanterpool, are extremely well thought of league wide AND will aid in attracting players here. Im not sure you can say that with Igor, the attracting players part. Like it or not, we are going to need a player wanting to come here to get him. Also, Isn't it possible the 'team' may have been part of this decision?

No boys, go ahead pissnmoan and dump on Sarver all you want, but this was a JONES / BOWER decision that was made with BobbyS knowing full well he'd take the heat and look the crazy villain owner. BTW, any of these outcasted former coaches gone on to anything significant ? You can say a few front office boys are still involved (Kerr, Griffin, etc) but all in all, this is perhaps the best fresh start we've had in quite a while...

We have the talent, another offseason where practically anything can happen as we have picks, some tradable players, and remarkably cap space if we need it to get a few more pieces (a coach too) to this fan-jaded puzzle. So be it. Clean slate for Jones and Bower and(?) to operate and build 'their' team. Igor was not their guy.

As you likely have figured, I think we have a sound FO in charge and with the hiring of a new coach, will be surrounding this so called scourge-ish owner with highly respected members of the NBA community. So much more to look forward to than the demise of Robert Sarver. Hate to see you guys disappointed. In fact, Im buying a hat today in support of my solidarity. Im on this bandwagon and gladly taking seat assignments. 'come on everybody...we're going streaking through the quad!!!'

You dark clouders are not going to rainout my parade.

2019-2020 will be our fifth season with a fresh start.
Sarver is changing GMs and they, subsequently, are changing HCs non-stop.
Nobody knows whether this is the time or not. We have been here before.
This time last summer we were thinking about a good season. May be fighting for a PO spot. New coach, draft first pick and so on. Hell, even Warren started hitting threes and playing the PF spot with success.

A year later we are in the exact same position. And we should expect improvement only because one reason: it would be difficult to get worse. That is the main reason we want to focus on. But listen, we can go and be the Kings, or the Nuggets, the Hawsk or the Nets... or we can remain the Suns... or even worse.. we can become the Knicks, the Bulls...

I do not know whether Sarver is that bad of a person managing the franchise. But he is terrible running things from a sport point of view. If he clearly steps aside and let the guys do the job they are paid for, then may be we have a chance. If he keeps deciding things behind the curtains, then we are screwed... Do you know of any other NBA franchise that lacks a Director of Basketball Operations?

Saberestar · Post #446 » by **Saberestar** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 9:02 am

WeekapaugGroove wrote:I wouldn't kill the Monty Williams hire but I do find it kind of funny that just a few years ago NO couldn't wait to fire him for running a basic system and stagnating ADs growth to now being the 'hot' candidate like he Phil Jackson or something. Time cures all I guess.

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It is all about competition.

Who is available that is a better option than Monty?

Years90Suns · Post #447 » by **Years90Suns** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 12:03 pm

Saberestar wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:I wouldn't kill the Monty Williams hire but I do find it kind of funny that just a few years ago NO couldn't wait to fire him for running a basic system and stagnating ADs growth to now being the 'hot' candidate like he Phil Jackson or something. Time cures all I guess.

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It is all about competition.

Who is available that is a better option than Monty?

Joerger, clearly.

NTB · Post #448 » by **NTB** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 12:12 pm

Years90Suns wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:I wouldn't kill the Monty Williams hire but I do find it kind of funny that just a few years ago NO couldn't wait to fire him for running a basic system and stagnating ADs growth to now being the 'hot' candidate like he Phil Jackson or something. Time cures all I guess.

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It is all about competition.

Who is available that is a better option than Monty?

Joerger, clearly.

Joerger is not a good coach at all IMO.

MathiasPW · Post #449 » by **MathiasPW** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 1:56 pm

WeekapaugGroove wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:I like that style too and if I were creating a team from scratch I'd do that but with this group I might go another route. Booker is a good iso player so might as well use it and as I mentioned I think Ayton needs to be utilized heavily in the pick and roll.

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I think that's fine...like SSOL the Suns with Nash and Amare used a lot of pick and roll but they also spread the floor with shooters and had great ball movement which made the pick and roll effective.

ISO is ok on occasion but if it gets to the point it takes the rest of the team out of it then ultimately it will likely hurt the team long term unless he is maintaining well over 60% TS%, because the rest of the team stays cold. The team that spreads the wealth results more often in the whole team or multiple guys getting hot and in rhythm and it helps chemistry and people always feel better when involved and playing team ball.
Sure you need some balance, I'm not saying they go full rockets and literally only run iso and pick and roll but I'd skew that direction vs the motion type O Igor was running even though I prefer to watch the motion teams.

Basically go all in around booker and ayton and shape the offense and roster to compliment what they do best.

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Pick N Roll has been the norm in the league, and defenses have mostly adjusted with all the switching to cover the drive and kick passing lanes and mobile or long big men to contain the penetration. The only team who still runs it in it's pure form is the Rockets, because Harden. If he gets contained he manages to draw a foul and go to the FT line, so it's still very profitable.

