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Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon

Moderators: UCF, Knightro, UCFJayBird, Def Swami, Howard Mass, ChosenSavior

Should we resign Vuc/Ross

Yes
43
34%
Yes, but just Vuc
9
7%
Yes, but just Ross
51
40%
No
23
18%
 
Total votes: 126

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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#321 » by zaymon » Tue Apr 30, 2019 1:44 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
j_n wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Season 8 episode 3 of GOT is one of biggest letdowns in my life :lol:

Man, this sucked

Should have lowered your expectations I guess, since the 6th season it feels like the story has been dumbed down to appease the casual fans, I could think of at least 5 better ways to end the nk storyline than what they came up with.


:dontknow:

plot armour on everybody, making years of speculations and hype about show complete waste of time.
To me this feels like Dexer, tv show that was great, had declining quality at the end just to s**t itself in last episodes.

GOT is **** since they changed the plots from the book. They have fallen very low since last season
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#322 » by OrlandoNed » Tue Apr 30, 2019 2:50 pm

zaymon wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:
j_n wrote:Should have lowered your expectations I guess, since the 6th season it feels like the story has been dumbed down to appease the casual fans, I could think of at least 5 better ways to end the nk storyline than what they came up with.


:dontknow:

plot armour on everybody, making years of speculations and hype about show complete waste of time.
To me this feels like Dexer, tv show that was great, had declining quality at the end just to s**t itself in last episodes.

GOT is **** since they changed the plots from the book. They have fallen very low since last season

They didn't change crap from the books for the most part. The most recent book ended around when Jon Snow got killed. The show has been sailing on uncharted waters since season 5 ended. HBO can't just put the show on indefinite hiatus because GRRM can't be bothered to finish his story.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#323 » by Magic_Johnny12 » Tue Apr 30, 2019 8:14 pm

pepe1991 wrote:
OrlandO wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:Season 8 episode 3 of GOT is one of biggest letdowns in my life :lol:

Man, this sucked

I thought it was great. This was my favorite scene...

Image
Spoiler:
why the F was it so dark?! Couldn't see anything.
Image



:rofl: :rofl:

7 years od Night King build up to find out who he is, what are his motivations, why he turned against CoF., his connection with Bran to find out.... we will never find out :lol:

And Azor Ahai thing ended up being as important as Nick Young for Warriors championship run

As for darkness, i don't know ,it's easier to make it dark to save budget because CGI isn't polished i guess ?

it's not as important but who da hell puts arthillery in front of army and charges calvary first? :banghead: It's like they wanted to die


Umm they literally were fighting the "NIGHT" King. I'm not quite sure what you expected :lol:
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#324 » by npiper17 » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:38 pm

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:Kanter is really becoming my option 1 for FA C if we go that route. Dude has been playing with passion since the Knicks traded him. Sadly I wouldn't be shocked if someone gives him a solid deal


Can’t see our old buddy Hedo popping back for a chat with David and Jeff during the second quarter if this signing happened.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#325 » by Def Swami » Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:05 pm

Read on Twitter
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#326 » by OrlandO » Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:18 pm

Magic_Johnny12 wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:
OrlandO wrote:I thought it was great. This was my favorite scene...

Image
Spoiler:
why the F was it so dark?! Couldn't see anything.
Image



:rofl: :rofl:

7 years od Night King build up to find out who he is, what are his motivations, why he turned against CoF., his connection with Bran to find out.... we will never find out :lol:

And Azor Ahai thing ended up being as important as Nick Young for Warriors championship run

As for darkness, i don't know ,it's easier to make it dark to save budget because CGI isn't polished i guess ?

it's not as important but who da hell puts arthillery in front of army and charges calvary first? :banghead: It's like they wanted to die


Umm they literally were fighting the "NIGHT" King. I'm not quite sure what you expected :lol:

It was so dark even the Night King couldn't see what was coming... :lol:
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#327 » by MoMM » Tue Apr 30, 2019 10:48 pm

Def Swami wrote:
Read on Twitter

Good for us, hope they don't offer anything to Vuc :D
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#328 » by KillMonger » Tue Apr 30, 2019 11:14 pm

SOUL wrote:
ezzzp wrote:Why did you choose those two specific season's for Vucevic? Everyone regressed under Vogel especially Vucevic. Why not compare 14-15 or 15-16 who were better season's for Vucevic and when he was also in All-Star discussion?


It's not meant to be a comparison of "better seasons" or else I would have compared it to this season's Vuc, which is obviously the best version of him. Also in those earlier Vuc seasons, everybody was in agreeance that he should be the 1st option because he was younger and we had nobody threatening as a better offensive option. There were not many debates going on at that time.

Those exact seasons were used because in those in those specific Vucevic seasons, which are comparable in the sense that they're similar/slightly worse than Gordon's current season, there were people arguing that Vuc did not need to be better on offense and that he still needed to be 1st option yet are criticizing the hell out of a player who, impact wise, is the same as Vuc was the previous 2 years.

So either Vuc wasn't as good as they thought the previous few years when they were arguing that he didn't need to improve much + should still be the 1st option, or it's the issue of just not liking Gordon.

Again, people keep missing the point that it's just as damning to Gordon as it is to Vucevic, yet the people who like Vucevic are the ones taking issue with the post for some reason?
MartinsIzAfraud wrote:Kanter is really becoming my option 1 for FA C if we go that route. Dude has been playing with passion since the Knicks traded him. Sadly I wouldn't be shocked if someone gives him a solid deal
Cancer? I don't know if i would want someone that both Utah and knick fans call a cancer to the locker room. Having fueds with gobert in Utah and bitching about minutes in New York. Guess he couldn't pull that in Portland as I'd figure lillard wouldn't have any of that. We'll see what happens i guess, it's going to get interesting in the coming months.

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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#329 » by MartinsIzAfraud » Wed May 1, 2019 3:11 pm

Now this would definitely change depending on what happens with TRoss/Vuc. Would see this as a cap clearing trade to go all in on 2020 FA chase. Vuc & TRoss sign deals elsewhere then the fun begins.

Orlando trades Evan Fournier
Minny trades Teague

Why for Orlando -> Teague is an expiring contract, capable starter/backup and we can continue to let Fultz go at a snails pace. There has been nothing to show that he will be ready for opening day so let's continue to let him slowly move along. Magic get more space

Why for Minny - They're not really going anywhere right now with that salary table. They don't really get a benefit clearing Teague's space in 2020 so they take a hit for 1 more year while getting a capable starter in Fournier an can push Okogie to bench. Dieng is on the hook until 2021 and this would match up with Fournier. They would clear a ton of space in 2021 while also being competitive but staying in lotto.

Orlando starting 5 would then turn into:

Teague
FA ( Lamb, Justin Holiday, Green, Temple) or 16th pick
Isaac
AG
Bamba

bench: DJ, Iwundu, 16th pick, FA Wing or C Moz??
A scoring guard.. never heard of one. :roll:
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#330 » by MagicFan101 » Wed May 1, 2019 3:24 pm

zaymon wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:
j_n wrote:Should have lowered your expectations I guess, since the 6th season it feels like the story has been dumbed down to appease the casual fans, I could think of at least 5 better ways to end the nk storyline than what they came up with.


:dontknow:

plot armour on everybody, making years of speculations and hype about show complete waste of time.
To me this feels like Dexer, tv show that was great, had declining quality at the end just to s**t itself in last episodes.

GOT is **** since they changed the plots from the book. They have fallen very low since last season


“Since they changed the plots from the book”
— I think you mean books.

“They have fallen very low since last season.”


They diverged greatly from the literature long before that season. ... and that is okay! They are literally separate entities.

Most of these characters are extremely young in the books. You can’t have a 10 year old in a rape scene on screen as one example. You have to change that and they chose to give that entire story line to a completely different character to preserve some of the writing but make it more fit for screen (although they still took a lot of PR backlash for that scene).

If you follow his other work or his personal interviews you realize he doesn’t care about Good vs. Evil. This is interesting to him and isn’t what the world is about. It should be no surprise then how this weeks episode and that long story line ended ... less than dramatic.

Family vs family, betrayed love and such and such. That is his style.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#331 » by MagicFan101 » Wed May 1, 2019 3:38 pm

OrlandoNed wrote:
zaymon wrote:
pepe1991 wrote:
:dontknow:

plot armour on everybody, making years of speculations and hype about show complete waste of time.
To me this feels like Dexer, tv show that was great, had declining quality at the end just to s**t itself in last episodes.

GOT is **** since they changed the plots from the book. They have fallen very low since last season

They didn't change crap from the books for the most part. The most recent book ended around when Jon Snow got killed. The show has been sailing on uncharted waters since season 5 ended. HBO can't just put the show on indefinite hiatus because GRRM can't be bothered to finish his story.


Lazy readers are the worst.