It also has a tendency to freeze other players out of the offensive system, and it's boring to watch.

Offensive schemes are evolving and have now multiple screens and secondary playmakers to make the drive and kick unpredictable (ball movement), which is what Igor was known for being good at (and would need more time to show results for, as adding complexity to a group of young guys still trying to figure out game basics is extra hard).

I don't know enough about defense, but I always always assume its' mainly joint effort and discipline.

BobbieL · Post #450 » by **BobbieL** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:46 pm

Saberestar wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:I wouldn't kill the Monty Williams hire but I do find it kind of funny that just a few years ago NO couldn't wait to fire him for running a basic system and stagnating ADs growth to now being the 'hot' candidate like he Phil Jackson or something. Time cures all I guess.

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It is all about competition.

Who is available that is a better option than Monty?

I think its very important that James Jones has a name or two in mind for the job. He fired Igor to replace him with another coach. This should not be an interview process of more than 2 or 3 people too me - unless he is fishing for ideas. Personally, if the courage of his conviction is Monty Williams - interview him and see if a deal can be made before moving on to other guys. He fired Igor for a reason - he should know EXACTLY who and what he wants

With any coaching staff - he does need to give him some time on the job. This one and done stuff is ridiculous. You see it in Utah, in Portland -- two solid NBA teams that win a lot of games and make the playoffs. Consistency in coaching, style of play, the Front Office knowing what players fit - thats a key part of this.

Saberestar · Post #451 » by **Saberestar** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 7:16 pm

Read on Twitter

Saberestar · Post #452 » by **Saberestar** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 7:16 pm

Read on Twitter

Blonde · Post #453 » by **Blonde** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 8:07 pm

I don’t know anything about Vanterpool, but I do know that a few years ago while in Portland, Jay Triano was seen as one of the top assistant coaches available. Maybe Stotts and Lillard are really good at getting their guys job opportunities, rather than them having some amazing coaching farm system.

Anyway, Monty would be a good hire for this team, can’t be mad about it. Easily one of the most respected guys in the league.

Post #454 » by **TASTIC** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 8:12 pm

I hope the Lakers get Monty and we get Vanterpool. As others have touched on - his results in NOR weren't that good and I specifically remember him being talked about as poor coach/strategist. Nice guy, but not a good coach. Plus if he's as close to Pop as has been referenced, Pop will tell him to stay the hell away from Sarver cos he HATES him.

Joerger might be a good coach but he's clashed BAD with two front offices. I could see him being the first head coach fired before coaching a single game!

BobbieL · Post #455 » by **BobbieL** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 8:39 pm

Saberestar wrote:

Read on Twitter

If the Suns like Monty - bring the checkbook and bring the years. 3/7 not getting it
maybe like 5/25 will get it done

Saberestar · Post #456 » by **Saberestar** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 10:06 pm

Read on Twitter

Post #457 » by **bwgood77** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 10:33 pm

Saberestar wrote:

Read on Twitter

Reading the responses on that tweet, did I come across one of our forum members?

Read on Twitter

BobbieL · Post #458 » by **BobbieL** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:01 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Saberestar wrote:

Read on Twitter

Reading the responses on that tweet, did I come across one of our forum members?

Read on Twitter

He may not curse but players will curse
Tattoos - part of society and part of the NBA

As for the prayer group -- if anybody saw his eulogy of his wife, would know he is a man of faith to be sure. Very powerful eulogy if you have not seen - look it up Also, I read an article about Ryan Anderson after the death (suicide) of his lady friend and how Monty and Ingrid Williams were very important people to help Ryan through his personal loss.

I am not that concerned with the record as a coach - as some of that is out of his control if a GM is making the decisions. How did the team play? Did they improve year over year? Things of that nature.

Lakers contingent talked today; Suns talking tomorrow. Unless a surprise team comes out (OKC?) -- might have a decision this week end.

Whether its a better job - LeBron and the potential of another star player and that team is in the playoffs. The Suns - well if he were to make the team competitive and fun to watch - well, the bar is a bit lower shall we say.

SuperSunsFan · Post #459 » by **SuperSunsFan** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:33 pm

Hasn't Monty been vindicated already after Gentry failing to just duplicate his success of making the playoffs when Gentry arguably had much better parts to work with plus a more mature Davis?

sunsbum · Post #460 » by **sunsbum** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:34 pm

Crives wrote:
Revived wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:

Read on Twitter

I like Vanterpool better than Monty Williams because Vanterpool figured out a way to develop a top 10 defense despite having two bad defensive players in the starting backcourt.

If the Suns get Morant, then that's what we will be looking like as well.

Would be nice if he helped bring in Aminu as well

Dame and CJ were never considered "Devin Booker" bad on defense so I don't know if I'd give him too much credit there. Aminu has been a guy that has always embraced and wanted to be the best defender on the team as well as guarding the best player if possible. The thing about the Blazers is they don't have any defensive studs but all of them Play avg to above average D so where I will give vanterpool credit is that he has turned that concoction into a top 10 Defense.