They changed A LOT! — the main plot line stands but from leaving out entire story lines to consolidating smaller characters into one main character plot to swapping roles entirely (even among main characters) they did change a significant amount.

... but for the most part I don’t see how to avoid it without a 12+ season show.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#332 » by OrlandO » Wed May 1, 2019 5:06 pm

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:Now this would definitely change depending on what happens with TRoss/Vuc. Would see this as a cap clearing trade to go all in on 2020 FA chase. Vuc & TRoss sign deals elsewhere then the fun begins.

Orlando trades Evan Fournier
Minny trades Teague

Why for Orlando -> Teague is an expiring contract, capable starter/backup and we can continue to let Fultz go at a snails pace. There has been nothing to show that he will be ready for opening day so let's continue to let him slowly move along. Magic get more space

Why for Minny - They're not really going anywhere right now with that salary table. They don't really get a benefit clearing Teague's space in 2020 so they take a hit for 1 more year while getting a capable starter in Fournier an can push Okogie to bench. Dieng is on the hook until 2021 and this would match up with Fournier. They would clear a ton of space in 2021 while also being competitive but staying in lotto.

Orlando starting 5 would then turn into:

Teague
FA ( Lamb, Justin Holiday, Green, Temple) or 16th pick
Isaac
AG
Bamba

bench: DJ, Iwundu, 16th pick, FA Wing or C Moz??

Go all in on who in 2020?
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#333 » by ezzzp » Wed May 1, 2019 6:23 pm

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:Now this would definitely change depending on what happens with TRoss/Vuc. Would see this as a cap clearing trade to go all in on 2020 FA chase.


Even if the Magic let Ross and Vucevic go, the Magic will more than likely not be able to spend cap in 2020.

Fultz and Isaac become restricted free agents in the summer of 2021. That means that the Magic will need to conserve cap space to retain them that summer. If they are anywhere near to the quality of players that Magic fans and the front office hope they'll be - at bare minimum they'll each get a 20% of salary cap contract, which is what Aaron Gordon got, but both will be eligible for 25% of salary cap max contracts. That means the Magic have to save for two potential salaries that will occupy 40 to 50% of their entire cap space. Salaries that the prior year will have been 5-10% of their total cap.

Then the following summer Aaron Gordon hits unrestricted free agency. He'll be eligible for a 30% of salary cap max...and the summer after that Bamba hits restricted free agency.

Jeff Weltman has continued to state that they just do not have a lot of flexibility with cap space. He's not lying.

This is the cap condition that occurs with teams that accumulate multiple rookie scale contracts that end in 1-3 year clusters. Within that short span, teams go from a 1/3 of their key players each earning $3m-$7m suddenly jumping to +$15m to $28m each. This nearly always starts to force premature roster decisions to avoid deep luxury tax issues...and because of that those moves rarely end up being good transactions.

This is why I continue to say, the Magic need to retain their assets and maintain a competitive baseline. This keeps trade value's up and improves the development of ALL players. It is also important to front load the structure of their new contracts. This allows the Magic to have multiple asset options at the trade deadline in 2020 to help resolve how they approach that jump in their payroll.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#334 » by tiderulz » Wed May 1, 2019 6:46 pm

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:Now this would definitely change depending on what happens with TRoss/Vuc. Would see this as a cap clearing trade to go all in on 2020 FA chase. Vuc & TRoss sign deals elsewhere then the fun begins.

Orlando trades Evan Fournier
Minny trades Teague

Why for Orlando -> Teague is an expiring contract, capable starter/backup and we can continue to let Fultz go at a snails pace. There has been nothing to show that he will be ready for opening day so let's continue to let him slowly move along. Magic get more space

Why for Minny - They're not really going anywhere right now with that salary table. They don't really get a benefit clearing Teague's space in 2020 so they take a hit for 1 more year while getting a capable starter in Fournier an can push Okogie to bench. Dieng is on the hook until 2021 and this would match up with Fournier. They would clear a ton of space in 2021 while also being competitive but staying in lotto.

Orlando starting 5 would then turn into:

Teague
FA ( Lamb, Justin Holiday, Green, Temple) or 16th pick
Isaac
AG
Bamba

bench: DJ, Iwundu, 16th pick, FA Wing or C Moz??

why does Minnesota want to push Okogie to the bench?
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#335 » by MartinsIzAfraud » Wed May 1, 2019 8:37 pm

ezzzp wrote:
MartinsIzAfraud wrote:Now this would definitely change depending on what happens with TRoss/Vuc. Would see this as a cap clearing trade to go all in on 2020 FA chase.


Even if the Magic let Ross and Vucevic go, the Magic will more than likely not be able to spend cap in 2020.

Fultz and Isaac become restricted free agents in the summer of 2021. That means that the Magic will need to conserve cap space to retain them that summer. If they are anywhere near to the quality of players that Magic fans and the front office hope they'll be - at bare minimum they'll each get a 20% of salary cap contract, which is what Aaron Gordon got, but both will be eligible for 25% of salary cap max contracts. That means the Magic have to save for two potential salaries that will occupy 40 to 50% of their entire cap space. Salaries that the prior year will have been 5-10% of their total cap.

Then the following summer Aaron Gordon hits unrestricted free agency. He'll be eligible for a 30% of salary cap max...and the summer after that Bamba hits restricted free agency.

Jeff Weltman has continued to state that they just do not have a lot of flexibility with cap space. He's not lying.

This is the cap condition that occurs with teams that accumulate multiple rookie scale contracts that end in 1-3 year clusters. Within that short span, teams go from a 1/3 of their key players each earning $3m-$7m suddenly jumping to +$15m to $28m each. This nearly always starts to force premature roster decisions to avoid deep luxury tax issues...and because of that those moves rarely end up being good transactions.

This is why I continue to say, the Magic need to retain their assets and maintain a competitive baseline. This keeps trade value's up and improves the development of ALL players. It is also important to front load the structure of their new contracts. This allows the Magic to have multiple asset options at the trade deadline in 2020 to help resolve how they approach that jump in their payroll.


Fultz might not even be in the NBA past this year so I'm not holding out cap space for a guy who can't even dribble or shoot a basketball right now. Yeah Isaac is a RFA but honestly if he doesn't improve offensively whose going to offer him a deal when we can match it? I actually could see us getting Isaac on a cheaper deal in RFA especially if he hasn't improved much.

You pretty much named every RFA we have over the next 3 years, I'll worry about that when it happens and not years early.
A scoring guard.. never heard of one. :roll:
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#336 » by pepe1991 » Wed May 1, 2019 8:41 pm

2020 FA class is one of worst in last decade
Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans. -John Lennon
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#337 » by zaymon » Wed May 1, 2019 9:19 pm

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:Fultz might not even be in the NBA past this year so I'm not holding out cap space for a guy who can't even dribble or shoot a basketball right now. Yeah Isaac is a RFA but honestly if he doesn't improve offensively whose going to offer him a deal when we can match it? I actually could see us getting Isaac on a cheaper deal in RFA especially if he hasn't improved much.

You pretty much named every RFA we have over the next 3 years, I'll worry about that when it happens and not years early.

Yeah great attitude for discussion. Denver is where its now becouse they thought two steps ahead, and you advice us to forget about next two years and make decisions based only on this year ??? wow.....
It took me 2 hours to analyze our cap space for 2 next years, possible free agents and more, and i am a random guy with no inside info. They must think about Fultz, they must think about Isaac, they must think about all of our players and more. If not we will be guided by morons of Magic Johnson caliber.
My money is on Banchero going number 1 !
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#338 » by Magic_Johnny12 » Wed May 1, 2019 10:03 pm

pepe1991 wrote:2020 FA class is one of worst in last decade


SAY IT LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK.
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#339 » by MasterGMer » Wed May 1, 2019 10:29 pm

except Vuc and Ross, Magic is pretty much not going to be involved in any Free Agent Signing, ha?

Sign and trade Kemba, and resign Vuc, make Fultz 6th man on the team. Oh boy, I like this team
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Re: Official Speculation Thread ‘19-'20 I: Big decisions on the horizon 

Post#340 » by ezzzp » Wed May 1, 2019 10:45 pm

MartinsIzAfraud wrote:
Fultz might not even be in the NBA past this year so I'm not holding out cap space for a guy who can't even dribble or shoot a basketball right now. Yeah Isaac is a RFA but honestly if he doesn't improve offensively whose going to offer him a deal when we can match it? I actually could see us getting Isaac on a cheaper deal in RFA especially if he hasn't improved much.

You pretty much named every RFA we have over the next 3 years, I'll worry about that when it happens and not years early.


Front offices don't have the luxury of short term thinking and not worrying about things until they happen; they have to prepare the cap terrain for 3-5 year cycles.

Good free agents NEVER sign with small market teams nosediving for high lottery...that's what Orlando will be in your scenario. Hell even low end free agents don't sign into that situation unless they are overpaid.

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